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The only coal on my whole continent is underneath a Brazilwood Camp-ed Jungle. 
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Jul 25, 2013 12:14
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isndl posted:For the Ancient and Classical eras, he's fine. Starting in Medieval where Civil Service farms should be kicking in, he's going to start stalling. Two of those Citruses are sitting on jungle, meaning he loses food (or the science from University) if he puts plantations down. He's got good diversity for trade routes, but it's frankly not a powerhouse science city like he is looking for. It's a good production city, a potentially good trade route city (can't guarantee this without seeing how the rest of the world looks), and if he was really ballsy he could settle on the Deer to be a trade city with Petra, but it's got nothing to make it shine as a science city. His early start is pretty good as he has a 3 food source and a 2 food 1 production source. He's going to need a trade route going back in to his capital for food later on but that's fine. He's playing on price so he probably doesn't even need to build improvements past getting a copy of each luxury. He'll be fine. It's also good to practice different terrains and see what they do and not just quit every time it's not a perfect start. Unless you're in tundra, then you can quit. Someone asked earlier what makes a good start: Salt!!!!!
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Jul 25, 2013 13:34
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I have real problems doing anything but a Tradition start these days. The massive super-capital with the halved unhappiness and the national college is just too good, not to mention fast expanding borders and a large free army. I just don't get how Liberty, Honour or Piety can stand up to Tradition as a first tree. Do Libertarians just play on huge maps only or lower difficulty levels (or slow game speed, same thing)?
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Jul 25, 2013 14:50
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Gort posted:I have real problems doing anything but a Tradition start these days. The massive super-capital with the halved unhappiness and the national college is just too good, not to mention fast expanding borders and a large free army. I haven't played a religious civ in BNW yet, so I've yet to take piety. I take liberty when I feel that I'm going to lose out on a good location for a third city since I can't afford to just buy a settler so easily in the early game since the gold changes. Honor never was a good opener(but sometimes good to get later), unless you were sandwiched between jerks or had a really close neighbor; but it's the only opener I'll take as Zulu. Zulu is amazing with honor. But Tradition is the best overall. Huge city plus faith purchasing great engineers is hard to beat.
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Jul 25, 2013 15:01
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I play standard maps, usually Immortal difficulty, and I tend to prefer Liberty. I think it helps get my empire up and running faster than Tradition, though it does limit my options in the mid-game more than Tradition would. (In my most recent game I rush-built the NC on turn 88 using the GE from the Liberty finisher and had four cities. By turn 100 I had 6 cities and was starting to bump into my neighbors.) Honor still seems weak and every time I try to start Piety I end up throwing the game away, so I'm not persuaded they're viable. But Liberty still seems so.
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Jul 25, 2013 15:11
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I play emperor/marathon on huge maps and like liberty, if only because the early Great Engineer lets me snag wonders I wouldn't be able to grab otherwise. I've been playing a long-running coastal empire game with England and liberty + exploration together give each new city +4 hammers right at the start, which really helps get things rolling. It's still possible to go somewhat wide and maintain a science lead, you just have to prioritize science buildings ASAP in every city and choose good locations for each city.
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Jul 25, 2013 15:16
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How many workers do people usually build? Is it a certain number per population / number of cities?
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Jul 25, 2013 16:02
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Poland is so good. Those social policies help you adapt on the fly to any empire deficiency. Getting Terra Cotta army and Foreign Legion means staying ahead of anyone militarily while building culture and science buildings. So good.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:02
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How're ya'll fitting religion into your games? I pretty much only play on Emperor, and if my random leader doesn't have a faith based unique ability/building, or I don't luck into having a faith generating natural wonder nearby, I'll generally just ignore religion all together as I have so many other things to focus on getting up and running in the early game. I've yet to go Piety in Brave New World, which kind of bums me out because there's some new stuff in there, but it just doesn't seem to hold a candle to the tried and true tradition and liberty starts. Who has the time to build shrines and temples when you're struggling to get land settled and libraries built and trade routes up and wonders essential to your victory condition completed and poo poo?
