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DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Jetrauben posted:

My money is on "there is weird time/space fuckery going on and Cloud saved Aerith in one timeline but it's overlapping with a version where she died, leading to dimensional fuckery." I do not think we're seeing a third game without a playable Aerith, though; she's clearly still an active presence and not just a hallucination, even if she's also a lifestream ghost or liminal being. Red reacts to her, even if he doesn't seem to realize it's her.

I saw the observation that both Cloud and Tifa, people who have touched the Lifestream, seem to see both Aerith dead and Aerith alive in that moment when Sephiroth stabs her, and notably Tifa lingers longest by the pool where we can assume they laid her body to rest and looks the most uncomfortable and disturbed by what's going on. Trying to reconcile conflicting memories? Doubting her own sanity? Unclear.

That said, I think we didn't see the burial because not only was Cloud possibly not present for it per se in this version of events, but also because it'll be the big reveal that starts the breakdown in the third game, when the rest of the party challenges him on not realizing/acknowledging that Aerith is extremely dead and buried.

EDIT: Also, I think the implications of the doomed timeline is that Zack (and Aerith and Cloud when you have your date) is experiencing every one of his deaths. There's not multiple Zacks, there's one Zack who keeps getting cycled through different possibilities that keep ending in his death. But like Aerith for example is wearing all three colors of jewelry bangles from Cloud's "date" with her, indicating she's done this multiple times, I think?

It'd explain that weird part where Cloud's happily all "Let's go everyone!" while Tifa is having a funeral moment

Actually Yuffie mood shifts from Funeral to Yay in like ten seconds but that could just be Yuffie I guess

DeathChicken fucked around with this message at 01:40 on Apr 1, 2024

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DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

And you can't choose the Stamp doll, the vendor is like "Oh I meant pick anything except that"

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

It's funny, my immediate thought at the end was "Oh *this* was what it felt like to see Empire Strikes Back in 1980"

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

It's funny since the timeline Zack doesn't choose in that scene seems to literally wipe itself out as he passes it. Then he turns up in it anyway

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Given how Sephiroth boss fights have gone so far it'll be a OHKO if you don't stagger him (at the end of whittling his health for 20 minutes)

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Given the Confluence of Worlds cheevo that pops at the end, I'm definitely under the impression that Cloud saved Aerith, but then the OG timeline where he didn't save her smushed into that one and we now have Schrodinger's Aerith who is or isn't dead depending on who's looking at her

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

"Cloud! I understand your girlfriend is trapped in a state of quantum indecision but if you aren't busy with that, how about collecting more intel"

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

It was a fun touch Tifa has posters of Emerald and Ruby up in her room at Nibelheim (or rather tourist posters that happen to look just like the Weapons)

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

That's pretty much where I am, in complete denial they'd be hacky enough to write a story about changing fate and then go nah you can't change fate convinced we have merged timelines now and Aerith is somehow in a dead/not dead state depending on who's paying attention to her. Kind of a Nonary Games type thing

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

You also have Zack coming to the conclusion "gently caress fate you guys are assholes" and he's probably the most unambiguously Heroic Good person in the tale

Reaching this conclusion after bumping repeatedly into timelines that kept getting him killed, to make it funnier

DeathChicken fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Apr 6, 2024

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

I mentioned it earlier but it really made me think of Nonary Games where Akane died in the past of one timeline, then in the game's timeline if she didn't mess with things in such a way to correct that she'd Back to the Future fade out of existence

It'd explain Aerith both being and not being there at the end of Rebirth, anyway

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Sephiroth trying his level best to kill Tifa dead in the Lifestream was pretty funny. Like presumably that's the real him, not a Jenova puppet or whatever, and the *only* thing Sephiroth Prime absolutely 100% tries to do is murder Tifa

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Yeah, Hojo is pretty explicitly a second rate scientist who shot Gast in the head and stole all his research

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

We're gonna get a scene in part 3 where Barret complains about taking the stairs at Shinra HQ and Tifa is like "No we took the elevator you're insane"

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

She talks about getting saved in third person ("I saw what you did back there, thank you") so....probably

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

The only Turk who seemed to really show any misgivings about the Sector 7 murder was Reno. Tseng was like "Well if we didn't do it someone else would have" and Rude put his head down and charged at that Kill Everyone button like it was going to sprout boots and run away

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

I think Zack in Crisis Core was the same age then as Yuffie is now, which is kind of funny and weird

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Hell, Zack opens his coffin in Crisis Core, finds him snoring, goes "Okay I guess I'll leave him alone" and closes it

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

It doesn't make much sense at all to be a Cloud hallucination if Red can also tell she's there

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

Zack is the most consistently Good Dude in the entire story and it takes until the end of Rebirth for him to figure out the universe is literally out to kill him for it

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DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

The cheevo you get at the end of the game is Confluence of Worlds, so I'm under the impression that A) Cloud saved Aerith B) it got smushed into the OG timeline where Cloud didn't save Aerith. We're now reading a Choose Your Own Adventure book where we could have gone to page 50 or page 60 and instead the pages are superimposed

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