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DNova posted:I have to question how much you really want it if you put in a limit order at a 44% discount from the current price. It never truly hurts to have a good until cancelled limit order - but it is kind of pointless when its that large of a % away from being filled.
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Nov 11, 2013 20:35
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DNova posted:I have to question how much you really want it if you put in a limit order at a 44% discount from the current price. He locked it in! Don't hate just because you didn't have the foresight to lock in such a great price.
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Nov 11, 2013 20:50
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Comb Your Beard posted:I decided I really want TWTR partly because I'm a big fan. I locked in a limit order at $24, I kinda just wanna hold out that I can get it for cheaper than it's at currently. Jesus, don't do this. If and when your order gets executed it'll likely be on a day it was plunging from $25 to $23 a la facebook. Follow the stock, let it plummet and consolidate, and then enter on your own terms when upward price action momentum has been established and/or TWTR is actually, you know, making money.
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Nov 11, 2013 21:29
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What’s the story with Motley Fool? On Saturday they sent out spam that looked like a penny stock pump and dump. It talked about the INTERNET OF THINGS. It didn’t mention the symbol, but with a little research it’s plainly SWIR. So I watched it today, and without any other news it popped 10%.
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Nov 12, 2013 00:22
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So would this lawsuit against TSLA have any merit? http://finance.yahoo.com/news/shareholder-alert-brower-piven-encourages-161113995.html quote:According to the Complaint, following October 2, 2013 news reports of a Model S battery pack catching fire and bursting into flames, October 28, 2013 news reports of a second Model S catching fire, the Company's November 5, 2013 disclosure that its third quarter 2013 financial results were below expectations on key metrics, including the rate of vehicle deliveries, and the Company's November 7, 2013 disclosure that a third fire had occurred in its flagship Model S, the value of Tesla shares declined significantly. I notice the distinct lack of WHY a fire was "caught" from this. Notably that in each, under "normal" driving conditions cars dont "catch" fire. In each of these a wreck/impact was involved. Wrecks and impacts are not considered normal driving conditions. One was from a guy driving drunk in Mexico. Wonder if the lawfirm doing this saw that report that from 2006 to 2010 there were over 152,000 car fires in the US per YEAR. On the face of reading it, it just seems to imply that the cars are just spontaneously bursting into flame. MrBigglesworth fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Nov 12, 2013 |
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Nov 12, 2013 19:10
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Warm und Fuzzy posted:What’s the story with Motley Fool? On Saturday they sent out spam that looked like a penny stock pump and dump. It talked about the INTERNET OF THINGS. It didn’t mention the symbol, but with a little research it’s plainly SWIR. So I watched it today, and without any other news it popped 10%. OOH. Do you have the email? Can you screen grab parts of it - like the fine print?
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Nov 12, 2013 20:45
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Tony Montana posted:I hear you guys, but even with your replacement.. you're looking at a depreciation value that you have to factor this 8 year thing into. A Ferrari is worth a shitload new, and depending on the model just goes up over time, or dips as it's not the newest anymore and if you hang onto it long enough it goes up again because it's rare. You don't have to swap out the engine of it, if it's not been driven by idiots and maintained. Trading in a Tesla, how close are we to the 8 year warranty expiry? Almost everything you said about luxury cars here is wrong, and especially about Ferraris. -The vast majority of luxury cars, including Ferraris, lose a huge amount of value over the first five years and will never, ever recover that value -Ferarris have high-strung engines that wear out quickly, needing constant amazingly expensive maintenance, including occasionally needing entire new engines -Only a tiny percentage of exotic expensive cars eventually become "collector's items" that appreciate in value. You might be led astray by watching Mecum Auto Auctions or something, but it's important to understand that concourse-level restored cars have had tens of thousands of dollars poured into them to bring them up to a sufficient level of fit and finish to appeal to collectors; often that condition exceeds the level they had on the day they were made. The profit margin on restored collectible cars is often narrow and even more often negative. It's actually an ongoing joke over in AI, seeing how many people have ridiculously unrealistic expectations for the sale value of the car they've "invested" in restoring. Mostly restoring collectible old cars is a costly hobby. -Many luxury and exotic cars are driven by idiots and not