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ronya posted:eh I dunno, offing the good father figure is like offing the dog in a YA novel. The fact that he's there means that he's going down, to illustrate the end of naïveté. But what Naivete does Elan have to lose? He's not the protagonist here, and he kind of already learned that his family sucks and is hopeless.
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Nov 14, 2013 21:17
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I hope Rich is okay.
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Nov 14, 2013 21:34
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Angela Christine posted:I hope Rich is okay. If you say it too soon, he'll bust his thumb again.
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Nov 14, 2013 21:40
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rocketrobot posted:If you say it too soon, he'll bust his thumb again. And we already blew the goblins card early.
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Nov 14, 2013 21:44
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The little rituals in here about rich posting remind me of my d&d players. "Argh, don't roll on your character sheet! It'll come up a 1." They don't really mean it, but confirmation bias is powerful. We're like that. Pigeons in a randomized skinner box, craning our necks and posting goblins, hoping for that food pellet.
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Nov 14, 2013 21:57
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I can't think of any fate more fitting for Tarquin than being slain by an already legendary hero whose entire life was basically a series of incredible stories. He doesn't get to be the main villain of a great dramatic tale of father versus son, or even the main villain of the unnecessary Elan-focused sequel. Tarquin's defeat won't go down in history as the resolution to the greatest story ever told, but as the end to yet another thrilling adventure in the life of Julio Scoundrél. What could be more infuriating to Tarquin than his legacy being remembered as "The time Julio Scoundrél fought that Terguin guy in the Western Continent?"
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Nov 14, 2013 22:37
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Hey everyone arguing over whether this is a deus ex machina or not. 1. Read Carrasco's post, just in case you forgot/missed this fact. (Carrasco clearly knows his Greek theater.) Carrasco posted:I always wondered why the airship was called Mechane. 2. Read this Wikipedia blurb: wikipedia posted:A mechane or machine was a crane used in Greek theatre, especially in the 5th and 4th centuries BC. Made of wooden beams and pulley systems, the device was used to lift an actor into the air, usually representing flight. This stage machine was particularly used to bring gods onto the stage from above, hence the Latin term deus ex machina ("god out of the machine") I can see the argument that "poking fun at a weak literary device doesn't absolve its use," but this would have been foreshadowed really well had OoTS not been a piece of episodic fiction. Unfortunately, it was involving a character who last showed up 7 years ago, so the rules are a little different than they would be if this weren't a serial. That said, there's a whole crapload of good metafiction going on in this if you read closely. I'm pretty impressed. hey girl you up fucked around with this message at 00:27 on Nov 15, 2013 |
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Nov 15, 2013 00:21
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SexyBrianPuppet posted:I can't think of any fate more fitting for Tarquin than being slain by an already legendary hero whose entire life was basically a series of incredible stories. He doesn't get to be the main villain of a great dramatic tale of father versus son, or even the main villain of the unnecessary Elan-focused sequel. Tarquin's defeat won't go down in history as the resolution to the greatest story ever told, but as the end to yet another thrilling adventure in the life of Julio Scoundrél. What could be more infuriating to Tarquin than his legacy being remembered as "The time Julio Scoundrél fought that Terguin guy in the Western Continent?" Doomed to be a filler villain in the annuls of history
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Nov 15, 2013 00:46
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Ugh. I think I reached a breaking point on the Deus Ex Machina discussion. Does it actually matter if it is or isn't? If it is, is this a bad twist because of it? I mean, it was fun, it was surprising, and it happening doesn't tell us plot resolution will immediately happen in a specific way. Who actually cares?
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Nov 15, 2013 01:09
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ZenMasterBullshit posted:But what Naivete does Elan have to lose? He's not the protagonist here, and he kind of already learned that his family sucks and is hopeless. Bugger if I know, but that's the gist of a coming-of-age story.
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Nov 15, 2013 01:27
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ikanreed posted:Ugh. I think I reached a breaking point on the Deus Ex Machina discussion. Does it actually matter if it is or isn't? If it is, is this a bad twist because of it? I mean, it was fun, it was surprising, and it happening doesn't tell us plot resolution will immediately happen in a specific way. Who actually cares?
