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Gort posted:This is hardly an isolated event, though. I play plenty of MP and it's utterly trivial to chuck AIs at other humans to distract them. Either the AI says no, or asks for some amount that adds up to about two units worth. 4 GPT is nothing, particularly when he's giving up the advantages of declaring war at the start of his own turn and having his forces properly positioned for the attack. At least you can even "negotiate" with those AIs. If someone allies enough city states via quests and money, it's trivial to DoW someone else and break all their hard earned friendships and suddenly have swarms of units nipping away at their borders and eating their trade routes from weird angles. And you are locked into war with them. Minor nations will never be balanced for FFA MP, because they will always behave like pinatas to whoever exploits them.
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Sep 16, 2013 12:45
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KKKlean Energy posted:InfoAddict fixes most of this (except the bolded bit). It shouldn't have to be a mod though. There are some weird design decisions in this game. Well, strictly, speaking, I just remembered that DoFs will show up in the global politics tab, but even then it would be so much easier to have a visual representation to let you map the world's relationships. Also, those british guys are terrible at this game. Are there any good LPs out there? I'd be especially interested in MP LPs, particularly if all the players know one another and can predict one another's playstyles.
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Sep 16, 2013 13:09
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22 civ marathon games on Greatest Earth Map are the best way to play this game, and anyone who's never tried it is missing out. I've just hit the atomic era in my game that I've been playing for about 3 weeks now, for an hour or two a night. As Egypt, I've got the entire Mediterranean except for Spain, as well as the entire Sahara. I've just started up a massive world war against Brazil (all of South America) and Poland (massive empire spanning from France to Russia and everything between), but bribed The Shoshone (the largest empire in the game, with all of North America, Australia, South Africa, and Indonesia) into the war with me. It's basically a countdown until I win a diplomatic victory at this point, but it's been incredible to see the world start with 22 civs who have devoured each other (or been devoured by me) until there's only about 10 left, with only 4 major world powers. The big question now is how much of Poland I feel like adding to my empire before I finish the game. I have like 90 happiness, so I think the answer is "all of it."
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Sep 16, 2013 15:12
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SlightlyMadman posted:22 civ marathon games on Greatest Earth Map are the best way to play this game, and anyone who's never tried it is missing out. I've just hit the atomic era in my game that I've been playing for about 3 weeks now, for an hour or two a night. As Egypt, I've got the entire Mediterranean except for Spain, as well as the entire Sahara. I've just started up a massive world war against Brazil (all of South America) and Poland (massive empire spanning from France to Russia and everything between), but bribed The Shoshone (the largest empire in the game, with all of North America, Australia, South Africa, and Indonesia) into the war with me. It's basically a countdown until I win a diplomatic victory at this point, but it's been incredible to see the world start with 22 civs who have devoured each other (or been devoured by me) until there's only about 10 left, with only 4 major world powers. I'm looking for the Greatest Earth map but I can't seem to find it by that name. Yet (not) Another Earth Maps Pack popped up when I searched; is that the one you mean?
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Sep 16, 2013 15:26
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Prism posted:I'm looking for the Greatest Earth map but I can't seem to find it by that name. Yet (not) Another Earth Maps Pack popped up when I searched; is that the one you mean? You can download the map from CivFanatics, but YNAEMP is the easiest way to play the map. It has a mod included that will allow 22 civ games with random selection and different resource options, whereas the base map from CF has everything statically placed in a scenario. Look for djvandyke's map in YNAEMP.
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Sep 16, 2013 15:49
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SlightlyMadman posted:You can download the map from CivFanatics, but YNAEMP is the easiest way to play the map. It has a mod included that will allow 22 civ games with random selection and different resource options, whereas the base map from CF has everything statically placed in a scenario. Look for djvandyke's map in YNAEMP. Cool, I just wasn't sure if that was the right one. I need an epic game in my life. Thanks!
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Sep 16, 2013 16:18
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So I'm guessing no one knows anything about the upcoming patch? When it will hit, or details?
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Sep 16, 2013 16:34
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Prism posted:Cool, I just wasn't sure if that was the right one. I need an epic game in my life. Thanks! Yeah, just make sure you choose the right one, because any of the true scale large or huge earth maps have massive gameplay problems. Namely, that whoever starts in Russia or America can expand infinitely and become a crazy runaway. Greatest still has this to some extent, in that the large end-game empires will likely be whoever started in Russia or America, but it's not as game-breaking, especially with the BNM changes to make ICS empires produces less science.
