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A running theory is that because at the end of the game Jack receives a US Army costume that John cannot use (at least not outside of Undead Nightmare), Jack may go on to fight in the Army. Which means that in a sense, he becomes essentially a killer working for the government, probably the last thing John would have wanted for his son.
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Aug 8, 2013 18:31
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raditts posted:I don't know why we should assume that Jack becomes an outlaw. Ross was a scumbag and the only thing that made him any different from an outlaw was that he had a badge and the law to help him carry out his murders, and got awarded and praised for it. That son of a bitch deserved every bullet he got, and I don't think giving them to him makes you a bad guy, that's just how you roll in the wicky wicky wild wild west. Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Aug 8, 2013 |
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Aug 8, 2013 18:37
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Accordion Man posted:He did kill a retired government official and he'd be suspect Number 1 what with him asking Ross' brother and wife where he was right before he was found shot dead in a river. Ross was a killer hiding behind a badge that deserved what came to him but Jack still had to sacrifice the life that John wanted for him in order to do it. Well you fix that problem by killing Ross's entire family obviously
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Aug 8, 2013 18:50
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Accordion Man posted:He did kill a retired government official and he'd be suspect Number 1 what with him asking Ross' brother and wife where he was right before he was found shot dead in a river. Ross was a killer hiding behind a badge that deserved what came to him but Jack still had to sacrifice the life that John wanted for him in order to do it. Nobody really knew who he was though, except Ross before he died of course. I can't remember if it's in one of the newspaper articles or just in some passing conversation you hear, but IIRC the common belief after you kill him is that he was just killed by a bandit that randomly came across him.
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Aug 8, 2013 18:59
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raditts posted:Nobody really knew who he was though, except Ross before he died of course. I can't remember if it's in one of the newspaper articles or just in some passing conversation you hear, but IIRC the common belief after you kill him is that he was just killed by a bandit that randomly came across him. Don't you kill him in Mexico anyway? It's not like the new Mexican government is going to give a poo poo that some gringo federale was gunned down by a bandit while out hunting, and it's not like the US can go after Jack for a crime committed on foreign soil.
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Aug 8, 2013 19:13
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Alfred P. Pseudonym posted:What would yall say is the quickest way to make lots of money in this game? I want to buy the explosive rifle but that thing is pretty pricey. Hunting beavers and buffalo? There's always the bird challenge glitch where you keep intentionally losing and wagering again, then finally winning, killing the gambler, and looting him for all the money that you lost.
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Aug 8, 2013 19:14
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Dinosaurs! posted:There's always the bird challenge glitch where you keep intentionally losing and wagering again, then finally winning, killing the gambler, and looting him for all the money that you lost. Where's the profit though?
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Aug 8, 2013 19:15
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5er posted:Where's the profit though? If you lose the challenge there's an option to double down and put more of your money into the pot. When you finally win, you get all your lost money back plus a little profit from the bet. The glitch is that the gambler is carrying all the money you initially lost, so you kill and loot him for an insane profit.
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Aug 8, 2013 19:33
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Bit the bird guy seemed so nice 
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Aug 8, 2013 19:49
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Dinosaurs! posted:If you lose the challenge there's an option to double down and put more of your money into the pot. When you finally win, you get all your lost money back plus a little profit from the bet. The glitch is that the gambler is carrying all the money you initially lost, so you kill and loot him for an insane profit. I see, nice. Personally I made my fastest money earliest in the game by heading into the Rio Del Lobos valley with as much ammo as possible and shooting wolves, quickskinning them with the horse parking glitch I described earlier. The bird glitch might be faster but I never tire of shooting wolves in the face.
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Aug 8, 2013 19:52
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Capn Beeb posted:Bit the bird guy seemed so nice If you put on your bandana no one will ever know. 
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Aug 8, 2013 19:53
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Capn Beeb posted:Bit the bird guy seemed so nice You're going to shoot him in the back and you know it. He's packed to the gills with cash - more money than man at this point! 5er posted:I see, nice. Personally I made my fastest money earliest in the game by heading into the Rio Del Lobos valley with as much ammo as possible and shooting wolves, quickskinning them with the horse parking glitch I described earlier. The bird glitch might be faster but I never tire of shooting wolves in the face. Yeah it isn't as fun as hunting, but Alfred. P Pseudonym asked for the quickest way to make a lot of money and I can't think of anything else that can double your wallet in just a few minutes (once you've come across the guy at least). Peas and Rice posted:If you put on your bandana no one will ever know. I was going to make a joke about "being a man" about it but I think I did exactly this when I played the game.
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Aug 8, 2013 20:00
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raditts posted:That son of a bitch deserved every bullet he got, and I don't think giving them to him makes you a bad guy, that's just how you roll in the wicky wicky wild wild west. It does if you hogtie and fire bottle his wife inside their house first. Not that I would know anything about that....
