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I don't think I will ever progress past King. I just don't "get" the really nitty gritty stuff.
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Nov 28, 2013 04:14
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kaujot posted:I don't think I will ever progress past King. I just don't "get" the really nitty gritty stuff. In Gods and Kings, it seemed like the only way to win at the highest difficulties was to use the AI's ridiculous gold generation against it, and that just didn't hold any interest for me. Winning on the highest difficulty wasn't about playing a better game than everyone else, it was all about tapping into the ridiculous gold the AI got and exploiting that. It was always funny to read about strategies that only work at the highest levels, because they're basically game-sanctioned ways to abuse the AI. It looks like they're trying to address it with the change to not allow the selling of luxuries for lump sums of gold without a declaration of friendship, but I'm not sure how effective that has been. I've been selling luxuries for GPT and I end up with the gold over the long term, just not all up front, so it seems like it's only marginally broken now, instead of the totally broken that it was. Stealing a worker from a city state is still totally a thing, which I find both hilarious and sad. I think my problem is that I feel that a strategy that you use to beat the game at the highest level should work at the lower levels too, and when it doesn't, it feels like exploiting the AI/game, even if it isn't. Granted, the AI is still awful at the game (though it has gotten markedly better with every expansion), so maybe I'm expecting too much.
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Nov 28, 2013 06:26
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I didn't notice that big of a difference going from king to emperor. The real jump is in emperor to immortal. Wonder spamming stops being a viable strategy, and you pretty much have to declare war on a neighboring civ to keep up with everyone else.
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Nov 28, 2013 07:42
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Azathoth posted:This is pretty much where I am at. I can win pretty consistently on King, but I haven't tried any of the higher difficulties since Brave New World came out. I've been thinking about moving up, but I'm not sure that I care to, since the high-level game in Gods and Kings was not something I was interested in. None of this is really true, as you never had to abuse AI gold stuff to win at any level, it is only necessary to win faster if you are gunning for a low turn count. Since the last patch they removed all of the obvious AI abuse and I (and others) can still beat Deity because warfare is the great equalizer. You can win games without any RA or even any DoFs, but understanding AI diplomacy and war trumps all. My biggest gripe with the game is how hard they continually whittled away at wide strategies until now it hardly makes sense to go anything other than Tradition except on Large or Huge maps that I basically never play.
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Nov 28, 2013 07:49
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Smol posted:Woop, that was my fastest victory so far. T241 culture victory with Pachacuti on that absurd terrace farm start I posted earlier. I think I could've been a lot faster, had I not finished Tradition completely before starting Piety (for the reformation tourism bonus) and Aesthetics. What game speed was this on?
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Nov 28, 2013 07:57
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Oh hey I just won an Inca game as well, though I was going for science victory, which I got in 1921. I also had half of my starting area be desert hills and flood plains. I got Desert Rites, and Petra. My tiles were loving bonkers.
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Nov 28, 2013 08:03
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Azathoth posted:This is pretty much where I am at. I can win pretty consistently on King, but I haven't tried any of the higher difficulties since Brave New World came out. I've been thinking about moving up, but I'm not sure that I care to, since the high-level game in Gods and Kings was not something I was interested in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uR0zxOO2T18 He did a bunch of different civs and victory types and does explain his motives and strategies while playing.
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Nov 28, 2013 09:17
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Jastiger posted:What game speed was this on? Normal speed.
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Nov 28, 2013 09:21
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Smol posted:That said, I should probably move up to immortal now. My recent games have been far too too easy. I moved to immortal recently. It sucks at first because it totally blows to know that some wonders will be completely off limits forever, but the variety of being forced into choosing some less good religious beliefs since others may beat you to them is good for variety, and it's certainly nice not to be able to half-rear end a victory every game. I still consider Emperor to be "normal" difficulty since you have a chance to accomplish everything the AI can do.(Meaning get the Great Library) The Human Crouton fucked around with this message at 10:56 on Nov 28, 2013 |
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Nov 28, 2013 10:39
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Smol posted:Normal speed. How the hack did you get a science victory so fast? I am bee lining science and I can't ever get s victory so quickly. Can you share your save file? Or can anyone that can get a fast science victory post a YouTube or something and show me how you do it?
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Nov 28, 2013 17:37
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Jastiger posted:How the hack did you get a science victory so fast? I am bee lining science and I can't ever get s victory so quickly. Can you share your save file? Or can anyone that can get a fast science victory post a YouTube or something and show me how you do it? It was a culture victory.  Edit: I wouldn't mind getting tips about fast science victories either. I think the fastest I've done took like 300 turns. I'm guessing that beelining even harder for Universities/Public Schools/Research labs is the way to go. Maybe you should save the Rationalism finisher and Oxford for some specific techs? Perhaps the faster tech pace and potentially higher number of research agreements on Immortal or Deity could help as well? Smol fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Nov 28, 2013 |
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Nov 28, 2013 17:42
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Started a Dutch game. Find Fountain of Youth 4 tiles out from my cap. Playing on epic. Turn 24, Hiawatha swoops in and settles it. Turn 70, he has 6 cities around my cap.