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Sep 16, 2013 16:40
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Jastiger posted:So I'm guessing no one knows anything about the upcoming patch? When it will hit, or details? We know nothing other than America and Japan might have balance changes. That's all.
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Sep 16, 2013 17:48
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Are there any good mods for scenarios in the Steam workshop? I was looking at one based on the Three Kingdoms of China, but other then that are there any that are good?
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Sep 16, 2013 18:42
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Can I just say I enjoyed this excerpt from a recent log   (Beshbalik was his last city, just to give an idea of the state of affairs)
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Sep 16, 2013 21:08
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I don't think I will ever get a Domination victory in Civ5. It is just soooo tedious going to war. How do people usually do it? Is it at all possible to not start going to war until like SUPER late in the game when I have XCom troops and stuff that can just roll over people? I feel like to get a domination victory you really have to get started early, but I may be wrong on this.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:19
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cams posted:I don't think I will ever get a Domination victory in Civ5. It is just soooo tedious going to war. How do people usually do it? Is it at all possible to not start going to war until like SUPER late in the game when I have XCom troops and stuff that can just roll over people? I feel like to get a domination victory you really have to get started early, but I may be wrong on this. Depends on map size, really. I usually play on Large or Huge, so it's just not a real option since the change in BNW where you have to hold every single capital (instead of being the last to hold their own). Diplomacy and Culture victories are going to happen first 99% of the time.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:22
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To get a domination victory, you only need to occupy the starting capital of each civ, not conquer their entire empire. You can have a modern but not super late game force that can grab and occupy a capital, which is way easier and faster if their capital is near or on the coast. Carriers, bombers, and paratroopers do a great job of this. Dominating a civ suddenly turns into hitting one coastal city, raze it or occupy just long enough to use as an airbase to bomb their capital, take over the capital, leave a decent garrison force, and move on to the next empire. You can also then sue for peace and extract some GPT usually.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:28
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I'm thinking a strong tech lead plus XCOM squads plus air support tend to make the late-game domination victories a lot faster to get.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:32
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Rakthar posted:To get a domination victory, you only need to occupy the starting capital of each civ, not conquer their entire empire. It's still a huge pain in the rear end, just from the sheer amount of time it takes to shuffle all those units around. The worst is when you have to hunt down the original capital of a civ you don't even know because they were wiped off the map before you found their continent. If you play a lot, you should be able to recognize all the capitals by name, but I have no idea how somebody new to the game would even know which cities to take in that case.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:51
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cams posted:I don't think I will ever get a Domination victory in Civ5. It is just soooo tedious going to war. How do people usually do it? Is it at all possible to not start going to war until like SUPER late in the game when I have XCom troops and stuff that can just roll over people? I feel like to get a domination victory you really have to get started early, but I may be wrong on this. Pangaea map and not end up one of the more isolated civs. I conquered 75% of the map as Pocatello by something like AD1000 and spent the rest of it slowly marching around mountains to finally take Aztec and France out sometime around when I got Rifling. I was at war for almost the entire game, except the slow marching bits. Alternately, if you want to wait later, play something like tiny islands where every capital is on the coast. The AI is terrible at naval combat and a fleet of frigates/battleships obliterate city defenses.
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Sep 16, 2013 21:55
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SlightlyMadman posted:The worst is when you have to hunt down the original capital of a civ you don't even know because they were wiped off the map before you found their continent. If you play a lot, you should be able to recognize all the capitals by name, but I have no idea how somebody new to the game would even know which cities to take in that case. Which is why in multiplayer you either rename all conquered cities or switch around the names. 
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Sep 16, 2013 22:08
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That means annexing cities though.
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Sep 16, 2013 23:33
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Fledgling Gulps posted:That means annexing cities though. If it's got good resources and happiness buildings (which capitals tend to) it makes sense to annex
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Sep 17, 2013 00:12
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Well, even if I'm not going for a domination victory, I would kind of like to play more of the military game. On the higher difficulties, does the AI go to war more? I play on King and the vast majority of my games end up with me going Diplomatic, unless someone has been killing city states, then I go culture. In these games, the only times I'm actually attacked, I'll defend for a few turns while they throw units at my invincible cities, then accept their surrender. It seems really easy to defend and never have to go on the offensive.
