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Premiering February 27th, 2024 - FX's Shogun, a miniseries adaptation of James Clavell's classic novel set in feudal Japan. Shogun depicts a fictionalized re-telling of the dawn of the Tokugawa Shogunate. The story revolves around an English sailor who is marooned in Japan, where he must adapt to a strikingly different set of social and cultural norms in order to survive. Upon being stranded, this foreigner becomes embroiled in an ongoing conflict between Japan's most powerful daimyos. The novel was written in 1975 and achieved international success. It was adapted into a TV miniseries in 1980 starring Richard Chamberlain, Toshiro Mifune, Yoko Shimada, and John Rhys-Davies. The original miniseries earned critical praise and was nominated for numerous emmy awards, winning for Best Miniseries. The 2024 FX series has already garnered attention for its period-accuracy, visuals, and quality. Fans of the novel have good reason to hope for fidelity to the source material, as Clavell's daughter serves as a producer for the show and has praised its adherence to the themes of the novel. It is set to premiere on Feb. 27th on both Hulu and FX, followed by weekly releases for the 10 part miniseries. Cast: Hiroyuki Sanada as Lord Yoshii Toranaga (Tokugawa Ieyasu) Cosmo Jarvis as Pilot Major John Blackthorne (William Adams) Anna Sawai as Toda Mariko (Hosokawa Gracia) Tadanobu Asano as Kashigi Yabushige (Honda Masanobu) Hiroto Kanai as Kashigi Omi (Honda Masazumi) Takehiro Hira as Ishido Kazunari (Ishida Mitsunari)  Trailers: "Final" Preview Trailer (Jan 2024) First Preview Trailer (Nov 2023) 
FLIPADELPHIA fucked around with this message at 03:38 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 00:31
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| # ¿ May 9, 2024 12:42 |
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As a big fan of the novel and someone who couldn't ever really get into the 1980 tv version, I am very much looking forward to this. The emphasis seems to be on the intrigue and cultural / political tension, which definitely sounds appealing. The visuals and set pieces look stunning, and I'm personally always up for historical fiction with good production values. The large ensemble cast and a 10 hour run time seem tailor made to give the story a balance of depth and cinematic grandeur. Early reviews seem very positive, so I'm just trying not to set the bar too high 
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Feb 26, 2024 00:44
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Yeah there is definitely room for criticism of the White Savior / Protagonist variety in the novel- hopefully there are more modern sensibilities at play that can address that, or at least hit a middle ground that minimizes the questionable stuff.
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Feb 26, 2024 22:44
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Episode 1 is available on Hulu as of now.
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Feb 27, 2024 20:50
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I only had time to watch the first 20 minutes or so before a work meeting but if it's any indication, this is going to be really good.
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Feb 27, 2024 21:53
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IGN declares Shogun a masterpiece.
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Feb 27, 2024 22:24
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I mean it won't be a phenomenon like either of those shows because this will only be one season, while those shows occupied a place in the industry for years. I think this will be received more like Chernobyl, which was lauded / beloved by critics and audiences. It will probably win some awards and generate a lot of buzz and praise for the network, but it won't ever be "water cooler" level, IMO. Also, 100% agree with the poster on how impressive the ship looked. Most media doesn't convey the scale of those ships- this one definitely did. It was an awe inspiring visual. FLIPADELPHIA fucked around with this message at 20:30 on Feb 28, 2024 |
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Feb 28, 2024 20:28
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From my recollection of the novel, and based on what little I know of Oda nobunaga, I think it's implied that the Taiko just really enjoyed war and was particularly good at it. Conquering and subduing Korea would have been a dream job for him, and likely would have required his full attention and a new court to be established there. I think he would have wanted to leave toranaga behind to safeguard the homeland and run it efficiently.
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Mar 1, 2024 00:35
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Thank you for the clarification. You are 100% correct.
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Mar 1, 2024 04:36
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That scene in ep2 in the garden may be one of the most riveting scenes I've ever watched on television. Absolutely gripping. I don't know the actor for Blackthorne but he's really nailing it, as is pretty much everyone.
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Mar 1, 2024 06:38
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Collateral posted:Is that Jarvis' actual accent? It's almost identical to the one employed by Russell Crowe as Cpt Aubrey RN. It's definitely not his natural way of speaking. Here's a pretty good interview with him and Hiroyuki Sanada. Turns out Sanada has played multiple characters and historical figures of this same period throughout his career. Also since he was a producer for the series, he was able to insist on hiring qualified Japanese advisors and crew to make sure the authenticity is there. Very cool stuff. I'd say that the gravel-y way his voice sounds is natural but yeah, his affected accent definitely sounds exactly like Crowe in M&C. I wonder if that's intentional, given the similarity in profession / lingo they'd employ. FLIPADELPHIA fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Mar 1, 2024 |
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Mar 1, 2024 17:22
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Stare-Out posted:Sure but goodness those contacts. He's good in the part and all but just hire a blue-eyed actor or something. Clearly it doesn't bug anyone else here so I'll clam up about it because otherwise the show is very good. No you are 100% correct. They went through extreme pains to craft a visually stunning series of scenes, complete with period-precise costumes, props, backgrounds, etc and then the co-lead has distractingly bad colored contacts. I just don't understand that decision. Two of my friends who are also watching the show independently made the same comments. You are definitely not alone on this, and it's unfortunate. Especially in today's industry where they can change that stuff in post production. If you want him to have blue eyes fine, but it looks like poo poo.
