p-lang thread: (now (have you (problems two)))

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Serious Hardware/Software Crap > YOSPOS > p-lang thread: (now (have you (problems two)))

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0xB16B00B5: Aug 24, 2006; by Y Kant Ozma Post

computers will never replace humans for sniping

# ? Jul 31, 2012 00:32

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# ? May 8, 2024 12:42

Brain Candy: May 18, 2006

tef posted:

you can roll your own in 0mq, sure, but really, there are other options out there. HTTP makes a decent request-response protocol, and there is a poo poo ton of library support for it. if you use a good one, you can take advantage of http caches and load balancers.

also I have no idea how 0mq makes things 'scalable'. scaling an application is m often an operations problem, more than an implementation problem.

While glyph is certainly cool and all that, I don't want to do real-time stuff over http/xml/json. Maybe it's possible, but it seems to end in horrible disaster every time I've seen it tried. I dunno, sounds like this is just a different domain than you are thinking of.

In small potatoes land, if I'm doing an internal service and I can get away with setting up one server in the corner to do everything, I'm gonna do it. The combo of being efficient in binary and handling concurrency lets that one machine scale nicely.

# ? Jul 31, 2012 00:40

Sapozhnik: Jan 2, 2005; Nap Ghost

i should write a high frequency ~~trading~~ sniping algo

in prolog

# ? Jul 31, 2012 01:02

Cocoa Crispies: Jul 20, 2001; Vehicular Manslaughter!; Pillbug

iamthexander posted:

am i missing something i thought good scripting languages could do concurrency

concurrency isn't something you'd want to mix with scripting languages, because it's hard

if you can't let your UNIX kernel handle concurrency (by making all your concurrence in separate processes that don't share resources except a database) the only right choice is erlang, which has crazy restrictions that make it possible to write correct and reliable concurrent code on the first try

locks and mutexes: scrub tier

asynchronous messaging: pro

# ? Jul 31, 2012 01:03

Meiwaku: Jan 10, 2011; Fun for the whole family!

iamthexander posted:

am i missing something i thought good scripting languages could do concurrency

Pray tell, what "good scripting language" is this?

# ? Jul 31, 2012 01:16

Tiny Bug Child: Sep 11, 2004; Avoid Symmetry, Allow Complexity, Introduce Terror

Meiwaku posted:

Pray tell, what "good scripting language" is this?

PHP

# ? Jul 31, 2012 01:18

Cocoa Crispies: Jul 20, 2001; Vehicular Manslaughter!; Pillbug

Tiny Bug Child posted:

PHP

how do you start a new thread?

# ? Jul 31, 2012 01:55

tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

call wget inside php

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:00

Jonny 290: May 5, 2005; [ASK] me about OS/2 Warp

no dont

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:02

tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

Brain Candy posted:

While glyph is certainly cool and all that, I don't want to do real-time stuff over http/xml/json. Maybe it's possible, but it seems to end in horrible disaster every time I've seen it tried. I dunno, sounds like this is just a different domain than you are thinking of.

In small potatoes land, if I'm doing an internal service and I can get away with setting up one server in the corner to do everything, I'm gonna do it. The combo of being efficient in binary and handling concurrency lets that one machine scale nicely.

in small potatoes land, http is fine.

in big things, http has caches and load balancers.

in real time stuff, 0mq is probably doing stuff behind your back that you don't want.

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:03

tef: May 30, 2004; -> some l-system crap ->

Jonny 290 posted:

no dont

pro tip: don't pass the same session id through, this deadlocks php

(I helped debug this once)

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:03

MononcQc: May 29, 2007

As the ultimate Erlang weenie, it's kind of nice to see people sometimes advocating Erlang instead of laughing at it all the time, like they did a couple of years ago.

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:17

Shaggar: Apr 26, 2006

tef posted:

call wget inside php

lol

# ? Jul 31, 2012 02:23

Blotto Skorzany: Nov 7, 2008; He's a PSoC, loose and runnin'
came the whisper from each lip
And he's here to do some business with
the bad ADC on his chip
bad ADC on his chiiiiip

MononcQc posted:

As the ultimate Erlang weenie, it's kind of nice to see people sometimes advocating Erlang instead of laughing at it all the time, like they did a couple of years ago.

munctional

# ? Jul 31, 2012 03:03

Brain Candy: May 18, 2006

tef posted:

in small potatoes land, http is fine.

in big things, http has caches and load balancers.

in real time stuff, 0mq is probably doing stuff behind your back that you don't want.

