|
Astro7x posted:Yeah, the Wii U problems extend far beyond awareness of it being around. Once you know it's around, nobody wants one because it has this huge stigma of a failing console. There's little reason to buy one. That's why it's a failed console.
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:25
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 21:51 |
|
|
Crowbear posted:Do not get Epic Mickey 2. Not only is the game pretty bad, the Wii U version is one of the worst ports I have ever seen in my life. Thanks for the advice, it looked alright. There's still a few games to choose from. Saw a marvel fighting game he'll adore off the back of it being marvel. If Pikmin drops in price pre-owned that's an option. I had a 20 minute bash on WW, it looks great. Didn't take Mario-u or Nintendoland out of the shrink wrap so I can't comment. I liked the look of Luigi U but he'd struggle with the time limit, that would be a buy for me to be honest.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:29
|
|
|
TheScott2K posted:I wonder if the thought that people know the WiiU exists, know it's out, and know that it is a whole new console but don't want to buy it at any price because it simply isn't compelling ever wakes anyone up in the middle of the night. I bet it occurs to Reggie when he sees his reflection in the mirror while he's washing his hands after his 2am dump. Turns out he thought the Wii U was Nintendo's attempt to get into the mobile market, an accessory tablet that played Wii games. Which is understandable, because all the Wii U ads he'd seen were someone holding an iPad in front of a Wii. Jeffrey posted:Just have your family exchange gifts on Halloween instead of Christmas. Problem solved. LITERALLY loving THANKSGIVING
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:35
|
|
|
Spiffo posted:fun fact IIRC, the Wii-U hardware supports up to two tablets. However, no actual games use two tablets and extra tablets aren't sold anywhere so that first sentence is suddenly really funny. Also, supposedly, while 2 tablets can be used at the same time, apparently doing so cuts frame rates in half. Which would probably explain a lot of why no one's pushed that yet.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:35
|
|
|
How intensively used is the tablet? I know you could potentially use it to play Mario instead of the TV but isn't it just maps and menus for the most part?
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:44
|
|
|
Dieting Hippo posted:- Remove the tablet No one is saying that removing the tablet is ideal and would solve all the problems. They are(I am at least) saying that Nintendo's console division is literally in crisis and needs to take drastic measures right now if they want to save the system. You basically said that they can't remove the tablet because it would remove <list of obviously tablet-exclusive features>, plus the second screen for games that require it. Do you think people use these features? What percentage of wiiu owners do you think have used video chat with their wii tablet? My guess is <0.1%. Obviously you aren't going to use a touchscreen drawing app if you don't have a touchscreen, would it really be missed? The biggest problem is games, and it is a logistical nightmare, I just don't see Nintendo as having any choice. I am guessing that, prior to the announcement, games will mysteriously start being labelled as "gamepad required" if they truly are. My understanding is it is optional for many but not all of the current games. You seem to suggest they stay the course in some way, which I think will do nothing to help, and there won't be a WiiU by next Christmas. Removing the tablet won't help immediately either, but a big price drop might at least do something. A new Mario game won't.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 22:56
|
|
Maybe someone will come in and post about removing the gamepad, I don't think it's been suggested yet.