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Mar 1, 2024 21:44
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My interpretation is that the vote gives them the authority to impeach, but I don't know that they are required to immediately have him executed. There have been a few examples so far of administrative power being quite flexible in terms of how it's used. The Jesuit priest gave a great example when he stated his fear that Toranaga would insist on a complete translation of the captain's journal, with the implication being that he could stretch that process out as long as he wanted or needed to. I'm guessing this is another example of that. Once the impeachment vote is decided, then Toranaga's fate is sealed, but Ishido would probably have some discretion on the timeline.
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Mar 3, 2024 20:29
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MeinPanzer posted:Thanks for the explanations about the politics, everyone. I don't think ishido is thinking about keeping toranaga alive for longer than it takes to figure out why the Catholic daimyos want Blackthorne dead so badly. Ishido is smart enough to know that both of them threatening to withhold their votes to impeach Toranaga (something they've all been working toward for some time it seems) means there's something bigger at play here. He wants to figure that out if he can, before having his allies quickly become his chief rivals after Toranaga is gone. Ishido is a dangerous enemy, Toranaga's only equal on the council. He thinks multiple moves ahead, which is why he wants to position himself as strongly as he can against the Catholic daimyos before the board shifts.
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Mar 4, 2024 15:40
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I don't think ishido is "low born", I think he's just from a moderately prestigious samurai clan. Being lower in the social hierarchy than Toranaga definitely irks him, as he takes every opportunity he can to belittle the reputation (I think he has done this on three separate occasions already) of Toranaga's clan and his ancestry. He's samurai middle class and the show has done a fantastic job showing that some middle-class people have a special hatred that stems from simultaneously believing in their superiority compared to lower classes and their vicious jealousy and resentment towards those higher than them. The actor portraying ishido has done a great job depicting someone who is just completely miserable, always stewing in a blend of arrogance and envy. This is also set in a time when a literal peasant became the de facto ruler of Japan (the Taiko). That event has definitely lit a fire in people like ishido who no longer need to respect the hierarchy as a legitimate obstacle to their ambitions. If a peasant can rule, then surely he can.
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Mar 4, 2024 16:33
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joepinetree posted:I don't think the show has addressed Ishido's social background yet, but the shogun fx page describes him as a former peasant who moved up through military success. In the scene where Ishido tells Yabu about his rise under the Taiko, he [Ishido] states that every lord in the country sent their finest stones, and his was chosen as the corner piece. I took that to mean Ishido was from a samurai family - especially since the character in the novel is based on Ishida Mitsunari who was not a peasant. Maybe the show will clear it up in the coming episodes.
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Mar 4, 2024 17:17
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Show looks very good on Hulu.
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Mar 5, 2024 17:57
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Jerusalem posted:
I'm not sure why but this poo poo made me laugh for like 4 solid minutes
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Mar 7, 2024 06:20
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It could be any or all three of those things- concealing his true plans / motives is his most defining practice.
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Mar 7, 2024 19:15
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I'm liking the interpretation of the character. He is, as someone else stated, a pretty weird dude but that makes total sense for someone who spends years sailing around and not interacting with regular people. He's brash and awkward but also quick thinking. Perfect qualities for a young pilot to have.
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Mar 8, 2024 19:27
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Eau de MacGowan posted:no toranaga bellyflop 0/10 uhh, I mean it wasn't a catastrophic "I just poo poo myself / died" bellyflop but he most certainly did gently caress up the dive- he landed at about a 45 degree angle on the water and I even audibly said "ouch" watching it lol
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Mar 8, 2024 22:52
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A SHAMEFUL DISPLAY!
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Mar 12, 2024 01:43
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Ep 4, holy poo poo.
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Mar 12, 2024 06:11
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Jerusalem posted:
Was about to post the exact same thing re: Yabu. The scene where he takes out his blade and looks Anjin right in the eye establishes him early on as a guy who is ready to die at any moment, which makes his YOLO approach to life much more meaningful and authentic. Dude has one shot and he's going to make the most of it. Also, I was skeptical that they'd be able to pull off the romantic aspect of the plot but I think the actors really sold it. When they let their guard down, they have a good chemistry. Jarvis has a goony earnestness about him while Anna Sawai really pulls off the vulnerability. Unexpected power couple. FLIPADELPHIA fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Mar 12, 2024 |
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Mar 12, 2024 13:42
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Yabu is definitely in over his head but only because Toranaga is a god-level schemer and manipulator. I think the show does a good job showing us that Yabu's scheming is conducted well enough to escape notice by everyone except Toranaga, who obviously sees it and is confident enough in his own abilities to let Yabu know he sees it. "You are so lucky, always in the right place at the right time" was a real power flex. He's telling Yabu that he sees his ambition and even respects it enough to let him keep climbing, but to take it down a notch and balance it with patience and trust in Toranaga to come out on top.
