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leica posted:Good to know, sure as hell won't hurt to do that when replacing the coils. Do the coils not so much outright fail on panthers, but become marginally bad, and cause those pesky misfires and lurching under acceleration? My experience from the lincoln was it would idle like poo poo and sporadically skip like hell under throttle yet not throw a misfire code until much later. It seems to be a universal issue on Ford V8's and coincidentally appearing about the time Ford owned Jaguar. The bitch of it was, by the time you got a misfire code, you already ruined the cats due to so much unburned fuel going through them.
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Apr 20, 2013 00:51
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Well luckily for me I live in FL and can replace the cats with test pipes 
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Apr 20, 2013 00:55
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leica posted:Well luckily for me I live in FL and can replace the cats with test pipes Tally here I traded my LS in on a Subaru WRX 2 weeks ago, and am already about to gut the uppipe due to that very fact.
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Apr 20, 2013 01:09
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Farking Bastage posted:Tally here Unless the cat is wrecked, sell it instead (to someone who ruined theirs  ), it'll more than pay for a decent replacement. OEM cats are $texas.
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Apr 20, 2013 01:38
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14 INCH DETECTIVE posted:E: other panther question, why'd they stop doing the front door strips after a certain year? It always reminds me of mk3 VWs missing a chunk of trim. I think it was always an optional delete, in case the buyer's department livery went down past where the trim goes -- it'd gently caress up the graphics if you left the trim on. First GIS result illustrating the reason:  Trim on, note that the graphics don't cover it: 
Chillbro Baggins fucked around with this message at 12:07 on Apr 20, 2013 |
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Apr 20, 2013 12:04
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Bad Angus! Bad!
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Would it be unreasonable to expect a Vic to be able to tow a flatbed car trailer with a race-prepped E30 on it? I think I'm going to pick up a PI from an auction as a DD and finally do away with the whole dual-purpose DD/AutoX car deal. I just want to be sure I'm not going to need three vehicles to get my racecar to the track.
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Apr 20, 2013 14:17
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If you think people wont mess with your panther, think again. We had some kids go through town shooting windows, and my p71 was the only car that was hit. As far as vandalism goes, it's best not to attract any sort of attention. It may be different in a state where there is unmarked cars, though. Kids are bastards. Has anyone encountered a good buying guide? It's scary to think of buying a car without driving it or spending some time thinking about it. I bought my current car from a dealer and was hosed on it. I'm happy with the car but if anyone is going to screw me it might as well be the government. I'm used to that.
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Apr 20, 2013 16:00
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Farking Bastage posted:Tally here Swap for an STI or an 06+ WRX up-pipe. Gutting is a pain in the butt and you can get more than the up-pipe in costs back by selling the catted one to an emissions state.
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Apr 20, 2013 16:57
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Beach Bum posted:Would it be unreasonable to expect a Vic to be able to tow a flatbed car trailer with a race-prepped E30 on it? I think I'm going to pick up a PI from an auction as a DD and finally do away with the whole dual-purpose DD/AutoX car deal. I just want to be sure I'm not going to need three vehicles to get my racecar to the track. The official towing rating tanked some time in the mid '90s, I'm not sure why. It was 5000 pounds, later models were 2000. I don't think the change lined up with the whale body bringing the watt's linkage, so that shouldn't have been it. In either case, it's a big vehicle with a ladder frame and the same basic drivetrain as a F-150. It should tow quite well if equipped with a proper hitch. The air suspension models will probably be better since they can autolevel, but no idea on the specifics. Make sure you have the sport package or a P71 for the tranny cooler of course. I think there was even a towing package back in the 5k rating days.
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Apr 20, 2013 21:24
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Tow ratings tanked because of the watts linkage. Not sure exactly why that is, if someone can explain why the addition of watts linkage would effectively ruin towing capacity that would be great.
