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JerikTelorian posted:Gotcha, thanks. She is exotic to me, so that's probably it. Yes, I think pressure from a civ with the same ideology will counteract pressure from differing ideologies. So if you're Freedom and both an Order civ and a Freedom civ are Exotic to you while you're Unknown to them, you should not be incurring any unhappiness penalties. I think. I can't recall ever paying attention to that (I tend to play Culture games where I'm one of the biggest Tourism powerhouses, so dissidents are seldomly an issue for me). So no trade routes and no open borders to civs of a different ideology with a better overall Tourism score than you, and you should be fine.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:28
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 Thalassicus (CivUP / GEM modder) is working on a new map script for the third version of his mod. Looking good so far.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:30
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Beamed posted:Maybe something like the Ivy League, to indicate such an intricate level of universities that it's tiered? This wouldn't make much sense either as Ivy League is an US thing only. They should just call it X university where X is the city it's built in.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:33
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Brannock posted:
I really want to play with CivUP again but man, he really needs to work on its bugs. It's crashy, there's buggy description and interface text at places, and so on.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:40
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Brannock posted:
Holy poo poo lake systems  I think the stock map generator actually handles river geography really well a lot of the time, but actual lakes like in that picture seems awesome. Now if only it was usable in multiplayer...
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Jul 29, 2013 18:41
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Haha so some more googling found the cause of my crash, and its really weirdly specific: Completing an archeological dig outside of your controlled territory while playing as Washington is apparently a known bug. Guess what exact circumstances my two crashing games both had when I hit the early 1700s? Although in the first one I could swear I was inside my borders, I'll have to check when I get home. Now I have to decide whether I want to finish those games knowing I can't safely dig...that's a hell of a culture setback.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:41
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I've seen a few posts where people are unsure about warmonger penalties, or are referencing the G&K warmonger penalties which are different from BNW's. Quoting Putmalk:quote:
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Jul 29, 2013 18:42
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Inspector_71 posted:Holy poo poo lake systems If we get navigable rivers at some point, even in modform, I will squeal like a 14 year old girl.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:43
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Inspector_71 posted:Holy poo poo lake systems Right now, lakes are a pretty big problem because of Great Admiral spawns. I'd prefer a map without them until that's fixed (which I doubt it ever will be).
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Jul 29, 2013 18:45
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I really want to play with CivUP again but man, he really needs to work on its bugs. It's crashy, there's buggy description and interface text at places, and so on. He is, as far as I can tell. It's a long process. SlightlyMadman posted:Right now, lakes are a pretty big problem because of Great Admiral spawns. I'd prefer a map without them until that's fixed (which I doubt it ever will be). Ooh, that would be an issue. I'll ask him and see if it's something that can be fixed. Brannock fucked around with this message at 18:50 on Jul 29, 2013 |
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Jul 29, 2013 18:45
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Brannock posted:He is, as far as I can tell. It's a long process. His problem Back When was apparently that he would just ignore bugs and continue adding features, before stopping all development altogether when BNW was announced, instead of at least fixing bugs in the meantime. So maybe he's fixing it now, but it was a longstanding concern.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:50
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Beamed posted:If we get navigable rivers at some point, even in modform, I will squeal like a 14 year old girl. I still really want buildable canals. Now that you mention it though, I'm surprised that traveling along a river doesn't impart some kind of movement bonus, especially for civs who are famous for canoeing and whatnot.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:51
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Inspector_71 posted:I still really want buildable canals. The Songhai get their River Warlord bonus, but yeah, I'd legitimately love if rivers mattered as much as they did realistically.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:51
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Beamed posted:His problem Back When was apparently that he would just ignore bugs and continue adding features, before stopping all development altogether when BNW was announced, instead of at least fixing bugs in the meantime. So maybe he's fixing it now, but it was a longstanding concern. I've been reading the forum for his mod on and off for a week or so now, and as far as I can tell the main goal right now is to set up a bunch of framework for the upcoming CEP mod, with him working on fixing CivUP bugs on the side. iirc his goal was to have three versions: CivUP, "raw" CEP (just AI changes and stuff like that? fuzzy on this), and "full" CEP (balance changes, leader changes, new units and techs). It'll probably take a while to get to a playable state, though. I'm not too concerned about it, I'm really enjoying vanilla BNW for now and don't see myself modding BNW for at least another few months. That should be enough time for him to get his poo poo in order. I'd love to play on that new map script though, once he's ironed out the bugs with it.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:52
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Ships up to Frigates at least should be able to go up river and cities on rivers should be able to be seaports (London, Philadelphia.) But that would mean rivers would have to be tiles I guess.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:53
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Inspector_71 posted:I still really want buildable canals. In Civ 1 or 2 you had a movement bonus along rivers, similar to roads. It was a neat mechanic and I miss it, but it made sense to take out when they changed them from being an actual tile type to a between tile feature. Navigable rivers would have to be a Civ 6 feature, since they're not really compatible with the current tile system. The way I'd do it would be to have all water units exist on the vertices between tiles, instead of on tiles themselves. This means water units could live on coasts as well as travel up rivers.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:55
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euphronius posted:Ships up to Frigates at least should be able to go up river and cities on rivers should be able to be seaports (London, Philadelphia.) But that would mean rivers would have to be tiles I guess. There's a debate going on in the Civ 5  , and one of the ideas I floated around was that oceangoing vessels can't use rivers, but otherwise rivers are functionally identical to Coasts, except land units treat them as they do now. Maybe Navigable rivers also can't have bridges across them?
