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TheSpiritFox posted:Wait, I'm confused. How the hell can one loss equate to 320 wins to get back to where you were? How the hell does anyone manage to have any money at all? There's something I'm missing here, help me out. I think those are large-scale corporation battles that cause the big loss, as opposed to more common small-scale battles. Also, somebody mentioned the large battles being tied in to EVE Online, so that might have something to do with it.
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May 23, 2013 04:14
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TheSpiritFox posted:Wait, I'm confused. How the hell can one loss equate to 320 wins to get back to where you were? How the hell does anyone manage to have any money at all? There's something I'm missing here, help me out. This requires a quick definition of one thing. In Dust, they explain in the game's lore that "press X to respawn" is actually logical because the game takes place in the future and each time your character dies, his/her consciousness is instantly transferred to a new "clone" waiting to be deployed. So you die, your brain gets uploaded/downloaded to a new body, and bam you're back on the battlefield. With that out of the way, there are different game modes in Dust. For a basic match, you just queue up in your game mode of choice and the game matches you with teammates and opponents. However a new game mode was just released called Planetary Conquest (PC), and it is the first baby step in allowing Dust players to conquer planets in the New Eden universe, just like you can conquer New Eden systems in Eve Online. One difference between a regular pubbie match-made game and PC is that in PC, you have to pay lots of in-game money for the supply of clones you use to conquer planets. So if you want to attack a "district" in PC, your corporation (guild) has to front the cash for the clones you're going to burn to attack the other corporation who currently holds the district. And if you win, you need to buy enough clones to defend the district from corporations who might choose to challenge you. So when you lose badly in a PC match, your corporation's players not only lose the money they spent on their equipment, but you lose lots of money for all the clones you got slaughtered (i.e. when you buy a pack of clones and some of them die, they're gone for good). To make that money back, right now the only real way to do it right now is to sit and play pubbie matches. This takes a long-rear end time to do, since the money rewards for them are beans compared to the cost of the clone packs you need to buy in order to play PC.
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May 23, 2013 04:48
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That's sounds like a system designed for the creation of a monopoly ruling everything, lording over everyone else in the game who are all trapped in poverty.
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May 23, 2013 04:55
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Gorilla Salad posted:That's sounds like a system designed for the creation of a monopoly ruling everything, lording over everyone else in the game who are all trapped in poverty. Welcome to EVE Online and it's affiliated franchises. To guarantee that you enjoy your stay, please be sure to keep your affiliation with Something Awful a secret, no matter how insignificant it might seem.
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May 23, 2013 05:00
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If you play pub matches, you win, on average, 250,000 ISK. Not including the losses you incur in battle. And it takes 80 million isk to purchase the 150 clones to fight in the smallest Planetary Conquest battle. So, if we gently caress someone over they're out, at minimum, 320 pub matches worth of ISK. The answer as to how the afford it? People spent months grinding out ISK to participate before the conquest game mode came out.
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May 23, 2013 05:32
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Why do people play EVE Online again?
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May 23, 2013 05:38
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Lutha Mahtin posted:This requires a quick definition of one thing. In Dust, they explain in the game's lore that "press X to respawn" is actually logical because the game takes place in the future and each time your character dies, his/her consciousness is instantly transferred to a new "clone" waiting to be deployed. So you die, your brain gets uploaded/downloaded to a new body, and bam you're back on the battlefield. Wow. They make you pay for respawns. I expected paying for vehicles and maybe some static defenses if there was an assault/defend style game mode but making respawns cost your corp money... Illuminating. And awesome. Is Goonswarm involved in exploiting this or just watching gleefully from the sidelines? Sammus posted:If you play pub matches, you win, on average, 250,000 ISK. Not including the losses you incur in battle. And it takes 80 million isk to purchase the 150 clones to fight in the smallest Planetary Conquest battle. So, if we gently caress someone over they're out, at minimum, 320 pub matches worth of ISK. The answer as to how the afford it? People spent months grinding out ISK to participate before the conquest game mode came out. Think they'll drop the price of admission when cash stockpiles start to dry up? Also, what exactly are the benefits of controlling a district or whatever? Also sorry I'll stop turning this into a dust thread after this.
