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bonds0097 posted:The rule is 1 page per 10 years of work experience. At my company we definitely look down on people with multi-page resumes without the experience to justify it. Well, you shouldn't have 3 pages if you've been working for 2 years. But if you've had 5 jobs in 10 years and contributed a lot at each, I wouldn't be surprised to see two or three pages. The only time I ever even see a paper resume is when someone hands one to me. Most of the time I'm looking at them on a computer or tablet.
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Jul 21, 2013 01:51
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I have 2-3 jobs and 2-3 github projects that I want to mention, in addition to relevant university extracurricular activities. It is quite difficult to squeeze these in on a single page, and I end up removing some details about the work experience or projects. Also, this setup gives me no room to add more things in the future without removing older ones. Each line is precious, and if I felt free to add a second page, I would definitely add it. The 1 page resume seems to be more of an American thing. In Europe, 2 page resumes are standard. Even some NGOs recommend them, as seen here. Admittedly, the samples are pretty bad and not suitable at all for Software Devs, but they make a point.
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Jul 21, 2013 01:58
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Your resume should be prioritized. Things that make you look the best should be emphasized and sometimes that means less impressive things go by the wayside. I'm going to wager that actual finished projects and actual work experience is going to matter more to people doing hiring than relevant university extracurriculars. It's not the worst idea to have a project that's not on your resume that you can bring up in an interview. Especially if they pull some bullshit like 'tell me about something I can't read about in your resume.' Mentioning things that are not on your resume can give the appearance of having more breadth and possibly humility (unless they are bullshit, do not bring up bullshit).
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Jul 21, 2013 02:15
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Pseudo-God posted:I have 2-3 jobs and 2-3 github projects that I want to mention, in addition to relevant university extracurricular activities. It is quite difficult to squeeze these in on a single page, and I end up removing some details about the work experience or projects. Also, this setup gives me no room to add more things in the future without removing older ones. Each line is precious, and if I felt free to add a second page, I would definitely add it. Nevertheless, in the US it would still be expected to have a single page (you shouldn't even be mentioning University extracurriculars if you've had multiple jobs after college). This is particularly true at career fairs or the like, I can't imagine recruiters will even look at your two page resume. I personally would rather have too little on my resume than too much. I think it's silly to even have a tools section. My resume should be communicating that I have the skills to learn whatever tools are needed if I don't already know them. I find it ridiculous when someone lists 'Windows XP' on their resume or 'Tortoise SVN'. Why would I care if you know how to use a specific VCS? Instead your resume should give me the impression that you can learn whatever is being used within a few weeks.
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Jul 21, 2013 02:32
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I like to read about your hobbies because then i know you aren't a sperglord. Unless your hobbies involve wearing fedoras and MRA meetings, then maybe leave them off.
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Jul 21, 2013 02:43
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FamDav posted:I like to read about your hobbies because then i know you aren't a sperglord. Unless your hobbies involve wearing fedoras and MRA meetings, then maybe leave them off.
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Jul 21, 2013 03:25
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Anyone have feedback on how much experience/skills are worth vs degrees, either in terms of being hired or being able to negotiate salaries?
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Jul 21, 2013 03:31
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Vei posted:Anyone have feedback on how much experience/skills are worth vs degrees, either in terms of being hired or being able to negotiate salaries? A degree will help you get your first job. A master's degree will generally count as "1-2 years of experience" (even though they're not even remotely the same thing) in terms of negotiating a salary. After job #1, no one really cares unless you want to a top-tier CS school like Stanford or MIT or an ivy league school, unless they also went to Podunk University.
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Jul 21, 2013 03:54
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FamDav posted:top interview tip: if you can describe a solution for a programming problem using a hylomorphism, you'll get the job. I've heard candidates talk about isomorphisms but what the hell? e: huh, I thought of philosophy first but you probably mean this hylomorphism? I've never heard that term 
csammis fucked around with this message at 04:29 on Jul 21, 2013 |
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Jul 21, 2013 04:26
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csammis posted:I've heard candidates talk about isomorphisms but what the hell? Pfft if it doesn't use a zygohistomorphic prepromorphism, it ain't worth talking about. Hylomorphisms are basically how stream fusion works.
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Jul 21, 2013 04:31
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NovemberMike posted:Couple of hours from St. Louis in what direction? IIRC Strange Loop has been sold out for awhile now but I might know some people to talk to. South; I'm in Cape Girardeau. Strange Loop is sold out and I'd definitely have to pay for it myself, but I went ahead and signed up for the waitlist.
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Jul 21, 2013 04:58
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Soup in a Bag posted:South; I'm in Cape Girardeau. Strange Loop is sold out and I'd definitely have to pay for it myself, but I went ahead and signed up for the waitlist. Ok, I know people west of Saint Louis. Not sure where you were looking, but I know that Carfax is hiring and they tend to pay a fair wage for the area, the city is nice and they make an effort to send people to conferences and training. I think that there are also some developer meetups in St Louis that you could go to, something like http://www.meetup.com/stlruby/. Really, as long as you can find some other professional programmers in a city you're interested in and you don't come off as a total goon, you can get onto the "I'm looking for something new, know any companies that are hiring?" conversation pretty easily over a beer or something.