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Apr 20, 2013 22:03
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Honestly it wouldn't surprise me if the linkage had no actual effect at all, and the rating drop was meant to "encourage" buyers towards a
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Apr 20, 2013 22:35
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leica posted:Tow ratings tanked because of the watts linkage. Not sure exactly why that is, if someone can explain why the addition of watts linkage would effectively ruin towing capacity that would be great. Without looking into it, my first guess is that it's either to do with having to change the metalwork to accommodate the linkage, and so "lose" the old mounting points, something along the lines of "people are fuckwits and can't be trusted with more than a ton on the back", or a legislative issue that was too expensive to make changes to address. Edit: VVVV Sounds reasonable enough explanation to me. InitialDave fucked around with this message at 22:49 on Apr 20, 2013 |
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Apr 20, 2013 22:46
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If it was a panhard rod in the back before, there's a chance that the panhard rod was considered stronger, and the watts linkage results in a better ride but isn't as durable / capable of handling side loads. So the towing rating got reduced.
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Apr 20, 2013 22:47
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kastein posted:If it was a panhard rod in the back before, there's a chance that the panhard rod was considered stronger, and the watts linkage results in a better ride but isn't as durable / capable of handling side loads. So the towing rating got reduced. I've heard stories of braking the studs on the watts linkage. I've also heard  the NHTSA was lobbied to lower the maximum allowable tow rating on sedans so the car companies would sell more trucks. I just spent 15 minutes searching for any real evidence of this and couldn't find it. It's more likely Ford just went and lowered entirely on their own so they could sell more high margin vehicles.
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Apr 20, 2013 23:05
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Motronic posted:I've heard stories of braking the studs on the watts linkage. Yeah I remember hearing this too. But what about just beefing it up? There's got to be a way to mod it to make it stronger, it can't be that hard. [edit] AH HA!! problem loving solved: http://www.adtr.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=196 Also, billet links motherfucker: http://www.adtr.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_72&product_id=115 Those upgrades right there should increase towing capacity substantially. Applebees Appetizer fucked around with this message at 23:42 on Apr 20, 2013 |
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Apr 20, 2013 23:40
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Hells yeah, that's exactly what I wanted to hear. Look for me to join the club soon  AI: For the Superior car buying experience 
Beach Bum fucked around with this message at 00:29 on Apr 21, 2013 |
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Apr 21, 2013 00:22
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Don't get too happy, man. Those parts may help but still might not be enough for a trailer with a car on it. I'd do some more research before you depend on a CV to tow your race car on a regular basis. How much does the trailer and car weigh?
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Apr 21, 2013 00:41
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If your going across the country I couldn't recommend towing that much weight. But around town? I can't see it being a huge ordeal. The 5 series is rated pretty high in Europe and in the US? Nothing. Part of it is because the US drivers are pretty good at being idiots and really overloading the poo poo out of things.
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Apr 21, 2013 03:06
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" This here F-250's got a GVWR of 12,000 lbs."*Loads 12,800 onto a single-axle trailer, plus a pallet of bricks in the bed*
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Apr 21, 2013 05:01
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leica posted:Don't get too happy, man. Those parts may help but still might not be enough for a trailer with a car on it. I'd do some more research before you depend on a CV to tow your race car on a regular basis. How much does the trailer and car weigh? After further research you're probably right. Figure 2500 for the trailer, that gives me only 2500 for car and gear and that's pushing it. I should probably just fix my truck
Beach Bum fucked around with this message at 15:05 on Apr 21, 2013 |
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Apr 21, 2013 14:40
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That sounds a pretty hefty trailer. I'd have thought something about right for an E30 would be more like 1500-2000lbs empty.
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Apr 21, 2013 15:34
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Someone needs to explain to me how Ford built a 4000lbs car with a 5.0L V8 and decided it only needed a 17 gallon gas tank.
