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FFVIIR benefits from a lot of ancillary dialogue. It's something I've noticed in my ben billion runs of FFVII, how relatively spartan the interactions are in rounding off the characters and the party dynamic. Like, Cloud goes from "who cares the planet is dying" too cool for school soldier-man to pretty nice guy in about five minutes. He really drops the rear end in a top hat merc gimmick after Tifa's bar, honestly. It's pretty abrupt. FFVIIR had the money and format to expand on everyone massively. I also don't particularly like VIIR but it did essentially give me what I always wanted in those FFVIIR replays, more interactions between the characters, so I'm not complaining. Everyone here talking about parallel universes, and here I am just wondering what Barret's arc will be since AVALANCHE explicitly did not kill a bunch of civilians in this version.
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Feb 23, 2024 20:25
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cock hero flux posted:i don't know that this is true. he's more invested in saving aeristh from the shinra building and afterwards his personal vendetta against sephiroth than he was AVALANCHE so when that becomes the focus he has a lot less reason to go "i don't care" all the time. I don't think that's an abrupt change in characterization. He's still notably a dick for large portion of the game, including my personal standout line "Listen, Yuffie, I don't care about the history of Wutai or your feelings". I mean, none of the party was feeling particularly sympathetic to Yuffie at that point. Same for most players, I imagine. She just robbed all of them - all of us - and this theoretically could have also gotten them killed. I never perceived this as being on par with how he treats Barret early on. He had pretty justifiable reasons to dismiss her after all she's done. (and will do since this was all still part of her ploy) But you are right he does have a personal motive for the stuff after meeting Aerith, as well as he's the leader now so he can't very well "mouth off" to someone about his orders cuz he's the one giving the orders. Still, things like Fort Condor are an option for you to do. That's literally giving up money just to help protect some hippies and their birds Then you are saving a little girl from a monster and with CPR. I dunno, I just can't really remember any unjustifiably rude lines or actions from Cloud after the first couple hours. Unless you count kicking that ball at Red XIII as hard as he could over and over again. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bNK5zgyQLo4
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Feb 23, 2024 21:31
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cock hero flux posted:you can do the same quest with tifa in the lead and her version of the line is far less mean That's a great point. I assume you can do it as Cid as well? I haven't waited to do it that late in a long, long time. EDIT: quote:Cloud This site is invaluable. I've certainly never seen a lot of these reactions to getting Vincent: quote:Cloud, Tifa, or Cid NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 04:24 on Feb 24, 2024 |
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Feb 24, 2024 04:16
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Is there like a good bullet point list of spoilers for Rebirth? I don't feel like watching any cutscenes, just want a good, reliable list of notable changes and stuff. (the stuff posted earlier seemed pretty tenuous, and I thought some of it was debunked.) I figure there has to be such a reliable list by now.
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Feb 29, 2024 09:56
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Rageaholic posted:Also, Hojo is Sephiroth's dad? gently caress Hojo! That last thing is revealed in OG FFVII, just fyi. It is just like one line and doesn't go anywhere unless you recruited Vincent, though.
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Mar 7, 2024 22:19
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ImpAtom posted:If by "go nowhere" you mean "Hojo literally hijacks the Sister Ray so he can shoot a bunch of energy to Sephiroth and you have to go and stop him" because, and I quote "My son is in need of power and help. ...That's the only reason." I mean...Hojo dies and becomes irrelevant immediately after he says it. No one ever mentions it again. That's how it goes nowhere. I can easily see why someone forgot one or two lines in a JRPG that have zero follow up of any kind.
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Mar 7, 2024 23:42
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ImpAtom posted:Because the game literally ends directly after that. Nobody mentions it because aside from wandering around breeding chocobos and collecting Materia the party is at the end of the game. Sure, I don't dispute any of that. I was just saying that, with Vincent, the lines have a lot more context and weight. Otherwise, as you yourself just said, "Hojo says the lines, game rushes to the end, roll credits." It can get easily lost in everything else happening with no wider impact(especially if you only played it once, as the OP added later), which is why Vincent and Lucrecia sort of give it that. For twenty years I've seen fans puzzled Vincent is even optional given how much context he adds to the main villain's backstory.
