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Nephilm posted:I really want to like Deff Skwadron, but the artstyle is very messy and I can't comfortable read most panels. It's a shame. Heretic! I find it hard to believe that anyone could dislike Deff Skwadron. The art is standard comic fair but the story and the characters were pretty awesome. Baron Bifford posted:I read that book and the only idiotic thing she did was not commit suicide when she was captured by the genestealers. She chose to stay alive so that she could record as much intelligence as she could on her bionic eye. Y'know, because her own life was not hers to end but FOR THE EMPRAH! (God that was a stupid part). I haven't read the book but this is pretty standard in 40k and fits into the usual grim dark fair right?
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Jun 18, 2013 15:22
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Kegslayer posted:Heretic! I find it hard to believe that anyone could dislike Deff Skwadron. The art is standard comic fair but the story and the characters were pretty awesome. No, I also didn't like the art because it's really hard to read. It's a black and white comic but it's inked like an uncolored color comic and there's very little shading, so every panel is this explosion of lines on white space and it's way too busy to parse easily. Compare this to, say, 2000 AD in the B&W years when they used lots of black, different types of line work, and shading to make the foreground pop from the background. The comic itself is good except for that, but the art just isn't suited to being in black and white and in a comic that's kind of a downer. OXBALLS DOT COM fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Jun 18, 2013 |
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Jun 18, 2013 16:46
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The Blood Ravens are loving stupid and their hinted at heritage story is on a par with the product of a 12 year old writing fan fiction. gently caress the Blood Ravens. They do have a cool colour scheme though.
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Jun 18, 2013 17:02
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Rapey Joe Stalin posted:The Blood Ravens are loving stupid and their hinted at heritage story is on a par with the product of a 12 year old writing fan fiction. gently caress the Blood Ravens. And, they are like Deffskulls. If it ain't nailed down, they nick it.
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Jun 18, 2013 17:32
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I wouldn't go as far to call the Blood Ravens thieves. It's not like they knocked the Novamarines' quartermaster over the head and nicked that Terminator armor. They mostly just find stuff lying around in strange places, and they are in no hurry to track down the rightful owner, if there still is one. They're like RPG adventurers. The Thousand Sons angle does sound very much like the origin story of a bad 90s superhero. And all Space Marines are insufferable. The most likable character from Dawn of War 2 was Sergeant Merrick ("Had I half a brain, I would have left this sector years ago.").
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Jun 18, 2013 19:15
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Kurzon posted:The Grey Knights have never been corrupted by Chaos because they are super-believers in the Emperor (this sounds kinda insulting to the other Chapters - are they not so zealous?). The Sisters of Battle get supernatural powers based on their Faith, yet they have no psykers among their ranks. This seems to suggest that the Emperor does have some sort of divine presence in the Warp, that he's more than just a glorified lighthouse. What's the true explanation? Is he a proper god, or is he just an uber-powerful psyker who is half-dead? The way I always heard it explained in cannon/books/codex's whatever is that one of the ideas behind the 2nd founding was to split the gently caress out of the space marine legions into TOTALLY separate chapters. On one hand, simply because of the age of some of the warriors, for instance the space marines in the new Gaunt book who says he remembers machines just after the great crusade, some chapters venerate the emperor as just as he was in the great crusade. poo poo TONS of respect and BORDERLINE religious zealot-ism but not actually believing him a god because in a few instances, they know he isn’t. Like their leaders met him in the case of the raven guard. I don't remember where exactly I read this but I remember their being a passage where specifically the Inquisition was working with either the Space Wolves or the Dark angels chapters on an operation, and the inquisitor actually petitioned the high lords of terra to eliminate the chapter because when the inquisition and normal humans were like "PRAISE BE TO THE GOD-EMPEROR" their response was basically "yep. I mean, whatever keeps you fighting kids". They clearly did NOT think he was a god, but they didn’t seem fussed that everyone else thinks he is. I think the high lords' response was like "uhmmm, yea space marines are weird don’t worry about it  ". On the other hand you do read about other chapters as being described as very religious so I think that has to do with the 2nd founding de centerlizeing the space marine structure so that a second heresy wouldn’t be able to absorb so much so quickly. Also because GW wanted you to be able to come up with whatever back-story you wanted for your Space marines, and not be limited to the well fleshed out 4 (I think) legions that actually have separate codex's.
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Jun 18, 2013 19:42
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Arquinsiel posted:I haven't read it, but I am wondering why she didn't send in a servo-skull on a long string instead. Because Steve Parker is a hack?
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Jun 18, 2013 20:13
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Well obviously, but what's the hacked justification for not doing it?
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Jun 18, 2013 20:39
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He doesn't even bother. What makes it worse is the Inquisitor she works for communicates nearly exclusively from a remote controlled servo skull, so it's not like the author is unaware of their existence.