The small potatoes stuff I was talking about is real time stuff :shobon:

in really big things, small efficiencies start becoming more important as dev time is relatively less valuable, a la protocol buffers.

eh, real time is like anything else, if something can get you 90% of the way you try that first.

# ? Jul 31, 2012 03:10

coaxmetal: Oct 21, 2010; I flamed me own dad

tinselt0wn posted:

this all brings us back to javascript. write javascript how you want. OO? great. Functional? even better.

Jslint allows you to be as strict as you want in regards to style and code conventions. You don't need a fancy environment to do your testing either, so if something screws up just press f5 in your browser and you're seeing the latest code.

the best testing tools, designed to work with your style of coding, not enforce silly restrictions like python, and capable of rapid development. please use a javascript today.

haha where is this from?

# ? Jul 31, 2012 03:12

Jonny 290: May 5, 2005; [ASK] me about OS/2 Warp

yospos, sadly

# ? Jul 31, 2012 03:58

gangnam reference: Dec 26, 2010; shut up idiot shut up idiot shut up idiot shut up idiot

pro tip: don't use php

(i helped debug this once)

# ? Jul 31, 2012 05:58

Tiny Bug Child: Sep 11, 2004; Avoid Symmetry, Allow Complexity, Introduce Terror

Gogey posted:

pro tip: always use php

# ? Jul 31, 2012 06:29

Tiny Bug Child: Sep 11, 2004; Avoid Symmetry, Allow Complexity, Introduce Terror

let's use php... forever

# ? Jul 31, 2012 06:30

Quebec Bagnet: Apr 28, 2009; mess with the honk
you get the bonk; Lipstick Apathy

have u ever used php ... on weed :2bong:

# ? Jul 31, 2012 07:28

rotor: Jun 11, 2001; classic case of pineapple derangement syndrome

closure compiler is nice for javascript

# ? Jul 31, 2012 07:33

rotor: Jun 11, 2001; classic case of pineapple derangement syndrome

Sniep posted:

don't write programs - have programmers write programs, then you don't have to worry about any of this super boring poo poo

for your mental health

alternately, write programs to write the programs for you

# ? Jul 31, 2012 07:35

CamH: Apr 11, 2008

i barely GNU her! posted:

have u ever used php ... on weed

ya the other day

# ? Jul 31, 2012 07:39

Max Facetime: Apr 18, 2009

tef posted:

dynamic and static typing are for weenies.

hybrid typing is where it is at http://sage.soe.ucsc.edu/

you write types, eliminates them statically, or inserts runtime checks where it can't.

that's pretty neat in how everything gets a really specific type, but I can't see how you could write code like that without an ide figuring the types out for you

# ? Jul 31, 2012 08:18

Max Facetime: Apr 18, 2009

and what's with every research language having a hardon for overloading the EqualsOrGreaterThan operator?

# ? Jul 31, 2012 08:18

Meiwaku: Jan 10, 2011; Fun for the whole family!

rotor posted:

alternately, write programs to write the programs for you

WFH is so much better when it's the computer that's doing all the work.

# ? Jul 31, 2012 08:40

cowboy beepboop: Feb 24, 2001

I am in posted:

and what's with every research language having a hardon for overloading the EqualsOrGreaterThan operator?

why does c++ apparently bitshift cout() by "some string" what a terrible idea. apparently it's an 'insertion operation' gently caress you c++

# ? Jul 31, 2012 09:49

MononcQc: May 29, 2007

rotor posted:

alternately, write programs to write the programs for you

monoiconic metaprogrammable languages supremacy

# ? Jul 31, 2012 12:25

trex eaterofcadrs: Jun 17, 2005; My lack of understanding is only exceeded by my lack of concern.

MononcQc posted:

monoiconic metaprogrammable languages supremacy

if your language can't write itself without use of the string concatenation operator then, well, get a new language

# ? Jul 31, 2012 14:15

Toady: Jan 12, 2009

The following is an email I sent to John Carmack of Id Software after having watched his 2012 Quakecon Keynote Speech.

Hi John,

I watched the live stream of your keynote speech yesterday, and � as every year � I enjoyed it very much. I applaud your openness; it's always refreshing to hear some insights from the gaming industry that is otherwise very secretive. Thank you!

However, I believe your views on JavaScript and WebGL are short sighted.

Nobody pretends that the next AAA-title will be written in JavaScript. The community understands that it's magnitudes slower than native code, but the thing is: it just doesn't matter.