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Nov 28, 2013 18:02
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Smol posted:It was a culture victory. Even a cultural victory that fast is crazy!
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Nov 28, 2013 18:24
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Cynic Jester posted:Started a Dutch game. Find Fountain of Youth 4 tiles out from my cap. Playing on epic. Turn 24, Hiawatha swoops in and settles it. Turn 70, he has 6 cities around my cap. Ahahaha. I only played the Dutch once on an emperor game (meaning I pretty much owned 80% of the world wonders and it wasn't really a challenge after the classical era), but have you tried denouncing and encouraging all of the other civs to declare war on Hiawatha? Also full disclaimer I sometimes save scum or whatever it's called before wars, founding a new religion, settling a new city, etc.
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Nov 28, 2013 18:44
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Smol posted:It was a culture victory. One decent rule of thumb for a quick Science victory is to turn all your early-midgame great scientists into academies, then hoard the rest when you're running out of tile space or are comfortably enough ahead. Then, bulb them (the 'discover technology' action) when you've finished researching Apollo Project or similiar so that you power through the last really annoying techs like Particle Physics and Nanotechnology. Otherwise, lots of growth and population is good for filling out your libraries, as well as trying to get an Observatory or two up and running quickly. They made it more difficult to achieve Science victories in BNW since the fall patch (the later techs need a lot more beakers than before), but a lot of it comes down to how high your population is; it's the main contributor to your science gain beyond flat building or trade route bonuses and all your science buildings are just enhancing the output of that number, favouring building tall (the Maya/Siam can go wide thanks to Pyramids/Wats giving +2/33% science but it's a bit eh). This is why the Inca are so drat good at it; their growth is absurd and they can be defensive very very easily as they're so hard to dig out of hilly areas. The Wicked Wall fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Nov 28, 2013 |
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Nov 28, 2013 18:54
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Smol posted:It was a culture victory. Immortal or Deity don't speed up tech victories too much, no. Mostly because you'll only have time to steal a few technologies before you want to start outpacing the AI. Higher difficulties speed up all other victory types as you'll be able to steal your way to relatively close to tech parity while focusing on other aspects.
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Nov 28, 2013 19:59
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Smol posted:Edit: I wouldn't mind getting tips about fast science victories either. I think the fastest I've done took like 300 turns. I'm guessing that beelining even harder for Universities/Public Schools/Research labs is the way to go. Maybe you should save the Rationalism finisher and Oxford for some specific techs? Perhaps the faster tech pace and potentially higher number of research agreements on Immortal or Deity could help as well? I usually aim the Oxford to get either Industrialization or Scientific theory, while researching the other manually.
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Nov 28, 2013 21:26
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The Wicked Wall posted:One decent rule of thumb for a quick Science victory is to turn all your early-midgame great scientists into academies, then hoard the rest when you're running out of tile space or are comfortably enough ahead. Then, bulb them (the 'discover technology' action) when you've finished researching Apollo Project or similiar so that you power through the last really annoying techs like Particle Physics and Nanotechnology. Otherwise, lots of growth and population is good for filling out your libraries, as well as trying to get an Observatory or two up and running quickly. I always thought the beaker ammount was always predetermined when the scientist was born? So basically it doesn't really matter when you pop him as you'll get the same amount of beakers regardless.
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Nov 29, 2013 03:23
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Star Platinum posted:I usually aim the Oxford to get either Industrialization or Scientific theory, while researching the other manually. 
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Nov 29, 2013 03:28
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DarthBlingBling posted:I always thought the beaker ammount was always predetermined when the scientist was born? So basically it doesn't really matter when you pop him as you'll get the same amount of beakers regardless. Nope it's something like a cumulative of the last (I think) 10 turns of science output.
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Nov 29, 2013 04:39
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dayman posted:Nope it's something like a cumulative of the last (I think) 10 turns of science output. It is, in fact, the last 10 turns, and your science will sharply plateau after Research Labs, so a few turns after you get them up and running is generally when you want to pop your scientists if you are going for the actual science victory.
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Nov 29, 2013 06:57
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DarthBlingBling posted:I always thought the beaker ammount was always predetermined when the scientist was born? So basically it doesn't really matter when you pop him as you'll get the same amount of beakers regardless. Great people giving 10*X value at date of birth is only the case for Great Writers and culture. But not Great Scientists and beakers. I like bulbing in two waves: one for Satellites so you can build Hubble and Apollo asap, then bulb the rest as your production queues clear up. Besides, the bottleneck for the spaceship is usually your raw beaker rate, not your production.
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Nov 29, 2013 07:17
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Phobophilia posted:Great people giving 10*X value at date of birth is only the case for Great Writers and culture. But not Great Scientists and beakers. Great Musicians also only have a set strength based on the turn they were born. Great Scientists are the last eight turns of total research added together, I believe
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Nov 29, 2013 08:21
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Marketing New Brain posted:It is, in fact, the last 10 turns, and your science will sharply plateau after Research Labs, so a few turns after you get them up and running is generally when you want to pop your scientists if you are going for the actual science victory. Well I never knew that! Usually winning my science victories in the 1930's, can now do it sooner I guess!
