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Chairchucker
Nov 14, 2006

to ride eternal, shiny and chrome

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2022




Lamquin posted:


They must've known people wanted this, right? RIGHT?!


They wanted it, too. Marvel said no. :negative:

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TheCenturion
May 3, 2013
HI I LIKE TO GIVE ADVICE ON RELATIONSHIPS
I never actually got around to playing Chimera Squad, but didn't it experiment with doing away with 'turns' and just doing a per-character initiative system?

I think the answer to alpha strikes and making abilities other than 'hit really hard' useful is going to be some form of 'turn-based until you come into contact, then individual initiative-based.' Possibly a system cribbed from tabletop war games like Bolt Action where you and your opponent are randomly drawing 'my turn' tokens from a bag and activating different units based on the current tactical situation, with some units having abilities to affect that system.

DeathChicken
Jul 9, 2012

Nonsense. I have not yet begun to defile myself.

It was bizarrely funny, during the last battle I spawned in with Deadpool to start and the trick to winning became "Get Deadpool out as soon as possible for someone actually useful"

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

TheCenturion posted:

I never actually got around to playing Chimera Squad, but didn't it experiment with doing away with 'turns' and just doing a per-character initiative system?

I think the answer to alpha strikes and making abilities other than 'hit really hard' useful is going to be some form of 'turn-based until you come into contact, then individual initiative-based.' Possibly a system cribbed from tabletop war games like Bolt Action where you and your opponent are randomly drawing 'my turn' tokens from a bag and activating different units based on the current tactical situation, with some units having abilities to affect that system.

Chimera Squad did use interleaved to try and control the issue; a number of RPGs do something similar (Larian jumps to mind). It has upsides and downsides, but I do think it's an improvement. Chimera Squad is a really cool game. Like Midnight Suns, it's a shame more people didn't give it a chance. I think both are better games than Enemy Unknown.

And because nobody asked for it, my ranking of the Jake Solomon series from best to slightly less best is,

Marvel Midnight Suns
XCOM 2
XCOM Chimera Squad (yes, I know Jake didn't work directly on it.)
XCOM Enemy Unknown

DeathChicken posted:

It was bizarrely funny, during the last battle I spawned in with Deadpool to start and the trick to winning became "Get Deadpool out as soon as possible for someone actually useful"

The game picks your lowest friendship heroes for Phase 1, so most people got to enjoy some version of this story their first time through. However, Deadpool being the deadweight is very appropriate.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

Chairchucker posted:

They wanted it, too. Marvel said no. :negative:

Although I think they were leaning more towards the Hunter and Illyana. Cowards, all of them.

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Dawgstar posted:

Although I think they were leaning more towards the Hunter and Illyana. Cowards, all of them.

As Jake's official favorite, I don't doubt that she would've been an option of they got to do romances.

W.T. Fits
Apr 21, 2010

Ready to Poyozo Dance all over your face.

Lamquin posted:

My one gripe is that even towards the end of the game I just never clicked with certain heroes - the "Taunt and get Block" heroes such as Captain America, Marvel and Wolverine or the "Use environmentals" Spider-Man all felt like they were intended for another kind of game.
Why take a punch when you can "knock out" the puncher. :shobon:

The trick with Captain Marvel is that she's not a "Taunt and Block" character, she's an "activate super mode, then try to avoid losing it" character. Once you've gone Binary, you stay Binary until you lose all of your Block meter. Her kit is balanced around her being in Binary to actually do good damage, so you want to avoid using her Taunt attacks once you're in Binary unless you can guarantee that the target(s) will be KO'd by it. Otherwise you run the risk of the survivors knocking you out of Binary on the enemy turn, causing your damage output to drop.

The Midniter
Jul 9, 2001

I never really clicked with Captain Marvel since she takes a bunch of card plays to be able to do real damage. You either frontload her card plays to be able to do damage, or use your other heroes’ cards (that don’t require setup to be effective) to wipe the map. I know which one I’d rather do, since controlling the action economy is what the game’s all about.

