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Vander posted:Could I please hear from someone what the process is to determine hit points at a level up? My group is new and the core rulebook isn't clear on it to us. What are the steps for us? Just roll the hit die for the class you're taking and add it to your total. So for instance, if you have 8 hit points right now and you take a level of fighter then you roll a D10 and add it to 8 for your new total. High constitution will increase that total as well as some feats like toughness.
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Jul 16, 2012 00:19
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Vander posted:Could I please hear from someone what the process is to determine hit points at a level up? My group is new and the core rulebook isn't clear on it to us. What are the steps for us? Roll your class hit die, add your Con modifier. That's how many more HP you get each level. Unless your GM is using something like average hp or some such modified system (And there's different ways of "averaging" too.) But the official is just roll the hit die of your given class and add your Constitution modifier to it. (Your hit die is almost universally determined by your Base Attack Bonus rate - if BAB improves at every class level you have a d10 hit die, if it's 3/4 you have a d8, and if it's 1/2 you have a d6 hit die. Barbarians, Dragon Disciples, and other corner cases violate this general rule, though.)
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Jul 16, 2012 00:28
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You both forgot to mention that if the level gained is in the character's favored class, he has the option of adding 1 extra HP at level up(or 1 extra skill point, arguably more valuable).
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Jul 16, 2012 00:30
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Cool thanks. Will that be the same for a druid's animal companion?
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Jul 16, 2012 02:28
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Vander posted:Cool thanks. Will that be the same for a druid's animal companion? They don't get a favored class bonus, but otherwise, yes, the same procedure.
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Jul 16, 2012 02:48
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Animal companions don't get a Hit Die every level, check the table to make sure that thier HD actually go up at that level.
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Jul 16, 2012 02:57
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ltugo posted:Just roll the hit die for the class you're taking and add it to your total. So for instance, if you have 8 hit points right now and you take a level of fighter then you roll a D10 and add it to 8 for your new total. High constitution will increase that total as well as some feats like toughness. This is default. I thoroughly recommend taking either 50% or 75% of the hit die at each level, though. It really sucks to be that guy who rolls 1's or 2's on his fighters hit die three levels in a row and has as many hit points as the wizard.
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Jul 16, 2012 03:13
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TheAnomaly posted:This is default. I thoroughly recommend taking either 50% or 75% of the hit die at each level, though. It really sucks to be that guy who rolls 1's or 2's on his fighters hit die three levels in a row and has as many hit points as the wizard. We're kinda doing that. I was DMing their lvl 1-2 change, and I let the paladin reroll until she got above 50% of the HD.
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Jul 16, 2012 03:39
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Vander posted:We're kinda doing that. I was DMing their lvl 1-2 change, and I let the paladin reroll until she got above 50% of the HD. My GM was letting us do 1 roll, if 50% or lower you get 50%, anything higher and you get that. I like it. We have a couple players who roll notoriously bad on their health so this was a way to prevent weaklings.
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Jul 16, 2012 03:51
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Vander posted:Could I please hear from someone what the process is to determine hit points at a level up? My group is new and the core rulebook isn't clear on it to us. What are the steps for us? I know this question has been answered, but I thought I'd add that something my DM does is let us reroll once but we have to accept whatever the reroll is instead of choosing the highest of the two rolls.
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Jul 16, 2012 05:09
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Hitpoints is one of those things where i feel strongly that you should do half+1 or 3/4 because honestly, who rolls for monsters? And that's what you're up against.
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Jul 16, 2012 05:18
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Question involving cavaliers and mounted reach. So, let's say you've got a cavalier pre:x pre:xx xx Now, you're cavalier is using a lance. Lances have reach, so if he was not mounted, he would be doing this sort of number (x is cav, . is no threat, o is threat) pre:..0.. .0.0. o.x.o .0.0. ..0.. pre:..oo.. .o..o. o.xx.o o.xx.0 .0..o. ..oo..
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Jul 16, 2012 06:06
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It is a lot, but it's balanced out by horses being god damned annoying on like 90% of all adventures because they can't fit in lots of places.
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Jul 16, 2012 06:35
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Can anyone recommend their favorite adventure path? I was thoroughly enjoying Kingmaker until my party got slayed by energy drain.  I had my eye on Serpent Skull and Carrion Crown. Shattered Star looks the most interesting, but I'll have to wait until next month for it to release.