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Jul 21, 2013 14:18
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I'm not sure where I'm looking yet either so thanks for the suggestions. I'll keep an eye out for meetups I might be able to make it to and go from there I guess.
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Jul 21, 2013 14:54
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FamDav posted:I like to read about your hobbies because then i know you aren't a sperglord. Unless your hobbies involve wearing fedoras and MRA meetings, then maybe leave them off. I have heard before that I should list hobbies on my resume, but it justfeels wrong. I feel like I shouldn't just say "programming", I'm going to sound like a tryhard. I don't think I should list video games or posting on internet forums, either. That leaves stuff like gardening, but do companies really like to hear about my cactus farm?
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Jul 22, 2013 09:10
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Zero The Hero posted:I have heard before that I should list hobbies on my resume, but it justfeels wrong. I feel like I shouldn't just say "programming", I'm going to sound like a tryhard. I don't think I should list video games or posting on internet forums, either. That leaves stuff like gardening, but do companies really like to hear about my cactus farm? You can't just come up with something like sports or reading or cooking or something? Anything to at least make people think you have hobbies that make you not seem like a neckbeard (not meaning to say you are)?
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Jul 22, 2013 09:13
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piratepilates posted:You can't just come up with something like sports or reading or cooking " -Ten years of experience in node.js and Android development. -I like to LARP, read manga, and make my own pocky. "
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Jul 22, 2013 09:34
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It just feels out of place to me. I'm applying for a job, not a date.
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Jul 22, 2013 10:31
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Zero The Hero posted:It just feels out of place to me. I'm applying for a job, not a date. If I spend 8 hours a day collaborating on a project with someone it would be nice if we shared a mutual interest or two besides programming.
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Jul 22, 2013 11:24
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Why on earth would you put hobbies on a resume, that's something you'd talk about during the interview process.
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Jul 22, 2013 15:14
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Mr. Crow posted:Why on earth would you put hobbies on a resume, that's something you'd talk about during the interview process. Exactly, that's what you yak about during the "have lunch with the candidate to verify they're not a scary goonlord" portion of the interview process.
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Jul 22, 2013 15:26
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generally the people who've put hobbies down are the nice people who are also really good at their jobs that i would enjoy to work with everyday. If you are hard pressed to think of hobbies, you might not be in that category. Last time I sent out a cover letter was for a finance position. I more or less wrote "I really prefer it snowing in the winter to raining. I enjoy hiking and rafting, and I like baking pies (I usually bring in a few every other week). Also, I do an algorithm." and ended up going in for an in person and got it, but realized it wasn't a good fit. disclaimer: It probably helped that the school to which I went is a feeder school for i-banks.
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Jul 22, 2013 16:51
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Newbies, I have some advice for you: don't take advice from this thread.
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Jul 22, 2013 17:01
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carry on then posted:Newbies, I have some advice for you: don't take advice from this thread. You've done it now.
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Jul 22, 2013 17:36
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Mr. Crow posted:Why on earth would you put hobbies on a resume, that's something you'd talk about during the interview process. Pretty much this. This is exactly what happened to me at my last interview, every single person I talked to asked me "So what do you do for fun?".
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Jul 22, 2013 18:32
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Is there any worse feeling than the limbo when waiting to hear back from an interview? I have always hated uncertainty and just want to know the outcome already! Every time I get an email I am scrambling to check it.
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Jul 22, 2013 19:02
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Tres Burritos posted:Pretty much this. This is exactly what happened to me at my last interview, every single person I talked to asked me "So what do you do for fun?". I've been asked that. I start by staring at them blankly for a beat and then saying, completely flatly, "Code." Then I laugh and tell them some other things.
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Jul 22, 2013 19:10
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Ithaqua posted:I've been asked that. I start by staring at them blankly for a beat and then saying, completely flatly, "Code." "What is... f-fuuunnn?"
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Jul 22, 2013 19:37
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Che Delilas posted:"What is... f-fuuunnn?" I've been asked what my favorite book/movie is, and my inner wise rear end really wanted to say "Mein Kampf" and "The Human Centipede". I didn't, though, because I wanted the job. Then after a few weeks, I didn't want the job.
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Jul 22, 2013 19:55
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Ithaqua posted:I've been asked what my favorite book/movie is, and my inner wise rear end really wanted to say "Mein Kampf" and "The Human Centipede". I didn't, though, because I wanted the job. Then after a few weeks, I didn't want the job. I loving hate being asked, "Where do you see yourself in 5 years?". At my last interview I asked if anyone would give me that one and all I got was "  God I hope no one asks you that".
