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 Beloved 2000's cartoon Avatar the Last Airbender just received it's second live action adaption, and surprise surprise - it's not bad. After getting stuck in ice for a hundred years, a the most magic boy is found by two inuits. They live in a world of benders, where some people can do yoga poses to control either water, fire, wind, or earth. They set off on a journey to help the boy master the those elements and stop the Fire Nation from taking over the world. The original series is still quite beloved, and for good reason. The series has incredible characters and how they change over the journey man story is masterfully done. If you haven't seen it and are wondering if you should, the answer is yes. Netflix is jamming the first season from 20 episodes into 8, but all the highlights are there and it isn't too cramped. How far we've come! 
CatstropheWaitress fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 03:08
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I'm on the last episode now. Assuming Netflix actually lets this finish instead of just doing one season and cancelling it like they do with everything, I really hope in a later season we get the My first girlfriend turned into the moon line.
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Feb 26, 2024 03:20
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Cojawfee posted:I'm on the last episode now. Assuming Netflix actually lets this finish instead of just doing one season and cancelling it like they do with everything, I really hope in a later season we get the My first girlfriend turned into the moon line. That's rough, buddy.
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Feb 26, 2024 03:28
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Trying not to come in too hot here, but I thought this adaptation wasn't that strong. Even ignoring the bad dialogue and stiff acting, there's not a lot here. I think a mate of mine said it best when he said this series only distinguishes itself from the original by virtue of being high res. Like, this sequence is pathetic: but it also makes the Shylaman film more memorable than pretty much anything in this new adaptation.
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Feb 26, 2024 03:36
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I just finished episode 4. I’ve never seen the cartoon or the live action movie, but I’m enjoying it so far. Perhaps not quite as much as I enjoyed Netflix One Piece but it’s good.
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Feb 26, 2024 04:02
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Open Source Idiom posted:Trying not to come in too hot here, but I thought this adaptation wasn't that strong. Even ignoring the bad dialogue and stiff acting, there's not a lot here. I think a mate of mine said it best when he said this series only distinguishes itself from the original by virtue of being high res. Because it's relatively faithful to the cartoon, nothing really stands out to people who have the cartoon memorised. But that's a good thing. If people are just nitpicking stuff i'm 100% fine with that.
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Feb 26, 2024 04:14
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Started it last night with my partner, we immediately found it visually beautiful but nearly unwatchable. Our assessment is that they wrote dialogue that sounds like cartoon dialogue in its simplicity and stiltedness, but because it's live action, the actors can't really over-act and over-deliver to the degree that voice actors can to make cartoon dialogue 'work' in a cartoon. So we have this strange mismatch between the acting and delivery, on the one hand, and the dialogue itself, on the other. The result is that it appears to just be horrendously written and directed, with lethal cringe oozing out of every cut. But we've found a solution! We switched the audio to the Mandarin Chinese dub with English subtitles, and all of a sudden it's totally watchable and great! My partner speaks Chinese and I made some efforts to learn a couple years back, and the dialogue is *so* simple that it's remarkably good as langauge learning tool. I also speak Spanish as a second language, and so we tried that (Spanish with English subs) and it also works more or less. My Spanish is a bit better than her Chinese, so the cringe seeps through into my brain to some degree, but not enough to make it unwatchable - especially because I do need the language practice. Main takeaway: Watch this show with the audio set to a language that you do not speak natively, and all of a sudden it's eminently watchable!
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Feb 26, 2024 04:47
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Don't know if it's nostalgia or if this show was made for me, but having a great time watching it. Visuals (and it's origin as a children's show) were cringe for a small moment, but then I was right back into it. My expectations of a live action adaptation have been surpassed and they even pleasantly surprised me with a few things. I'm impressed so far in the ways it's handled the themes. The strangely adult story just behind the story you're shown is done well. (That is, people living and dying during wartime, as much as "life goes on" is true to the spirit of the show, and actual life) Azula leading a group of young revolutionaries to incineration, and smiling as she watches them roast. drat BRJurgis fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 05:26
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shwinnebego posted:Our assessment is that they wrote dialogue that sounds like cartoon dialogue in its simplicity and stiltedness, but because it's live action, the actors can't really over-act and over-deliver to the degree that voice actors can to make cartoon dialogue 'work' in a cartoon. I reckon there are plenty of live action cartoons out there. Pretty much all of Sam Raimi's work, for instance.