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Jul 29, 2013 18:56
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Corvinus posted:
What I’m getting from this is that I should nuke cities to the ground to avoid the penalty for capturing them.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:57
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about warmonger penalties
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Platystemon posted:What I’m getting from this is that I should nuke cities to the ground to avoid the penalty for capturing them. You're not doing that already just to avoid the happiness hit? Unless I'm getting Uranium out of the deal, I take no prisoners (cities) once I have nuclear missiles.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:58
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If you can keep 6 or so allied city states, that cushions the blow of the entire world hating you.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:58
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Nukes have one of the worst penalties so not so much.
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Jul 29, 2013 18:58
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RagnarokAngel posted:Nukes have one of the worst penalties so not so much. Yeah but who cares, anybody who badmouths you can just eat a missile or five. I tend to play really peacefully until the Atomic Age, at which point I am Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin and George Bush combined.
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Jul 29, 2013 19:00
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Inspector_71 posted:I tend to play really peacefully until the Atomic Age, at which point I am Napoleon, Hitler, Stalin and George Bush combined. Oh hey Edna. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLqW7G8797U&t=80s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dk9z3ECEbso
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Jul 29, 2013 19:07
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Regarding the passivity of the AI, this thread http://tinyurl.com/mjctfsb at civfanatics explains that it is indeed trade routes that curtail (early) AI aggression. Unrelated, finished my first BNW game: Brazil, Prince, Large/Marathon small continents. I had a marvelous start (production and jungles and even a great Petra city.) Won a cultural victory before any other Civ had declared an ideology. I was two techs into Modern, closest rival had just reached Industrial. In fact I didn't even get to my unique unit. Tourism during golden ages is the bomb. Blackluck fucked around with this message at 19:20 on Jul 29, 2013 |
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Jul 29, 2013 19:13
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Corvinus posted:I've seen a few posts where people are unsure about warmonger penalties, or are referencing the G&K warmonger penalties which are different from BNW's. Quoting Putmalk: This is really informative, thanks for this. So the conquest penalty he speaks of is the "genocide" penalty we refer to? If that's completely out of the game now, then great, you should try to eliminate civs completely when feasible so they aren't screwing you over in the world congress. Some observations: Early wars get progressively more diplomatically costly the bigger the map type you play on. Also early wars are more costly in general. If you like to put in more players on larger map types to fill in the empty space rather than let everyone get huge empires, wars are also more diplomatically costly. On a Large map type and in the early game when everyone only has about 4 cities each, taking two incurs an 8 point penalty, seemingly more than the one you got in G&K. So in most instances the penalties are lesser but in some it's higher, and should be something you should be careful about. You may want to wait until city spam has begun in full before taking someone else's territory. edit: On the other hand, it now occurs to me that finishing off an opponent is still very costly, especially in the early game. Even in the mid or late game, if there are exactly as many cities or fewer than the estimated map size number, which is likely, then finishing off a last city will incur 10 or more warmonger points, which is exactly the amount you got when finishing off a civ before. In the early game, When the map is filled up to half capacity, that's a 20 point penalty, which is massive. So yeah, no specific penalty for killing off civs for good, but the scaling per-city penalty can be and often will be just as or more huge. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 20:45 on Jul 29, 2013 |
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Jul 29, 2013 19:52
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Inspector_71 posted:Yeah but who cares, anybody who badmouths you can just eat a missile or five. The game needs a new dialog option once you have nuked a city to the ashes: "I believe <City> would disagree."