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Jul 16, 2012 06:37
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Swags posted:Do I have this correct? That seems like a fuckload of reach for one dude. It's actually slightly more than that! With a lance: pre:ooooo o...o o.x.o o...o ooooo pre:oooooo o....o o.xx.o o.xx.o o....o oooooo
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Jul 16, 2012 09:56
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So I got invited to a new core-only game, and since I didn't know the DM or how long the game would run, I decided to see if "Caster Supremacy" was a real thing. Who knows, I thought maybe it was a long-running joke, made up by old grogs to scare new players like a snipe hunt. It would be a good laugh. One of the primary characteristics of Caster Supremacy is "you can make a cleric that's better at fighting than a fighter at a very low level." So I tried it. I don't think I optimized that hard, I took cleric, added half-orc, gave it a reasonable strength score of 16, and a wis score of 18, and picked some domains I thought looked good. Travel for armored mobility, and Charm because hey Save or Sucks are one of the parts of Caster Supremacy that people are always going nuts about. Then I took a look at what an equivalent fighter would be getting. Fighter advantages: +1 to attack, Longbow proficiency, 1st level access to Power Attack. Cleric advantages: 30 foot AoE heals, +10 landspeed in medium/heavy armor, touch attack daze (six times per day, no save), completely ignore terrain (six times per day), access to Cure Light Wounds/Bless/Cause Fear, and 1/day charm person (DC 15). Has to wait til level 3 for Power Attack. Caster Supremacy is real isn't it guys. 
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Jul 16, 2012 11:48
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I was wondering if anyone has written up a version of 4E's inherant bonuses for Pathfinder? I've found one that looks usable on the Pathfinder forums, but just wondering if anyone here had their own take on it.
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Jul 16, 2012 12:45
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Nanja Monja posted:It's actually slightly more than that! I think you're very slightly off on that for both of those. The four corners of both squares there for each are 15' away, not 10', since diagonals go 1-2. So it should be this without a horse: pre:.ooo. o...o o.x.o o...o .ooo. pre:.oooo. o....o o.xx.o o.xx.o o....o .oooo.
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Jul 16, 2012 14:29
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EscortMission posted:So I got invited to a new core-only game, and since I didn't know the DM or how long the game would run, I decided to see if "Caster Supremacy" was a real thing. Who knows, I thought maybe it was a long-running joke, made up by old grogs to scare new players like a snipe hunt. This was your first mistake, old grogs acknowledge caster supremacy while simultaneously believing it to be indispensable. If the casters are not more powerful than the melee classes, then the world does not make sense internally, and thus their verisimilitude is destroyed.
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Jul 16, 2012 14:45
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Idran posted:I think you're very slightly off on that for both of those. The four corners of both squares there for each are 15' away, not 10', since diagonals go 1-2. So it should be this without a horse: Nope, that's not how reach works. See here. You're effectively a large (long) creature, you get the square template.
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Jul 16, 2012 15:11
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Aha, okay. I'm starting to wonder if I even know the system, I don't think I've said something about PF yet here that turned out to be right.  At least it's a good way to learn where I'm wrong, though.
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Jul 16, 2012 15:14
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Angrymog posted:I was wondering if anyone has written up a version of 4E's inherant bonuses for Pathfinder? I've found one that looks usable on the Pathfinder forums, but just wondering if anyone here had their own take on it. I did it once, but the formulas for expected stats doesn't seem to be linear due to the relative scaling of costs and wealth against expected expenditures. Managed to divorce most of AC from wealth more easily though. Those are pretty consistent. AC Bonuses - Screw the bajillion types and just make one broad 'level' bonus to AC that acts like deflection. You can match this up with the expected monster attack bonus progression in the bestiary for a shortcut rather than working out what that means in gp. Approximately 1/2 level of deflection-equivalent and 1/4 level of dodge bonus should do the trick. Ability scores - Casters will have the absolutely highest bonus they can afford in their casting stat, with whatever's to spare going to Con. Everyone else would have more like 3 stats they need high. My solution was to just give across the board, a point below what you can normally afford. Drawback is stuff like the paladin just went to heaven. Resistance to saves - Its dirt cheap once you are out of starting levels. I just handed out a point every 3 levels. EDIT: Weapon and Armor raw enhancement bonuses, while theoretically expensive and slow to progress....just base the numbers off Magic Vestment and Greater Magic Weapon. If you have casters with any slots to spare there they'd be riding on that. veekie fucked around with this message at 15:23 on Jul 16, 2012 |
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Jul 16, 2012 15:21
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EscortMission posted:Caster Supremacy is real isn't it guys. My friend's cleric wields a greatsword. He swings with it and channels positive energy. That's all he does because that's all he needs to do.
