|
dpkg chopra posted:big loving kudos to Edwards for getting 80mil to poo poo over the US. I expressed as much to my movie pal on the way out as rationale for why this movie is gonna tank. At the very least 50% of the audience won’t be able to take it as anything but a slap in the face.
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 03:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 6, 2024 08:28 |
|
|
This movie is destined to be forever unappreciated as amazing comedy without a single quip, or even just a signposted joke. Just pure visual wit. They fuckin hijacked the plane from 2001 A Space Odyssey and used it to do a terror attack on a Dr. Strangelove reference. 10/10 film.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 03:59
|
|
|
What's the Strangelove reference?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 04:18
|
|
|
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:What's the Strangelove reference? Washington riding atop the giant nuke in the bomb bay.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 04:31
|
|
|
I did find it pretty funny that NOMAD was somehow both at blimp height, and near the Karman line, depending on what the scene called for. This movie will definitely annoy you if you have CinemaSins brains.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 04:49
|
|
|
Solid but flawed Sci Fi movie. I got to let it gestate a bit before stating thoughts. A good one though.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 05:14
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:Washington riding atop the giant nuke in the bomb bay. Lol, duh.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 05:21
|
|
|
dpkg chopra posted:I did find it pretty funny that NOMAD was somehow both at blimp height, and near the Karman line, depending on what the scene called for. Not every movie can be as real as Elysium, but this one isn't really going for that anyways. The alt-history retrofuturism and the self-conscious anime style cover most any complaint. Like, there's a bit at the end that I can only interpret as a reference to fuckin' GunHed. That being said, NOMAD obviously doesn't need to chill in space, and just floats down when it feels like intimidating people.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 05:23
|
|
|
NOMAD can be best understood as the Death Star if it were an RTS cursor. Permanently loitering, highlighting, dragging and clicking. Modern drones are controlled like a video game, this is even more banal, moving files to the recycle bin.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 05:49
|
|
|
R. Guyovich posted:good: more media messaging that it is just for the peoples of the global south to do armed struggle against the us war machine, dog playing fetch with grenade, 30-second interrogation of a dead man, big beefy suicide boys, ralph ineson, ken watanabe, allison janney, ice cream bomb fakeout curious where do the Uighur fall into New Asia?
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 05:55
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:curious where do the Uighur fall into New Asia? There was a scene where nervous R2D2s do suicide bombings.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 06:19
|
|
|
There's that old saw about how SF isn't really about the future but instead about the present. I think my issue with this movie is that it's really about the past. It's beautiful and I agree with everything it's saying, but it's not adding anything new to the conversation. That said, I did enjoy it because I'm happy to take any cyberpunk adjacent stuff that's on offer.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 17:38
|
|
|
I listened to a brief interview with Edwards who said he first came up with the movie in 2010 so that I think explains the mindset a bit more. Not that America has stopped being imperialist or whatever, but I think the withdrawal from Afghanistan and the Iraq War being “over” gives the robot 9/11 plot line slightly less cultural relevance. Edwards also straight up says that “AI” was just code for “the other”. It’s honestly a bit surprising (in a good way) that they didn’t do any sort of rewrite to fit it with what we currently see as “AI” in the news. dpkg chopra fucked around with this message at 18:44 on Oct 2, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 18:41
|
|
|
Joementum posted:I was trying to be charitable to its critics who, from the reviews I’ve seen, seem to have absorbed the marketing that it’s a movie about AI, which I think is about as true as saying that Starship Troopers (probably this movie’s closest parallel after Star Wars) is about entomology. I see. I haven't read reviews, but it’s funny that there are those that have gotten lost in both directions — from the history of A.I. in sci-fi to blindly lapping up the A.I. marketing of our tech overlords in order to produce the most banal interpretation.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 20:04
|
|
|
dpkg chopra posted:I listened to a brief interview with Edwards who said he first came up with the movie in 2010 so that I think explains the mindset a bit more. Yeah, I think the mindset has changed to where liberals are more jingoistic than ever because they've been given permission to forget the last 20 years of American history.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 20:07
|
|
|
I don’t know that America has become more jingoistic, it’s just become a much more polarized issue. The likely crowd for this movie probably already vaguely agrees that American boots on the ground is essentially bad, but it’s been a while since it’s been a hot topic issue so it’s just like “in the past” and America is now bad in different ways than the subject of the movie. I do wonder what a pro-American exceptionalism type of person thought of this movie.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 20:49
|
|
|
They're already telling you - it's not sufficiently anti-Russia or anti-China, criticism of American hegemony is passé and even cringe.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 21:12
|
|
|
PeterWeller posted:There's that old saw about how SF isn't really about the future but instead about the present. I think people talking about the film’s ‘simplistic message’ aren’t doing enough to form an oppositional reading. What does ‘droid freedom’ actually entail when the good guys have a capitalist society with a familiar gig economy, prostitution, etc.? Is Alphie - literally designed to be God - an Antichrist? In any case, this definitely isn’t a Cold War movie, and I’d say a “subtext is for cowards” version of Star Wars is quite relevant today, given the whole Disney thing. The Creator is really enhanced by first sitting through the litany of dogshit superhero movie trailers that precede a given showing. Going from Marvels and Aquaman 2 to this.