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Nov 29, 2013 11:32
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I need to redo the traits in the Supernatural Civilizations mod, and could use some ideas. I don't want to just copy stuff from the other civs in the game.
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Nov 29, 2013 20:03
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My stockpile of nukes and missile artillery units are just so I can work on my spaceship in peace OK? e: quote:Brazil also is one of the rare civs that is predisposed towards picking Freedom in a game full of Commies and Fascists. Somehow, Pedro was the only one in the world who went Autocracy, and he was making it work. If he'd gone Order we might have stayed bros. Peas and Rice fucked around with this message at 01:57 on Nov 30, 2013 |
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Nov 30, 2013 01:27
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I've held off buying BNW for a while now due to a lack of it going on sale. Now that Steam's Autum sale is on, I'm wondering if it is worth $15, or if I should wait for more than 50% off to pull the trigger on it. Also, are the scrambled Continents/nations map packs worth getting?
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Nov 30, 2013 03:21
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I guess it just depends how important five bucks is to you. Is five bucks more or less valuable than getting it a month sooner? (BNW is pretty good and I recommend you pull the proverbial trigger now. The map packs are worthless.)
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Nov 30, 2013 03:48
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Eric the Mauve posted:I guess it just depends how important five bucks is to you. Is five bucks more or less valuable than getting it a month sooner? Good point. Purchased and installing now, and nix on the new map packs.
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Nov 30, 2013 04:01
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Meaty Ore posted:Good point. Purchased and installing now, and nix on the new map packs. Yeah, new map packs suck. I heard good things about small continents plus, but all it does is put half of the civs on one continent and put the rest on their own continent; all connected by shallow water. I use a modded continents plus script that makes about three main continents with a good mix of city states on islands and mainlands. It is the most fair while also being most random that I've found.
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Nov 30, 2013 04:12
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What maps are worth playing on? I have mostly been doing Continents Plus if I feel like a peaceful game and Pangaea Plus if I feel like war since I really like how they keep citystates off the main map, but I haven't had great luck with any of the others. Anyone have recommendations?
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Nov 30, 2013 04:14
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I like Fractal and Continents Plus for general purposes, or Small Continents or Large Islands if I want a more ocean-based map. Pangaea Plus or Hemispheres can be fun too for bigger landmasses, and Ring has an interesting gimmick if I'm feeling xenophobic and want to limit the amount of AI bullshit I'm exposed to. Then of course there are map types that favor certain civs, e.g. Pachacuti + Highlands. But usually I just use Fractal.
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Nov 30, 2013 04:20
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I've drifted over time toward using Fractal pretty much exclusively. I've found it consistently produces the most interesting maps. I tried PerfectWorld for a while but don't like it much. Besides the seam problem, it produces maps that are highly realistic but not very much fun to play Civ V on.
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Nov 30, 2013 04:38
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Yeah I've been using Fractal since Civ 4 (at least I think it was in that) and it's always been the best to me for an entertaining game.
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Nov 30, 2013 04:46
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Talking about terrace farms earlier, you guys should try settling a Dutch city on a floodplain. Polders are ridiculous.  If you aint Dutch, you aint much. 
SurreptitiousMuffin fucked around with this message at 11:22 on Nov 30, 2013 |
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Nov 30, 2013 11:15
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Thing is, though, there's nothing about the Dutch that makes them likely to be near a floodplain, so unless you're start-scumming it's not something I'd rely on.
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Nov 30, 2013 12:58
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SurreptitiousMuffin posted:Talking about terrace farms earlier, you guys should try settling a Dutch city on a floodplain. Polders are ridiculous. Having just finished an Aztec OCC with 46 pop in my capital on turn 276 (and the Dutch were exterminated by the Germans): get over my altar, amateur.
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Nov 30, 2013 13:00
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Azathoth posted:What maps are worth playing on? I have mostly been doing Continents Plus if I feel like a peaceful game and Pangaea Plus if I feel like war since I really like how they keep citystates off the main map, but I haven't had great luck with any of the others. Anyone have recommendations? My personal favourite is playing a huge "Tilted Axis" map. Half of the world (the bottom) is contested by the various Civ's, while the north is just a giant snowy barren wasteland of Barbarian camps and ruins. Make sure you click "Raging Barbarians" on. If you're into modding, I increase the barbarian spawn rate slightly, as well as increase the number of camps that can exist in the game. I've sent expedition teams up into the "wastes" around 1700 AD to grab a ruins, only to have them swarmed by the barbarian horde and have to retreat. It's the closest I've gotten to the Alpha Centauri feel of having the map itself (mindworms) pose a constant danger.
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Nov 30, 2013 16:21
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What do people think of the Pyramids as the Liberty wonder? I find that even when I go Liberty (which is pretty rare), I have no desire to build the Pyramids because I need to build or steal a first worker pretty early to start getting luxuries online to counteract expansion unhappiness, and after that and the free worker from the right side of the tree I just don't need two more. Does anybody like it or find themselves using it a lot?
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Nov 30, 2013 17:18
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  This is certainly a start. A certain city state is going to meet some nice landsknechts somewhere down the line.
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Nov 30, 2013 17:34
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