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quote:Minesweeper, but you only solve each situation once. What Is It? Bombe (Steam link) is a game in which you solve Minesweeper variants (think Hexcells, Demon Crawl, Tametsi, etc.) not by making the individual deductions manually, but by defining rules which can then be applied automatically to all available levels, assuming they pass a logic check. The venn-diagram interface may look intimidating at first, but it's very usable, and the UX/features are being actively being improved almost daily (at time of thread creation). As you progress, your access to levels, game modes, and ability to manage rules grows with unlocks. [Placeholder for more explanation, screenshots, and/or videos] What should I know before starting?
FAQ/Advanced Tips
dirby fucked around with this message at 21:09 on Jul 4, 2023 |
# ? Jul 4, 2023 19:11 |
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# ? May 5, 2024 07:17 |
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[This post reserved for future use. OP suggestions welcome.] dirby fucked around with this message at 00:18 on Jul 5, 2023 |
# ? Jul 4, 2023 19:12 |
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I am just getting started after unlocking Variables. And I do recommend that you double click every region regularly, to solve all the possible puzzles. Some of the unlocks make things much easier. Variables and Hiding especially. I just deleted my old rules and am making better rules with a variable. I also unlocked a Maximum Regions slider, and have no idea what it does. Also, the help screen mentions you can double click a rule to add it to the rule constructor. I had forgotten by the time I finished reading it, but it is very useful.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 19:44 |
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I played about 13 hours of the demo + full game but once I saw that the next unlock was a third variable I lost a bit of interest, because I assume the last bottom right unlock on the rules is a fourth variable. I still really enjoyed the game and I could see myself going back to it at some point. Once rules start involving three regions it started breaking my brain a bit, and I was also having trouble thinking about how I would use the third variable. Maximum regions I believe just limits the amount of displayable regions that can possibly be on the screen at any given point.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 20:06 |
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ChewyLSB posted:I played about 13 hours of the demo + full game but once I saw that the next unlock was a third variable I lost a bit of interest VictualSquid posted:I also unlocked a Maximum Regions slider, and have no idea what it does. quote:Maximum regions I believe just limits the amount of displayable regions that can possibly be on the screen at any given point. dirby fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Jul 6, 2023 |
# ? Jul 4, 2023 20:56 |
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Getting more into variables. And please tell me that there is x-const option somewhere somewhen to add to the x+const stuff.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 21:18 |
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VictualSquid posted:Getting more into variables. And please tell me that there is x-const option somewhere somewhen to add to the x+const stuff. You can effectively get x-const by adding const to both sides of the equation. If you don't know what I mean by that, give me an example where you'd want to use x-const and I can explain how to achieve the same result with x+const.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 21:19 |
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dirby posted:You can effectively get x-const by adding const to both sides of the equation. If you don't know what I mean by that, give me an example where you'd want to use x-const and I can explain how to achieve the same result with x+const. In the specific case that annoyed me it was just a lot of clicking required to convert to rebasing the whole complex rule while I could have just set that one place to x-1 if it was possible.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 21:54 |
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dirby I think you're trying to trick me into doing my math homework.
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# ? Jul 4, 2023 22:07 |
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Is there a way to back up my rules before I reset them? I kinda wanna start over but if I lose energy to start from scratch I might just go back to my current set.