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May 23, 2013 05:38
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TheSpiritFox posted:Is Goonswarm involved in exploiting this or just watching gleefully from the sidelines? The guys in space are just sitting on the sidelines enjoying all the tears. Of which there are gallons. The guys on the ground however... Well we don't talk about our involvement (or lack of) in such actions where prying eyes can see. TheSpiritFox posted:Think they'll drop the price of admission when cash stockpiles start to dry up? Also, what exactly are the benefits of controlling a district or whatever? Also sorry I'll stop turning this into a dust thread after this. Probably not, they might tweak it a little, but the price won't chance much. And if you can hold a district long enough, you start making money off of it, but the game zone is such a small fraction of New Eden right now that it's a nonstop clusterfuck and no one is making money. There will be benefits to the EVE side of the corporation eventually, but that's in the future, knowing CCP it will be a while. Sammus fucked around with this message at 06:06 on May 23, 2013 |
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May 23, 2013 05:52
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TheSpiritFox posted:Also, what exactly are the benefits of controlling a district or whatever? Depending on what is built on the district, A reduction to fuel consuption of POSs, A reduction of research time of BPCs/BPOs at POSs, and some other bonuses I can't find I think one is a reduction to ship building time at POSs. http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/team-true-grit-brings-some-changes-this-may/
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May 23, 2013 07:05
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TheSpiritFox posted:Also sorry I'll stop turning this into a dust thread after this. Then how about a change of pace. One of my favorite griefing memories takes me back to my days in World of Warcraft. Towards the end of Burning Crusade during PVP Season 4 I had a brutal gladiator mortal strike warrior. (That is wow nerd speak for overpowered juggernaut motherfucker) Anyway, I took my warrior with a night elf priest healer friend out to a remote enemy outpost in Ashenvale. Now the server we were on was a normal server where if players are blue flagged (even if they are enemy faction) you cannot attack them. My goal was to get under leveled pubbies to red flag so I could chain kill them over and over. So I encouraged them to do so by killing every vendor and quest npc in the outpost. When the blue flagged pubbies came to turn in their quests, no one was there to serve them. So they sat and waited for the npcs to respawn. Before any of the pubbies could get to them, I would one shot every npc that respawned. After about 20 minutes of constantly doing this some of the low level pubbies red flagged and raged on me, only for me to one shot them and mock their corpses. After 40 minutes, then came the hate mail and people logging into their characters in my faction to send me bucket loads of tears. I pressed on. Moments after hate mail, their level 70 mains flew in and began their assault. There was this troll shaman named Vabitotijin that would always come to the defense of the pubbies under my griefing assault. He and his crew showed up to stop me. 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 guys flew in. I killed the two weak ones right away as Vabi started to heal the other two. My health got low but my cloaked night elf priest friend popped out on the roof and healed me to full. I eventually killed Vabi and since the heals on the other two was gone; they died in short order. Oh, I forgot to mention all the low level pubbies red flagged too so I got to kill all of them. For the next hour I camped their npcs and their bodies. The rest is history, history filled with lots of hatemail and angry wow forum posts. Those were the days, and in other games, still are.
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May 23, 2013 07:16
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I don't know why, but I giggle myself silly every time you guys describe "tears". Harvesting tears, drinking tears, bucket loads of tears. Pubbie tears, the gift that keeps on giving.
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May 23, 2013 13:44
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Also, bear in mind that's 250k per person. Squad size is six, so you can have six people making that 250K (more or less). It seems like a lot for a singular person, but for a whole corp of people throwing their money in the corp wallet (space communism style) it makes it go by a lot quicker. Districts themselves also produce clones on a regular basis and have a maximum 'cap' for clones. Whenever they produce more clones than they can hold, the excess are sold off for massive piles of isk. Since every Skylar with a proto-fit thinks they're the loving king of the gun game with no broader understanding of the game or New Eden, every cocksucker in the game is struggling for a district, and no one has an corporation security at all, so PC battles are happening constantly for pretty much every actual corp and the forums are awash in pubbie tears. I'm mean, we're talking Hurricane Katrina level of flood waters.