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Jul 25, 2013 16:08
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Some of the reformation beliefs in Piety are so strong that you may want to reconsider. The AI is programmed to often go Piety first, before Liberty or Tradition, and religion is always first-come, first-serve, so if you still want to go Tradition, you might want to consider not going full Tradition until later in the game.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:10
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DEO3 posted:How're ya'll fitting religion into your games? I think on Emperor you need an edge to be competitive with religion -- either a convenient natural wonder, a great Desert Folklore start and a faith shrine, or something similar. Trying to do it with just faith and temples won't work because some of the AI civs will outpace you with their bonuses/Piety. Shoshone could probably engineer an ok religion start with enough shrines. You can sortof bootstrap your way into religion by building Hagia Sophia / Burobudur but it's not always viable. Hieronymous Alloy fucked around with this message at 16:13 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 16:11
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:I think on Emperor you need an edge to be competitive with religion -- either a convenient natural wonder, a great Desert Folklore start and a faith shrine, or something similar. Trying to do it with just faith and temples won't work because some of the AI civs will outpace you with their bonuses/Piety. Shoshone could probably engineer an ok religion start with enough shrines. You can sortof bootstrap your way into religion by building Hagia Sophia / Burobudur but it's not always viable. I've found that simply going Pottery first, and then immediately starting to build shrine in your capital after the research finishes is enough to get you your own religion even on emperor. Of course getting a religion goody hut makes that even easier.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:22
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Rabhadh posted:Whats everyone's opinion of settling cities on top of resources? Anything that produces extra hammers or food though, don't do it. Wheat, horses, silver, etc.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:27
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Zilkin posted:I've found that simply going Pottery first, and then immediately starting to build shrine in your capital after the research finishes is enough to get you your own religion even on emperor. Of course getting a religion goody hut makes that even easier. Do you actually get any worthwhile beliefs though? Getting "a religion" is one thing, but there's a big difference between Tithe and, say, Peace Loving.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:34
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Bubbacub posted:How many workers do people usually build? Is it a certain number per population / number of cities? I usually handle it on a project basis, with a minimum of one worker per city. But basically I'll estimate out how many worker turns, say, a road will require 20 worker turns. If I think that's not fast enough I'll build another worker to speed up the project. I personally don't worry too much about having 'too many workers', since spreading farms over everything is a pretty labor-intensive process and the sooner it gets done the better off you are. If you get to the point where workers really don't have anything to do you can always disband a couple to save on cost. Tao Jones posted:Honor still seems weak and every time I try to start Piety I end up throwing the game away, so I'm not persuaded they're viable. But Liberty still seems so. But, that said, if you're inheriting a religion and not founding it, I'd probably say meh to Piety. But if you're inheriting a religion you're probably not going to do too much with Faith that game, anyway.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:36
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Decided to play a game as the Dutch. Did a Large Terra map to change things up. It placed me in an area next to a river with plains and hills and horses and cattle with 3 different luxuries within easy border expansion all around plus a second river only two tiles away. With a stable my horse hexes are giving me 4 hammers and I making so much drat food because of farms on both sides of two rivers is just ridiculous. Not a god drat Marsh in sight though.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:38
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I had a game with Brazil that had a good religion start (emperor difficulty), one of those faith adding natural wonders spawned pretty close, so I settled my second city right next to it. Most of the piety tree is pretty meh, but the reformation picks are pretty awesome. I managed to snag Pagodas/Mosques and then got the reformation pick that adds tourism for every religious building. It was pretty boss, I had a hefty bit of tourism up and running by the Renaissance, which just kept snowballing, and by the time I could build airports/hotels, I didn't really need them thanks to the Brazil tourism goodness/religion picks. I'd still call it very situational, but if you can get a good faith lead and guarantee one of the good reformation picks, I'd give them a try. I keep meaning to give Byzantium a try with a piety start, just to see how many religion synergies I can stack in one game. Anyone else tried this out and care to comment?
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Jul 25, 2013 16:44
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Thing is, going wide, Liberty doesn't really have all that much to recommend it. An extra hammer per city isn't much, one happiness per city is okay until you realise your size 30 Tradition mega-capital is giving you 15 free happiness. I also find Liberty lands me with money problems a lot more often since small cities are less profitable to link up with roads and garrisons cost you upkeep. Is the real strength of Liberty just the early land grab? 'Cause I find myself usually far more limited in my expansion by happiness and available space than by the mere hammer cost of settlers.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:44
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The early worker is the thing that draws me to liberty again and again, along with a predictable great engi for nabbing petra. My normal play is scout -> liberty opener -> monument -> granary and it's about when the granary starts getting built that the free worker pops out, hopefully nabbing a culture ruin to speed up the process. After that it's archers and DOWing the nearest AI to grab their wonders/lands. Tradition is a very strong policy but I've just gotten used to using liberty.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:50
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Gort posted:Thing is, going wide, Liberty doesn't really have all that much to recommend it. An extra hammer per city isn't much, one happiness per city is okay until you realise your size 30 Tradition mega-capital is giving you 15 free happiness. I also find Liberty lands me with money problems a lot more often since small cities are less profitable to link up with roads and garrisons cost you upkeep. The early Great Person can also be extremely useful, as it gives you a much bigger chance at wonders like Chichen Itza, or allows you to get Petra in an otherwise-poo poo city you managed to settle in the perfect location, etc. Getting that guaranteed, essentially-free wonder is a huge boon, and I would prefer that to a technically mathematically superior benefit from Tradition.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:52
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Also decided to play a little bit of Babylon to see how they are. I got two great scientist thanks to writing and their bonuses before we even made it out of the B.C. era's. Having +16 science around the capital helps pump out tons of research.
