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wilfredmerriweathr posted:What did she tell you? There was a study that was published about three or four months ago, that really confirmed a suspicion I've had all along. Taking your  will permanently alter your brain and neural pathways. They have evidence from multiple independent studies that the reason children grow out of ADHD is that they are medicated. They compared brain scans and can demonstrate a physical improvement because of the drugs.So she's having me take them every day without vacations, or with minimal vacations.
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Dec 9, 2013 05:38
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TheBigBad posted:There was a study that was published about three or four months ago, that really confirmed a suspicion I've had all along. This is really interesting to me Maybe some day I will be able to stop taking them and still function
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Dec 9, 2013 06:20
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I'm not asking for any websites or methods, maybe just looking to vent or for some advice. I'm not sure. A few days ago a general nurse practitioner gave me some Strattera samples and I had a terrible reaction to it. I'm seeing her this Thursday but she can't prescribe all types of meds for ADD. I don't know how long it will be until I see the doctor and I need an EKG and blood tests done before they'll try giving me new drugs. The ekg isn't an issue I'm sure I can get it done on a day or two's notice by my family doctor. The problem is I'm leaving the country to go overseas in 2 weeks. Part of me doesn't care if I don't get meds before leaving the U.S. I am going for tourism and friends so I don't have to do much over there(You guys talking about being diagnosed while you're grad students or trying to get your doctorate is incredible to me). I would like to have some working meds when I leave but I refuse to let it get in the way of my trip. The other part of me is just scared in general of trying to function the next 2 weeks while I prepare for the trip. Like most young adults who aren't diagnosed until later in life I occasionally will/did buy 5 or 6 30mg vyvanse from a friend maybe once a month just to take em for a week and help me get the major flags in my life sorted out. I would love a script to take overseas not 30mg xr adderal or 70mg vyvanse but SOMETHING to help me function day to day. I know there are substitutes like nuvigil you can buy online but I'm not in a position to do that right now nor would I be able to bring that out of the country, plus I don't know for sure how the drug would react to me. I almost want to just call 3 or 4 doctors on my insurance and if I can get in within the next 2 weeks tell them my story and hope one of them understands. I don't want to lie for a script I won't do that and I wan't a safe/right amount for me(like, vyvanse over adderalxr or concerta). My family doctor is really cool and will usually give me anything(codine when I have strep throat, stuff like that) but I really don't think she would be remotely comfortable prescribing me a stimulant even though she would believe and trust me personally. I really don't know what to do ADD goons. Chances are I'll go overseas without add meds and I'll be ok in the long run but I'm concerned and also worried about the next 2 weeks as well. It's not fair, I'm affected by this and feel like I have no agency in my life, even when it comes to getting well with medication. I know that's bullshit, it's not my doctors fault I'm going overseas soon and that add meds are incredibly hard to get or I am possibly a lazy man baby but what am I supposed to do? I know this post makes me sound like a huge druggie or something but I'm a grown rear end man that just recently discovered a fix to a problem I've been trying to find my whole life. Before anyone asks, no, this isn't a rambling vyvanse post although those are funny. I'm just stressed and feel like I'm in a hopeless situation. I get it, I waited my whole life to find these meds and a diagnosis why can't I wait another 2 months, well, now that I've got a taste of what it's like to function and finally be myself I don't want to wait anymore I've already lost enough of my life. This took me like 30 minutes to write and was very emotional. I usually only post to call out goons on bad opinions and poo poo post people but thanks everyone for reading and I appreciate everyone in this thread.
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Dec 9, 2013 06:59
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I would ask my family doctor if I were in your position. It went like this, my friend said she was diagnosed with ADHD. She described her symptoms and I went whoa. I asked my CBT who was treating me for PTSD if I could possibly have it- she said whether you have it or not will be determined by if you respond to the medication. You have all the classic symptoms. I scheduled with a child psch in the practice for a diagnosis. Talked to my general practitioner, said you have to do an ekg and whatever because Im in the process of diagnosing this disorder. She said oh- okay. Then I had a business trip, I called my GP and she said I'll write you a low dose script to get through the trip- just follow up with the shrink when you get back. I did, and then my GP wrote meds for me until I decided to tackle persistent depression with Dr. Feelgood. I could literally just say- Dr GP, can you write these scripts from now on- I don't want to see this one anymore and I bet my GP would be like- cool. I can bill for that office visit.