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May 23, 2013 16:07
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SpookyLizard posted:Also, bear in mind that's 250k per person. Squad size is six, so you can have six people making that 250K (more or less). It seems like a lot for a singular person, but for a whole corp of people throwing their money in the corp wallet (space communism style) it makes it go by a lot quicker. Districts themselves also produce clones on a regular basis and have a maximum 'cap' for clones. Whenever they produce more clones than they can hold, the excess are sold off for massive piles of isk. Since every Skylar with a proto-fit thinks they're the loving king of the gun game with no broader understanding of the game or New Eden, every cocksucker in the game is struggling for a district, and no one has an corporation security at all, so PC battles are happening constantly for pretty much every actual corp and the forums are awash in pubbie tears. I'm mean, we're talking Hurricane Katrina level of flood waters. Never mind, I want this game now. Is it coming out for/already on computer or just Xbox or whatever?
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May 23, 2013 18:39
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It's PS3 exclusive
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May 23, 2013 18:43
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Magres posted:It's PS3 exclusive There have been rumors however that it may get released on the PC. It already accepts a keyboard and mouse, and a lot of the options are very PC-centric.
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May 23, 2013 20:44
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E-Tank posted:There have been rumors however that it may get released on the PC. It already accepts a keyboard and mouse, and a lot of the options are very PC-centric. Except they (most likely) signed an exclusivity contract with Sony, else they wouldn't have gotten the wad of cash they did to produce the game. Sony reps were also all over last year's fanfest due to this and they couldn't speak 3 words without saying "Sony" during the presentations.
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May 23, 2013 20:52
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Haquer posted:Except they (most likely) signed an exclusivity contract with Sony, else they wouldn't have gotten the wad of cash they did to produce the game. That sucks. I would love to play this game game but have no other reason to buy a PS3.
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May 23, 2013 21:52
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Machai posted:That sucks. I would love to play this game game but have no other reason to buy a PS3. Yes you do, Demons' Souls. The best game.
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May 23, 2013 22:16
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Ok, so there's this custom SC2 game in the arcade called Probes vs Zealot. I have no idea if it's based on a previous game or something, but the basic idea is that you have a zealot who tries to kill all the probes and the probes build walls and turrets to keep the zealot out of their base where they build econ to get bigger walls and turrets. The zealot gets money equivalent to the damage he does and buys upgrades. It's basically an econ race trying to build your econ while still denying the zealot feed with turrets so he can't get so powerful he eats your wall and gets to kill you. You protect your wall by repairing it with your probe, basically you have to have a wall that you can repair faster than he can kill it. And the game is designed so that the zealot has a limited amount of time. There comes a point when the probes can get walls and turrets strong enough that the z cannot possibly kill the wall and then you before the turrets kill him. This is what probes love, building econ to the point that they're untouchable. Then you build super stalkers and go hunt the z down and it's finally kind of fun and satisfying I guess. This is a fairly long game. It starts, probes claim bases and start building things, then like 40 seconds later the zealot pops and starts eating your walls. From there it can last 45 minutes or more if the probes and zealot are all good and there's a good mixture of feeding and denying where people get to build massive economies. Econ in this game is almost nothing like econ in the actual SC2 game btw. I'll describe it later if someone is interested. So where is the grief? The zealot starts out weak as hell. Walls get upgraded as he gets more damage and there are like 18 wall levels with the costs (and HP/Damage resistance) growing exponentially the higher you go. But right when he pops he cannot eat his way through wall level 1 if it's being repaired. So you hide. And you wait. And as soon as he finds his first base (he has to scan or run around to find dudes, making hiding a valid tactic) you come behind him and build three walls and three turrets. This will basically force him to retreat with a cooldown TP power or die as he can't kill the walls and get out with you there repairing them. Thing is, if he finds a base and you find him fast enough, unless he feeds until he's inches from dead before he uses the TP power or runs across you unprotected and kills you after, the game is over. If he waits until his TP power recharges fully to go feed again he will be too behind to not be easily denied by everyone the rest of the game. If he doesn't, the next time he attacks you do it again and he dies. It seems simple, a valid tactic even. But there is no way to balance the game and have it be fun and prevent this, and like many G-Mod games this very much depends upon the cooperation of all the players to be true to the "concept" of the game which involves sitting around building econ and poo poo talking each other or the zealot. People rage. They hate you for it. You ruined their 45 minute sit there and econ game. The zealot will hate you because there's nothing he can really do to stop you. The probes will hate you because you're not playing your assigned role in the game and thus deny them theirs. The people who don't know the game will be bemused, but the people who play it alot and enjoy it have sometimes followed me for days sending me hate messages because why block people like that? It's funny. It's one of my favorite griefs because it's so drat easy to do and you're almost certain to ruin the game every single time. TheSpiritFox fucked around with this message at 23:07 on May 23, 2013 |
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May 23, 2013 23:04
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Sounds like a series of custom maps in the original Starcraft called "Cat and Mouse". If a probe got popped by (what was usually an ultralisk, or -I think- dragoon) it would get placed in a prison at the center of the map. Other 'mouse' players could release them by going to the prison and tagging a glowing spot. The rest of the game would go pretty much how you've described, except probes were unable to repair anything. Come to think of it, I can't imagine why they would include a feature where probes CAN repair in a new version, since, as you've described, that blatantly breaks the game's balance - literally, the Cat&Mouse appeal, of building walls to slow the cat down, and running the hell away.