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Sep 17, 2013 00:41
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 I think I've been playing this game a little too much when I can start predicting where the AI is gonna place it's
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Sep 17, 2013 03:03
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 I mean, it's not an objectively bad city location, but it is a bit far from home. Also, she offered me a city for peace in a war where I killed one great prophet and then did absolutely nothing.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:24
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It really is an objectively bad city location. Junk cities for two luxuries aren't really worth it anymore.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:29
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fivre posted:Also, she offered me a city for peace in a war where I killed one great prophet and then did absolutely nothing. Reminds me of the time I was given a city halfway across the world for a war I never actually contributed to. The Iroquois were right next to me and wanted to go to war with some guy on a completely different continent so who was I to say no? ~15 turns later I get given a 16 population city. Net effort expended: none.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:33
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:It really is an objectively bad city location. Junk cities for two luxuries aren't really worth it anymore. I don't know about that. It's a Portuguese city, on a coast, with two luxuries that are worth twice as much each in trade than any other city would get. It doesn't look like too bad of location. Those two luxuries are worth twice as much for trade routes, and I'm sure Maria has two ships to spare for food to the city. Not a bad place to start a foothold. I wouldn't set up there as any other civ, but Portugal is so good at this bullshit that I think it's a good move.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:35
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The Human Crouton posted:I don't know about that. It's a Portuguese city, on a coast, with two luxuries that are worth twice as much each in trade than any other city would get. It doesn't look like too bad of location. Those two luxuries are worth twice as much for trade routes, and I'm sure Maria has two ships to spare for food to the city. Not a bad place to start a foothold. I wouldn't set up there as any other civ, but Portugal is so good at this bullshit that I think it's a good move. It also has 3 fish; one's hidden by the name.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:42
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The Human Crouton posted:I don't know about that. It's a Portuguese city, on a coast, with two luxuries that are worth twice as much each in trade than any other city would get. It doesn't look like too bad of location. Those two luxuries are worth twice as much for trade routes, and I'm sure Maria has two ships to spare for food to the city. Not a bad place to start a foothold. I wouldn't set up there as any other civ, but Portugal is so good at this bullshit that I think it's a good move. I find these kind of distant trade posts or whatever to sound like a good idea on paper but never work out to really pay off. You'd need to get workers up there to improve every resource and then maybe the trade routes will be worth but it who knows because it's almost impossible for me to predict how the trade values will end up working out. I've settled some speculative colonies that seemed like they should be great but I ultimately just kept trading from my capital city that had all the trade buildings and whatnot in them. And since we're talking about civ abilities, Portugal's feitora makes luxury colonies extra pointless because you can often just get enough luxuries through city states. edit: 3 fish isn't enough to grow that city into an acceptable size or level of production. edit 2: I REALLY want a mod with BUG-levels of information overload. CivUP+. I want to go to settle a city and have it tell me "If you settle a city here you can expect it to have these resources and when fully improved to trade at this amount with these cities." Because not having that information just makes trade a really frustrating guessing game. Dr. Video Games 0031 fucked around with this message at 04:48 on Sep 17, 2013 |
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Sep 17, 2013 04:44
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fivre posted:It also has 3 fish; one's hidden by the name. Oh yeah. I didn't even see that since the resource indicators were off. That city is great. Give it a worker, send it some food, and let it produce an army. Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I find these kind of distant trade posts or whatever to sound like a good idea on paper but never work out to really pay off. You'd need to get workers up there to improve every resource and then maybe the trade routes will be worth but it who knows because it's almost impossible for me to predict how the trade values will end up working out. I've settled some speculative colonies that seemed like they should be great but I ultimately just kept trading from my capital city that had all the trade buildings and whatnot in them. And since we're talking about civ abilities, Portugal's feitora makes luxury colonies extra pointless because you can often just get enough luxuries through city states. It's not that I disagree with what you're saying. I think we are both right, even though we contradict because we don't know the specific game conditions. But if you are going to start a colony on another continent, is there any better place than that after looking at the map? That city has time to grow where it is because it's tiles are not in demand. The trade may be good or not, we don't know what else Portugal, or the other civs have access to regardless of the feitora. I like the spot. The Human Crouton fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Sep 17, 2013 |
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Sep 17, 2013 04:47
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The Human Crouton posted:Oh yeah. I didn't even see that since the resource indicators were off. That city is great. Give it a worker, send it some food, and let it produce an army. I really don't understand how that's going to happen with those tiles, though. Maybe in the early game in can be productive. But by the mid to late game? It's going to be a quarter as productive as your other cities and really offer nothing of value. 3 fish is nothing.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:49
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:I really don't understand how that's going to happen with those tiles, though. Maybe in the early game in can be productive. But by the mid to late game? It's going to be a quarter as productive as your other cities and really offer nothing of value. 3 fish is nothing. It's a new continent. It's not supposed to be great. It's supposed to survive long enough to give you a base. I would settle there as Portugal(maybe England).