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# ? Jul 5, 2023 13:35 |
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Argue posted:Is there a way to back up my rules before I reset them? I kinda wanna start over but if I lose energy to start from scratch I might just go back to my current set. You can export your selected rules with the "Copy Rule to Clipboard" button: Bombe Rules (6): 💣⠨⢵⠯⣽⡣⡂⣯⠺⠅⡛⠂⡝⠄⠀⡢⠄⠏⠕⢠⠵⡭⢯⡀⡋⢓⠍⠿⢯⣪⢆⣑⢖⣜⢒⢛⠻⢨⡿⣶⠁⠁⠷⣫⡪⡝⠴⣷⠍⢿⠿⡖⢷⡧⢳⣽⣒⡎⣿⢥⣇⣬⠕⠞⣍⢗⠉⡊⡲⢠⡔⢠⡤⠌⠄⢒⠊⠠⠛ ⢼⣐⡎⡊⡫⢘⠃⠟⠝⢘⡔⣟⡄⣏⠈⡢⡲⡜⠖⠭⢅⣞⣯⡁⡜⣍⢂⢨⠳⢣⡂⢷⡍⢨⣩⡅⣧⣹⠠⠷⡀⢾⠀⣠⢱⠂⡥⢪⢙⠆⡚⢤⠗⣌⡴⠄⡭⣿⡴⠩⣕⢰⡸⢔⡁⡢⢄⣴⣏⣘⢴⡁⡂⡨⠁🛑 Loddfafnir fucked around with this message at 14:02 on Jul 5, 2023 |
# ? Jul 5, 2023 14:00 |
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This puzzle appears to have multiple solutions, I must be missing something
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# ? Jul 6, 2023 15:26 |
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malnourish posted:This puzzle appears to have multiple solutions, I must be missing something 1. Displayed information in the middle of a puzzle usually has "multiple solutions", since you potentially reveal a new number clue when you mark a cell as being clear. 2. In this case, hint: is there any cell you can be sure does/does not contain a bomb? Even if that doesn't solve everything, it should move you forward. (If this were a more advanced puzzle, I'd also ask if there's a bunch of cells where you have some new information about the number of bombs among those cells, since after you've solved 20 puzzles, a rule can create a new region.) dirby fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Jul 6, 2023 |
# ? Jul 6, 2023 15:39 |
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dirby posted:Two things: You're spot on. Thanks
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# ? Jul 6, 2023 17:14 |
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Well, stumbled onto this gem and it's devouring my life haha. Been focusing on the three region mode, and just reached my goal of top ten in all board types.
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# ? Jul 6, 2023 19:39 |
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I cannot figure out how to make a rule or play the game. I must be too much of an idiot for this game. Can anyone give me a "baby's first Bombe"-type of guide? Edit: Ooooooh, so I don't create regions myself. Do I ever delete rules, or just create new ones? Kuule hain nussivan fucked around with this message at 17:26 on Jul 7, 2023 |
# ? Jul 7, 2023 17:14 |
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You can delete rules, but you don't need to in order to make progress. You might want to, if for example you have a bunch of rules that you realize you could have covered in one instead, as a trivial example: "Oh I have different rules for regions of size 1-4 with 0 bombs in them, that could have been one rule for regions of size ? (don't care) with 0 bombs in them"
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 17:32 |
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Yeah, I think I just opened up the rule list editor. It's a neat game, but hoo boy is this UI dense.
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 17:44 |
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I get so annoyed when I come up with a great generic rule then realize the game doesn't actually let me do 0/x or x/y
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 18:05 |
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Kuule hain nussivan posted:Can anyone give me a "baby's first Bombe"-type of guide? Double-click on a region to add it to the rule editor. Right-click on a rule editor region to remove it. (After solving 20 puzzles) A rule can create a new region by clicking on, say, a number and putting it in multiple places instead of the bomb or clear icons.
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 22:44 |
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What the hell, there is a hard mode? I just went through this clickfest of almost identical rules for p- x+ and p x + and x/x+1 and x/x+2 all all those permutations. Did I miss an easier way? VictualSquid fucked around with this message at 23:23 on Jul 7, 2023 |
# ? Jul 7, 2023 22:47 |
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VictualSquid posted:Did I miss an easier way? dirby fucked around with this message at 23:34 on Jul 7, 2023 |
# ? Jul 7, 2023 23:32 |
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At least two easier ways. You can use ? as a region to create rules for "any region", and you can create a -x region for every x region so you don't have to double up on rules like you did for psi there. I'm now at a point where I have to use the maximum region limit to keep the game playable, as I've got a couple of rules that cause explosions of thousands of regions, but which I don't want to get rid of because they also solved some hundreds of puzzles each. I could rewrite at least one of them into a more limited form that would still solve the level I originally created it for, but it's impossible to know how many of the additional levels need the full form.
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 23:35 |
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KNR posted:At least two easier ways. You can use ? as a region to create rules for "any region", and you can create a -x region for every x region so you don't have to double up on rules like you did for psi there. I was thinking about doing it this way, but I wanted to avoid the problem you are describing in the second paragraph.