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May 23, 2013 23:21
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Yeah there was a War3 version, Tropical Tag I think it was called, that gave the attackers various (there were several kinds of attackers) ways of getting past walls. Think Pudge's hook from DotA to fish out workers hiding behind walls, random teleports to skip over them, spells that did massive damage to walls to destroy them, etc. Also the probe stand-ins built their economy by constructing fairly large, weak buildings so hiding was out of the question as you would fall behind very quickly. It was a fun game, but I can't imagine playing it while needing an honor system.
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May 23, 2013 23:33
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Just to chime in - another Starcraft 1 gametype which was a heck of a lot of fun was "Comp Stomp". 5 (or more) players would all gang up together against one AI opponent in order to collect the 10 quick wins they needed to participate in the Battle-net ladder tournament. Of course, that all went out the window once we would join a match. The amusing thing was that, back then - you could click "Allied Victory / OFF" at any point in the match, so once the computer was dead, everyone was just standing around, thinking there was still a computer left. Of course, my friends and I would then argue (in game chat) that there *HAD* to be a *second* computer, and that it probably was one of the random human players in the game. Cue all sorts of "NO, STOP IT" and "I'M NOT THE COMPUTER" and "PLEASE!!" while we're all casually destroying their units with quips like "drat, the AI is even giving us taunts; this must be a good map script" and "Are you sure it isn't another Human player" and "No, I'm sure it's the AI - they upgraded it in another patch". Eventually, when they had nothing but 1 burning building left, we'd come clean and tell them the gig was up. Then, if they REALLY, REALLY wanted that win, they would say exactly what we told them to in the chatlog, no matter how degrading. ... They never got that win. (We even used to have a website devoted to it - it's probably still hidden away in the internet archives) Guigui fucked around with this message at 23:38 on May 23, 2013 |
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May 23, 2013 23:33
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bottles and cans posted:Sounds like a series of custom maps in the original Starcraft called "Cat and Mouse". If a probe got popped by (what was usually an ultralisk, or -I think- dragoon) it would get placed in a prison at the center of the map. Other 'mouse' players could release them by going to the prison and tagging a glowing spot. This game isn't about running away though. You can choose to, many of the things you build can be salvaged and you get every single bit of resources you put back into them, letting you relocate much or early on all of your base. People do that early sometimes. Zealot finds you, you move somewhere he doesn't know, and he has to go search out a new base, giving everyone else time to econ ahead of him and possibly letting you set up somewhere he won't find and saving you the cost of turrets (which get very expensive very fast) But no in the end you settle in one spot and build a base which you protect from him so that you can eventually kill him. I play it legit sometimes as well and I usually hide my base. The way the maps are set up, each base has one entrance which you can put a wall in so the z cannot get in. These entrances are almost always ramps into an elevated area, so the z has to scan or run into visual range to actually see you. I set up in a corner of a large base where even if the z runs up the ramp he has to run a little inside the base to actually see me. Experienced zealots sometimes check these spots so I have to move or I end up just quitting and hoping for better luck next time, but when I don't get found I don't have to spend a penny on turrets and can salvage my wall or other things at times to get the resources back and upgrade my actual economy faster than anyone else in the game. In the end, if no one fucks up too bad and just lets him feed I'm way, way ahead of everyone including the Z and pick the largest empty base on the map and go set up there and when he does eventually find me he dies the second he comes within firing range of my highly upgraded turrets. Once in a while I end up being the last base left as other probes lose their bases to a good z and run to mine because I can still hold my own. The game is set up so that multiple probes can repair a wall at the same time and repair it faster, which sometimes is enough to hold off the z and sometimes not. Probes can trade resources during the game and stuff, it's sometimes an interesting balance between helping the team win and wanting your own base which you got to the point you can survive with no help and kill the Z yourself. I've seen everyone salvage everything they can and pile in one base and give all their money to the dude who owns that bases wall so he can upgrade his poo poo and let everyone survive and win. TheSpiritFox fucked around with this message at 23:54 on May 23, 2013 |
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May 23, 2013 23:45
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TheSpiritFox posted:I've seen everyone salvage everything they can and pile in one base and give all their money to the dude who owns that bases wall so he can upgrade his poo poo and let everyone survive and win. It's also fun to get people to do this, then suicide so that A) they lose all their resources and B) your structures and units are all instantly destroyed. At least this is how it worked for the Warcraft 3 version of the mod. Another fun thing to do with the WC3 version was that it was possible to have two bad guys instead of just one. Each one of these bad guys gets a nuke, which is individually not enough to kill a builder - but when you have two, they die instantly. It was a short game.