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Feb 26, 2024 05:40
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The Lord Bude posted:I just finished episode 4. I’ve never seen the cartoon or the live action movie, but I’m enjoying it so far. Perhaps not quite as much as I enjoyed Netflix One Piece but it’s good. See I was curious as to what people that have never watched the original would think of this. And if it would inspire them to watch the original.
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Feb 26, 2024 05:57
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Open Source Idiom posted:I reckon there are plenty of live action cartoons out there. Pretty much all of Sam Raimi's work, for instance. You leave Emo Peter Parker out of this discussion.
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Feb 26, 2024 06:02
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a neat cape posted:See I was curious as to what people that have never watched the original would think of this. Not sure I’d watch the cartoon. I struggle with animated stuff these days. Although the fact that it’s an American made show with a compact run of episodes is intriguing. I’m much more likely to watch that than an anime with eleventy billion episodes of mostly filler. That being said I really do like the live action show and I probably wouldn’t watch the cartoon until it ends its run.
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Feb 26, 2024 06:33
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I've complained about a bunch of stuff in the other threads but one weird change that I noticed is that all the characters are kinda.. better? Like, not better written but better people for some reason. Sokka is less of a jerk, so is Zuko. Iroh is very empathetic to the Avatar from the get-go instead of just being kinda neutral. Aang isn't as much of a coward or a goof. Yue is suddenly this strong involved princess and her not-betrothed isn't a dick. Azula is more emotional. Zuko is much nicer to his crew in the end and is never as cruel to his uncle. Even Pakku, while still sexist, has decorum for lack of a better word. Some people might see this as an improvement, as characters being more round, but to me I feel like it's this compulsive need to have all characters be relatable and endearing at all times. Another minor thing is that I don't buy Aang-Sokka-Katara as these close friends / family, while I did in the cartoon. But maybe this is mostly a matter of time spent, and ditching most scenes that aren't plot-critical.
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Feb 26, 2024 08:09
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I don't know if I would describe OG AtLA as "compact" as each season is still 20+ episodes each, and they still have filler episodes (that they, thankfully, excised some of the more egregious ones for this remake). Then again, most anime shows I've watched aren't much longer than western shows. Something that occurred to me over the weekend that I've seen people comment on for this remake. I've noticed a number of people point out that Katara is kind of  in comparison to the rest of the cast and I feel that way too. She got better as the season went on, but for whatever reason I never got the sense that she was giving as much as either Aang or Sokka (Zuko's in a class of his own, as usual). I think it's the same issue that happened with Dafne Keen in His Dark Materials, Kiawentiio was either given very rigid directions or wasn't really given any direction.Personally, she's one of the actors that I was the most pumped about when I first read who had been cast in the show, because for an actress her age she is very good. Her work in the film Beans alone made me think "she will make an excellent Katara, with all the meat that role has" but a decent chunk of this season left me wanting. I think it may have been a mistake to take out her competitiveness with Aang over waterbending. The fact that Aang doesn't really DO any waterbending is a bit of an issue on its own, but a good deal of Katara's season 1 arc was pettiness and chips on her shoulder. I liked that they got rid of the pirates (much like the minstrels, I don't think they would work with the tone that is being established in this take) and had Gran-Gran give her the scroll with the waterbending forms, but I think it was a missed opportunity to still have Aang immediately pick up the forms and leave her jealous and bitter. However, with all that said, Dafne Keene got more stuff to do in the later seasons of HDM and that improved the show immensely, so hopefully that will happen here as well. Though I already wonder how they're going to tackle bloodbending and her hunting down her mother's killer. She had a line in Omashu (can't remember if it was to Jet or someone else) about how she didn't wish death on every Fire Nation citizen she would meet, even the one who killed her mother and I immediately stiffened and said out loud "gee, I sure hope you remember that after you learn how to bloodbend and actively seek out that man". For all the people talking about how Bumi got done dirty, I think something like this would be a monumental gently caress-up in comparison.
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Feb 26, 2024 08:17
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2 eps in, the kim's convenience guy has zero gravitas. and i don't get why they unnaturally call the elements "bending disciplines".