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Like all the other ramp characters (Deadpool, Storm, Hulk), her payoff isn't really enough to count-balance the loss of frontload, and her base card quality is some of the worst, so taken together that leaves her in a pretty bad spot. I think the only heroes I'd rate lower are Ghost Rider, Morbin' Time, and maybe Scarlet Witch.

And I don't even think Ghost Rider is technically worse, I just loving hate his passive.

Kobal2
Apr 29, 2019

Skippy McPants posted:

I think the only heroes I'd rate lower are Ghost Rider, Morbin' Time, and maybe Scarlet Witch.


My boy, you have Issues. Ghost Rider does insane Heroism DPS and is basically the absolute king of missions featuring Hell devils (appropriately enough) and Scarlet Witch can Mark half the map - for Free if you're lucky enough !

(I've had very naughty matches with Wanda paired with Dr Spooky where she marked everyone, then played Quick Toss over and over and over again w/ Spooky's "Draw the last two attacks", ramping up to max in one turn)

JBP
Feb 16, 2017

You've got to know, to understand,
Baby, take me by my hand,
I'll lead you to the promised land.

The Midniter posted:

I never really clicked with Captain Marvel since she takes a bunch of card plays to be able to do real damage. You either frontload her card plays to be able to do damage, or use your other heroes’ cards (that don’t require setup to be effective) to wipe the map. I know which one I’d rather do, since controlling the action economy is what the game’s all about.

Captain Marvel is one of those characters I like to take for funsies but you're right it takes work to get her going and on higher difficulties she's just too much work versus Iron Man or Captain America (who isn't amazing but I reckon underrated) that can take a hit pending your card selections and then dole out a shitload of damage or debuffs.

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

JBP posted:

Captain Marvel is one of those characters I like to take for funsies but you're right it takes work to get her going and on higher difficulties she's just too much work versus Iron Man or Captain America (who isn't amazing but I reckon underrated) that can take a hit pending your card selections and then dole out a shitload of damage or debuffs.

Yeah, I was always hoping Carol would get a buff but that never happened. She just kind of stalls out mid-way through and then falls out in late game. Still it has to be said Captain Marvel x Blade OTP.

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Kobal2 posted:

My boy, you have Issues. Ghost Rider does insane Heroism DPS and is basically the absolute king of missions featuring Hell devils (appropriately enough) and Scarlet Witch can Mark half the map - for Free if you're lucky enough !

(I've had very naughty matches with Wanda paired with Dr Spooky where she marked everyone, then played Quick Toss over and over and over again w/ Spooky's "Draw the last two attacks", ramping up to max in one turn)

Plenty of other characters deal good damage and spend heroism well, and do it without making your deck worse. In my books, Ghost Rider will never overcome Drain Life. Polluting your deck with dead cards is usually incurred as a penalty in card games, but some gormless designer decided it should be his passive? And that making GBS threads up your hand with unplayable cards is a good thing? Madness.

As for Wanda, she just doesn’t have any oomph. She lacks damage, and her Legendary is the worst in the game. Yes, her quick attack is one of the best, and she has AoE mark in her base kit. However, many other heroes have good quick attacks and Mark is a common Mod easily rolled on much better AoE abilities.

They’re both fine, in the same sense the other lower tier heroes are fine. Totally playable, but hardly standouts.

Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 10:21 on Oct 14, 2023

Away all Goats
Jul 5, 2005

Goose's rebellion

W.T. Fits posted:

The trick with Captain Marvel is that she's not a "Taunt and Block" character, she's an "activate super mode, then try to avoid losing it" character. Once you've gone Binary, you stay Binary until you lose all of your Block meter. Her kit is balanced around her being in Binary to actually do good damage, so you want to avoid using her Taunt attacks once you're in Binary unless you can guarantee that the target(s) will be KO'd by it. Otherwise you run the risk of the survivors knocking you out of Binary on the enemy turn, causing your damage output to drop.

I had one run where I keep rolling Resist+ on her cards and she became an absolute beast. Between her passive and a few of her other cards giving counter she was dealing a poo poo ton of 'extra' damage with her taunts.