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Nov 15, 2013 01:28
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Hey, we have to know if we can add OoTS to the deus ex machina TVTropes page, man. These are important things. (I was mostly saying that Rich clearly knows it plays as deus ex machina and doesn't give a gently caress.)
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Nov 15, 2013 01:37
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ikanreed posted:Ugh. I think I reached a breaking point on the Deus Ex Machina discussion. Does it actually matter if it is or isn't? If it is, is this a bad twist because of it? I mean, it was fun, it was surprising, and it happening doesn't tell us plot resolution will immediately happen in a specific way. Who actually cares? It's a vector for complaining about how slow he's updating, like everything else.
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Nov 15, 2013 03:04
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Guys I think we are all missing the important part here: There is going to be a pun duel to end all pun duels. One pungeon master against another. I think Rich will top himself with the dialogue.
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Nov 15, 2013 05:25
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Speedball posted:There is going to be a pun duel to end all pun duels. One pungeon master against another. I think Rich will top himself with the dialogue. 
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Nov 15, 2013 05:36
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I like how Tarquin hear's the propellers and is all 'not now!' Clearly he recognizes Julio as well.
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Nov 15, 2013 09:50
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ikanreed posted:Ugh. I think I reached a breaking point on the Deus Ex Machina discussion. Does it actually matter if it is or isn't? If it is, is this a bad twist because of it? I mean, it was fun, it was surprising, and it happening doesn't tell us plot resolution will immediately happen in a specific way. Who actually cares? the JJ posted:I like how Tarquin hear's the propellers and is all 'not now!' Clearly he recognizes Julio as well. I just re-read Julio's previous appearances, and does anyone else hear an echo of Tarquin's own philosophy in that last kernel of wisdom? 
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Nov 15, 2013 12:20
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Has Elan changed rapiers since he got Julio's weapon way back before Azure City? Because I can't think of anyone but Tarquin who would make a good Devil-King of Dinosaur Island. Of course all that's based on is him having a Dino army but, you know.. Julio's old weapon fighting an old for and all that.
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Nov 15, 2013 15:38
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Oh I just realised. Convenient big shadow blocking out the sun.
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Nov 15, 2013 15:58
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I don't think Julio is in any danger here. This isn't "Good mentor self sacrifice", it is meant to hint at that narrative arc. Every single time OOTS has been on the backstep with Tarquin, they have been following his narrative requirements. They get the better of him when they break his narrative arc; what better way to defeat him by breaking such and old and common trope. Honestly I kind of wish that Tarquin helped out OOTS, then he can do the last minute change of heart up against Xykon, get mortally wounded and die in Elan's arms. That would satisfy his pathological need for a narrative as well. If he survives this, I predict that is how he dies in the climax by the way.
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Nov 15, 2013 16:54
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Alchenar posted:Oh I just realised. Convenient big shadow blocking out the sun.
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Nov 15, 2013 17:03
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SexyBrianPuppet posted:l. What could be more infuriating to Tarquin than his legacy being remembered as "The time Julio Scoundrél fought that Terguin guy in the Western Continent?" Not being remembered at all. From the viewpoint of pretty much the entire Army, Tarquin and his adventuring buddies teleported off into the desert chasing a stolen T-Rex. If the Order had managed to take them down, and then left, The result would be that nobody would know how, or if, Tarquin died, and his empire would reorganize, or fall apart, or both. Given the huge losses the army took on this crazy scheme, probably the latter. If Tarquin is scheduled to take down Scoundrel here,I'd guess the resolution would be that he's forced to make his way back to civilization on his own, only to find that his empire has crumbled while he was gone, and to die in obscurity in a mugging or something.
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Nov 15, 2013 17:22
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Ian is still running around the desert somewhere. With some sort of plan. If Julio gets brought back to help wrap up this arc then I don't see why more family shouldn't come.
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Nov 15, 2013 17:25
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Spiderdrake posted:Also, the title gimmick was interrupted "Go" "Through" then "Overshadowed" Ehh... I think that was just in reference to Tarquin running Elan through with Roy's sword to get to Roy.