maintained, especially cars that cost $100k and up. People who buy $100k cars are buying status symbols and/or expensive toys. They accept up-front that they will pay a huge premium for that utility, including expensive maintenance. Part of the reason that luxury cars lose such a huge percentage of their value in the first few years (compared to affordable practical vehicles sold to the general carbuying public) is that the market for used luxury vehicles is so weak. There is a segment of up-and-coming lower-level management types that will consider a 8-year-old Mercedes that originally cost $80k and is now barely affordable at $30k, but not really that many; they have to account for the $80k-car-maintenance level, and when cross-shopping $30k brand new Lexuses and BMWs, the 6-year-old Merc doesn't usually compare all that well. So basically what I'm getting at is that, if there is anything to be concerned about in terms of battery longevity affecting resale value, it'd be for cars like the Prius where resale value actually matters to new car buyers; yet, that concern hasn't really materialized (used Priuses hold their value pretty well). Maybe it will matter if/when Tesla starts selling cars that cost something under $40k, but it sure doesn't matter for the Model S. e. Search your local Craigslist for "2006 Mercedes" and marvel at how many are available in the $10k to $15k price range. Leperflesh fucked around with this message at 21:48 on Nov 12, 2013 |
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Nov 12, 2013 21:43
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Thanks. I clearly have no idea about this. By the time the Tesla's battery warranty expires, it's depreciated so much, who cares. Perhaps it's even smart because the kind of people buying it in 8 years will be wanting their next toy (less probably) and don't give much of a poo poo if it's worth a fraction of what they paid. Buying a Tesla isn't an investment and you shouldn't think that's how buyers think of it. Gotcha.
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Nov 12, 2013 21:57
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Tony Montana posted:Thanks. I clearly have no idea about this. By the time the Tesla's battery warranty expires, it's depreciated so much, who cares. Perhaps it's even smart because the kind of people buying it in 8 years will be wanting their next toy (less probably) and don't give much of a poo poo if it's worth a fraction of what they paid. Buying a Tesla isn't an investment and you shouldn't think that's how buyers think of it. Exactly, yeah. I decided to just randomly check, for a comparative example. This 2006 Mercedes-Benz C55-AMG originally had a base MSRP, in 2006 dollars, of $54,450. With options it surely exceeded $60k. Today, with 93k miles on the clock, it's being advertised by a dealer at $16,885; after bargaining I'd expect to pay no more than $14k for it. That's fairly typical depreciation for such a car.
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Nov 12, 2013 22:03
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Tech companies generally need a critical number of early adopters who are willing to buy a not yet ready for mass market product which allows subsidization of the R&D to get it to its finished state after a couple product cycles. In order for those early adopters to buy in the product or idea has to be perceived as "cool" by the mass market. So I think Tesla will be fine because the market is onboard with the product and the early adopters are there. The fact that it isn't quite polished enough yet for the mass market doesn't matter as long as rich people keep buying them as a status symbol. If sentiment about electric cars changes then the floor will drop out.
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Nov 12, 2013 22:57
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If we've established the target market is people with too much money that like buying toys (not the mass market) 1) Toys are more cool if they're unique or have something different about them. Electric sportscar 2) Environmental green angle so you can be a douche over your cappuccino and tell everyone how conscientious you are 3) Performance characteristics unique to electric cars I guess that's why it's being discussed in this thread at all, sounds viable. Next would be the financials and if this company is run according to best practice, and if not at least reasonable practice. Some of these trading Goons sound like they've done that and bought the stock as a result.
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Nov 12, 2013 23:30
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Tony Montana posted:If we've established the target market is people with too much money that like buying toys (not the mass market) I agree with most of this stuff, but I thought Tesla was assuming some (or all) of the liability of the battery. Some places I've read that Tesla will replace the battery if it can't hold more than 70% of its max charge. That sounds like a huge liability for the company...
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Nov 13, 2013 00:29
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tiananman posted:I agree with most of this stuff, but I thought Tesla was assuming some (or all) of the liability of the battery. Some places I've read that Tesla will replace the battery if it can't hold more than 70% of its max charge. If you're so concerned about that what about the no-fault eight year battery warranty?