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Feb 26, 2024 09:05
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I think 8 eps vs 20 is what is causing the problem of not feeling like they are really bonding. In the cartoon, there is a clear amount of time passing as they are traveling. With the live action, it's just bang bang bang, southern air temple, kyoshi island, omashu, roku's temple, northern water tribe. We miss out on all the slower episodes of the three of them just traveling around and bonding. I think it's also a mistake for Aang to do zero water bending at all. They hint that Katara will be teaching him next season. I guess they maybe have time, since Aang doesn't start really learning earth bending until halfway through book 2. Though I wouldn't be surprised if they just have him already being proficient in water bending at the start of the next season to not be redundant by showing both Katara and Aang learning the same thing at different times. I think it would have been better to show them learning at the same time, but whatever.
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Feb 26, 2024 10:00
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I haven’t watched the original show since it aired, so I only remember the broad details, but I thought it was a very good adaptation. One thing I found odd was that Aang never bothered learning waterbending in the time that Katara went from completely beginner to highly advanced, but I can’t remember if it was like that in the original too.
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Feb 26, 2024 11:49
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kiminewt posted:I've complained about a bunch of stuff in the other threads but one weird change that I noticed is that all the characters are kinda.. better? Like, not better written but better people for some reason. I read a review that said the characters have all had their edges sanded down, and that's a bit of a shame because it limits their potential growth. Aang's goofiness is contrasted with the immense weight on his shoulders of having to save the world, for example.
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Feb 26, 2024 14:35
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I'm a little over halfway through and I'm not going to be "rarrrr my precious characters" about it but I agree the changes they made to Aang and Sokka don't really work, imo. Aang just coincidentally leaving on a midnight flight to clear his head instead of actively running away really cuts his potential character growth out at the knees. Especially since two separate grown adults absolutely rip into him for running off when he didn't do anything wrong lol. Ditto to Sokka who's not a kid with "big fish, little pond" syndrome and insecurities brought on by wanting to live up to his imagined ideal of manhood. He craves challenge to prove himself and he wasn't provided with any of it before his dad and the other fighting adults left. But here the ice dodging scene shows that no he's uh, actually a fuckup and his dad is secretly disappointed in him. I've got no real problems with Katara, though given that she reads as younger to me I do wish they hadn't cut out her earlier impulsiveness and frustration at Aang being more skilled than her. Her guilt at being present for her mother's murder but unable to do anything to help is a stronger character beat than the cartoon, I think. It's something I would've expected to be directly contrasted to Aang's situation (he wasn't there and thinks he could have done something), but those threads don't quite come together between the characters. Overall my main takeaway is I'm not sure who they made this show for. The dialogue gets so overwritten in places to make sure you take away the right message from the scene. I'd trust an adult to understand a basic story beat of "Azula is threatened and angry that her father praised Zuko" -> "Azula tries to beat the poo poo out of an unrelated guy" without Ty Lee and Mai stepping in to literally say "You could have hurt him" "This wasn't about him, was it". But then they're happy to show multiple scenes of people getting set on fire. So it's not like, meant to be a little kid's show, lol. That said, I think the main cast is doing a good job with their parts. Zuko's actor is really delivering, he's the stand out for me I think. I like the added focus on Azula so far and I'm hoping they lean into the fact that she's also an abused kid of a hosed up genocidal would-be emperor to the world. She's his favorite, sure, but that's not a good place to be, either. Also, idk, I liked Suki being some weird fighting gremlin from an isolated community. She sees a boy she's attracted to for the first time in her life of studying
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Feb 26, 2024 15:10
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Giving Suki and Zuko the best actors is clearly an implicit approval of the Zuko-Suki ship and I expect we will see it develop in the coming seasons.