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Jul 16, 2012 16:58
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Mounted Combat is one of the more complicated and easy to gently caress up systems in Pathfinder/DnD, and indeed in most RPGs, right along with grappling. I've had my own trouble with the system but here is a summary of how I'm pretty sure it works. Combat rounds begin and you are sitting on a horse! Or a dragon! or whatever! 1: Before we start, some basics. Your mount must be (at least) 1 size category larger than you. For truly massive mounts, your GM probably has to make up some rules. You share your mount's space for the sake of 'simplicity'. Your mount acts on your initiative, also for simplicity. Piell posted:Nope, that's not how reach works. See here. You're effectively a large (long) creature, you get the square template. This yields identical results as adding up the threatened squares you'd have as a medium creature in each of your mount's spaces, and seems like the correct (and easiest) way to account for reach, modified for reach weapons as appropriate. 2: Is your mount combat trained? If it is, great. If not, you're going to be making DC 20 Ride Checks every single round to control it. These are Move Actions if you succeed, and Full-Round Actions if you fail. Either way your mount is not attacking and you are only getting one Standard per turn. If you want your mount to do much, you may be using Handle Animal with that standard to move it around, but you're probably better off just dismounting at this point. Dismounting is a DC 20 Ride check, and a free action if you succeed, and a move action if you fail. You must have a move action available to attempt this check.
2a: So okay, your Mount is combat trained and this is now totally a reasonable thing to be doing! Make another Ride Check! This one is only DC 5 but Armor Check Penalties do apply (certain Cavaliers aside). If you succeed, you can control your mount with your knees this round and use both hands to attack. If you fail, you can only use one hand to attack as you direct your mount with the other. 2b: Wait, make one more Ride Check! Fighting with a combat trained mount requires you to direct your mount to fight! This is a DC 10 Ride Check and a free action. 3a: You move at your mount's speed. Even though your mount is taking its own action to move, not you, if it moves more than 5 feet you do not get your full-round attack with a melee weapon. You may make a single melee attack at the end of your mount's movement. If your mount charges, you get all the benefits and penalties of charging. If your target is on foot and smaller than your mount, you get a +1 attack bonus for being on higher ground.
3c: If you have your mount move and then cast a spell, that's totally fine. Likewise if you cast a spell and then your mount moves. If you have your mount move both before and after your spell (spellcasters can do this for some reason while melee classes need a feat) then you will incur a Concentration Check. Really this should just be a GM discretion 'was your horse moving while you were casting' situation. Anyway, the Concentration DC is 10 + spell level, or 15 + spell level if your mount is double moving or more. 4a: So some jerk decided to attack you! You take attacks as normally, anyone that can attack any square your mount takes up can attack you or your mount. If your mount is attacked and you have the Mounted Combat feat, you may, as an Immediate Action (so once per round, and it eats your next Swift Action) make a Ride check. If your check beats their attack roll, you make your mount avoid their attack. 4b: So that jerk killed your horse! Or at least made it Unconscious somehow! You need to make a Ride check at DC 15 to fall softly. If you fail, you take 1d6 damage and fall prone. If you succeed, you take no damage and land on your feet. This takes no action. 4c: Worse! That jerk killed you! What a jerk! You have a 50/50 shot of staying in saddle passed out or falling and taking 1d6 damage. A military saddle gives you a 75% chance of staying in the saddle. Either way your mount will wander off away from combat and try not to die, unless it is intelligent, in which case it does whatever it wants (probably get the hell out of battle, though). So uh, that is, to the best of my understanding, how mounted combat works in Pathfinder. I avoid this like the plague in my games and generally gloss over 90% of the ride checks and other nonsense and just wing it so that people don't avoid playing Cavaliers more than they already do, and so that I don't go insane.
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Jul 16, 2012 17:48
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Brass posted:My friend's cleric wields a greatsword. He swings with it and channels positive energy. That's all he does because that's all he needs to do. That's basically my cleric in PFS. Round 1: Divine Power. Round 2-whatever: smack things in the face. Usually do more damage than most melee types outside of barbarians or paladins smiting vs. demons.