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Mar 7, 2024 23:58
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The Dave posted:It will be interesting to see how/if they can stop going to the FF7verse after part 3. They're going to have so much investment in development and assets and they know it will be highly profitable. There's supposed to be that FFIX remake. Which still kinda baffles me. FFX would be the logical next one to remake. Although I don't want an FFX remake in an ARPG style so they can do FFIX instead, please. Azubah posted:Is the soldier degradation the same as the geostigma stuff from AC? It's just jenova cells trying to take over the body, right? Near as I recall from theorizing about AC from two decades ago now, Geostigma was a specific reaction of the Jenova Cells in people, probably triggered by Sephiroth. Jenova at this point is super dead. Like, nobody got a fatal disease from having Jenova Cells in the original game or its backstory. They got brainwashed and overpoweed but it wasn't fantasy cancer. Cloud had Jenova Cells in him for years while he's basically at death's door from Geostigma by AC. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 18:50 on Mar 11, 2024 |
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Mar 11, 2024 18:44
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cock hero flux posted:i guess we're working on ff9 rules now That's exactly where my mind went, too.
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Mar 11, 2024 19:51
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The Gi stuff is certainly more complex than in the original. Did the game give any indication that the Cetra or Planet will be more morally ambiguous in this as well?
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Mar 11, 2024 21:27
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ImpAtom posted:The Planet isn't really morally ambiguous. It's a living organism and the Lifestream and creation of life is part of its lifecycle, but that doesn't mean it isn't willing to lay loving waste if it needs to. The original game had Weapons and the whole "There's a pretty reasonable chance if we unleash Holy it will loving end humanity because we're a threat too" part. The planet being able, and willing, to gently caress up things it considers threats was always there. Yes but that's what I'm saying. The Planet is the supreme judge and whatever it decides is right. Our heroes don't wanna die but they aren't saying "this is unfair and the Planet has no right to do this." It has every right to do it because there's no moral ambiguity. If humans got erased, it's because they deserved it. The stuff on the Gi makes the Planet sound much less perfectly just.
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Mar 11, 2024 21:45
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So Aerith dies at the very end of Rebirth, correct? I was responding to this in the RPG thread, how Square has totally lost their nerve when it comes to character deaths. What was so impactful about the OG was not what happened, but when it happened. And yet in every game after? Vivi, Tidus(gently caress off, X-2), Fang and Vanille(gona count them), Noctis....it all happens when the game is over. Not that it doesn't make you sad but it's not surprising. And then here comes Rebirth, perfectly crystalizing my point. It takes the same character who is noteworthy for her death midway through the game and transports it to the very end. I wonder if they will ever dare to do what FFIV or FFVII did again?
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Mar 12, 2024 20:53
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ImpAtom posted:.. uh? Really? I don't know poo poo about XVI but I was originally responding to to your own comment that Clive dying at the end is just what to expect from FF games nowadays. I did not think anyone else died. My bad. I retract my criticism, then.
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Mar 12, 2024 21:08
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He did make Vincent which I don't think had anything to do with Jenova. He just turned some random guy he shot into an immortal monster. Dunno if that shows he's a great scientist but he has some ability.
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Apr 11, 2024 23:24
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Augus posted:in the original the only Sephiroth clone that made it to the Reunion was one that Hojo considered a reject and when he realized this he threw a temper tantrum That's not true, actually. It's something I always saw as weird. We explicitly see before the Jenova DEATH fight two black robed men with "Sephiroth" and he proceeds to kill them. But they got there, brain-scrambled normies that they were, they still climbed a mountain and got through a maze full of monsters and poo poo. He just killed them for it. Hojo wouldn't know this, of course. It's just...I felt bad for those two. They made it despite the overwhelming odds and Seph still killed them. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Apr 11, 2024 |
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Apr 11, 2024 23:46
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ImpAtom posted:I presume they are going to get a redemption arc in the Return to Midgar/Meteorfall where they are shown doing everything they can to save people's lives during the evacuation, because that is canonically what they were doing during that time frame. (It's also when all the Turks who are in hiding come out of hiding to assist.) Wait, do you mean in the original game? If so, was that in some supplement? All we do with them in OG FFVII is fight them or choose not to fight them if you did Wutai. I don't remember anything about them going around saving people.