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Feb 26, 2024 16:27
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Mercury Hat posted:Also, idk, I liked Suki being some weird fighting gremlin from an isolated community. She sees a boy she's attracted to for the first time in her life of studying Regarding Suki. This was one of my favorite changes. A lot of people prior to the series kinda moaned about the idea that Sokka's overt and completely over the top sexism had been removed. I didn't have a problem with it because in the cartoon it's ridiculously over the top and it literally only lasts like a handful of the first episodes and then it's no longer a part of the character. I get it even more now after seeing what they did with Suki here. That dynamic would not have worked if Sokka was completely dismissive of her. It only works if his puffing out his chest but knows deep down he's not even close to that level. And it allows a new dimension to Suki where she's much more awkward in her interaction. And also at the same time it even heightens her warrior mentality. So you're reinforcing the original characterization with her and added a whole new layer to it. It makes her a much more interesting character. Definitely looking forward to seeing more of her down the road. I agree that Suki's actress was one of the big standouts for me in the season. X-O fucked around with this message at 16:36 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 16:34
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SolarFire2 posted:I read a review that said the characters have all had their edges sanded down, and that's a bit of a shame because it limits their potential growth. Aang's goofiness is contrasted with the immense weight on his shoulders of having to save the world, for example. Yeah this is my biggest complaint with the live action series. With the exception of Zuko, who I think is somewhat improved by the live action series vs. season 1 of the cartoon, all the other major characters are just a lot less interesting. Part of it is that there's just a lot less screen time for the main 3 in favor of Zuko, longer action scenes, and exploring more of the side characters in the Fire Nation. Also the show's tone has changed from being comedic to dour which has filtered down to all the characters. Katara in the cartoon was often rather petty and quick-tempered, for example. Her getting pissed off and accidentally bending the glacier in anger is what originally freed Aang! Now she's either sad and depressed because War is Hell or is in Lisa Simpson mode, giving some inspiring and righteous monologue. She also comes off as a bit... dopey now. Aang actually being the coward people call him out on in the cartoon and avoiding his responsibility as the Avatar was also actually interesting and a theme that exists throughout the entirety of the show. But it's just weird now that people call him a coward since he doesn't have any of those tendencies in the live action. In the cartoon he once prevented Sokka and Katara from finding their father or something like that because he wanted them around as friends and was afraid they would leave. In the live action version this is pretty much flipped where he is told he has to leave his friends behind because he's putting them in harm's way and he just goes "okay." (He is told to let go much later on in the cartoon version but the context is very different than in the live action version). Iroh is probably the biggest change where the character has changed significantly to match the new dour tone of the show. Zuko being improved by the show being more dour makes a lot of sense although his cartoon version was pretty 1-note early on in the cartoon so there was certainly room for improvement. Overall I don't really see what this new version brings, I watched through some episodes of the cartoon after watching this for comparison and I found the cartoon to hold up pretty well and I ended up still preferring the cartoon version for the most part. The Zuko Blue Spirit sequence and his return to the ship is overall a good bit better in the live action version but that's about it. I don't think it's bad but it sticks close enough to the cartoon version that the changes stick out and I don't care for a lot of them. Cojawfee posted:I think 8 eps vs 20 is what is causing the problem of not feeling like they are really bonding. In the cartoon, there is a clear amount of time passing as they are traveling. With the live action, it's just bang bang bang, southern air temple, kyoshi island, omashu, roku's temple, northern water tribe. We miss out on all the slower episodes of the three of them just traveling around and bonding. The weird part is that both the cartoon and live action version have about the same runtime. 20 x 20 minute episodes vs 8 x 45 minute episodes (excluding credits and recaps), give or take. But they spend a lot more time in the live action version on Zuko and action sequences and random side character stuff like Azula so they end up missing the 3 hero characters bonding. kiminewt posted:Giving Suki and Zuko the best actors is clearly an implicit approval of the Zuko-Suki ship and I expect we will see it develop in the coming seasons. ...Is this really a thing in the fandom? koolkal fucked around with this message at 16:56 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 16:48
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koolkal posted:...Is this really a thing in the fandom? Do these two even interact during the course of the show?
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Feb 26, 2024 17:36
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I was impressed at how accurate the characters look to their cartoon versions in terms of hair and costumes without looking stupid. Yue's wig was the only really off thing for me. The moon had a baby with Emilia Clarke's wig. Unfortunately the action scenes suffer from how little damage these spears, rocks and fireballs. That is difficult to get right, though. It's great in a cartoon (and necessary for a Nickelodeon show.) They could diverge by having more 1v1s and fewer cartoon scenes where 10 fire mooks get obliterated, but then stand back up dazed. I'm really glad they didn't do the Dark Gritty Reboot With Gore! And Hookers! style the internet sometimes dreams of. I don't need to see Sokka gutting anyone with the space sword.