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Jul 16, 2012 18:09
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grah posted:4a: So some jerk decided to attack you! You take attacks as normally, anyone that can attack any square your mount takes up can attack you or your mount. If your mount is attacked and you have the Mounted Combat feat, you may, as an Immediate Action (so once per round, and it eats your next Swift Action) make a Ride check. If your check beats their attack roll, you make your mount avoid their attack. I'm playing a mounted Druid, and here's an important one you forgot. If someone attacks YOU, you can make a DC 15 Ride check to use your mount as cover as an immediate action. That's +4 armor on demand, if you can make that check handily. Imagine sitting in the saddle and seeing someone about to hit you, and you lean to one side. My DM was very lenient and ruled that since this was an immediate action, I could use it much like the Deflect Arrows feat, which means he rolls to hit me, informs me that I have been hit, and lets me try to take cover then. RAW I think you have to declare it before it is announced you are hit, but it's still +4 AC for a DC 15 Ride check. You have to use your move action the next round to get back into the saddle proper, but you don't use your move action anyway, unless you're making full attacks or have some special ability, since your mount moves for you. My (small) druid rides around hurling Produce Flame fireballs and summoning monsters while still having a tiger under it, it's been pretty awesome.
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Jul 16, 2012 18:15
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Brass posted:Can anyone recommend their favorite adventure path? I was thoroughly enjoying Kingmaker until my party got slayed by energy drain. Do Not Play Carrion Crown. Also the ongoing pirate AP is pretty good, so consider it as well. I don't remember the name.
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Jul 16, 2012 19:04
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Skull and Shackles. It is fairly great. I recommend it. I'm DMing it right now and it is one of the most fun games I've ever been involved in.
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Jul 16, 2012 19:18
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Just wanted to say I thought people were exaggerating about gunslingers. Then I tried to make a level 2 gunslinger when I passed the DM hat to a friend of mine in my game so I could get some playtime in. Because I was the DM, I wanted to play by the book, no house rules, no special treatment. You were not exaggerating.
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Jul 16, 2012 19:38
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Angrymog posted:I was wondering if anyone has written up a version of 4E's inherant bonuses for Pathfinder? I've found one that looks usable on the Pathfinder forums, but just wondering if anyone here had their own take on it. There's two basic problems before you look at costs and level and etc, etc. With 4e there were three enhancement bonuses: Armor, Weapon, Saves. They were set at fairly equal levels (ie at level x the bonuses change to +2, at level y they change to +3). With 3e you have the "big 6" so that's more bonuses to keep track of, and they weren't set at fairly equal levels, so when they come into play was something of a crapshoot. So, we have the big six: * Magic weapon * Magic armor & shield * Ring of protection * Cloak of resistance * Amulet of natural armor * Ability-score boosters Thing is, as is very readily apparent, all of those have different costs and come in at different levels. Plus look at that last one: ability boosters. Some characters need more then one! So getting a generic system meant to apply to everyone is pretty dang hard. The second pitfall is that 3e characters often need more behind the big six. At a certain level they need a regular method of flight, for example. This makes things even more weird. I think in order to have an inherent bonuses system in 3e, first someone would need to plot a semi-generic set up through the levels and set not items but capabilities. At level x players are expected to have y bonuses and be able to do z. This would be really loving complicated because you'd basically need a different setup for every class, and that's assuming no multiclassing.
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Jul 16, 2012 23:44
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Meepo posted:Yes. That's the main reason summoning is so powerful, it shatters the action economy of the game. This was awhile back but I thought I'd interject something here: It's powerful for two other reasons, one of which is rarely touched on. The second was already brought up: it's pure versatility. One spell can grant you big damage, a solid meatwall, trap finders, etc, etc. But the other thing is how that utility can be manifested, something that usually goes ignored and appears especially at higher levels: summoned monsters can be spellcasters. I'm not even talking about COMBAT ability here. I'm talking pure utility. One spell can bring out a succubus who dominates (literally) any and all social functions or an Erinyes with permanent trueseeing and greater teleport or a big naked snake lady bard or etc, etc, etc.
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Jul 16, 2012 23:53
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ProfessorCirno posted:I think in order to have an inherent bonuses system in 3e, first someone would need to plot a semi-generic set up through the levels and set not items but capabilities. At level x players are expected to have y bonuses and be able to do z. This would be really loving complicated because you'd basically need a different setup for every class, and that's assuming no multiclassing. I found that most of the time, making it work involves disregarding casters. Yes, they get bonuses they don't need(weapon enhancement, and secondary stat boosters), but it doesn't matter as much because they're just that good anyway.
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Jul 17, 2012 05:25
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veekie posted:I found that most of the time, making it work involves disregarding casters. Yes, they get bonuses they don't need(weapon enhancement, and secondary stat boosters), but it doesn't matter as much because they're just that good anyway. Right, but it goes beyond just the Big 6. I mean this could also hypothetically be called "Why Vow of Poverty Didn't Work." At higher levels you generally need more then just a magic item, magic armor, etc, etc. There's a whole toolbox you're semi-assumed to have. Like the example I used - a melee fighter is going to need a method of flight, a rogue will likely require a means to turn invisible or otherwise gain concealment, etc, etc.
