|
TheKingofSprings posted:Tomino thinks anime needs to stop teasing romantic poo poo and just get on with gettin on: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/in...ntimacy/.152531 And yet, there are still people who think Mari Okada wasn't the right choice to write a Gundam show. Madness.
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 11:56 |
|
|
Raxivace posted:Hasn't he said like, the exact opposite in regards to sexual content in anime before? I think the idea in those interviews tie in neatly here: the idea behind a lot of those series is will-they-won’t-they teasing combined with providing a sexless cipher for the viewer to visualize themselves as and relentless, ceaseless fanservice. Those are the things he seems to be taking umbrage with. And I’m super sick of it too so hell, I agree!
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:51
|
|
|
TheKingofSprings posted:Tomino thinks anime needs to stop teasing romantic poo poo and just get on with gettin on: https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/in...ntimacy/.152531 I think he almost reaches a salient point, in that a lot of the dragging out "will-they, won't they, whoops misunderstanding" types of romance are just spinning the wheels on character development for no real benefit to the story at-large. Part of what made Rascal Does Not Dream of Bunny Girls good was just letting Mai and Sakuta actually HAVE a relationship that evolves over time and in response to dealing with everyone else's issues.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:54
|
|
|
I don't think he's wrong to some extent but, "And yet the boy's hand never reaches the girl's crotch." is one hell of a way to say it haha.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:55
|
|
|
Weird BIAS posted:I don't think he's wrong to some extent but, "And yet the boy's hand never reaches the girl's crotch." is one hell of a way to say it haha. You read the Anno interview? Once you've read that, this will come off as tame.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:58
|
|
|
drat, Tomino's right.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:58
|
|
|
Oh which one? I've read a few but nothing is coming to mind right now that is relevent. e: I'm a big fan of his and her circumstances for what it's worth precisely because it's not limited to will they won't they nonsense for the majority of the show. If more anime had people during relationships or, here's a radical idea, adults during relationships as the focus, I'd be much happier. Weird BIAS fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Nov 1, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 06:59
|
|
|
Weird BIAS posted:Oh which one? I've read a few but nothing is coming to mind right now that is relevent. The time Anno interviewed Tomino. It included a discussion of Char and Nanai's sex life, and an extended nudity metaphor criticizing Miyazaki's directorial work. It's... a thing. Whatever else it is, it's a thing that exists. chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Nov 1, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 07:10
|
|
|
The only Tomino/Anno interview I found was focussed on Victory, the only thing I can find related to CCA Anno/Tomino just has dead links to twitter. e: I mean I just found a picture of a small section that is pretty wild but no source on it. e2: oh the original tweets are under a protected account? Weird BIAS fucked around with this message at 07:47 on Nov 1, 2019 |
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 07:32
|
|
|
Weird BIAS posted:I don't think he's wrong to some extent but, "And yet the boy's hand never reaches the girl's crotch." is one hell of a way to say it haha. I think this is it, there's a point to be made about wheel-spinning relationships but he kind of let it slip that he thinks of it first from the perspective of the dude's agency.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 18:24
|
|
|
IBO had the girl reach out for the dick though
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 19:11
|
|
|
Caphi posted:I think this is it, there's a point to be made about wheel-spinning relationships but he kind of let it slip that he thinks of it first from the perspective of the dude's agency. https://twitter.com/HIDEO_KOJIMA_EN/status/358265892175495169
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 20:53
|
|
|
If there's anyone I'm chomping for the bit to hear talk about romance in anime it's definitely not the guy who has never written a romance that isn't the worst thing ever
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:24
|
|
|
Blockhouse posted:If there's anyone I'm chomping for the bit to hear talk about romance in anime it's definitely not the guy who has never written a romance that isn't the worst thing ever I don't know if you're talking about Tomino or Kojima, but the Gainer/Sara romance in Overman King Gainer is really sweet, and Kojima created literally the most romantic scene in any video game ever. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T_GKYU1bR_0
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:28
|
|
|
You will be ashamed of your words and deeds.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:29
|
|
|
Gripweed posted:I don't know if you're talking about Tomino or Kojima, but the Gainer/Sara romance in Overman King Gainer is really sweet, and Kojima created literally the most romantic scene in any video game ever. Thanks for reminding me I never finished this and need to go back and do that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:33
|
|
|
I’m trying to think what the best Tomino romance would be, besides in Gainer or L-Gaim since I haven’t seen those. Maybe Ramba and Hamon? Hard to really separate them from The Origin in my memory though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:37
|
|
|
There's a couple pretty sweet, understated romances in G-reco
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:39
|
|
|
Tomino is good at small scale natural kind of romances and really not at giant epic plot defining romances.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 21:43
|
|
|
ImpAtom posted:Tomino is good at small scale natural kind of romances and really not at giant epic plot defining romances. Yeah, I don’t know that I’d want to see him write a romcom, but he’s got a strong attention to detail that can make side characters & subplots shine without stealing the spotlight.
|
|
#
?