Kobal2
Apr 29, 2019

Away all Goats posted:

I had one run where I keep rolling Resist+ on her cards and she became an absolute beast. Between her passive and a few of her other cards giving counter she was dealing a poo poo ton of 'extra' damage with her taunts.

Yeah, I feel like that's the niche the game wants you to slot her in - Cap is the Block taunt&counter ; Wolvie is the Health taunt&counter and she does it with Resists. In all three cases they're not to be expected to take the whole map in the face, but distract one or two big mooks or maybe the Small Dog Horde.

OxMan
May 13, 2006

COME SEE
GRAVE DIGGER
LIVE AT MONSTER TRUCK JAM 2KXX



Got the whole kit and kaboodle for 70% off a couple of weeks back and game owns hard. Im in act 2 and it feels like I'm really in the swing of things now (unlocked mod rolling on cards, done with the abbey stuff) and sometimes I'll just play like 8 days in a row and lose track of time completely. DLC owns hard too, is there a secondary vampire storyline at all without it? Seems like you miss out on a lot, really feels like part of the whole game as intended.

Dav
Nov 6, 2009

OxMan posted:

Got the whole kit and kaboodle for 70% off a couple of weeks back and game owns hard. Im in act 2 and it feels like I'm really in the swing of things now (unlocked mod rolling on cards, done with the abbey stuff) and sometimes I'll just play like 8 days in a row and lose track of time completely. DLC owns hard too, is there a secondary vampire storyline at all without it? Seems like you miss out on a lot, really feels like part of the whole game as intended.

*vampyre
(And no, there isn’t)

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
The Ultimate Edition is ~$20 on Epic with their coupon thing right now. I finally grabbed it.

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
Got hit by a gamebreaking bug that just wasted the last *checks* ffive days of my playthrough. It seems to be fairly common and people know about it and Firaxis is not fixing any bugs no more.

Manually save every day, folks.

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Megazver posted:

Manually save every day, folks.

All day, every day. Sometimes twice. My habit of manual saving in every game has never done me wrong and saved my rear end more than once. Never trust developer placed checkpoints to keep you from losing hours of progress.

Sorry that happened, though. It majorly sucks.

Lammasu
May 8, 2019

lawful Good Monster
Here is something from some guys I follow. He had no idea exactly what Midnight Suns was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XrEp0sLzQ6s

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012

Shocked I tell you
I can’t play the game I have no idea why.

Plotac 75
Aug 8, 2007
Mysteries of the ancient lizardman sealed by ancient, mysterious lizard magicks lost in the mysterious realm of ancient lizardmen from ages far, far ago.
Enjoying the pants out of this game, especially the social links business. Marvel presents Persona was not on my bingo card but I'll take it. Am I understanding right that She/They Hunter is considered better voice than He/They Hunter?

Dawgstar
Jul 15, 2017

Plotac 75 posted:

Enjoying the pants out of this game, especially the social links business. Marvel presents Persona was not on my bingo card but I'll take it. Am I understanding right that She/They Hunter is considered better voice than He/They Hunter?

No, I think they're about on par. Male Hunter's voiced by Matt Mercer, even.

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
If you didn't get this on Epic, it's part of this month's Humble Choice now.

Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.
Just got the game for Christmas and played into Act 2. Like everyone else, incredibly impressed by the card battle side of the game. They did a phenomenal job there and the game is worth playing just for that. I can totally see why this flopped though. It was way too expensive; it should have been a 40 dollar game with a 20 dollar season pass - asking people to pay 100 bucks for this title on launch was a huge misstep.

The Abbey stuff is fine but it's not a natural fit for a tactical game and I don't think they quite pulled it off. It also suffers from frontloading a bunch of plot setup and seeming very MCU Lite - but as I've continued to play through the game they've significantly diverged from that paradigm and it's actually become much more comic-booky and enjoyable. The Abbey regeants stuff is excruciatingly boring and the production design frequently doesn't cut it; the character models look rough and and animations are stiff and I still occasionally get lost out around the Abbey because the wooded areas are so generic looking (later areas don't really suffer from this although they have a shocking amount of copy-pasted assets).