|
Xillah posted:How intensively used is the tablet? I know you could potentially use it to play Mario instead of the TV but isn't it just maps and menus for the most part? It depends on the game; Wario Ware and Zombi U use the tablet extensively and would be different games without it; Mario not so much. I personally love it for 2 player Sonic Racing as you each get your own screens.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:12
|
|
|
TheScott2K posted:I wonder if the thought that people know the WiiU exists, know it's out, and know that it is a whole new console but don't want to buy it at any price because it simply isn't compelling ever wakes anyone up in the middle of the night. I bet it occurs to Reggie when he sees his reflection in the mirror while he's washing his hands after his 2am dump.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:15
|
|
|
Miyamotos RGB NES posted:It depends on the game; Wario Ware and Zombi U use the tablet extensively and would be different games without it; Mario not so much. Is wario ware any good? Loved it on the game cube and the Wii version had it's moments. I'm going to move my questions over to the actual Wii-U thread, I'm derailing this, sorry.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:16
|
|
|
Jeffrey posted:See I also would need a reason to buy it, but I want them to release many killer IPs that don't use the tablet at all, and then I want them to stop making the tablet. I think it was a bad idea and they are wasting money continuing to manufacture them. Fortunately for me, I don't think they'll be going with your idea. There will be plenty of titles that don't make revolutionary use of the gamepad, and that's good too. A good game is a good game, and the gamepad is a good controller. whaley posted:The majority of people don't know it exists. I have a feeling a lot of people here think the entire planet is as informed as the Something Awful forums. Kind of like the guy who says above me "even if people did know it existed, the stigma of a dying comsole will keep them from buying it. " like some kids mother sees a commercial on tv for a new Nintendo system with a pretty new Mario game and says "Here is a Nintendo for my child but I hear it is a dying console from my time on video game message boards and from reading NPD sales stats so nevermind." True. Edmund Honda posted:Maybe that's the problem with the Gamepad actually, because anyone developing a game for it has to account for the off-screen play: anything essential has to be on the main screen at all times. That kinda limits it to being used as a minor convenience and nothing more-- maps, inventory etc. I don't think so. Wonderful 101 has some sections that rely on second-screen information, and their solution is to allow instant switching of the view screens, plus a picture in picture mode. Even if a developer can't find a way to allow off-tv play in their game, big deal. Not every title has to use every feature. it's not even feasible for all features to be used to the max simultaneously. Lots of options, and that's good. For me, anyways. Dieting Hippo posted:Back to the internet armchair drawing board, I guess Surprising that it hasn't been suggested in 152 pages. Such a great idea. (not) Jeffrey posted:You seem to suggest they stay the course in some way, which I think will do nothing to help, and there won't be a WiiU by next Christmas. Removing the tablet won't help immediately either, but a big price drop might at least do something. A new Mario game won't. I don't think they're in a "crisis" really. An under-performing product, a slow launch, or even an outright flop - none of those seem to be a "crisis" for Nintendo. They can deal with it. They want to take acceptable risks and be able to try again if it doesn't pan out. They are capable of doing just that. I guarantee that if they "stay the course" there will still be a Wii U next holiday. The gamepad is a great controller with a lot of potential. Relegating it to an accessory seems short-sighted and unhelpful to me.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:20
|
|
|
TheScott2K posted:I wonder if the thought that people know the WiiU exists, know it's out, and know that it is a whole new console but don't want to buy it at any price because it simply isn't compelling ever wakes anyone up in the middle of the night. I bet it occurs to Reggie when he sees his reflection in the mirror while he's washing his hands after his 2am dump. People not knowing about the console isn't an "excuse", it's a problem in itself and I think everyone agrees about that. "Everyone knows exactly what the console is and hates it" sounds like some weird smug console warrior fantasy; there are of course plenty of people who fit that bill, but there's demonstrably a large segment of the consumer base that doesn't even know enough about the platform to inform or motivate a purchasing decision either way.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:21
|
|
|
Jumbled_Johnsons posted:Not every title has to use every feature. it's not even feasible for all features to be used to the max simultaneously. Lots of options, and that's good. For me, anyways. You can either have a map or mirror the screen, lots of options!
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:24
|
|
|
OLIVIAS WILDE RIDER posted:You can either have a map or mirror the screen, lots of options! (In all seriousness there are some good companies doing legit cool things with it, like Criterion. Of course they were rewarded for their efforts by the game not selling at all. I'm starting to think that Nintendo's fans are its greatest weakness as well as its greatest strength.)