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Apr 21, 2013 17:07
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leica posted:Tow ratings tanked because of the watts linkage. Not sure exactly why that is, if someone can explain why the addition of watts linkage would effectively ruin towing capacity that would be great. I just checked and the tow rating dropped in '96 (towing package last offered in 1995), the watts linkage came in '98, so it doesn't look like that was the reason. There doesn't seem to be any change to the actual car that would matter even in the general timeframe (the transmission change in '95 doesn't fit, as the 4R70W is just some minor tweaks on the AODE and is generally regarded as being stronger). I'm wondering if there may have been a legal reason for the change, either a change to actual law or a loss/close call in court that made Ford paranoid. Was the Explorer tire thing going yet in '96? I don't think that was for another few years, but if that had started I could see why Ford might have backed off any of their primarily passenger vehicles. wolrah fucked around with this message at 17:32 on Apr 21, 2013 |
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Apr 21, 2013 17:26
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NOTinuyasha posted:Someone needs to explain to me how Ford built a 4000lbs car with a 5.0L V8 and decided it only needed a 17 gallon gas tank. I'm sure the easy scapegoat is the Pinto.
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Apr 21, 2013 17:27
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wolrah posted:Was the Explorer tire thing going yet in '96? I don't think that was for another few years, but if that had started I could see why Ford might have backed off any of their primarily passenger vehicles. That was '98. I had one and got a set of free tires. Never had any problems because I kept them aired up properly and my wife didn't think the saw driving a go-kart when she had it.
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Apr 21, 2013 17:36
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I've never seen a Panther towing anything significant, so there's that. I camp a lot and live right near the water and have never seen one towing a boat or camper. I suppose if it were the opposite I'd be more inclined to recommend one for towing, but it's just not the case. Maybe the transmissions could be a weak link also? I know you can't use OD while towing but isn't that true for any auto trans? Beach Bum posted:After further research you're probably right. Figure 2500 for the trailer, that gives me only 2500 for car and gear and that's pushing it. I should probably just fix my truck Jesus you have a truck? Why would you want to buy another vehicle to tow if you could just fix a truck that you already have?
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Apr 21, 2013 18:27
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leica posted:I've never seen a Panther towing anything significant, so there's that. I camp a lot and live right near the water and have never seen one towing a boat or camper. I suppose if it were the opposite I'd be more inclined to recommend one for towing, but it's just not the case. I saw a Town Car pulling a 30ish foot sailboat on a triple axle trailer down the interstate at about 80 MPH not long ago, so it must be able to move that much mass and not poo poo itself immediately.
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Apr 21, 2013 19:10
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leica posted:
The same transmission was offered in F150's, so that can't be it.
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Apr 21, 2013 19:24
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Poisonlizard posted:The same transmission was offered in F150's, so that can't be it. Yeah the AOD-based AODE/4R70W/4R75W platform was universal across 4.6L RWD vehicles to my knowledge, everything from the Mustang to the Econoline got it. The 5.4L trucks got the heavier C6-based 4R100.
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Apr 21, 2013 21:25
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leica posted:I've never seen a Panther towing anything significant, so there's that. I camp a lot and live right near the water and have never seen one towing a boat or camper. I suppose if it were the opposite I'd be more inclined to recommend one for towing, but it's just not the case. When I was kid, it was common to see Country Squires and Caprice Wagons amongst the pickups at the boatramp. This was pre-minivan era, and Suburbans were only driven by contractors. It was the only way to haul a family of 5 and all their crap to the river/beach.
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Apr 21, 2013 22:06
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Goober Peas posted:When I was kid, it was common to see Country Squires and Caprice Wagons amongst the pickups at the boatramp. This was pre-minivan era, and Suburbans were only driven by contractors. It was the only way to haul a family of 5 and all their crap to the river/beach. Sure, when I was a kid my uncle towed his ski boat with an LTD. I dunno, if I was in the market to buy a dedicated towing vehicle for a large boat/camper/race car I would not buy a Panther. However I plan on buying a lightweight trailer for camping eventually and will not hesitate to tow it with my mine. A pop up may be in the cards, and I doubt the Vic would have a hard time with it. Reasonable is the key term here I think.