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# ? Jul 7, 2023 23:59 |
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Rules that are useful but create way too many regions is honestly my least favourite part of this game.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 00:13 |
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this game is super neat, I'm finding using question marks as much as possible creates good rule
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 05:34 |
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MrQueasy posted:this game is super neat, I'm finding using question marks as much as possible creates good rule I think the meta-rule for rules is that the more general a rule is, the better it is, and question marks are a part of generalization. Once you start unlocking variables the possibilities start to make you taste the universe. Although I wish the interface had an easier way to set up subtractions; just because you can write any linear equation only using addition doesn't mean some quality of life wouldn't be amiss. Two examples: Incidentally, 0+ regions convey literally zero information and can be safely trashed, correct? I have a couple hypotheses which I have no idea how to prove or disprove but I think are correct: Definition 1: rule A generalizes rule B if every time rule B would trigger rule A also triggers with the same results. (Or better results but I have no loving clue how to precisely define 'better') For the purpose of this definition, marking a region with a 0 or 0- is considered equivalent to marking it clear; marking a region with a number of bombs equal to its size is considered equivalent to marking that region as full of bombs. Quick lemma, if A generalizes B then A cannot involve more regions than B; it is possible for a rule involving n regions to have generalizations involving less than n regions, but I think the game recognizes rules with redundant regions and calls them impossible. Definition 2: a rule is fully generalized if it has no generalization. Hypothesis 1: a rule involving n regions can always be fully generalized such that no hard numbers* remains, but only variables and question marks. At most n variables are needed for this generalization. *the hardcoded numbers e.g. x/x+2/x+4 or x+2* don't count Note, even if this is correct what I assume is the fifth variable would still be a great quality of life unlock Hypothesis 2: a fully generalized rule involving 2 or more regions cannot contain "clear" or "bomb" declarations.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 19:36 |
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Loving this game, just gotta figure out a good way to generalize all these "1/2 intersecting with 5/7/9 creates a clear space here, but this won't work for 2/3 and 6/8/10 or 0/1 and 4/6/8" scenarios I keep running into, and also maybe figure out a more efficient way to create new regions from !x regions.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 19:37 |
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Omobono posted:I think the meta-rule for rules is that the more general a rule is, the better it is, and question marks are a part of generalization. quote:Incidentally, 0+ regions convey literally zero information and can be safely trashed, correct? quote:I think the game recognizes rules with redundant regions and calls them impossible.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 19:58 |
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Yeah on that last one I was straight up wrong, I misunderstood when the game declares an impossibility ("illogical": this rule is not always true; "impossible": this region combination cannot exist). The game will let you build rules with useless regions.
Omobono fucked around with this message at 21:05 on Jul 8, 2023 |
# ? Jul 8, 2023 20:44 |
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Has anyone been messing around with the 60 rule mode? I found it saves rules to have all regions with X bombs define a region with X- bombs and X+ bombs, even though it's ugly as sin doing that.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 21:54 |
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I haven't stacked up to 60 yet, but I don't think it tracks visibility rules in that count. It does seem to track deleted rules, though.
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# ? Jul 8, 2023 23:13 |
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Visibility rules are fine, it just slows things down to be making all the extra regions. Deleted or modified rules count to the total until you reset the levels. It'd be nice if they didn't count until they've been used at least once, but oh well.
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# ? Jul 9, 2023 00:32 |
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I found that once I unlocked variables, resetting the levels and the rules and starting over to be VERY satisfying and pretty fast.
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# ? Jul 9, 2023 03:21 |
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Is there any way to make a rule that only works if x is even? Got this rule: And I could switch the x+3/... for a x+k/... but only if k is uneven. Can't find a way to do this without making several rules.
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# ? Jul 23, 2023 12:12 |
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VictualSquid posted:Is there any way to make a rule that only works if x is even?
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# ? Jul 23, 2023 13:48 |
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I suspect I have created an infinite loop of generation rules.
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# ? Jul 29, 2023 22:08 |
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The good news is that it's not possible to go infinite, as the rules cap out a constant of 32. You can check this by making x- into (x+1)-. The bad news is that "not technically infinite but might take weeks to compute them all" is a lot harder to fix than infinite.
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# ? Jul 30, 2023 01:48 |
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VictualSquid posted:I suspect I have created an infinite loop of generation rules. Here's my worst so far.
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# ? Jul 31, 2023 02:35 |
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# ? May 5, 2024 07:17 |
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I reset my rules, got back to where i was with like, 1/10th using variables, and have spent the last 3 hours staring at puzzles i know how to solve trying to apply variables. 10/10
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# ? Aug 10, 2023 03:29 |