Many, many types of games don't need the absolute best and fastest environment to offer interesting gameplay and graphics. Take a look at X-Type on your iPad or iPhone for instance.

You yourself talked about how frustrating it is that you need 200 lines of code just to set up your screen for rendering on Windows, whereas in the olden days you could just push pixels to the screen with 3 lines of code.

We're there again: take 3 lines of JavaScript and you're drawing an image to a canvas element. Take 20 more lines and you have a rendering loop and a sprite that moves with the arrow keys. And all you need is a text editor and your favorite Browser. That is what JavaScript is all about.

When you're new to programming and still figuring out whether you like it, you don't want to read thick books. You want to see results. Fast. You want pictures dancing on the screen.

JavaScript is the language you should teach your son.

I backed the Oculus Rift Kickstarter yesterday and I fully expect to see significant development for it going on with WebGL. It doesn't matter that JS is "slow" when you're just trying stuff; ease of development is far more important.

Coupled with the openness of the Web, I wouldn't be surprised if much, if not most, of the research for applications of the Rift comes out of the JavaScript community.

Right-Click -> View Source is what made the web so successful and it's awesome that we now have this for 3D graphics as well.

Don't hate JavaScript. It's our generation's Apple II.

Regards,
Dominic

# ? Aug 3, 2012 16:48

double sulk: Jul 2, 2010

Toady posted:

Don't hate JavaScript. It's our generation's Apple II.

Regards,
Dominic

# ? Aug 3, 2012 16:55

Jonny 290: May 5, 2005; [ASK] me about OS/2 Warp

Toady posted:

The following is an email I sent to John Carmack of Id Software after having watched his 2012 Quakecon Keynote Speech.

Hi John,

I watched the live stream of your keynote speech yesterday, and � as every year � I enjoyed it very much. I applaud your openness; it's always refreshing to hear some insights from the gaming industry that is otherwise very secretive. Thank you!

However, I believe your views on JavaScript and WebGL are short sighted.

Nobody pretends that the next AAA-title will be written in JavaScript. The community understands that it's magnitudes slower than native code, but the thing is: it just doesn't matter.

Many, many types of games don't need the absolute best and fastest environment to offer interesting gameplay and graphics. Take a look at X-Type on your iPad or iPhone for instance.

You yourself talked about how frustrating it is that you need 200 lines of code just to set up your screen for rendering on Windows, whereas in the olden days you could just push pixels to the screen with 3 lines of code.

We're there again: take 3 lines of JavaScript and you're drawing an image to a canvas element. Take 20 more lines and you have a rendering loop and a sprite that moves with the arrow keys. And all you need is a text editor and your favorite Browser. That is what JavaScript is all about.

When you're new to programming and still figuring out whether you like it, you don't want to read thick books. You want to see results. Fast. You want pictures dancing on the screen.

JavaScript is the language you should teach your son.

I backed the Oculus Rift Kickstarter yesterday and I fully expect to see significant development for it going on with WebGL. It doesn't matter that JS is "slow" when you're just trying stuff; ease of development is far more important.

Coupled with the openness of the Web, I wouldn't be surprised if much, if not most, of the research for applications of the Rift comes out of the JavaScript community.

Right-Click -> View Source is what made the web so successful and it's awesome that we now have this for 3D graphics as well.

Don't hate JavaScript. It's our generation's Apple II.

Regards,
Dominic

i want to put caltrops behind this person's tires every day for a month

# ? Aug 3, 2012 16:57

Tiny Bug Child: Sep 11, 2004; Avoid Symmetry, Allow Complexity, Introduce Terror

tbh that guy's prety much right on the money

# ? Aug 3, 2012 16:58

Toady: Jan 12, 2009

love his demand that javascript be taught to carmack's son

# ? Aug 3, 2012 17:08

Socracheese: Oct 20, 2008

I unironically thought webgl would be a cool platform until I dug a little and found a github javascript physics engine that grinds to 2fps when you crash one block into a stack of five blocks

# ? Aug 3, 2012 17:18

Tiny Bug Child: Sep 11, 2004; Avoid Symmetry, Allow Complexity, Introduce Terror

Socracheese posted:

I unironically thought webgl would be a cool platform until I dug a little and found a github javascript physics engine that grinds to 2fps when you crash one block into a stack of five blocks

who cares, eventually hardware will catch up

# ? Aug 3, 2012 17:19