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Aug 8, 2013 20:05
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zoomdog posted:It does if you hogtie and fire bottle his wife inside their house first. Not that I would know anything about that.... To me the lesson of the story is this...in trying to get rid of all the outlaws by killing one of the last ones in their eyes, the government only created a new one. Violence only creates more violence. So yeah...the family had to go.
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Aug 8, 2013 20:27
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zoomdog posted:It does if you hogtie and fire bottle his wife inside their house first. Not that I would know anything about that.... No no, you hogtie her, take her to Mexico with you so she can watch you gun down her husband from the back of your horse, then after the credits you put one in her head and let her float down river with him. 
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Aug 8, 2013 20:32
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Fuzz posted:No no, you hogtie her, take her to Mexico with you so she can watch you gun down her husband from the back of your horse, then after the credits you put one in her head and let her float down river with him. Wow, amazing.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:07
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Fuzz posted:No no, you hogtie her, take her to Mexico with you so she can watch you gun down her husband from the back of your horse, then after the credits you put one in her head and let her float down river with him. I was always fond of cutting throats for my driftwood.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:12
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Fuzz posted:No no, you hogtie her, take her to Mexico with you so she can watch you gun down her husband from the back of your horse, then after the credits you put one in her head and let her float down river with him. I could never bring myself to kill anyone besides Ross. Ross' wife didn't do anything and likely knows absolutely nothing about his work; but if Ross' brother wants to come after me for an attempt at revenge, let him. He'll get the same chance Jack did.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:16
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raditts posted:I don't know why we should assume that Jack becomes an outlaw. Ross was a scumbag and the only thing that made him any different from an outlaw was that he had a badge and the law to help him carry out his murders, and got awarded and praised for it. That son of a bitch deserved every bullet he got, and I don't think giving them to him makes you a bad guy, that's just how you roll in the wicky wicky wild wild west. The thing is though, that in killing Ross, Jack has become an outlaw. Jack killed a man (and in the case of many people in his thread, a man's entire family) in cold blood, and one way or another, Jack has rejected the better life that his father wanted for him, and embraced the same wild west that his father died trying to escape from.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:23
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I sure hope one of the controlled protagonists of GTA5 has lineage we can trace back to Jack Marsten. That'll really pique the discussion.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:33
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SlothfulCobra posted:The thing is though, that in killing Ross, Jack has become an outlaw. Jack killed a man (and in the case of many people in his thread, a man's entire family) in cold blood, and one way or another, Jack has rejected the better life that his father wanted for him, and embraced the same wild west that his father died trying to escape from. I don't think anyone knows who killed Ross. There are things in the game that hint at nobody having a clue. In a way, it is like the inverse of the "I Know You" quest.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:36
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blackguy32 posted:I don't think anyone knows who killed Ross. There are things in the game that hint at nobody having a clue. Even if that's the case, a precedent is set by which to interpret the remainder of Jack's life we don't have access to. A proficient killer that has had a taste of revenge. There can't be any kind of good future for him. That's the sentiment I pulled by the end of it all, whether or not he became wanted over Ross' demise.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:43
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5er posted:Even if that's the case, a precedent is set by which to interpret the remainder of Jack's life we don't have access to. A proficient killer that has had a taste of revenge. There can't be any kind of good future for him. That's the sentiment I pulled by the end of it all, whether or not he became wanted over Ross' demise. Even the gameplay backs this up. All you can do is wander around doing odd jobs and trying to alleviate boredom. John Marston had a goal, a purpose, but Jack Marston? All he has is revenge, and once that's done, he has nothing left. Just like you, the player.It's the first sandbox game that really did something with that emptiness most sandbox games give me when I realize I've done basically all of the content.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:57
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Fuzz posted:No no, you hogtie her, take her to Mexico with you so she can watch you gun down her husband from the back of your horse, then after the credits you put one in her head and let her float down river with him. God drat, man.
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Aug 8, 2013 21:58
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Crappy Jack posted:Even the gameplay backs this up. All you can do is wander around doing odd jobs and trying to alleviate boredom. John Marston had a goal, a purpose, but Jack Marston? All he has is revenge, and once that's done, he has nothing left. Just like you, the player.It's the first sandbox game that really did something with that emptiness most sandbox games give me when I realize I've done basically all of the content. What? There is nothing to imply that Jack Marston has nothing to live for anymore after his revenge. Just like there is nothing to imply that Jack Marston became an outlaw. You may have done nothing, but I took the time to explore a little bit and find areas that I never did before.
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Aug 8, 2013 22:12
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Hell, the game itself is prepared if you do quests as Jack instead of John. One multi-part quest is even better; if you start it as John, die and switch to Jack and go finish the quest as Jack, the quest-giver even comments that you look different or something even more appropriate, it's been a while. In my post-game though, John was a complete gentleman and never broke the law, whereas Jack became a completely savage outlaw. I felt that it was appropriate that way.