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Jun 18, 2013 21:45
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Baron Bifford posted:I wouldn't go as far to call the Blood Ravens thieves. It's not like they knocked the Novamarines' quartermaster over the head and nicked that Terminator armor. They mostly just find stuff lying around in strange places, and they are in no hurry to track down the rightful owner, if there still is one. They're like RPG adventurers. Er, isn't the text description for a few items exactly that? Something about an inquisitor "disappearing" and they have his bolter now, and the same deal with the champion of another chapter and his sword? They see gear they want, kill the owner, and take it
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Jun 18, 2013 22:03
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AcidRonin posted:The way I always heard it explained in cannon/books/codex's whatever is that one of the ideas behind the 2nd founding was to split the gently caress out of the space marine legions into TOTALLY separate chapters. On one hand, simply because of the age of some of the warriors, for instance the space marines in the new Gaunt book who says he remembers machines just after the great crusade, some chapters venerate the emperor as just as he was in the great crusade. poo poo TONS of respect and BORDERLINE religious zealot-ism but not actually believing him a god because in a few instances, they know he isn’t. Like their leaders met him in the case of the raven guard. I don't remember where exactly I read this but I remember their being a passage where specifically the Inquisition was working with either the Space Wolves or the Dark angels chapters on an operation, and the inquisitor actually petitioned the high lords of terra to eliminate the chapter because when the inquisition and normal humans were like "PRAISE BE TO THE GOD-EMPEROR" their response was basically "yep. I mean, whatever keeps you fighting kids". They clearly did NOT think he was a god, but they didn’t seem fussed that everyone else thinks he is. I think the high lords' response was like "uhmmm, yea space marines are weird don’t worry about it
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Jun 18, 2013 22:07
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Fried Chicken posted:Er, isn't the text description for a few items exactly that? Something about an inquisitor "disappearing" and they have his bolter now, and the same deal with the champion of another chapter and his sword? They see gear they want, kill the owner, and take it
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Jun 18, 2013 22:28
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Baron Bifford posted:Or maybe they get into a fight with somebody who was hostile to them and they looted his corpse. Maybe the Inquisitor was being dick. Or maybe They Steal loving EVERYTHING
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Jun 18, 2013 23:07
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"Blood Magpies" has a ring to it.
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Jun 18, 2013 23:20
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Now I feel like an awful person because I kind of like the Blood Ravens...
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Jun 18, 2013 23:41
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bunnyofdoom posted:And, they are like Deffskulls. No no no no, they get everything as "gifts". VanSandman posted:Dammit. I'm reading Deathwatch by Steve Parker (it's new) and dammit if he doesn't go and get all gross on me. Oh boy, listening to this when it comes out is going to be an interesting if not awkward experience then.
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Jun 19, 2013 01:07
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Let's not forget that in a very real way, the Astartes are all grandchildren of the Emperor. There's plenty of spots in canon where Inquisitors or other zealots are uncomfortable with how they regard the Emperor. There are also plenty of incidents where the Astartes properly venerate the God Emperor. 40K is a big tent, there's at least one of everything in there.
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Jun 19, 2013 03:31
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mllaneza posted:Let's not forget that in a very real way, the Astartes are all grandchildren of the Emperor. There's plenty of spots in canon where Inquisitors or other zealots are uncomfortable with how they regard the Emperor. There are also plenty of incidents where the Astartes properly venerate the God Emperor. 40K is a big tent, there's at least one of everything in there. I bet Lorgar still gets a laugh at seeing how his earlier faith took root so well that even the Empire's top defenders have been swept in. Back to books, I've been giving the Word Bearers series a try and it's...not very good. It has a few starts here and there but never really engages. I guess the Night Lords series and Betrayer spoiled me for how writing about traitors should be done.
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Jun 19, 2013 14:01
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A few of those items were lost in battle with xenos. Yeah, I guess the Blood Ravens are a bit douchey for not immediately shipping that jump pack back to the Blood Angels. Some of the others are a bit suspicious, yes, but there's no smoking gun.
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Jun 19, 2013 14:02
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Baron Bifford posted:A few of those items were lost in battle with xenos. Yeah, I guess the Blood Ravens are a bit douchey for not immediately shipping that jump pack back to the Blood Angels. Some of the others are a bit suspicious, yes, but there's no smoking gun. You mean the literal and figurative smoking gun where they claim the got in a gun exchange but the BA have no record of? Are you being deliberately obtuse?
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Jun 19, 2013 14:43
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Haha, this is awesome. I so want a Blood Ravens Epic army now.
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Jun 19, 2013 15:13
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berzerkmonkey posted:Haha, this is awesome. I so want a Blood Ravens Epic army now. You could have a mishmash of marines from random chapters and it'd still work as a Blood Ravens army. 
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Jun 19, 2013 17:30
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bunnyofdoom posted:You mean the literal and figurative smoking gun where they claim the got in a gun exchange but the BA have no record of? Are you being deliberately obtuse?