Nov 1, 2019 23:36
|
|
|
Blockhouse posted:If there's anyone I'm chomping for the bit to hear talk about romance in anime it's definitely not the guy who has never written a romance that isn't the worst thing ever Champing at the bit.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 00:06
|
|
|
00 kind of went there with Anew and Lockon pt. 2, in terms of less ambiguous "definitely either about to bone/have boned recently".
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:14
|
|
|
SEED had the Kira/Flay plotline that was not ambiguous at all about it.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:20
|
|
|
That whole thing was so weird since they spliced Kira and Flay loving with a fight sequence, IIRC. When 00 had that scene with Lockon and Anew in bed I had a moment where I thought it was going to go that route.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:28
|
|
|
The Kira/Flay one is one of the few times a tv broadcast airring anime in Canada showed that characters could gently caress so it stands out in my mind. SEED was garbage in some ways but having Flay manipulating Kira while he was so despondant was interesting, not well handled, but in better hands...
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:52
|
|
|
Apprentice Dick posted:SEED had the Kira/Flay plotline that was not ambiguous at all about it. And, as mentioned, IBO had Mika and Atra and Naze and Amida have totally confirmed boning. Gundam has a lot more loving than most anime, on average. (Which is probably an influence on Anno having Evangelion feature those scenes of Misato and Kaji). Kira and Flay, though, is interesting because of how it contrasts both his later relationship with Lacus and how they combine to contrast with Gundam in general. Kira and Flay have a very physical relationship. We all but see them gently caress, after all. But it's also a relationship the show disapproves of. It's a relationship based on cheating and manipulation, with Flay shown as A Bad Person and also a space racist. Her being ready to bone down is shown as in keeping with her more villainous qualities, even if she's given more sympathy and a more redemptive arc than the actual villains. Lacus, meanwhile, has a much less sexual relationship with Kira, at least from what I've seen and heard. It's notable that the villain of Destiny's attempt to make "his own" Lacus has "more sex appeal" as one of the box traits. In total, the show treats the "good" relationship as much less inherently based on carnal desire than the "bad" relationship. Meanwhile, in IBO and the Tomino Gundams, sex is shown as part of a normal, healthy relationship just as much as it is in incredibly unhealthy relationships. People wanting to bone is more a fact than a judgement on them. It's interesting, I think.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 01:56
|
|
|
I would really resist the urge to portray the sexual relationships in IBO as part of a healthy relationship dynamic. Atra boned Mika in an absolutely desperate attempt to anchor him in some way to arrest his headfirst plunge into what amounts to intentional suicide-by-combat and also as a desperate attempt to cling to some part of him once he was gone(in the form of a baby). Naze's relationship with Amida was "normal", but it existed in the context of Amida being Wife #1 in Naze's gigantic floating harem ship crewed entirely by young women who Naze rescued, employed, and also boned regularly enough that they had an entire nursery full of his offspring created with his employees, which is an intensely hosed up dynamic. Nobody in that show had a healthy sexual relationship except Merribit and the mechanic dude, and they basically didn't exist in the show past a certain point.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 02:56
|
|
|
Kanos posted:I would really resist the urge to portray the sexual relationships in IBO as part of a healthy relationship dynamic. Atra boned Mika in an absolutely desperate attempt to anchor him in some way to arrest his headfirst plunge into what amounts to intentional suicide-by-combat and also as a desperate attempt to cling to some part of him once he was gone(in the form of a baby). Naze's relationship with Amida was "normal", but it existed in the context of Amida being Wife #1 in Naze's gigantic floating harem ship crewed entirely by young women who Naze rescued, employed, and also boned regularly enough that they had an entire nursery full of his offspring created with his employees, which is an intensely hosed up dynamic. TBF, season 2 retconned the harem a little to him just saying they were all his to ensure they stayed safe from the various people most of them were running from. You don't touch the girl(s) of a Teiwaz Clan member, and all that.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 03:05
|
|
|
Neddy Seagoon posted:TBF, season 2 retconned the harem a little to him just saying they were all his to ensure they stayed safe from the various people most of them were running from. You don't touch the girl(s) of a Teiwaz Clan member, and all that. There were babies. He hosed a nonzero number of the crew of his ship.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 03:40
|
|
|
Tulalip Tulips posted:00 kind of went there with Anew and Lockon pt. 2, in terms of less ambiguous "definitely either about to bone/have boned recently". Anew was super transparently there specifically for that and also to die, though.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 03:41
|
|
|