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 22:40
|
|
|
VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:That sounds good to me, dude. Only one of those is a good movie imo but even though I don't expect this to be as good as a Blomkamp joint I'm excited!
|
|
#
?
Oct 2, 2023 23:52
|
|
|
Were NOMAD's missiles supposed to be nukes? It seemed like no, but then he goes back to the beach house and he has to wear the suit?? But also he takes it off???
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 03:39
|
|
|
Why are they just plucky guerillas fighting the Americans? Where are the New Asian military forces? Is it just police? Feels like they omitted the fact the US invaded and put in a puppet government.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 07:34
|
|
|
I mentioned in gen Guardians 3 is literally a better movie about the other
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 08:03
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:I think people talking about the film’s ‘simplistic message’ aren’t doing enough to form an oppositional reading. What does ‘droid freedom’ actually entail when the good guys have a capitalist society with a familiar gig economy, prostitution, etc.? Is Alphie - literally designed to be God - an Antichrist? I don't think the movie's message is simplistic. It's just not new. Like "are the robots just free to be exploited now?" is a question cyberpunk spent the 90s asking. You had a very different trailer experience from me. I got a trailer for some horror movie I can't remember and one for The Bikeriders, so my only trailer thoughts going into this were, "why name it that when 'The Vandals' is right there?"
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 13:16
|
|
|
"Why do they call you Big Evil?"
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 13:51
|
|
|
Mae posted:Why are they just plucky guerillas fighting the Americans? Correct, New Asia (assuming it even exists as a polity) has only a police force. As Ken tells us, the us army is lying about the necessity of the war and the casus belli.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 14:28
|
|
|
I am seeing a lot reviews where people are reading the film to be literally about AI, no metaphors. Just people who somehow are capable of breathing and presumably like going to the toilet on their own and who also believe that the message of this film is unironically "AI is the underdog and people should stop being mean to it" or something.
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 18:39
|
|
|
Majkol posted:I am seeing a lot reviews where people are reading the film to be literally about AI, no metaphors. Just people who somehow are capable of breathing and presumably like going to the toilet on their own and who also believe that the message of this film is unironically "AI is the underdog and people should stop being mean to it" or something. Well, they're not wrong; the film literally is about this new species of people whose creation requires the various massive facilities that you see scattered around the landscape. They're people, but not human. The confusion between today's algorithmic text-generation poo poo and actual AI is a major plot point - expressed succinctly in the "they were built to take our jobs" scene. If the robots aren't actual AIs, then they're just an extension of the capitalists looking to reduce labour costs through automation. But, of course, if they are actual people then, yeah, they're slaves. This confusion is rather crucial to understanding the conflict of the film; since the war obviously isn't actually about the Americans seeking revenge against Skynet for the Terminator-referencing bombing of LA. That was just a pretext for western fascists to scapegoat the failings of capitalism (unemployment, etc.) onto this minority. And that's perennial. Think, like, anti-Asian bigotry during COVID. So, people are understanding the film, to a degree. They're just on the side of the Americans
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 19:30
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:Is Alphie - literally designed to be God - an Antichrist? I really couldn’t figure out the movie’s perspective on this specifically, and the several scenes of Alphie subduing individual robots to her will and temporarily enslaving them. Presumably she’ll, like, keep on doing that? And she can deactivate machines as she pleases, and is unique. Does she have a gun to the head of robotkind, forever? That final shot of her grinning could be read as kinda creepy, right?
|
|
#
?