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:32
|
|
|
Chaltab posted:Don't forget the inventory! Some creative developers out there guys. A super updated port of an old game is still a port of an old game.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:35
|
|
|
Jumbled_Johnsons posted:Surprising that it hasn't been suggested in 152 pages. Such a great idea. (not) I went back two pages and found this  Jeffrey posted:See I also would need a reason to buy it, but I want them to release many killer IPs that don't use the tablet at all, and then I want them to stop making the tablet. I think it was a bad idea and they are wasting money continuing to manufacture them. I can keep going back and finding more quotes, but it'd be more of the same. There are legit things Nintendo can do tokeep the Titanic afloat a bit longer like putting in a proper account system or maybe doing more 3ds/WiiU interactivity. Those suggestions I mention keep popping up and are wishful-thinking white noise. edit: I spaced on the fact that you quoted the same post, did you forget it too? Dieting Hippo fucked around with this message at 23:41 on Oct 4, 2013 |
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:37
|
|
|
Bobnumerotres posted:A super updated port of an old game is still a port of an old game. But Zelda HD is going to save the WiiU?
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:38
|
|
|
OLIVIAS WILDE RIDER posted:But Zelda HD is going to save the WiiU? No one's saying that except Nintendo.
|
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:56
|
|
|
Dieting Hippo posted:I went back two pages and found this He's being ironic, you fool. Removing the gamepad comes up literally every other page and most people are sick of it. Cliff Racer fucked around with this message at 00:00 on Oct 5, 2013 |
|
#
?
Oct 4, 2013 23:57
|
|
|
Speaking of Zelda, having played Wind Waker HD for the last few hours, I think I can safely say that its actually a good argument for having an inventory and general menu on the gamepad rather than the usual method of stopping everything. With the gamepad, I could just keep moving as I checked my inventory, maybe swapped a few items, or switched to a map on the fly. Similarly, if I ever needed to check where I was in a dungeon, all I had to do was briefly glance down and that was it. It may seem like I'm overstating it - and I probably am to some degree, having just come off playing it - but it honestly lends to the experience. For actual gameplay with the tablet though, I think Wonderful 101 is still one of the champions - out of the limited selection mind you - to this effect. Certain unite morphs I find easier to pull off with the touchscreen than with the right stick, there's actual asynchronous gameplay every now and again, and it adds little details to things like when you get a new teammate, or are checking items in the shop.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:00
|
|
|
Cliff Racer posted:He's being ironic, you fool. Removing the gamepad comes up literally every other page and most people are sick of it. Man, after so many pages of it, all talk about it just blends toether into a giant shitheap. Sorry Jumbled 
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:11
|
|
|
Supercar Gautier posted:People not knowing about the console isn't an "excuse", it's a problem in itself and I think everyone agrees about that. And even if that segment of the customer base knew enough about it to inform a purchasing decision, they still wouldn't be buying it. The part of the market that does know about it isn't buying it. The awareness issue certainly isn't good, but it's like having a busted roof on a house with a sinkhole under it. Sure, the roof's bad, fix the roof if you want, but the fucker's still going to end up in the ground. Chaltab posted:Yeah, that's it. The hardware is literally so bad and so obviously bad that everyone will ignore it no matter how much Nintendo drops the price. Might as well start digging a landfill for them now. This but unironically
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:25
|
|
|
I actually think it's a fair question to wonder whether the tablet drives more people away from purchasing Wii U than it entices people. Wii U did have an advertising campaign when it launched. How many not-sales were the result of someone seeing the tablet in those ads and saying "well I already have a tablet" or "I don't need/want a tablet"? That goes for the kiosks, and any marketing done to date.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:29
|
|
|
Quest For Glory II posted:I actually think it's a fair question to wonder whether the tablet drives more people away from purchasing Wii U than it entices people. Wii U did have an advertising campaign when it launched. How many not-sales were the result of someone seeing the tablet in those ads and saying "well I already have a tablet" or "I don't need/want a tablet"? That goes for the kiosks, and any marketing done to date. The tablet kind of draws me in since you can play games like Pac Man vs. with it. But the problem is that it is much harder for me to get a group of people together to come to my apartment simply to play video games so it is kind of wasted.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:35
|
|
|