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Dec 9, 2013 07:52
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I wonder if the brain structure stuff is referring to this study (here's a brief article on it). Because if so, it seems to be saying something sightly different - that not treating ADHD messes up brain structures, whereas medicated kids end up with relatively normal stuff. I'm not sure how much that's saying about the ability of stimulants to reverse pre-existing abnormalities (for all us lucky bastards that didn't get diagnosed until way past our teens), but... let's hope so? I mean, off the top of my head there's some studies about street meth/cocaine abuse screwing things up, so maybe the legit stuff can still nudge in some (hopefully positive) direction. That said, I don't think this suggests anything about optimal dosing w.r.t. vacations/no vacations. (But maybe there's something in the full paper, or this is another paper entirely. I'd be interested to know.) Personally - and this is 100% anecdotal - I find that regular small breaks (about 1 day a week, give or take one) useful to both get a better effect after the break and work on better habits off-meds/not have to rely on them as much. But that's just for me. Unfortunately for all this kind of stuff there need to be a whole bunch more studies.
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Dec 9, 2013 10:25
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Really this makes perfect sense and it's something I have personally noticed. The question is: is it the drugs themselves that are rebuilding/preventing deterioration of your neural connections, or is it the fact that medicated people can consciously build the proper neural pathways by developing positive behaviors and habits which then in turn assist your brain in creating/maintaining normal neural connections? I would be interested in learning if TheBigBad's psych read that study that was already posted, or some other one.
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Dec 9, 2013 15:04
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That's a really good question. I think at least part of it would be behaviour-based, since recent studies show behaviour and things that happen in life can alter gene expression*. On the other hand, medications already physically increase the production/retention of neurotransmitters, so it's not a far leap to say that reinforces certain pathways over time. But which effect is stronger... *There was a really interesting study lately where they conditioned male mice to fear the smell of cherries by releasing the smell at the same time as giving them small electric shocks. Their children and grandchildren inherited this fear! And it wasn't taught, either - some of those children were given to completely unrelated mice through in vitro fertilization. The brain structures for processing this smell was enlarged in all of them. Now, that's just one study, so there's still a chance the researchers just bunked something up. But there's been some interesting research going on into this type of stuff lately - it's called epigenetics. The basic gist is that you've got your genetic code, but there's something called DNA methylation going on that can still change things around during your life. I don't recall the name, but there was some other study where they turned off DNA methylation in plants, and they all got pretty sickly and died off quick. (Of course, this is possible even if methylation doesn't control adapation - it could just be necessary for some other life process) But it makes intuitive sense to me - that adaptations happen faster than just genetic code based evolution would predict. Survival of the fittest is some really crazy-nasty odds otherwise, particularly for big leaps like going from the ocean to land... ...So, uh, going back on topic, at least there's less of a basis for going "welp my brain is hosed forever".
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Dec 9, 2013 17:26
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I think its very important to be cautious when interpreting those studies Goddamn and anyone else who is reading. I'm not surprised to find that children with ADHD on medications are seen with more normalized brain organization compared to nonmedicated ADHD controls. Your brain is ALWAYS changing. Every single day connections are strengthened or weakened and while there is evidence to say that brain plasticity is greatest during times of rapid development that DOESN'T mean its not possible that people in their late teens or past those years won't see similar changes on medication and behavioral therapy, albeit a little slower in rate. Saying something like my brain is hosed forever would be a massively wrong statement to make.
guppiehaus fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Dec 9, 2013 |
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Dec 9, 2013 18:59
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Some days I wonder whether I even have ADD because I feel pretty drat normal even without meds. Then comes days like today where I'm in a complete and utter brain fog, my mind is bouncing around non-stop and I can't focus on a single task for five seconds without being distracted by something else.