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Apr 21, 2013 23:56
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There are a lot of strength differences within the AOD/4R70W changes and even throughout the development of the 4R70W. Basically 4R70Ws built 93-97 are poo poo. The V6 Mustang ones have fewer clutch packs. 98-00 ones from a V8 are decent, they'll have stronger input shafts, revised valve bodies, the better accumulators, etc. They will still try to cook themselves pretty much no matter what car they're in, the radiator cooling that ford put in most cars was really ineffective. Dont tow without a tranny cooler. 01+ from behind a 5.4L are the best with the major difference being a higher pressure solenoid, the best of the valve bodies and the best planetaries. Yes, different 4R70Ws of the same yes had different planetary sets. The AOD is a 4R70W like a 1960s flat tappet 260 is a roller 302. It isn't. Theyre both windsor motors, ones miles ahead of the other. Lord Gaga fucked around with this message at 00:08 on Apr 22, 2013 |
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Apr 22, 2013 00:02
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Kid sold the CV I was gonna look at and I still need a DD so thoughts on this? Thoughts on this?  2000 Mercury GM 124,000K miles, $3200. I know a guy who works at this place so I should be able to get them to drop the price. Forgot to snag the VIN to run it but it looked straight and solid.
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Apr 22, 2013 00:25
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^^^^That's a good price.Lord Gaga posted:The AOD is a 4R70W like a 1960s flat tappet 260 is a roller 302. It isn't. Theyre both windsor motors, ones miles ahead of the other. Yeah That's what I kinda figured. I've been thinking of getting a bigger tranny cooler anyway just for insurance from the FL heat durring the summer.
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Apr 22, 2013 01:01
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leica posted:Jesus you have a truck? Why would you want to buy another vehicle to tow if you could just fix a truck that you already have? It's a 1980 F250 4x4 with a 302 and a 3 speed C6 that gets about 8mpg and I need to drop the transmission/transfer case to replace the flywheel. It's also at about three Sockingtons. So yeah, I have a truck. Sorta  There's also the matter of not having a car right now because of idiots and wildlife, so I need to pick something up soon and I'm stepping away from Europe for vehicles for awhile. InitialDave posted:That sounds a pretty hefty trailer. I'd have thought something about right for an E30 would be more like 1500-2000lbs empty. 1900-2200 seems to be the standard for wood deck dual-axle trailers with 3.5k axles; I figure I can use a trailer like that for a lot more than just a racecar, and I'm the kind of guy who likes to buy things right the first time. Beach Bum fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Apr 22, 2013 |
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Apr 22, 2013 02:09
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leica posted:^^^^That's a good price. What should I look for before I make an offer?
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Apr 22, 2013 03:13
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Transmission shifting issues, rough shifts, a very pronounced transmission shudder right around 50ish (torque convertershudder from old fluid), any misfires/rough idle, and anything loose in the front suspension.
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Apr 22, 2013 03:18
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Fucknag posted:Even the good 302s have issues above 400HP or so with the blocks splitting, don't they? One of them has a 350 in it, but that is going to be my brothers. I still want to buy it.
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Apr 22, 2013 17:31
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Rhyno posted:Kid sold the CV I was gonna look at and I still need a DD so thoughts on this? That looks like a 2003/04. Its a GS so it will be a little lacking in options but then again I used to drive Town Cars so I may be a bit skewed. I liked my Town Car when I had it but man was it loving slow. 210 hp  I don't think so. Even 3.27 RAR it still took for ever to get to speed. When the valve seals failed it was quite the mosquito fogger at stop lights. The 4R70W transmission had one speed for shifts, slow. I really haven't driven many 1998+ Panther car mostly cause I don't like the whale styling and I wanted something with more options and speed. So now I drive a car not quite as old as a Panther but it is discontinued like a Panther a N* DTS.
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Apr 22, 2013 19:37
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[quote="KennyLoggins" post="414707260" The 4R70W transmission had one speed for shifts, slow. I really haven't driven many 1998+ Panther car mostly cause I don't like the whale styling and I wanted something with more options and speed. So now I drive a car not quite as old as a Panther but it is discontinued like a Panther a N* DTS. [/quote] I have no idea why... but it seems like every one in AI secretly loves an land barge just to go for a drive in. Well, almost all of AI.
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Apr 22, 2013 21:36
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