Oct 3, 2023 23:20
|
|
|
quote:GARETH EDWARDS: I really was using robots and AI as a metaphor for people who are different, you know, the other and the idea of, like, how we always reject people who are different and fear them, and vice versa, they do the same to us https://www.npr.org/2023/09/29/1202745342/he-wrote-this-film-before-ai-was-a-hot-topic-now-its-all-the-rage Also, I was wrong, he wrote the screenplay in 2018 so honestly idk why he went so hard on the 9/11 angle so late in the game. This movie was great, I just wish Edwards had brought in Tony Gilroy and just given us Andor again.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 00:51
|
|
|
Also it felt pretty clear that Alphie was supposed to be a Buddha-like figure helping free Joshua (and the world) and the world from suffering and achieve some sort nirvana. Of course, it was as nuanced as the concept of “New Asia”.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 00:57
|
|
|
Edwards had nothing to do with andor. Sounds like you wanted Tony gilroy to do it lol
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 03:36
|
|
|
CelticPredator posted:Edwards had nothing to do with andor. Sounds like you wanted Tony gilroy to do it lol I thought Edwards had been involved in Andor but I'm probably confusing it with Rogue One, which had Edwards as director and Gilroy as scriptwriter. In any case, my point was that I enjoyed The Creator and think that the same world, aesthetics, and premise with a more nuanced script would've been fantastic.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 03:49
|
|
|
Gilroy was brought on to re do the script late in the game for reshoots.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 04:09
|
|
|
dpkg chopra posted:Also it felt pretty clear that Alphie was supposed to be a Buddha-like figure helping free Joshua (and the world) and the world from suffering and achieve some sort nirvana. What is the 'missing' nuance?
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 04:32
|
|
|
I thought the art design and visuals were great, but the world was totally incoherent and underbaked. So New Asia is at war with the US, but there isn't a US puppet government theres still a police force and presumably indigenous government. So the nomad station is just floating around shooting missiles at...cities? "Bases" (whatever the gently caress those are)? Why do none of the cities in New Asia appear to be affected by the war? Why is the US a halo-esque post-scarcity looking society? Alfie crawls into a giant holographic projection of the world on the nomad station - where is everybody? Who is that projection for? Edit: sorry, last thing. Allison Janney looks loving great. lonelylikezoidberg fucked around with this message at 06:57 on Oct 4, 2023 |
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 06:52
|
|
|
lonelylikezoidberg posted:So New Asia is at war with the US, but there isn't a US puppet government theres still a police force and presumably indigenous government. So the nomad station is just floating around shooting missiles at...cities? "Bases" (whatever the gently caress those are)? The US of the film is not (yet) at war with any Asian nation, but specifically just concerned with the AI rebels who have been plotting and conducting attacks on targets like NOMAD. These rebels are secretive and happen to be totally enmeshed in the cities and town, so the US - hands tied - has been performing the occasional 'surgical' airstrike and clandestine attack, with limited success. The events of the film are a sudden and extreme escalation by the Americans in response to news of "the weapon". Also, the station's technical staff were all evacuated.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 07:18
|
|
|
Also, if any other country in the world sees robots as anything approaching people, the US's stated charter in New Asia is a straight up genocide. But I guess everybody just goes along with the US, predictably
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 07:34
|
|
|
I have a lot of questions about the plot but I want to know what the gently caress that tentacle robot was in the escape pod room. Like what purpose does that serve. We really need to reduce US military spending, goddamn.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 08:12
|
|
|
How are people feeling about JDW? The protagonist in Tenet was purposefully underwritten, but here — I don’t know. He’s convincing without being particularly charismatic. I can’t fault him but I’m not sure he has what it takes to carry a movie. I have two straight up plot questions which may have been explained but I somehow blanked it out: 1) So, if Maya had been in a coma since the attack, where did the video come from that they showed Joshua at the start? Was it old, a fake, or were they just lying when they said she was verified human? 2) Why was there was a copy of Maya on the Nomad at the end? Was that just a supply of backup workers and by coincidence one of them happened to have her face..?
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 12:53
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 6, 2024 08:28 |
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:The US of the film is not (yet) at war with any Asian nation, but specifically just concerned with the AI rebels who have been plotting and conducting attacks on targets like NOMAD. These rebels are secretive and happen to be totally enmeshed in the cities and town, so the US - hands tied - has been performing the occasional 'surgical' airstrike and clandestine attack, with limited success. I hear what you are saying but am going to push back a little. In the movie an American official specifically says "we are at war with New Asia"
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2023 13:23
|
|