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Mar 12, 2024 21:04
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Mariko was reading his journal, not the rutter. The journal was full of poo poo like "lol we hosed this island up" and "burned that whole city to the ground RIP bitches" which I thought would be viewed more negatively by her, but then she talks about how much pain she's endured because of her enemies and I think that in a weird way makes them kindred spirits. She understands why the Anjin doesn't show mercy to his enemies, and maybe she even admires it because she longs for that sort of agency in order to have her own revenge.
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Mar 13, 2024 07:02
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When a book adaptation earns my respect by actually being good (like this one) I for one am willing to give the writers / directors the benefit of the doubt for scene changes like the boat scene. I thought it played out fine in the show despite the differences from the book. There are a million possible reasons why the scene was changed, and as long as the show is delivering on the themes, plots, and performances, I'm fine with their choices.
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Mar 14, 2024 18:32
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"the scene is WAY better in the books!" is often just gatekeeping dickery by people wanting recognition that their book fandom makes them super cool opposed to these show tourists who just don't understand, bro
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Mar 14, 2024 23:42
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Panzeh posted:I do love scenes of people being tired of Anjin's nonsense. In particular, I loved the scene where Toranaga is listening to Anjin and Mariko ineptly hide their lover's quarrel and he stands up and says "I cannot spend any more time on this nonsense" What an amazing character moment. He's annoyed and resigned, but not angry. He knows he doesn't have the time or energy to teach Anjin how to be Japanese, and that their cultures are too different to make conversation on the topic constructive. He's got his entire life and legacy to deal with, he can't be bothered to make this rube understand that a gardener's death is nothing to him- he [Toranaga] is juggling the fates of his life, his, clan and his entire society. He has zero capacity to take on more. Stellar acting by everyone involved. I don't know who the gently caress Cosmo Jarvis is (lol fuckin Star Wars rear end name) but he's owning this role.
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Mar 19, 2024 15:46
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I thought the reveal of Mariko's family name was well done. Having read up on the period recently, I recognized the name from actual history so it landed well. It was a real Oh poo poo moment, and really did explain a lot of the subtext that we've seen in her relationships.
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Mar 20, 2024 05:29
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The way I look at it, FX had some concrete parameters that they gave to the showrunners / writers, such as "we're doing 10 episodes max" or "you have 50 mil to spend on this, do what you will" and within those constraints, whatever they are, I feel like the showrunners are exceeding my expectations to such a level that it's nearing perfection as an adaptation. With that in mind, I can't fault the writer(s) for having to rush some things just to make them fit. I do wish we could have 20 episodes but then again, that alternate universe me would be here complaining we can't have 30 lol I think the love story as a rushed element actually makes a lot of sense. They've depicted/cast Mariko as an astonishingly beautiful woman who has been completely trapped in a life she mostly hates, in a marital relationship she completely hates. Even her brief respites from her suffering (her tender moments with her son) are under the cloud of her husband's scorn, disapproval, and abuse. In stumbles this absolute dipshit who has almost nothing in common with her, until she starts to realize they actually have a lot in common and that his dream of adventure and freedom is a captivating, if impossible dream for her. It's totally believable that she'd develop strong feelings for him, and that he would for her as this tragic, melancholy figure who needs protecting. I think the love story is very well done given the above constraints.
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Mar 20, 2024 18:54
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The final twist is revealing those same swords ended up in Stringer Bell's apartment.
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Mar 21, 2024 14:31
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I got the impression it was a series of landslides caused by an earthquake.
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Mar 24, 2024 18:24
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Bobson Dugnutt-sama
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Mar 25, 2024 19:43
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Sash! posted:You always have to sacrifice to make something even remotely filmable, like Apollo 13 being pretty much right but also having to do plenty of "this guy was actually a team of 30." Chernobyl is another good example of this.
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Mar 25, 2024 22:06
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Really great episode, I am really loving the pacing. I wasn't sure what to expect given last week's slow burn, but yet another introspective, measured episode that focuses on the characters was such a great choice. Instead of just ticking the plot event boxes, the showrunners are really working to establish mood and subtlety in how the characters interact. What a breath of fresh air compared against so many other shows that feel rushed or awkwardly paced.
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Mar 27, 2024 06:27
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There are various explanations on the hair thing, the one that seems to be most popular (but not definitive) is that it's a fashion that grew out of period hats / helmets fitting better with a partially shaved scalp. The theory is that it prevented the headgear from sliding around while riding / fighting.
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Mar 28, 2024 03:24
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As someone else pointed out, the costumes are doing a lot of the heavy work in that regard. Combined with good lighting and good to great cinematography...it just looks amazing and has all the grandiosity one would expect from a top tier studio.
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Mar 28, 2024 06:53
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I'm down for Shogun: I Now Super Enjoy Temu Hardy as a new thread title if the mods will it
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Mar 29, 2024 02:26
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| # ¿ May 9, 2024 12:42 |
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Oof, the weakest ep of the series so far IMO. Lots of wheel spinning and rehashing of already fully developed beats. A few good scenes but overall quite underwhelming.
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Apr 2, 2024 06:06
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