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May 24, 2013 03:46
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TheSpiritFox posted:Also sorry I'll stop turning this into a dust thread after this.
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May 24, 2013 03:54
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I think the WC3 version was either Tree Tag or Sheep Tag, although the best was Worm Wars, a multiplayer snake/ tron.
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May 24, 2013 03:58
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Dreggon posted:It's also fun to get people to do this, then suicide so that A) they lose all their resources and B) your structures and units are all instantly destroyed. At least this is how it worked for the Warcraft 3 version of the mod. Oh! I finally remembered a griefing story! In Warcraft 3 there was a variant of the cat&mouse/probe games being talked about called kodo tag. What was different was that the 'cat' (kodo) was computer controlled (so it wasn't very smart) and had multiple 'cats' with different strengths. Anyway the builder used in kodo tag would, when constructing something, disappear inside of it and become invulnerable until the building was done. So what my friends and I would do is chain the most basic 'wall' which was free and had ~1 second construction time. You could start the next one pretty much right away with good button mashing so you'd almost never be vulnerable to attacks, while leaving a trail of basic walls across the map. Kodos (and honestly most players) were too stupid to time their attacks for when you would be vulnerable and/or would get distracted by the walls. The grief came either by deliberately creating wall-chains to other players bases that the kodos would for sure find and follow, screwing over the other guy, or you could just build right into their base and kill their worker without them being able to retaliate. Next step is that once a player's worker was killed, all their other buildings and units were destroyed, and they were sent to 'prison', where other players could save them (even with a reward for doing so). So basically my friends would intentionally kill/get other players killed, then rescue them for the reward money, then do it again and again. We even tried extortion, saying we'd only come save them if they paid us a percentage of their savings. Not the best grief I suppose, but to our 13 year old selves it was pretty good. We even had some notoriety with people coming into the pre-game lobby of games we hosted just to warn other people/insult us. edit: oh right, my friend also modified the game type to constantly play Linkin Park at 10x speed, I think that was probably the better grief Mazerunner fucked around with this message at 04:49 on May 24, 2013 |
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May 24, 2013 04:12
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My friend and I pretty much only attack with C4 jeeps and smoke grenades in BF3 these days. For our own team's vehicles, however, we just slap some C4 on and wait for someone to get in; as long as friendly fire is off, the explosions just knock them around, usually into the ground or buildings. This time, the resulting ground collision didn't kill them outright, so my friend immediately bailed out and stole the dude's heli. Short-lived but worth it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLTUwbyTEeE
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May 24, 2013 05:09
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Achtane posted:My friend and I pretty much only attack with C4 jeeps and smoke grenades in BF3 these days. For our own team's vehicles, however, we just slap some C4 on and wait for someone to get in; as long as friendly fire is off, the explosions just knock them around, usually into the ground or buildings. Forgetting C4, if you build up enough speed, you can knock somebody down with it, then burn them to death with the welding torch. People either burst out laughing or get incredibly angry at being killed by a tiny Wall-E. Either way, it's fun. If you ignore sometimes-annoying commentary, here's a good video of it. SurreptitiousMuffin fucked around with this message at 06:33 on May 24, 2013 |
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May 24, 2013 06:26
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Guigui posted:Just to chime in - another Starcraft 1 gametype which was a heck of a lot of fun was "Comp Stomp". Never underestimate the power of a Comp Stomp being griefed by the person running it. I never personally participated in this but one of my friends in middle school who was completely obsessed with starcraft prodded Big Game Hunters (gently caress that map forever) to have a single protoss AI opponent by default that would build absolutely nothing but photon cannons and probes. See the center landmass that looks vaguely like a face? That had a really giant any-unit trigger over it that would give the AI a huge pile of resources and force them to build a bunch of carriers and even more photon cannons. I wonder if anyone ever taught the WC3 AI how to highperch..