TheScott2K posted:The awareness issue certainly isn't good, but it's like having a busted roof on a house with a sinkhole under it. Sure, the roof's bad, fix the roof if you want, but the fucker's still going to end up in the ground. The reason this metaphor doesn't work is that you can't convince someone to buy a product they don't know about. The people who currently don't know what a Wii U is wouldn't suddenly start buying this product that they're unaware of if it had a different game library, or internal specs, or fixed whatever specific problem you think is the "sinkhole" here. These elements can't attract or repel anyone who has no awareness of them. Right now, the marketing needs to shape up and establish what the product is, and make the case to purchase from there. It's not something that can be done in the opposite order at this point; They'll get a better read on what to do next if they can cut out the influence of market confusion. Supercar Gautier fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Oct 5, 2013 |
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:36
|
|
|
I think part of it also unfortunately relates to how the Wii U was announced - initially, all that was shown was the gamepad. Obviously, Nintendo wanted it to be a symbol of the console, but a lot of people thought that the thing itself was the Wii U. I mentioned earlier, my sister knew the gamepad existed, but not that it was part of a larger set for a whole new console. And it took it being in her hands for her to find it was actually pretty neat.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 00:50
|
|
|
Supercar Gautier posted:The reason this metaphor doesn't work is that you can't convince someone to buy a product they don't know about. The people who currently don't know what a Wii U is wouldn't suddenly start buying this product that they're unaware of if it had a different game library, or internal specs, or fixed whatever specific problem you think is the "sinkhole" here. These elements can't attract or repel anyone who has no awareness of them. The all-powerful hand of marketing isn't going to solve the problem that people just don't have a use for this thing. That's the sinkhole - it does nothing for most people looking for a game console. It doesn't present improved graphics over the consoles that 100 million people already own, it doesn't have new and exciting games that didn't already pretty much exist on the Wii or 3DS, and its vaunted tablet controller looks downright stupid next to the iPads that the filthy casuals already have in their house that have tons of free and 99-cent games that look better than anything does on that giant 480p "tablet" (lecture them about F2P being bullshit all you want, my parents don't care and neither do yours). It is a lovely value proposition compared to the existing consoles, the next-gen consoles are going to crush it graphically, and if "second screen" does take off (big "if"), Sony and MS's approaches are much more versatile that Nintendo's. The sinkhole is the very concept and execution of the console itself. There is no marketing solution to that. Super Bowl ads aren't going to suddenly fix Nintendo's complete tone-deafness. This console is their chickens coming home to roost, and it says a lot about the magnitude of its problems that a total failure of marketing is basically background noise in the story. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 01:07
|
|
|
quote:It doesn't present improved graphics over the consoles that 100 million people already own quote:it doesn't have new and exciting games that didn't already pretty much exist on the Wii or 3DS quote:and its vaunted tablet controller looks downright stupid next to the iPads that the filthy casuals already have in their house that have tons of free and 99-cent games that look better than anything does on that giant 480p "tablet" (lecture them about F2P being bullshit all you want, my parents don't care and neither do yours) quote:It is a lovely value proposition compared to the existing consoles, the next-gen consoles are going to crush it graphically, and if "second screen" does take off (big "if"), Sony and MS's approaches are much more versatile that Nintendo's. The sinkhole is the very concept and execution of the console itself. There is no marketing solution to that. Super Bowl ads aren't going to suddenly fix Nintendo's complete tone-deafness. This console is their chickens coming home to roost, and it says a lot about the magnitude of its problems that a total failure of marketing is basically background noise in the story. quote:and if "second screen" does take off (big "if"), Sony and MS's approaches are much more versatile that Nintendo's. And honestly, I don't know that Nintendo can every turn it around enough to make the hardware profitable, but to say that it won't sell 'at any price' is absurd. It's eventually going to have Super Smash Brothers on it--a Super Smash Brothers developed by a studio with actual experience making online fighting games. That poo poo would move consoles if it were out now, and there's no reason not to assume another price drop won't happen before then if the sales continue to drag.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 02:15
|
|
|