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Nov 13, 2013 00:34
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tiananman posted:I agree with most of this stuff, but I thought Tesla was assuming some (or all) of the liability of the battery. Some places I've read that Tesla will replace the battery if it can't hold more than 70% of its max charge. Why? Does this happen a lot? All new cars come with a warranty, all car manufacturers have liability to the people they sell their cars to. This would be the point you'd look through the financials and see if there is data to support what you're worried about - namely a lot of returns and a bigass expense for replacing customers batteries free of charge.
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Nov 13, 2013 00:43
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cowofwar posted:Tech companies generally need a critical number of early adopters who are willing to buy a not yet ready for mass market product which allows subsidization of the R&D to get it to its finished state after a couple product cycles. In order for those early adopters to buy in the product or idea has to be perceived as "cool" by the mass market. Electric cars still have a large upfront cost and the savings, if any, are small when compared with an internal combustion engine. Combine this with cars that are reaching 50+ mpg and that have a similar, if not smaller carbon footprint. It is not practical for people working at the median wage in the US to buy an electric car. Some may do it for the green status symbol but most will just go with a Focus or Civic or whatever else is cheap and practical.
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Nov 13, 2013 00:51
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tiananman posted:OOH. Do you have the email? Can you screen grab parts of it - like the fine print? There's no fine print. Just 10 pages of this: R.I.P., Internet--1 stock to turn the Web's "funeral" into YOUR $44,500 payday posted:They'll Call 2014 the Year the Internet Died... The gist is that in the near future all objects will have wifi-enabled accelerometers, photo sensors and temperature gauges which aggregate data in the cloud. My own observation is it's been happening for a couple years now. You see it in Nike Fuel bands, Siemens Building Automation Systems, Lutron Dimming Ballasts, On*Star and so on. I'm interested in it in a professional level, because the size and cost of the sensors have come down to a point to make it all feasible, and it will be years before people connect the dots to find all the applications for it. How about a fuel oil gauge that sends email alerts when you're low on home heating oil? Or smart dog collars that spams social media sites every time your dog woofs?
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Nov 13, 2013 01:02
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lightpole posted:Electric cars still have a large upfront cost and the savings, if any, are small when compared with an internal combustion engine. Combine this with cars that are reaching 50+ mpg and that have a similar, if not smaller carbon footprint. It is not practical for people working at the median wage in the US to buy an electric car. Some may do it for the green status symbol but most will just go with a Focus or Civic or whatever else is cheap and practical.
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Nov 13, 2013 01:15
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lightpole posted:Electric cars still have a large upfront cost and the savings, if any, are small when compared with an internal combustion engine. Combine this with cars that are reaching 50+ mpg and that have a similar, if not smaller carbon footprint. It is not practical for people working at the median wage in the US to buy an electric car. Some may do it for the green status symbol but most will just go with a Focus or Civic or whatever else is cheap and practical.
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Nov 13, 2013 01:29
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So I've been reading some recommended goon books and scouring through Investopedia and I got the itch to try my hand at trading. I've developed a portfolio within my area of expertise of a few companies I'm interested in. I have a small amount of money set aside right now which I plan to continue adding to as an investment fund. I'm wondering if I should just jump right in and put some money down. Or is this a sure fire way to throw it down the toilet? The money I have set aside wouldn't be sorely missed, as I'm only setting aside what I deem acceptable to lose at this point.
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Nov 13, 2013 01:31
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 Elon Musk is the loving man.
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Nov 13, 2013 03:08
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abagofcheetos posted:
I just saw that in Twitter, it is funny and ironic lol
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Nov 13, 2013 03:10
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Josh Lyman posted:The Prius is doesn't really save you money over a Corolla, sure, but we're really talking about a difference barely into the thousands. Anything comparable to a Tesla in performance and luxury will NOT have a much small carbon footprint. I am not sure that is true but I don't see Tesla moving far out of its niche. Batteries are still one of, if not the, problem. One reason why Musk and everyone else are still trying to come up with better, lighter, more efficient batteries. The basic battery has not changed much for decades while the internal combustion engine continues to forge ahead. Efficiency improvements can also take out hybrids as they can better use the power generated by braking doing other things. As things are, internal combustion is king and there is nothing on the horizon anywhere close to dethroning it. Tesla still has the problem of becoming a mainstream car. The rich that care can buy one but there are other options that may be better. I don't see this changing. lightpole fucked around with this message at 04:53 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 04:50
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lightpole posted:The basic battery has not changed much for decades while the internal combustion engine continues to forge ahead.