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Jul 17, 2012 05:46
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That yes. Personally I did it to keep wealth off being spent on the Big Six, so they can fling their wealth around on other stuff that are interesting.
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Jul 17, 2012 05:56
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ProfessorCirno posted:Right, but it goes beyond just the Big 6. I mean this could also hypothetically be called "Why Vow of Poverty Didn't Work." At higher levels you generally need more then just a magic item, magic armor, etc, etc. There's a whole toolbox you're semi-assumed to have. Like the example I used - a melee fighter is going to need a method of flight, a rogue will likely require a means to turn invisible or otherwise gain concealment, etc, etc. Stuff like lack of flight etc. aren't a big deal to me because I don't run pre-written modules, so there wouldn't be any 'Surprise! You need flight to get past this or fight that' moments unless I'd also accounted for the lack of flight etc. Same with special types of DR and DR breaking; it's just not going to be required as a matter of course. Yes, I know the real answer here is 'Use a system other than Pathfinder' but it does almost everything I want, and for all that people rail against class based systems it can make tagging the feel of your world pretty simple.
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Jul 17, 2012 08:10
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Angrymog posted:Stuff like lack of flight etc. aren't a big deal to me because I don't run pre-written modules, so there wouldn't be any 'Surprise! You need flight to get past this or fight that' moments unless I'd also accounted for the lack of flight etc. This isn't really a module thing. Flight just solves so many problems, it lets a melee hop over soldiers to get to casters, ignore checks to climb/swim/anything else that gives an armor check penalty, disregard traps triggered by stepping on the floor, and it's usually double the move speed that their normal speed is. Casters can go up to get away from melees, their Protection from Normal Missiles essentially lasts all day, so even if the monsters are archers they probably can't hurt you (if they can, then you just got some magic bows as loot when they die), and party archers can rain down arrows from the sky to ignore cover. It's just such a good tool that it's ridiculous, and pretty much everyone should have something that lets them fly by level 10 if not earlier.
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Jul 17, 2012 16:23
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GaryLeeLoveBuckets posted:ignore checks to climb/swim/anything else that gives an armor check penalty Except for Fly checks themselves? A PC with the Fly spell on it gets a bonus to Fly checks (4 + 1/2 Caster Level), but they still need to make the checks. Remember that doing things like "staying in place" and "turning more than 45 degrees" require some decent checks (15), and still have the armor check penalty. Not to mention if you are attacked or bull rushed in the air, and that winds can negatively impact your checks as well. edit: it's also important to note that Fly isn't a class skill for any fightery-class, and that they're not even ALLOWED to take ranks of it if they do not have "a reliable means of flying every day", and your DM might say that being in a party with a Wizard isn't reliable enough for the entire party. Inverse Icarus fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Jul 17, 2012 |
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Jul 17, 2012 17:19
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Inverse Icarus posted:Except for Fly checks themselves? That's true, but you can still take some actions without making a check, such as Ascending at a 45 degree angle at half speed or descending at any angle at normal speed.
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Jul 17, 2012 17:52
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Flight should really have been the same skill as Jump, so that the former doesn't make the latter all obsolete, and then it should have been giving to the fightery-types but not the casters.* You could have thrown Balance in there too, I suppose, or taken it in with Climbing and Opposed Bull Rush Check as a catch-all "purchase" check that keeps you from being flipped around and landing on your head, but then you're sort of getting into a full skill-system/save rewrite. Basically, though, flight is such an enormous part of the upper-level heroic suite that one of the primary conceits of any game which will use it extensively is that everything should be arranged so that the heroes can actually grow into using it. [*There's probably a workable dynamic to solve the magic-men/mundane-rear end in a top hat dichotomy in letting the magic men continue to be the gatekeepers on upper level abilities but giving the less overtly magical characters the means to use those abilities more effectively, just sayin']
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Jul 17, 2012 19:15
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One thing that bugs me a lot about Pathfinder is that they came up with Versatile Performance, a very neat way of making the Perform skill useful in a way that was flavor neutral and could fit into pretty much any character concept, and then they proceeded to force players to be Mr. Magical Musician if they wanted to use it. It would have been nice if they had spread it around a bit more, or at least didn't strip it out of every Bard Archetype that wasn't all "MUSIC IS MAGIC!"
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Jul 17, 2012 20:50
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