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Feb 26, 2024 17:48
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Another interesting addition in the last couple episodes was bringing in Kuruk and his backstory that I think has really only been touched on in books. His story is a wild one and the fact that they actually acknowledged that stuff was cool since it was never really touched on in the original series. He was the youngest Avatar to die and his life was pretty terrible.
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Feb 26, 2024 18:33
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soviet elsa posted:Unfortunately the action scenes suffer from how little damage these spears, rocks and fireballs. That is difficult to get right, though. It's great in a cartoon (and necessary for a Nickelodeon show.) They could diverge by having more 1v1s and fewer cartoon scenes where 10 fire mooks get obliterated, but then stand back up dazed. I'm really glad they didn't do the Dark Gritty Reboot With Gore! And Hookers! style the internet sometimes dreams of. I don't need to see Sokka gutting anyone with the space sword. What are you talking about, LOTS of people get killed in this. Or did you miss Azula leading that whole group of revolutionaries to get roasted by her father? Heck, I'm preeeeetty sure a good number of the fire nation soldiers Aang and Zuko knocked off the walls during their Blue Spirit escape are dead, or definitely not going to be useful soldiers anymore
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Feb 26, 2024 18:37
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I think I’ve realised I really don’t like Sokka as a character. He feels like he’s been lifted right out of a totally different show. The way he talks and behaves feels off for how the rest of the setting is presented, like he’s wandered in from a modern sitcom or a b grade highschool/college comedy or something. I dunno if it’s just the way his dialogue is written, or the limitations of the actor, or if it’s intrinsic to the character. Don’t get me wrong I like the show as a whole, and I like the other characters.
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Feb 26, 2024 19:17
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Sokka is probably the one closest to the cartoon version besides Zuko out of the main cast. But he's toned way down in terms of goofiness and comedy. Which I think works. I think the actor does a great job and he feels like Sokka should feel to me. He's really unlikable I think for the majority of the first season in the cartoon I feel just because he's way over the top and annoying. The live action I think is an improvement of Book 1 Sokka. By the time you get to Book 3 he's great though.
X-O fucked around with this message at 19:35 on Feb 26, 2024 |
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Feb 26, 2024 19:33
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I’ve never seen the Cartoon. Perhaps it feels different in animated form.
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Feb 26, 2024 19:34
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Live action Sokka and Suki have really good chemistry. I also really liked that connection between Aang and Sokka in episode 1. In the original, it felt like Aang really bonded with Katara and Sokka was just kinda there
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Feb 26, 2024 19:48
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Sokka has been improved by quite a bit if we just compare his Season 1 of the original and the remake. I'm still not sure I agree with the decision to have him already done the ice dodging trial and him only "passing" it because he's the chief's son. I honestly wondered if they were doing a bit where the fog actually extrapolates your biggest fear/regret and part of the trick is realising "wait, that's not what actually happened" and Aang was the only one strong enough to do that, but no, turns out Sokka hosed up three times in a row, and now that next time they see their father is gonna be kinda awkward. Outside of that, everything they did with Sokka was good, and I actually like that his attempts at humour have that Ember Island Players feel to them of the jokes kinda suck or don't always land. I really liked the one spirit that calls him out on that, and then we notice he tones it down after Also Yue just casually hanging out in the spirit world as a fox was cool, so hopefully we do get to see more of her in future seasons, since she's a permanent denizen now. When the fox spirit first appeared, I thought the writers were just following along the path of introducing Wan Shi Tong and so a fox showing up to Sokka was to show that Wan's fox helpers were more magnanimous than he was, then we find out later that, no, actually that was Yue and now we know a bit more about why she's already so open and warm with Sokka. Also, Sokka's awkwardness with Suki was great, way better than how he acted in the original. I honestly wasn't sure if we were going to get a huge divergence at the end of the episode and have Suki immediately join the Gaang. The show is all the better for both Suki and Sokka recognizing that they like each other, but neither having any experience in that realm and so they show affection in the only way they know how, fighting and being competitive.