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Jun 19, 2013 17:53
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Lyer posted:You could have a mishmash of marines from random chapters and it'd still work as a Blood Ravens army.
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Jun 19, 2013 18:18
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gently caress, Space Wolves get the all the cool attributes of wolves and poo poo. Blood Ravens like to steal shiny poo poo like a crow.
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Jun 19, 2013 18:26
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Baron Bifford posted:OK, there's that one. That's the one that's truly suspicious. Add in all the other "How the hell did they get these?" and a pattern starts to emerge. It's like having a murder conviction. One piece of phsyical evidence (fingerprints on the murderknife) and a whole bunch of circumstantial with varying degrees of suspiciousness (suspect threatened guy with knife, suspect had burned clothing in his furnace, guy was seen around the crime scene around time of death)
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Jun 19, 2013 18:31
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Has this been explicitly confirmed in some canon write-up?
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Jun 19, 2013 18:38
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Baron Bifford posted:Has this been explicitly confirmed in some canon write-up? Everything and nothing in 40k is "canon". So in short: who cares
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Jun 19, 2013 18:46
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/\ Yeah, that/\ DoW 2
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Jun 19, 2013 18:47
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Baron Bifford posted:Has this been explicitly confirmed in some canon write-up? All those images are descriptions from Dawn of War 2, which is as canon as you get with the Blood Ravens.
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Jun 19, 2013 18:58
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Fiction is not non-fiction. Dawn of War isn't an account of something that actually happened. Here's the "for literal children" explanation: Blood Ravens stealing poo poo started because DoW II had items and Relic saw it as an opportunity to incorporate mentions of all the famous chapters instead of having to make up a ton of boring items only from their made-up chapter with a mysterious, ambiguous past. Then somewhere along the way, some writer or someone noticed that this made them seem like a bunch of looters, so they put in subtle jokes to that effect because it's funny and also adds to the characterization of the Blood Ravens as mysterious, possibly disreputable, and short on materiel or relics from their founding.
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Jun 19, 2013 19:07
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Cream_Filling posted:Fiction is not non-fiction. Dawn of War isn't an account of something that actually happened. Also, it's a good bit of comic relief, which 40k really bad needs, considering the orks are the only ones, and even then, they are pretty loving grimdark too
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Jun 19, 2013 19:20
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They should use the Tau for observational humor, as they are perhaps the only sane people in the galaxy.
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Jun 19, 2013 19:37
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Baron Bifford posted:They should use the Tau for observational humor, as they are perhaps the only sane people in the galaxy. Barring in mind they'er probably a race of mind controlled space-socialists, yeah, relatively speaking.
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Jun 19, 2013 19:41
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Baron Bifford posted:They should use the Tau for observational humor, as they are perhaps the only sane people in the galaxy. There's a great bit in Dark Crusade where a Chaos lord communicates telepathically with the Tau commander, who dismisses the voices in his head as radio interference.
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Jun 19, 2013 19:41
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TheStampede posted:Barring in mind they'er probably a race of mind controlled space-socialists, yeah, relatively speaking. They're the only remotely reasonable people in the galaxy, so they are born to be its stand-up comics, if the Orks are the clowns.
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Jun 19, 2013 19:51
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Baron Bifford posted:Honestly I see the Tau race not as misfits but as a missed opportunity. Games Workshop decided W40K needed an optimistic race because the grimdark gets really stupid when you have 15-year olds screaming FOR THE EMPRAH and WAAAGH! all the time. They came off initially as the United Federation of Planets in the 41st millenium, which many players didn't like. I think none of the writers knew what they were supposed to do with these guys, so they are steadily making them as grimdark as everybody else. What about the Salamanders? They're the galaxy's straight man I swear.
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Jun 19, 2013 20:05
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I hear lots of good things about those guys. They're nice guys who actually believe in getting to know the people they are supposed to protect. But they're still Imperium. They still have lots of funny beliefs. Like everyone else, they believe that their bolters are alive and must cuddled every so often so that they don't feel unloved.
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Jun 19, 2013 20:11
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bunnyofdoom posted:What about the Salamanders? Eh, GW will mandate that someone writes about a book about them that reveals that they worship the emperor as if he were moloch and that they force the people they "help" to sacrifice one third of their infant population in a pit of fire.
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Jun 19, 2013 20:12
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Baron Bifford posted:Honestly I see the Tau race not as misfits but as a missed opportunity. Games Workshop decided W40K needed an optimistic race because the grimdark gets really stupid when you have 15-year olds screaming FOR THE EMPRAH and WAAAGH! all the time. They came off initially as the United Federation of Planets in the 41st millenium, which many players didn't like. I think none of the writers knew what they were supposed to do with these guys, so they are steadily making them as grimdark as everybody else.
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Jun 19, 2013 20:24
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