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Jul 29, 2013 19:54
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MANIFEST DESTINY posted:Haha so some more googling found the cause of my crash, and its really weirdly specific: Well, someone else will dig them up right? Let them do the legwork then go in with the guns  That is a hilarious bug though. What possible quirk in the code could lead to that. America doesn't even have a UA related to it. vvv Good spot, that's probably it. Microplastics fucked around with this message at 20:14 on Jul 29, 2013 |
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Jul 29, 2013 20:12
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KKKlean Energy posted:Well, someone else will dig them up right? Let them do the legwork then go in with the guns It might be related to the Raiders of the Lost Ark achievement—Have your American Archaeologist extract an Artifact from Egypt with a German Archaeologist within 2 tiles.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:13
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KKKlean Energy posted:Well, someone else will dig them up right? Let them do the legwork then go in with the guns They do have an achievement, though, the one that's an elaborate Raiders of the Lost Ark reference. It would be funny if that was what was causing the bug!
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Jul 29, 2013 20:14
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Platystemon posted:It might be related to the Raiders of the Lost Ark achievement—Have your American Archaeologist extract an Artifact from Egypt with a German Archaeologist within 2 tiles. This achievement is bugged, too. I managed to get it without any German Archaeologist anywhere near me while digging in Egypt. I'm not complaining because otherwise it would have been really impossible to get that last condition...
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Jul 29, 2013 20:15
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MANIFEST DESTINY posted:Ugh for the second game in a row, something is causing the game to lock up when I hit the next turn button in the middle of the 1700s. In both instances it happens just as I take the upper hand in a big war, I feel like the computer is flipping the board in a rage or something. In all seriousness though, its hugely frustrating to spend that much time on a game and then have it be unrecoverable, is there any way to find out what is tripping it up? I go back to an older autosave but as soon as I get to the same point in the game, even if I do things differently, it freezes again, so I'm assuming its hitting some trigger like a wonder that someone built or something. As much fun as the game is, I really don't want to start another round if its going to just die on me at the good part again, this has only happened in the two Emperor games I've tried. This exact issue just killed a Venice game I was crushing on turn 301 and happened to the previous game as well (Shoshone turn 383). Game just hard locks when I click next turn. Really knocks the wind out of my sails after such careful buildup  Both games were Standard/Continents/King I see the post about Washington/Archaeology, could it happen even if Washington is an AI? I know he was in my Shoshone game it's possible I hadn't met him in my Venice map.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:18
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Android Blues posted:They do have an achievement, though, the one that's an elaborate Raiders of the Lost Ark reference. It would be funny if that was what was causing the bug! Should've turned it into a cultural site instead of opening the chest!
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Jul 29, 2013 20:20
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Man, to get the Radio Free Europe achievement I'm going to need to go Freedom and conquer the hell out of an enemy. Possibly with Foreign Legions and Arsenal of Democracy.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:22
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It’s kind of odd that you can’t trade great works for gold or resources. I presume it’s because the AI couldn’t trade intelligently. If your guilds can’t give you enough great works, you have to take them by the sword.  Surely poorer nations would be willing to sell their cultural heritage for the right price. 
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Jul 29, 2013 20:38
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More odd that you can't use spies to steal great works! I'd have it be a risky business, like pulling off a coup; screw up and your spy dies.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:39
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Scorps posted:This exact issue just killed a Venice game I was crushing on turn 301 and happened to the previous game as well (Shoshone turn 383). Game just hard locks when I click next turn. Really knocks the wind out of my sails after such careful buildup No idea, but this is where I found it which vaguely seems to suggest that they know about the bug and should be working to fix it: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=500750 Given the turn number, I wouldn't be surprised if yours is also a similar archeology bug. Tonight when I can try again I'm going to go to an earlier autosave and try just digging what is in my own territory, we'll see how it goes. Either way, we can now end the debate: Washington is handicapped! (Real talk though I think he's pretty good otherwise, I've been leveraging those Minutemen in rough terrain and +1 sight pretty drat hard).
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Jul 29, 2013 20:40
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The Autocracy Ideology should definitely have a Raiders of the Lost Ark Tenent.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:40
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I used to laugh at Washington, right until the game when I was assaulted by a horde of minutemen walking through the dense jungle and mountains to my south like it was nothing.
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Jul 29, 2013 20:42
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I would not like to see Minutemen with Kilimanjaro promotions.  God help you if they upgrade to Mechanized Infantry. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 20:55 on Jul 29, 2013 |
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Jul 29, 2013 20:47
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I have a question regarding the earlier AI jerk point calculations: what's the current rules for how your actions affect unmet civilizations? I think previously, warmongering done early on before contacting civs on another continent would still be known, so they'd immediately hate you upon meeting them. In my current game though, I wiped out two civs on my home continent (good to hear I didn't get a genocide penalty though), and while the other remaining civ of course hates me, I just met a new civ on another continent and he's totally neutral. Does that mean we can do what we want in our home continent and then just reform our ways when everyone hits optics?
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Jul 29, 2013 20:49
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