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Jul 25, 2013 16:56
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Muscle Tracer posted:The early Great Person can also be extremely useful, as it gives you a much bigger chance at wonders like Chichen Itza Is Chichen Itza considered a really good wonder? I can't think of the last time I've bothered to build it unless I rolled Darius as my random leader or something - should I be feeling stupid now?
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Jul 25, 2013 17:05
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Do you actually get any worthwhile beliefs though? Getting "a religion" is one thing, but there's a big difference between Tithe and, say, Peace Loving. The AI still picks monumentally dumb pantheon and religion beliefs.
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Jul 25, 2013 17:08
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natetimm posted:The AI still picks monumentally dumb pantheon and religion beliefs. I smirk whenever I see someone grab Goddess of Protection. Then I realize it's my neighbor who I meant to invade early game, and I have to bring way more units than I planned on to actually take one of his cities - especially if he has a Composite Bowman garrisoned. This typically ends up derailing my war plans 
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Jul 25, 2013 17:09
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  I think Doge is suicidal.
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Jul 25, 2013 17:11
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Speedball posted:Some of the reformation beliefs in Piety are so strong that you may want to reconsider. The AI is programmed to often go Piety first, before Liberty or Tradition, and religion is always first-come, first-serve, so if you still want to go Tradition, you might want to consider not going full Tradition until later in the game. I feel like this actually weakens Piety, as guaranteeing an early religion would be a much better sell if half the civs on the map didn't also go for it, and with their innate social policy headstart they'll probably get there before you. The Celts' ability seems a lot less special in this regard now too.
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Jul 25, 2013 17:11
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DEO3 posted:Is Chichen Itza considered a really good wonder? I can't think of the last time I've bothered to build it unless I rolled Darius as my random leader or something - should I be feeling stupid now? A Golden Age increases production and culture by 25% and increases gold tile benefits by +1, which is a pretty decent increase. The Chichen Itza depends largely on how you're able to manage happiness. It's much better if you're playing tall than wide.
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Jul 25, 2013 17:11
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natetimm posted:The AI still picks monumentally dumb pantheon and religion beliefs. Most of the time, yeah, but every so often that RNG just fucks you.
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Jul 25, 2013 17:15
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For some reason my laptop likes to overheat and shut off randomly during my multiplayer game. Right as I dropped the AI took over and decided Goddess of Protection was a good pantheon. Did I mention I'm right in the middle of the loving Jungle?!
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Jul 25, 2013 17:43
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Most of the time, yeah, but every so often that RNG just fucks you. Every time I try to goof off and try to be Theodora with 3 faith buildings and the tourism reformation, I always get Selassie and Boudicca on the map grabbing all those buildings before I can. And Shaka as my neighbor and a capital with no hammers. I swear the game is biased to screw Byzantium over at all points.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:04
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Kaal posted:A Golden Age increases production and culture by 25% and increases gold tile benefits by +1, which is a pretty decent increase. The Chichen Itza depends largely on how you're able to manage happiness. It's much better if you're playing tall than wide. If I ever have happiness to spare I usually just sell it off instead to buy.. well, whatever. I guess that's why I've never really cared about golden ages - am I playing the game wrong?
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Jul 25, 2013 18:16
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Is iron not important anymore? Because I frequently can't find any, whereas with vanilla it was rare to not have some. Also is there an easy way to spread a religion? Can I automated my missionaries or something?