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Nov 15, 2013 17:32
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Regalingualius posted:Ehh... I think that was just in reference to Tarquin running Elan through with Roy's sword to get to Roy.
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Nov 15, 2013 17:34
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Regalingualius posted:Ehh... I think that was just in reference to Tarquin running Elan through with Roy's sword to get to Roy. Or perhaps Julio overshadowed the comic title gimmick with his arrival. Eh? Eeeehhhhh?!
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Nov 15, 2013 17:46
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I was referring more to how Durkon's going to be relevant again. (all that other stuff is obvious)
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Nov 15, 2013 17:47
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Alchenar posted:Ian is still running around the desert somewhere. With some sort of plan. If Julio gets brought back to help wrap up this arc then I don't see why more family shouldn't come.
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Nov 15, 2013 18:53
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maltesh posted:Not being remembered at all. Actually, on this topic, this would otherwise be Tarquin's original plan, ruling for however long until some hero (Julio, it turns out) finally beat him. It wasn't until Elan arrived that he got hung up on the stuff that's basically been destroying his whole plan here.
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Nov 15, 2013 18:57
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Roland Jones posted:Actually, on this topic, this would otherwise be Tarquin's original plan, ruling for however long until some hero (Julio, it turns out) finally beat him. It wasn't until Elan arrived that he got hung up on the stuff that's basically been destroying his whole plan here. Sort of, but he needs to die in a way that he actually gets remembered as the power behind the throne. If he doesn't, he's just a general of an empire who got killed in the desert by a hero.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:02
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It would be hilarious if Julio accidentally hopped on a normal carpet and just craters into the ground like Roy once upon a time. I doubt that's the direction the story would go in but I love a good botched dramatic entrance.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:12
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greatn posted:It would be hilarious if Julio accidentally hopped on a normal carpet and just craters into the ground like Roy once upon a time. I doubt that's the direction the story would go in but I love a good botched dramatic entrance. He craters onto Tarquin who dies from Julio's sword stabbing into him and then being crushed by Juluo. He doesn't just die in the middle of no where without a way to ensure his legacy, he dies in the middle of no where because a guy got the wrong carpet.
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Nov 15, 2013 22:27
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Other ideas: to combat the use of narrative, Elan and Julio use terrible short form improv. Tarquin: This is not how it final confrontation will progress! Elan: Yes and, I am stabbing you. Tarquin: what? I am a general. Elan: Yes and, I'm just a lowly bard, from the rooooooaring twenties! Tarquin: Shut up! Julio: Yes and, he's using Perform [Charleston]! Tarquin: Stop saying yes and! Elan: It's like the first rule of improv dad!
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Nov 16, 2013 00:14
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PFlats posted:Hey everyone arguing over whether this is a deus ex machina or not. The Mechane was a DEM in its first appearance too, giving Elan a handy way to get back to the party and pick up some useful abilities in the meantime. That makes it all the better, really, nobody expects a DEM to reappear 
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Nov 17, 2013 14:28
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As a regular DM I kind of like this deus ex machina because it's a situation you occasionally have. Your players run into a hairy situation, maybe due to their stupidity but maybe also out of sheer bad luck and then you have a choice. Either go through a boring travel & resurrect play session the third time this year, have half the party be forced to throw away their organically grown characters and restart with complete unknowns, or you just pull out a DEM and fudge the result. Often the last one is the correct choice.
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Nov 18, 2013 20:55
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Is Rich.... ok?
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Nov 18, 2013 20:59
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VanSandman posted:Is Rich.... ok? Wow, the level of impatience here is growing palpable.
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Nov 18, 2013 21:59
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It's his own fault. Every page has been a cliffhanger. Driving us all nuts.
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Nov 18, 2013 22:27
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 New PageDurkula kicking rear end was probably the biggest surprise, I thought it would be all Julio vs Tarquin.
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Nov 18, 2013 22:53
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VanSandman posted:Is Rich.... ok? What the gently caress
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Nov 18, 2013 22:55
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