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Feb 26, 2024 20:38
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I wonder if the writing of the characters was poisoned by knowing where they end up. The writers know that some of these characters end up being redeemed, and felt bad writing them to be terrible in the beginning.
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Feb 26, 2024 20:42
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I didn't mind most of the sand downs, but it was odd to me to kill so much of Aang's fun personality.  Core thing to him in the original is that he's a goofball that has the weight of the world on his shoulders. Makes the contrast when he becomes an elemental behemoth and the tasks he has to do hit harder. It's also why the whole conflict of the third season/show works so well: "Hey eight year old goofball, you gotta go commit a murder". This was pretty solid, blown away at how non-goofy the bending looked, but it does feel lesser than One Piece for the above reason. OP really, really nailed the heart and spirit of the source material, and that imo that's largely why it's had such a wild success of a rollout. I didn't mind any other character changes much, but Aang's change was a noticeable detriment. Which is a shame, as the actor did a great job with it anyway.
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Feb 26, 2024 20:55
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I think a lot of that is that live action just a brings a different weight and gravity to actions like war and children being involved in war. A number of people were lamenting the fact that Azula doesn't act like a 25 year old woman, and that's because she's literally a child. That stuff hits way harder in live action. You can't ignore that fact as easily when it's real people. Every person they come across talks about the horrors of the last century. That's gonna kill the vibe a lot of times. We get small looks at it when he meets the children on Kyoshi Island and a few other times here and there. It's one of the pitfalls of doing live action. It's the same reason they're always hesitant to do Robin in a live Batman movie. A child doing that kind of stuff is cute when it's animated, not so much when it's an actual child though.
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Feb 26, 2024 21:01
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Don't disagree, but I think that's all the more reason to keep Aang's goofiness in it. His dynamic personality in the face of the hardships is initially off putting in the series too, but that's who he is, and he does the job, so people learn to accept it.
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Feb 26, 2024 21:22
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I'm with you. But I'm not sure people who have never watched the show would be. You have to remember they're trying to walk a thin line here and making a show that fans will like and grabbing people that never would have watched a cartoon about the same story. I can see the hesitancy of leaning too far into that and alienating a potential new audience. It's very hard to know where that balance is. Once they hook people with the story and characters they may be able to open up to some of these thing when you have an audience already bought in.
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Feb 26, 2024 21:28
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Aang's airbending "trick" better show up next season or this whole endeavour will have been for naught. As much as I have enjoyed what they've done, they're treading on thin ice by not having this as even a casual thing he does off-hand or something
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Feb 26, 2024 21:44
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Aces High posted:Aang's airbending "trick" better show up next season or this whole endeavour will have been for naught. As much as I have enjoyed what they've done, they're treading on thin ice by not having this as even a casual thing he does off-hand or something By this point any depiction of it will disappoint you. Better just move on and forget about it.
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Feb 26, 2024 22:10
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Interested in what they have planned for season 2 since they plindered a bunch of stuff from later seasons, including one of the central conflicts in the second season finale. Also I can't see this version of Iroh say (season 2 spoilers) ]"she's crazy and she needs to go down" about this version of Azula.
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Feb 26, 2024 22:13
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kiminewt posted:Interested in what they have planned for season 2 since they plindered a bunch of stuff from later seasons, including one of the central conflicts in the second season finale. They mentioned events from a few of the skipped season 1 episodes, but there are still 3 or 4 skipped season 1 episodes which could feature in season 2. Imprisoned, The Fortuneteller, Bato of the Water Tribe and The Deserter from what I can figure. Bringing in Bato again may also allow them to revisit some of the adjusted trial backstory. Would be nice to throw in a least two downtime low stakes bonding episodes next season by using some of that. My pitch for season 2: Episode 1: Waterbending training starts, do skipped Granpakku reveal, content from The Avatar State Episode 2: Combine The Fortuneteller and Bato of the Watertribe to build more on the siblings Episode 3: Aang finishes out water training and we start Imprisoned Episode 4: Gaang journeys into Earth kingdom to find Earth bender and we get Toph tease Episode 5: Toph intro Episode 6: Zuko alone Episode 7: The Chase and Bitter Work Episode 8: The Library and stuck in desert cliffhanger finale Then season 3 can be finding Appa and intrigue of Ba Sing Se.
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Feb 27, 2024 00:41
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