Astro7x posted:Yes, why is this a big deal? No game requires a second tablet, and Nintendo can do a repair/replacement if it breaks. Putting the tablet for sale on it's own for people that simply broke it and need a replacement would just add to confusion of it being an accessory vs. new console. If you had two people wanting to play a game together that actually used the tablet in a way other than displaying inventory or minimap? Also, the confusion is Nintendo's own loving fault.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 03:51
|
|
|
Doomsday Jesus posted:If you had two people wanting to play a game together that actually used the tablet in a way other than displaying inventory or minimap? Even if you could buy a second Game Pad, the cost is so high no developer would waste time on a feature that would require a $100 accessory. It's bad enough that they have to include a Wii Motion Plus remote with pretty much any game that needs it since they don't support it out of the box.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 04:00
|
|
|
Doomsday Jesus posted:If you had two people wanting to play a game together that actually used the tablet in a way other than displaying inventory or minimap? You'd also need to have 2 open outlets near the two of you and that would be more annoying to me. The battery life on the tablet is so loving short.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 04:00
|
|
|
I remember talking to a 20 year old co-worker who's in GameStop regularly and plays more games than I do a few months after the WiiU's launch. He had absolutely no loving clue it existed.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 04:06
|
|
|
They should just advertise it as a crunk gaming console and not even show the tablet but still include it. You buy it and open it up and surprise there's a giant controller in there too. Then no one will be confused until it's too late. Oh yeah, once again, you are probably blind as poo poo if you think the Wii U is only as powerful as an XBox 360 or PlayStation 3 whaley fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Oct 5, 2013 |
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 04:54
|
|
|
The Wii U might be more powerful than the current gen but lets be honest, its feature set has more in common with the PS360 than with the upcoming ones that are focused around online streaming, cloud bullshit, and huge Destinyesque multiplayer games. Not to mention that once the dust finally settles the Wii U will probably receive versions of multiplat games based on the PS360 version rather than the 4bone version (for the titles that even include a Wii U version, that is.) So in that regard it will be like the Wii in one of the ways that left owners unhappy this generation.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 05:18
|
|
|
CapnAndy posted:Ha ha you make jokes, but do you know when Hannukah is this year Oh, thanks for reminding me. I'll have to start the "find a single store in this loving goyim town that stocks candles" search early. I don't think I've ever found them in the same store twice, though I do have a nice list of places to check by now (which stores are hub stores for example, more likely to have products for limited audiences)
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 05:41
|
|
|
Wait, you can't just use normal candles for Hannukah?
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 05:46
|
|
|
Cliff Racer posted:Wait, you can't just use normal candles for Hannukah? It takes an unusual number (44 total) and typical hanukkiahs take a size of candle too big for most small candles (birthday and such). It's not a mandatory size or anything, just what's become the standard for a good aesthetic and 1-2 hours of light (shorter by the end of the holiday with more candles making more heat and dribbling their neighbors.)
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 06:29
|
|
|
Here, these are good candles. Now join me in commiserating that all the presents have to be bought before Black Friday, and also how the gently caress do you celebrate Hannukah on Thanksgiving anyway, how is that going to work?
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 06:34
|
|
|
Nintendo should make a 2D Zelda roguelike. Just rework nethack, make it slightly less difficult and actually playable without spoilers and you're golden.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 06:41
|
|
|
Chaltab posted:Yes, Nintendo made some really bad decisions in the design and implementation of the console. But downplaying the terrible marketing is ridiculous. The value proposition of the console is not something that can be determined accurately when a lot of people don't have the correct information. Thinking its a Wii addon, or that the tablet itself is the console, or that it's less powerful than seven year old hardware gives people a horribly skewed idea of what the value proposition is. People who know about it have determined that the value proposition is poo poo. Fans hope that Nintendo will make a marketing push once their big games are released and that the console will have a miraculous second wind when it's over a year old and competing with more powerful competitors, but it's hard to imagine that happening.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 06:41
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 21:51 |
|
|
icantfindaname posted:Nintendo should make a 2D Zelda roguelike. Just rework nethack, make it slightly less difficult and actually playable without spoilers and you're golden. Nintendo already has an existing franchise of Japanese roguelike games based around Pokemon.
|
|
#
?
Oct 5, 2013 06:47
|
|