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Apr 12, 2024 22:47
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Ardryn posted:I think if Vincent had the wherewithal to team up with Zack, then the two of them might have been able to handle Sephiroth, but that might is doing a lot of heavy lifting. If they survived it be a pretty funny and great friendship, though. Vincent looks like a Magus or Shadow but he's actually really nice, just very melodramatic and serious, perfect as a foil for Zack.
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Apr 14, 2024 20:18
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Harrow posted:It's important to keep scale in mind here, too. VII Rebirth likely isn't meeting expectations sales-wise, but it's also handily outselling every other JRPG released around the same time, like Persona 3 Reload and Like a Dragon: Infinite Wealth. These are all excellent games, of course, but it's worth noting that "poor sales" for a major Final Fantasy game is still a pretty high number by JRPG standards. We're not talking about a flop. I've always wondered about the plethora of sequels and spinoffs ever since X-2 and if that diluted the brand any? Everything else you mentioned is also a contributing factor but X-2 was such a big game changer back in the day because of its sequel sttatus, and then Square has just continued that trend with sequels big and small, to say nothing of remakes now. If you hear about the new Final Fantasy game, that used to mean the new Final Fantasy game. Not now and not for 22 years and certainly never again. JBP posted:I wonder if this is just him being fully voiced and having an expressive face? I'd actually forgotten about the Dyne plot and had a massive sad face when I arrived at Corel and it came flooding back. Yeah, in the original Dyne and Barret fight because Dyne has a speech about how he wants to kill everyone, settling on Marlene, talking about how his dead wife is lonely so he has to kill Marlene and they can both go to his wife. He pretty nuts. Death was a mercy for him.
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Apr 16, 2024 00:28
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Jetrauben posted:Honestly I felt Dyne was really well done in Rebirth, particularly the painful note that he simultaneously desperately wants to die, wants to save Barret, and refuses to let him have closure when he dies. That scene was rough, and really effective, because in the original Dyne more or less marked the end of Barret's arc being of great significance, but in the Remake trilogy, as with many other characters (most notably Nanaki by adding his new goal to save the Gi without omnicide), his chapter spurs him on but does not resolve his issues. That is something people criticize about certain older JRPGs. Even if characters have arcs, they tend to wrap up at a designated town or spot in the story and after that they just kinda linger. My beloved Xenogears is guilty of this with characters like Billy, Marie, or Bart. Then you get your Rico's or Freya from FFIX where their arc just gets gutted and never really resolved. I've always felt like the presence of voice-acting helps a lot. It allows for incidental dialogue to keep everyone feeling involved. (Assuming the game cares enough to try and keep them involved like FFX. FFXII emphatically did not)
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Apr 16, 2024 02:56
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I think FFX's ending hits pretty hard as is. Also I wonder if people would actually care this time if Square tried to just dump all the English VAs associated with one of their most beloved titles. You'd hope so. But really I just don't want it remade because it be an ARPG. Even ARPG fans seem to understand my feelings on this one since FFX is a massively beloved game for many reasons, its battle system being one of them. Its turn-based gameplay is praised quite as much as its characters, story, soundtrack, and all the other non-minigame things it did exceptionally well. But hey, FFIX is next on the horizon. They can do whatever the gently caress they want with that. Exactly no one will miss its gameplay or voice-acting(from Dissidia or whatever).
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Apr 16, 2024 11:28
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OG FFVII is too easy, like most FF games. It doesn't mean you can't use strategy, you just don't have to. You gotta look to mods and hacks to bring out the more interesting aspects of the battle system, again just like pretty much every FF game.Jetrauben posted:It's nice. It helps reinforce the idea that the world's actually worth fighting for instead of that vaguely misanthropic 90s "maybe humanity is the virus" undertone. I enjoyed finding Parasite Eve and how much it, FFVII, and Chrono Cross al had in common with this theme.
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Apr 16, 2024 20:06
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