What I really have a problem with is the card economy; I absolutely despise the Gamma Coil system (complete with loot box animation, in a single player game - gross) and so I quickly gravitated to crafting cards but it chews up resources fast. Whoever on Firaxis thought I wanted to push buttons to turn my cards into currency and then go to a different menu to turn those currencies back into cards - come on! This kind of gaming quartermastering is loved by a tiny percentage of people and tolerated in varying degrees by everyone else and the annoying UIs and multi-menuing made it miserable for me. I also dislike the Mod system greatly, since it just encourages tedious grinding and affix-chasing for best-in-slot instead of tactical consideration. I really feel like they botched this entire economy, upgrading hero cards and unlocking new ones could have been done so much better than this. Instead it's some design mediocrity's dopamine drip and it sucks.

But ultimately you're doing card battles fights and those are sublime. I would have really loved to see this succeed because we never got Moon Knight, a legit interesting character who could have had an absolutely wild mechanics that could be implemented tons of cool ways: putting Confused on himself, having multiple decks he shuffled between (Mr. Knight, Moon Knight, and Konshu's Fist) as he played, whatever. Tons of design space here, and we'll never see it. Sad.

edit: fixed typo, clarified a few things

Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 18:03 on Jan 3, 2024

Kris xK
Apr 23, 2010
I keep popping onto nexus mods hoping to see someone's modded a better card economy but it's just wall to wall titty mods.

Lammasu
May 8, 2019

lawful Good Monster

Kris xK posted:

I keep popping onto nexus mods hoping to see someone's modded a better card economy but it's just wall to wall titty mods.

Isn't that everything with Nexus?

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006
There is a mod that lets you see where the cat is on the map at all times. I'd suggest installing that one.

There are no other good mods, yeah. Unreal engine is bad for mods, apparently.

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Kris xK posted:

I keep popping onto nexus mods hoping to see someone's modded a better card economy but it's just wall to wall titty mods.

What kind of changes are you looking for? There are a poo poo ton of mods on Nexus that tweak the game mechanics.

Edit: if you mean the card crafting system, you can install something like the 1000x version of Buffed Collectable Resources and never have to worry about having enough crafting mats ever again.

Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Jan 4, 2024

twistedmentat
Nov 21, 2003

Its my party
and I'll die if
I want to
Has the DLC ever been on sale? I haven't touched it in months because I wanted to play with Storm mostly, and they're all still sitting at 20bux a pop.

Away all Goats
Jul 5, 2005

Goose's rebellion

twistedmentat posted:

Has the DLC ever been on sale? I haven't touched it in months because I wanted to play with Storm mostly, and they're all still sitting at 20bux a pop.

I picked up the season pass for $25CAD during the thanksgiving(?) sale

Chairchucker
Nov 14, 2006

to ride eternal, shiny and chrome

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2022




twistedmentat posted:

Has the DLC ever been on sale? I haven't touched it in months because I wanted to play with Storm mostly, and they're all still sitting at 20bux a pop.

What platform? At the moment the season pass appears to be 60% off on Steam. (And the season pass is probs the best way to buy the dlc)

Kris xK
Apr 23, 2010

Skippy McPants posted:

What kind of changes are you looking for? There are a poo poo ton of mods on Nexus that tweak the game mechanics.

Edit: if you mean the card crafting system, you can install something like the 1000x version of Buffed Collectable Resources and never have to worry about having enough crafting mats ever again.

I was just looking at some of those mods, I think I'm gonna give it another go.

ultrachrist
Sep 27, 2008

twistedmentat posted:

Has the DLC ever been on sale? I haven't touched it in months because I wanted to play with Storm mostly, and they're all still sitting at 20bux a pop.

On ps5 the ultimate edition was (maybe still is) $30, which includes the season of pass (which is $50 and not on sale….)

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming

ultrachrist posted:

On ps5 the ultimate edition was (maybe still is) $30, which includes the season of pass (which is $50 and not on sale….)

Nah, the season pass is also on sale for $20

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Kris xK posted:

I was just looking at some of those mods, I think I'm gonna give it another go.