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Aug 8, 2013 22:17
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blackguy32 posted:What? There is nothing to imply that Jack Marston has nothing to live for anymore after his revenge. Just like there is nothing to imply that Jack Marston became an outlaw. You may have done nothing, but I took the time to explore a little bit and find areas that I never did before. I think that what he said works very well... the very lack of things to do once you run out of all story elements while you continue to persist in the open world is kind of its own allegory. It's even worse if you cleaned out all the faffing-about challenges prior to Jack taking over. Even if this wasn't intended by the developer, I like the notion that Crappy Jack got out of it.
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Aug 8, 2013 22:38
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SlothfulCobra posted:The thing is though, that in killing Ross, Jack has become an outlaw. Jack killed a man (and in the case of many people in his thread, a man's entire family) in cold blood, and one way or another, Jack has rejected the better life that his father wanted for him, and embraced the same wild west that his father died trying to escape from. Uh how did Jack kill them in cold blood? He killed Ross, you don't have to kill anyone else, because he murdered his father. He seemed very much motivated to revenge by anger rather than killing someone random without giving an emotional hoot. I mean, you can go all psycho and buck wild but it's not necessary at all.
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Aug 8, 2013 22:49
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That isn't killing in cold blood. Look at how pissed he gets at his slow-rear end horse. Jack is definitely not killing him in cold blood.
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Aug 8, 2013 22:56
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Alfred P. Pseudonym posted:What would yall say is the quickest way to make lots of money in this game? I want to buy the explosive rifle but that thing is pretty pricey. Hunting beavers and buffalo? And the legendary animals, if you haven't already. If you're wearing the expert hunter outfit (free DLC,) you can get often get duplicate teeth/hearts/skins/whatever from everything (grizzly parts are worth the most and they are damned plentiful) and make pretty good bank in a hurry. Also, do the treasure hunts and sell it all off after your honor hits 'peacemaker' (I think you get a 50% sell bonus for everything at that level and above.) Almost all animal parts are worth way more in Mexico, but the treasure prices are the same everywhere.
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Aug 8, 2013 23:35
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Is it possible to play the post game as John at all or are you locked into playing as Jack for the rest of the save file once you hit that point in the story?
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Aug 8, 2013 23:52
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Philip J Fry posted:If you're wearing the expert hunter outfit (free DLC,) ... That outfit has one of my favorite unlock requirements. Having to blow up a cougar with a stick of dynamite.
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Aug 8, 2013 23:54
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5er posted:That outfit has one of my favorite unlock requirements. Having to blow up a cougar with a stick of dynamite. Doing it with dead-eye and watching a stick of dynamite chase down a cougar like a sidewinder missile never gets old. GreatGreen posted:Is it possible to play the post game as John at all or are you locked into playing as Jack for the rest of the save file once you hit that point in the story? Nope. That's why it's best to create a separate save file right after MacDougal leaves Blackwater. Philip J Fry fucked around with this message at 00:01 on Aug 9, 2013 |
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Aug 8, 2013 23:58
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Philip J Fry posted:Doing it with dead-eye and watching a stick of dynamite chase down a cougar like a sidewinder missile never gets old. Gotcha. I was so pissed when I beat the game the first time and found out the hard way if for no other reason than Jack's player model being ugly as sin. Just wanted to make sure there wasn't anything I was missing.
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Aug 9, 2013 00:22
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Philip J Fry posted:Doing it with dead-eye and watching a stick of dynamite chase down a cougar like a sidewinder missile never gets old.  I had no loving idea you could dead-eye with dynamite. I snuck up on a cougar, it spotted me, and I shot it once in the haunch so as not to kill it. It ran away and I chased that fucker from the rails north of McFarlane ranch all the way down to Mescalero until the 8th stick of dynamite got him.
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Aug 9, 2013 00:44
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5er posted:I see, nice. Personally I made my fastest money earliest in the game by heading into the Rio Del Lobos valley with as much ammo as possible and shooting wolves, quickskinning them with the horse parking glitch I described earlier. The bird glitch might be faster but I never tire of shooting wolves in the face.
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Aug 9, 2013 00:54
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5er posted:
You've been missing out on one of the best glitches (features?) in the entire game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJ07v2sZQLE
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Aug 9, 2013 01:06
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falconry posted:You've been missing out on one of the best glitches (features?) in the entire game: Holy good god drat.
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Aug 9, 2013 01:39
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So if I accept a bounty and then do a mission instead, is the bounty lost forever?
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Aug 9, 2013 04:50
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Nah, it should come back up eventually. You may get some other bounties in the meantime. This doesn't rule out a weird glitch, right.
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Aug 9, 2013 04:56
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