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Jul 25, 2013 18:16
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Seems like the spawn rate of iron went wayyyy down in BNW. Probably because it now shows up with bronze working so you have a bit longer to plan on acquiring it if you need it. Allying city-states seems to be the best way to get lots of strategic resources anymore.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:18
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DEO3 posted:Is Chichen Itza considered a really good wonder? I can't think of the last time I've bothered to build it unless I rolled Darius as my random leader or something - should I be feeling stupid now? It's definitely dependent on getting golden ages, which I definitely tend to play around. If I'm not rolling on a 45+ turn golden age in the Modern era, I feel bad about myself.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:20
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Speedball posted:Some of the reformation beliefs in Piety are so strong that you may want to reconsider. The AI is programmed to often go Piety first, before Liberty or Tradition, and religion is always first-come, first-serve, so if you still want to go Tradition, you might want to consider not going full Tradition until later in the game. The finisher in tradition is awesome, never avoid going full tradition if you're putting stuff in there. On my immortal game I just finished up I went full tradition and was second to get a reformation belief. Hieronymous Alloy posted:I play emperor/marathon on huge maps and like liberty, if only because the early Great Engineer lets me snag wonders I wouldn't be able to grab otherwise. I've been playing a long-running coastal empire game with England and liberty + exploration together give each new city +4 hammers right at the start, which really helps get things rolling. It's still possible to go somewhat wide and maintain a science lead, you just have to prioritize science buildings ASAP in every city and choose good locations for each city. I view the great person policy to be pretty bad. It's a few hundred hammers for you. Ideally with tradition you'd have a big enough capital to hard build the same wonder if it's important. Gort posted:Thing is, going wide, Liberty doesn't really have all that much to recommend it. An extra hammer per city isn't much, one happiness per city is okay until you realise your size 30 Tradition mega-capital is giving you 15 free happiness. I also find Liberty lands me with money problems a lot more often since small cities are less profitable to link up with roads and garrisons cost you upkeep. The extra hammer per city and 5% building building (heh) is the best policy out of liberty. The problem with liberty is that generally speaking going wide with tradition is better than going wide with liberty (but slower) if you can manage your happiness. I just finished up a standard continents immortal game as france. Won a culture victory on turn 334 or something (game crashed when I hit replay) without ever having been to war and built 4 cities the whole game. I started on my own island that was not connected by shallow waters (polynesia found me eventually). I started next to salt and wheat so after moving my settler a turn I jumped out the gates pretty quick and was able to grab stonehenge to get a religion and eventually get the tourism reformation belief. I thought things were going to go downhill when nobody else picked freedom but I was already crushing the tourism game so it didn't particularly matter. Managed to set up some hotels and then research/scientist/oxford myself to internet and airports with a great engineered CN tower that boosted my tourism from 100 to 600 over the course of 10 - 20 turns or something.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:20
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So trying out Brazil I lost my attempt to net a culture victory to the Roman warmachine, and I've got a few questions before I try again: How do I best take advantage of Tradition? I normally use Liberty, should I just stick with it even for this type of victory? I'm mostly lost in the earlygame, I'm never sure when to take time to build settlers, build buildings, or build units for defense. How the heck to theming bonuses work? The pop-out says "collect different eras and civs and put them together" and I do that and get nothing for it. Is there a "Best" Ideology for Tourism/culture wins? They all seem to have tools for it. Picking Freedom made for a sweet story though where in an act of desperation the peaceful nation of Brazil drafted a volunteer army to hold the line against the massive Autocratic Roman invasion. It even spawned Leonidas as a great general. 
Geight fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 18:26
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Geight posted:How the heck to theming bonuses work? The pop-out says "collect different eras and civs and put them together" and I do that and get nothing for it. Maybe you're mixing artifacts and great works? I had two great works and some ancient era beads or something in one of the 3-slot wonders and it took me the longest time to figure out why I wasn't getting the bonus despite seemingly meeting the requirements. Turns out that was it.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:30
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Hulk Krogan posted:Maybe you're mixing artifacts and great works? I had two great works and some ancient era beads or something in one of the 3-slot wonders and it took me the longest time to figure out why I wasn't getting the bonus despite seemingly meeting the requirements. Turns out that was it. I was making that mistake for one of the buildings but I couldn't get any theming bonuses with my two-slot writing building, either. Geight fucked around with this message at 18:40 on Jul 25, 2013 |
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Jul 25, 2013 18:38
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Geight posted:Is there a "Best" Ideology for Tourism/culture wins? They all seem to have tools for it. Picking Freedom made for a sweet story though where in an act of desperation the peaceful nation of Brazil drafted a volunteer army to hold the line against the massive Roman invasion. It even spawned Leonidas as a great general. Freedom gives you flat out tourism bonuses in every city that has a broadcast tower. Order requires you to have higher happiness, which can be very difficult. I forget what Autocracy has, but Freedom is pretty much hands down best imo, if tourism is your only concern. The others might be a better choice depending on how your empire is set up, though, because of other tenets.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:39
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I love freedom just for the -50% specialist unhappy and -50% specialist food. Combine that with the statue of liberty for +1 hammer per specialist and the rationalism unlock for +2 science per specialist, and your specialists become monsters. It doesn't help that the computer seems to go order 80% of the time though, always putting unhappy pressure on me.
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Jul 25, 2013 18:41
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