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May 24, 2013 07:48
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bucketmouse posted:Never underestimate the power of a Comp Stomp being griefed by the person running it. Man oh man I hate BGH - Hunters was such a good map and scrubs ruined it with BGH
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May 24, 2013 09:21
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Guigui posted:Just to chime in - another Starcraft 1 gametype which was a heck of a lot of fun was "Comp Stomp". 5 (or more) players would all gang up together against one AI opponent in order to collect the 10 quick wins they needed to participate in the Battle-net ladder tournament. Oh man, I used to love ruining these back when Starcraft was big. It was called 'bsing' when you attacked human players in a compstomp. I'd unally one or two people and then pre-emptively claim they were the bsers so I had a pretext for attacking them. The ultimate compstomp achievement, as far as I was concerned, was to sow enough chaos that all 6(?) of the other human players received a loss.
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May 24, 2013 09:34
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SurreptitiousMuffin posted:People either burst out laughing or get incredibly angry at being killed by a tiny Wall-E. Oh battle buddy[eod bot] and recon friend[recon drone]. You where one of the few things  did ever so right. I miss them so.
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May 24, 2013 14:13
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Mazerunner posted:
Oh my god I remember this, I thought it was hilarious back then.
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May 24, 2013 15:56
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SurreptitiousMuffin posted:It's funnier if you manage to stick C4 on the EOD bot. It's a tiny robot with a repair tool attached to it and is mostly pretty useless. It's very low to the ground and can move surprisingly quickly when it needs to so it's kinda easy to get it close to enemies. Getting the C4 to stay on it kind of an art, since it's got a tiny, wobbling little frame but it's always rewarding to pilot the little guy into a group of enemies. Roadkills with the EOD bot are the best. On a related note, people used to hate when you'd use the UAV in Battlefield: Bad Company 2 to destroy the objectives in Rush by loading them down with C4 and flying them over to it. Related note further, UAV roadkills (which didn't really annoy anyone since it was a goon server): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXHYdLGGKUA
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May 24, 2013 17:39
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Rev. Bleech_ posted:Related note further, UAV roadkills (which didn't really annoy anyone since it was a goon server): I miss WookWook.  For all it's horrible gaping flaws, BC2 was still awesome.
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May 24, 2013 17:49
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Corbeau posted:I miss WookWook. BC2 was flawless  , but yeah I miss wook wook too. Those were some good times.
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May 27, 2013 01:25
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For some reason I find BF3 just doesn't have the same capacity for entertaining shenanigans, especially the ones that benefit the team as a dual purpose. Even basic things like jihad jeeping are so much more finicky.
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May 27, 2013 01:31
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Some people in Dust, who shall not be named, and who may or may not be related to GoonFeet, have continued their trend of ruining people's high dollar matches and taking trophies. Such as this: http://tinyurl.com/pl5nymv
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May 27, 2013 07:48
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SurreptitiousMuffin posted:It's funnier if you manage to stick C4 on the EOD bot. It's a tiny robot with a repair tool attached to it and is mostly pretty useless. It's very low to the ground and can move surprisingly quickly when it needs to so it's kinda easy to get it close to enemies. Getting the C4 to stay on it kind of an art, since it's got a tiny, wobbling little frame but it's always rewarding to pilot the little guy into a group of enemies. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0fRZ0Dc89s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPdgLTl7ja4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=11YaS7Jdc7w Another great thing about the EOD bot is you can drive it to the next set of mcoms and wait until your team takes the base and immediately plant the new mcom. (you just have to keep exiting the EODbot before the 10 sec timer runs out)
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May 27, 2013 08:19
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