Yeah, that particular modder, Belinn, has done a shitload of superb QoL mods that let you iron out basically every annoying mechanic in the game. He is a bright shining star in a sea of titty modders.

Megazver
Jan 13, 2006

Skippy McPants posted:

Yeah, that particular modder, Belinn, has done a shitload of superb QoL mods that let you iron out basically every annoying mechanic in the game. He is a bright shining star in a sea of titty modders.

Any you'd recommend?

Skippy McPants
Mar 19, 2009

Megazver posted:

Any you'd recommend?

Uhh, let's see. These aren't in any order, just going down his mod list.


Mandatory For All:

Buffed Collectable Resources: if you use no other mods, use this one. The crafting economy in this game is 100% hosed. You don't notice it at first, but once you start unlocking the various upgrade options, it quickly becomes clear that the game gives you only a fraction of the materials you need to do stuff. And this isn't X-Com, where there's any kind of time pressure. You can grind normal missions forever, so all this mod does is remove the hellacious grind involved in getting the mats you want to craft/upgrade cards. I recommend the 1000 per pickup option, but if you're slightly worried about having too much money the 250 option is a fair compromise.


For New Players:

More Abby Travel Locations: adds the forge and war room to the fast travel list. Minor but useful.
The Infinity Offering Bowl: rewards from the Offering Bowl are barely worth it, and needing to hike out there every night is a pointless chore. This makes it one-and-done.
Pet The Dog: gives Charlie +1 level with each pet, massively reducing the grind required to max his level.
Overload Explosives: lets Storm's Overload card effect explosive items in missions, making it slightly less useless.
Craftable Summon Charlie and Annihilation: without this mod, you can't get the upgraded versions until 200 Dark/Light, making them useless until the late-late-game.
No More No Self-KO: makes it so Scarlet Witch's Ultimate doesn't KO her. Even with this mod, her Ult is merely okay. Without it, the card is 100% useless.
Where's Ebony: puts the dumb cat on the mini-map you can find her and pet her more easily.
Buffed Legendary Card Salvaging: returns a Legendary Blueprint when you salvage a Legendary. No loving idea why this isn't the default.
Buffed Legendary Gamma Coils: makes it so you always get a Legendary from Legendary Gamma Coils. Again, no clue why this isn't the default. By the time you're getting Leg. Coils the game is almost over and the last thing you want to do is grind a bunch of normals to craft your Legendary cards.
Better Blueprint Crafting: removes the Blueprint requirement from crafting higher level Blueprints and normalizes the cost to retain balance. No more crafting eight loving Blueprints just to craft one Epic. Again, mystified as to why this isn't the default.


For NG+ Players:

Buffed Legendary Challenge Rewards: anything to make grinding Legendary card mods less tedious is good.
Buffed Legendary Hero OPs: same as above.
Instant Non-Priority Research: reduces the number of normal missions you have to grind to progress Research.
No Hero Combs: removes Hero Combo Cards from the game. These cards are already mediocre when you first unlock them and become dead cards in the late game. One of my favorite mods. I hated having six useless cards clogging up my deck. (note: requires a fresh playthrough to function.)
Item Bench Overhaul: lets you craft all items at the bench, gives them unlimited stock, and converts all costs to credits. No more running around picking flowers to get a Major Strength Tonic.
Bad Mods Be Gone: removes all the poo poo tier card mods and makes it much easier to craft optimized decks. Note that the game is not balanced for 100% optimal decks, and you will poo poo-stomp all content with this mod if you know what you're doing.


Bonus Non-Belinn Mod:

Dark and Light x5: increases the amount of Dark/Light points gained. Has options for x5/10/100. I'd recommend x5 even for new players, as the Dark/Light scale is another pointlessly long grind and it's easy to not even max it out if you aren't optimizing for one or the other.

Skippy McPants fucked around with this message at 12:36 on Jan 5, 2024

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Away all Goats
Jul 5, 2005

Goose's rebellion

They should make a mod that lets me do missions without having to sleep in between. Hell, just take the whole abbey out except for the card stuff and mission table. Give me tower mode

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