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Nov 13, 2013 04:54
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Popete posted:So I've been reading some recommended goon books and scouring through Investopedia and I got the itch to try my hand at trading. I've developed a portfolio within my area of expertise of a few companies I'm interested in. I have a small amount of money set aside right now which I plan to continue adding to as an investment fund. I'm wondering if I should just jump right in and put some money down. Or is this a sure fire way to throw it down the toilet? The money I have set aside wouldn't be sorely missed, as I'm only setting aside what I deem acceptable to lose at this point. If youre reading decent books and paying attention to what people are telling you, how did you miss the part about paper trading until you're comfortable you can turn a profit? 
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Nov 13, 2013 09:40
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Josh Lyman posted:This isn't really the thread to discuss electric cars vs. gas cars, but you can't seriously believe this is true, can you?
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Nov 13, 2013 14:10
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http://www.economist.com/blogs/babbage/2013/07/battery-technology Stuff is happening in this space.. it's just not finished yet. As for the Tesla becoming mainstream, we were just saying how it's market is entirely not mainstream and if you're looking at their stock (as opposed to arguing the merits of a Prius), which is the purpose of this thread.. that's what matters. Thinking in terms of when 'it goes mainstream' and the stock explodes because Tesla is a leader, is along the same lines of when Google Glass explodes because we're all cyborgs, so should or shouldn't we buy GOOG? It's too far off to speculate about sensibly, so you can just assess what you've got in front of you now - the model S is an expensive toy for rich people.
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Nov 13, 2013 14:23
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Tesla DOES have a mainstream (a ~40k car is another world from an 80+k car) future, and it will be here in only a few years. They just haven't elaborated on it yet, because they aren't ready to. If you think the car will have the same appeal as the Model S, there is no stock price that is too expensive. If you think that it won't, the floor of TSLA is probably like $40.
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Nov 13, 2013 15:55
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tiananman posted:He locked it in! Don't hate just because you didn't have the foresight to lock in such a great price. Yeah you did uncover the absurdity of that. Really the choice is a more realistic limit order like $40 or wait it out. Still undecided. Thankful for this thread. I shoulda bought more Bitcoins than 2 because they have tripled but that's a different thread I think...
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Nov 13, 2013 16:03
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Thoughts on DATA? I really like the software and has no debt but it's ev/ebitda is -1.75k lol
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Nov 13, 2013 16:19
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I just come in here to mention CSIQ from time to time. I bought in at $12.2x, and yeah I want to sell, but the poo poo won't stop going.
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Nov 13, 2013 16:25
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abagofcheetos posted:
 When they opened Disneyland in 1956, nothing worked!
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Nov 13, 2013 16:44
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Turkeybone posted:I just come in here to mention CSIQ from time to time. I bought in at $12.2x, and yeah I want to sell, but the poo poo won't stop going. What's the deal with rebates in Canada for this? In Australia it was a boom, almost dot-com style industry while the Government heavily subsidized panel installation in line with Green sentiment - but when the rebates stopped so did the ridiculous growth. edit: \/\/ I am being constructive, I'm telling him the most important point succinctly, which someone else said to me here. You can practice, with a perfect simulator of the market, for free. The 10,000 hours thing, although cute and beaten to death by Gladwell, means if you trade 3 hours a day, 5 days a week you'll be done in a little over 12 years. It's more in reference to concert violinists and Bill Gates's learning to code.. although perhaps if you attack with that vigor you can be the next Warren Buffet 
Tony Montana fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 16:45
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Popete posted:So I've been reading some recommended goon books and scouring through Investopedia and I got the itch to try my hand at trading. I've developed a portfolio within my area of expertise of a few companies I'm interested in. I have a small amount of money set aside right now which I plan to continue adding to as an investment fund. I'm wondering if I should just jump right in and put some money down. Or is this a sure fire way to throw it down the toilet? The money I have set aside wouldn't be sorely missed, as I'm only setting aside what I deem acceptable to lose at this point. Slightly more constructively, it seems like you have both the right mindset (only invest money you can consider lost the day you invest it) and the right level of caution (oh my god everyone is going to take all my money!). Tony Montana is right, though not constructive, that you should now try your hand at paper trading. Sock away that money into a low risk passive yield vehicle like a savings account for the time being. You can pick a brokerage who allows paper trading and start playing with funny money, most of them will let you do this at no cost. You have to be your own judge on when you'll transition to real trading but here are some theories to consider: - Wait until you've turned an acceptable profit trading over a 6 month time span. This will probably mean you have picked up some skills and didn't just hit a lucky fluke. - Wait until you've incurred a significant loss, and then made it back. I took a 20% drawdown and then earned it back on paper before I did any real trades. - Wait 10000 hours. This is 10000 hours of trading, not 10000 hours from starting trading. You have to weigh the opportunity cost of not making any real money against the cost of losing significant chunks of your own real money. 10000 hours is overboard, but it's the general timespan for acquiring high functioning expertise in any skill, and trading is a skill. Keep reading. Remember that any time anyone gives you concrete advice (buy TSLA at $150!) there's a very real risk they're trying to create opportunities for themselves rather than help you out. When someone gives abstract advice they're probably trying to share their own strategies, but probably are also not fully describing those strategies. Take everything with a grain of salt except your own experience.