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Sep 17, 2013 04:52
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The Human Crouton posted:It's a new continent. It's not supposed to be great. It's supposed to survive long enough to give you a base. I would settle there as Portugal(maybe England). But you just said it was great and could produce an army.  If by an army you mean one or two units, yeah I guess.edit: Maybe it actually is a good trade city and a forward base of operations, I'm really bad at estimating trade route values, I'll give you that. But I just don't see it.
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Sep 17, 2013 04:55
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Dr. Video Games 0031 posted:But you just said it was great and could produce an army. It's all hills on a coast. It has just enough food to support itself with fish, and Portugal will certainly have the ships available to send it more food. The fish are just a bonus to the city supporting itself. It can survive on it's own, but it should have a naval empire supplying it. That city could thrive with proper food support, and produce a great foothold army if set to production. I don't like the city by itself, but as part of an empire, it's a very good city. Edit: The actual trade for luxuries is questionable, but it's still 2 gold per tile if they are worked even without trade. It's the foothold that's good with the option of it being self-sustaining with fish if the empire can't support it with food trade routes. The city will at least pay for itself until it is conquered if it is not supported with food trade. The Human Crouton fucked around with this message at 05:01 on Sep 17, 2013 |
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Sep 17, 2013 04:58
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If it was early to mid game then I could see it being good, but 1455 (dunno what 311 turns means since it's obv. not standard speed) it's a bit late. At 9 pop it could work the 3 fish and 6 mines without starving. Send it food and it wouldn't take too long to get there. At 11 it could work the sheep and quarry too. Almost all the hexes are either resources or hills so they're not /that/ bad despite being tundra and ice. I would guess there are still better spots out there for late expansion.
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Sep 17, 2013 05:03
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Is there no way to label things or draw lines in Civ V? One of my favourite things in Civ 4 was naming all the new continents, islands, etc that I found. Fighting epic tank battles through the 'Burning Sands' was much cooler than doing it through some nameless desert.  Also, is it normal for mods to just stop working when you reload? I had Ethnic Units enabled for my latest game because I wanted to see the variety in modern era planes and tanks, but on reloading - through the mod menu no less, it seems everything has reset to vanilla.
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Sep 17, 2013 05:18
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The Human Crouton posted:It's all hills on a coast. It has just enough food to support itself with fish, and Portugal will certainly have the ships available to send it more food. The fish are just a bonus to the city supporting itself. It can survive on it's own, but it should have a naval empire supplying it. That city could thrive with proper food support, and produce a great foothold army if set to production. They're snow hills, they're only 1h. And I wouldn't waste food routes on a city like that. It's poo poo.
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Sep 17, 2013 05:19
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Ah, I forgot snow hills are poo poo. Got them confused with desert hills I guess.
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Sep 17, 2013 05:40
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Does founding a city steal the ring of hexes around it for border? Either way, it would have probably been better to settle the lower forest tundra patch, which, if she rush bought tiles, would get an extra stone (with stone circles pantheon), some river tiles, an extra copper, and truffles, albeit losing two fish. On the other hand, it might piss off Genghis more, since he conquered all of Celts shortly after. She also passed up a perfectly good floodplains/cotton/wheat/mountain spot right next to her capital though, and chose the Heathen Conversion reformation belief, so I'm guessing she's just batshit.
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Sep 17, 2013 05:41
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Always play with tile yields (ctrl-y) and hex grids (g) and resource bubbles (ctrl-r).
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Sep 17, 2013 05:41
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Phobophilia posted:They're snow hills, they're only 1h. And I wouldn't waste food routes on a city like that. It's poo poo. I didn't realize that snow hills were 1 hammer. Nevermind then. Portugal would be better off just sending in tons of ships to take a good city on that continent, unless they really need the extra happiness(which shouldn't happen if you are Portugal).
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Sep 17, 2013 05:42
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