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Jul 22, 2013 20:08
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I'm a big fan of seeing extra-curriculars and hobbies. When I sift through dozens of dry resumes one after another, anything that shows a little bit of personality, earnest interest, or passion is super appealing to me. We already have enough people on the team who just show up to earn their paycheck. It's a testing/automation group, so anything that shows creativity or problem-solving is a big plus.
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Jul 22, 2013 20:12
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I like to post in FYAD. It's kind of obscure, you probably haven't heard of it.
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Jul 22, 2013 20:16
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Tres Burritos posted:Pretty much this. This is exactly what happened to me at my last interview, every single person I talked to asked me "So what do you do for fun?". I used to have hobbies. Now I just job search. Maybe I could have a conversation about job searching with the guy interviewing me. My roommate once had an interview where the two guys interviewing him took a break halfway through to talk about Final Fantasy XI with each other. My roommate was clueless about the game. but I would have had that job. Honestly though, it sounds like I should list a hobby or two. I'm thinking botany and, idk, home repair. Maybe woodworking. I don't actually do that anymore, but I could still discuss it if asked about it. One of my few remaining hobbies is discussing politics, but I don't think that's going to land me any jobs.
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Jul 23, 2013 00:06
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Zero The Hero posted:Honestly though, it sounds like I should list a hobby or two. I'm thinking botany and, idk, home repair. Maybe woodworking. I don't actually do that anymore, but I could still discuss it if asked about it. One of my few remaining hobbies is discussing politics, but I don't think that's going to land me any jobs. If you're having trouble getting interviews, the problem isn't that you don't have a "hobbies" section on your resume.
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Jul 23, 2013 00:48
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Mr. Crow posted:Why on earth would you put hobbies on a resume, that's something you'd talk about during the interview process. Strangely enough, during my interviews we've discussed the things on my resume.
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Jul 23, 2013 01:53
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https://docs.google.com/document/d/124RMMieHN9Axsr1axYtOTC18Xuqar6CdV_HLtZYg74k/edit?pli=1 I've applied for roughly 40 jobs and have been rejected from every one. Judging from my LinkedIn history, when I apply for a position the recruiter visits my profile, but something is turning them off. Some of the rejections could be that I'm applying for positions using technology I don't have listed on my resume (Ruby, specifically). But I feel like there is something more to it. My initial suspicion was that people thought I got fired from my team lead position and was only able to find part-time work. To counter that, I moved my education section above the career one and added a note that I left that position specifically to get a bachelor's.
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Jul 23, 2013 04:18
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oRenj9 posted:https://docs.google.com/document/d/124RMMieHN9Axsr1axYtOTC18Xuqar6CdV_HLtZYg74k/edit?pli=1 Get rid of the line about attending community college for CIS in 2005 and not getting a degree.
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Jul 23, 2013 04:34
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I would also drop tools, platforms, and most of expertise. Also, drop the expository paragraphs under each job. Finally, can you change your bullet points so they have the struct BULLET: (Something I did) which (How it affected the project or the company). As an example of the last point: "Modified our serialization module to use protobufs, resulting in a 10% reduction in time spent during solver iterations." This tells me what you did, why it was important, and also gives me some things to ask questions about ( How did you measure the time reduction? Why was this meaningful? Why did you pick protobufs? ).
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Jul 23, 2013 08:50
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I could use some advice: I've recently applied for a position (at a company I would love to work at) that is just a little bit out of my comfort zone. I did mostly web development before, the position is for a sysadmin, for which I also have a decent amount of experience setting up (web) servers, networks, simple shell scripts, both at work and in my free time. As it's a position that only requires "basic" knowledge in all of that I think I could do this and learn a lot of the skills I still lack quickly. Now in the process of setting up the interview, they have sent me another mail basically saying that they reviewed my resume again and think I sound more like a web developer than a sysadmin (which of course I do), and if I was really sure I wanted to apply for this. They currently don't have an open developer position that would fit me, at least not publicly, else I would probably have applied to that first, but honestly I think I could do both (I would still have a lot to learn for both anyways), and I don't think I would be unhappy in either of these. What do?
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Jul 23, 2013 09:29
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Explain that you specifically want to work for them and why. Mention that you didn't see any developer positions but found another one that you would like to do and think you're capable of. "if I was really sure I wanted to apply for this" is kind of hard to judge without more context, but given the circumstances some careful fishing for any interest for a developer would be good. That's why I'd simply state you're more experienced as a programmer but didn't have the impression they were currently hiring any, yet *would still be perfectly happy* doing the other job.
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Jul 23, 2013 12:02
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oRenj9 posted:https://docs.google.com/document/d/124RMMieHN9Axsr1axYtOTC18Xuqar6CdV_HLtZYg74k/edit?pli=1 Is it customary in the US (or wherever you are) to put skills & education before career? The problem of a skills section like that going first is that there's no way to judge your knowledge of any of the things you list as skills, and going back and forth takes  .This isn't your first job, so I give gently caress-all about your education. Then there's a few things like "Android SDK". I can't find any place in your career where you mention using that, yet it's an in-demand skill. What gives?
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Jul 23, 2013 12:07
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