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Nov 13, 2013 16:46
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Applied for Freelancer IPO in decent retail size and got refunded full amount. Not happy. Edit: Think it will at least double when it lists Friday. Urge to vomit. Mills fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 17:28
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the 10,000 hours thing is about mastering something, not learning the basics and making a decent, chill, 5 figure living
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Nov 13, 2013 17:43
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cowofwar posted:I remember when I was a kid I would buy AA batteries for my remote controlled cars and twenty years later Tesla is using AA batteries in their power packs. Clearly battery technology has not changed. His power packs use Lithium Ion, same batteries laptops use. Not by much. Musk himself freely admits it and is spending billions along with many others looking for a solution. DDD is still doing its thing. Also grabbed some PRLB and ALGN.
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Nov 13, 2013 19:17
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Relevant post in the D&D Pictures thread:substitute posted:
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Nov 13, 2013 20:48
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lightpole posted:His power packs use Lithium Ion, same batteries laptops use. Not by much. Musk himself freely admits it and is spending billions along with many others looking for a solution.
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Nov 13, 2013 22:05
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TOO SCSI FOR MY CAT posted:You're acting as if stable LI batteries aren't a recent innovation. Less than ten years ago most laptops used NiCd or NiMH because it was too difficult to stop LI batteries from blowing themselves up, and many electric cars still use NiCd today. We're also coming at it from two directions, not only we're working on batteries that work better.. but we're also getting better at making electronics more efficient. Modern Ultrabook laptops are a great example, that is some seriously sci-fi poo poo if you took a guy from the 80s and showed him how we roll. Next year's F1 regulations have a huge change; namely new powerplants that combine the engine and ERS (energy recovery system). People that know F1 will note the drop in the K of KERS, it's not just kinetic recovery but also taps into the heat output through the exhaust. There are stiff rules around the amount of 'power units' that can be used in a season.. meaning both the turbocharged combustion engine and it's hybrid electrical power component are counted as one. It's not the boost you have in this season but accounts for a significant portion of the engine's continuous output. This means you have Ferrari, Mercedes, Renault pouring not only development money but engineering resources and expertise into the core problems, which makes even someone like Elon Musk's efforts look positively rural. Next year is the launch of FIA's Formula E. poo poo is getting serious in the performance electric car world.. it doesn't matter if you're first when a serious player turns his attention toward your market and can develop, market and sell your rear end out of the water. Tesla? Oh yeah that thing Elon did for a while before, being the astute business man he is, he realized the big boys were coming for his lunch. Not being stupid he decided trying to beat Mercedes, Ferrari and Renault at selling cars was probably dumb, so he sold what work he'd done (while it was still worth something) to them and poured the money into SpaceX because of the high barriers to entry and the amount of proprietary, loving-hard-to-copy technology it developed. You bought SpaceX on the day of the IPO, right? Tony Montana fucked around with this message at 23:05 on Nov 13, 2013 |
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Nov 13, 2013 22:47
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I'm not allowed to do it because I'm an employee, and it breaks my heart every time because it's pretty much guaranteed money at this point. Did anyone short CSCO on earnings?
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Nov 13, 2013 23:13
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