TheKingofSprings posted:Anew was super transparently there specifically for that and also to die, though. It wasn't great for sure. I'm okay for the most part with a lot season 2 for 00 but Anew's whole deal was super flat for me.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 04:44
|
|
|
Midjack posted:There were babies. He hosed a nonzero number of the crew of his ship. Yeah, they're pretty blunt about the fact that while he didn't gently caress literally all of his crew, he absolutely hosed some of his crew.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 04:49
|
|
|
Midjack posted:There were babies. He hosed a nonzero number of the crew of his ship. Pretty sure some of that was also implied as "Oh yeah, that's TOTALLY my kid and not some drug lord she was escaping from". But yeah, a lot/most of them are definitely his kids.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 05:46
|
|
|
Raxivace posted:I’m trying to think what the best Tomino romance would be, besides in Gainer or L-Gaim since I haven’t seen those. Duker Iq and Renda.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 07:12
|
|
|
Edit: nope
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 07:13
|
|
|
Neddy Seagoon posted:TBF, season 2 retconned the harem a little to him just saying they were all his to ensure they stayed safe from the various people most of them were running from. You don't touch the girl(s) of a Teiwaz Clan member, and all that. Eh, IBO doesn't treat the attitude that 'my personality-cultists follow me willingly, and I'm doing this to protect them' particularly kindly. Remember that both Naze and his pupil Orga end up getting themselves and a bunch of their crew killed by trying to live up to the impossible standards they've created for themselves.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 11:32
|
|
|
What? That's...kind of the opposite of how Naze dies? Naze is framed by a rival(which he picked up by defending/sponsoring Orga) and gets rumbled by Gjallarhorn. He attempts to surrender and face the music to save his "family"(you know, literally the opposite of what Orga would do at that point), Iok refuses to accept the surrender and opens fire on the Turbines, so Naze dies heroically trying to defend his employees from being massacred. How on earth is that "getting his crew killed living up to the impossible standards they've created for themselves?" At no point does he overreach himself in the pursuit of still greater power and wealth like Orga does, and in fact the very essence of his character is screaming "be happy with what you have, you moron" at Orga constantly throughout S2. He's like, the single voice telling Orga to not do what Orga is doing in S2. Naze's weird harem situation is treated nothing but positively by the show. Naze himself is an angelic big brother figure who is heavily responsible for elevating Tekkadan to prosperity, his harem is portrayed as a positive non-standard family that is admired by all the protagonists, even Kudelia, and his death is painted as nothing but a noble sacrifice for the sake of his "family". He's not treated negatively by the show in any way(and it would have been better if he was, because he'd be more nuanced and less boring/gross).
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 19:53
|
|
|
Naze dies for Orga's sins. Orga does something dumb against Naze's express wishes that gets them all in hot water, and Naze sacrifices himself to get his girls and Tekkadan out of it. The show frames this not as Naze following a code of honor to a fault but as Naze voluntarily, nobly paying the price for the only viable option.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 20:00
|
|
|
Kanos posted:What? That's...kind of the opposite of how Naze dies? Naze is framed by a rival(which he picked up by defending/sponsoring Orga) and gets rumbled by Gjallarhorn. He attempts to surrender and face the music to save his "family"(you know, literally the opposite of what Orga would do at that point), Iok refuses to accept the surrender and opens fire on the Turbines, so Naze dies heroically trying to defend his employees from being massacred. The problem is that he didn't need to take his girls with him when Gjallarhorn put a bounty on his head. There was literally no reason for them to be anywhere near Dainsleif range other than their worship of him overriding their sense of self-preservation. He could have just left them with McMurdo, which is what ends up happening anyway after his death. He got so wrapped up in his cult of personality that he ended up prioritising their belief that he could keep them safe over actually keeping them safe. It's a very intentional piece of foreshadowing of the fall of Tekkadan, and I don't think it's a coincidence that the new leader of the Turbines at the end of the series is a woman who rose from the ranks of her peers (and presumably isn't banging all of them). Azee isn't a husband-god to her girls, and that's a good thing for keeping them capable of independent thought.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 20:38
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 11:56 |
|
|
It's not like they had a second ship with registration papers that wouldn't link them to the Turbines. IIRC the Turbines' stuff got locked down almost immediately and the only reason force was used with Naze and crew was because Iok wanted to. It's not like they sailed off from Teiwaz and decided not to turn around when it happened. I don't recall if it's quite clear where they were but the framing isn't that they could've gotten off the ship at any time.
|
|
#
?
Nov 2, 2019 20:47
|
|