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Dec 9, 2013 20:48
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Goddamn posted:I wonder if the brain structure stuff is referring to this study (here's a brief article on it). Because if so, it seems to be saying something sightly different - that not treating ADHD messes up brain structures, whereas medicated kids end up with relatively normal stuff. I'm not sure how much that's saying about the ability of stimulants to reverse pre-existing abnormalities (for all us lucky bastards that didn't get diagnosed until way past our teens), but... let's hope so? I mean, off the top of my head there's some studies about street meth/cocaine abuse screwing things up, so maybe the legit stuff can still nudge in some (hopefully positive) direction. This sounds like the study. Full disclosure- I suspect I'm Dr. Feelgood's first adult ADHD patient or first one that took an active role in treatment decisions. Lets be honest, this publication is a 6-parsec advancement in the medical field's perception on stimulants on the brain for the group of disorders we call ADHD. How many posts in this thread of people afraid to ask for stimulants for medical reasons? With life-long bike riding, regular sleep, solid habit building and proper medication I have a feeling I'll be able to die a normal person.
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Dec 10, 2013 07:25
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I took my Final today. Even if I completely bomb the class (which I won't), I feel accomplished I being able to complete a credit college course in a math heavy field, and online to boot. Things I'm doing differently next Quarter: 1. Talking to the Disabilities Office! I don't know why it didn't occur to me, but they might have been able to help with the stress that I hit inthe second half of the quarter. 2. Work on planing better - that wacky Executive Function is still out of whack. Maybe even see a Study Skills person. 3. Never taking a science/math-based online class ever again. I REALLY need the info fed to me in a classroom. Unless it's completely unavoidable. Also, I may give a go at volunteering to tour basic math in the Tutoring Center; I obviously have a skill here, I like explaining things to people, and would be great application fodder for if/when I transfer to a 4 year institution. And 36 mg of Concerta seems to be the optimum amount for me. 
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Dec 10, 2013 08:37
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I wanted to ask everyone in here diagnosed with ADHD do you have problens going to sleep, staying asleep, waking up, or all three?
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Dec 10, 2013 20:05
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guppiehaus posted:I wanted to ask everyone in here diagnosed with ADHD do you have problens going to sleep, staying asleep, waking up, or all three? All 3
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Dec 10, 2013 20:17
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Ana Lucia Cortez posted:Some days I wonder whether I even have ADD because I feel pretty drat normal even without meds. Then comes days like today where I'm in a complete and utter brain fog, my mind is bouncing around non-stop and I can't focus on a single task for five seconds without being distracted by something else. Have you been tested for something else? Like your thyroid gland.
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Dec 10, 2013 20:37
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guppiehaus posted:I wanted to ask everyone in here diagnosed with ADHD do you have problens going to sleep, staying asleep, waking up, or all three? staying asleep works fine but the other two.........
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Dec 10, 2013 20:42
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guppiehaus posted:I wanted to ask everyone in here diagnosed with ADHD do you have problems going to sleep, staying asleep, waking up, or all three? Yes, but they were unrelated to ADHD per se. Getting to sleep and staying asleep were because I was taking my stimulants at 2pm, so I'd have some still in my system after work ended for studying. Now that Finals have passed, I went back to a morning schedule. When I'm taking a break from the stims, I don't have these issues. Waking up in the middle of the night was due to allergies, and breathing through my mouth. Treating the allergy (dust mites!) fixed that somewhat.
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Dec 10, 2013 21:08
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Frog 1.0 posted:Have you been tested for something else? Like your thyroid gland. Curiously enough, that post explains what I'm like most of the time as well, and there's a history of Hashimoto's disease in my family. I get my thyroid tested later this month. So yeah seconded on the get checked out sentiment.
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Dec 10, 2013 21:11
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I sleep like a rock on Vyvanse. I attribute it to the fact that my mind isn't whirling between detailed daydreams and horrible memories. But I also feel tired throughout the day - tired-wired. Like it's sucking up my energy as soon as I obtain it. Still preferable to the alternative.
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Dec 10, 2013 21:24
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Hate going to bed, hate getting out of bed. Sleep like a log though, but maybe that's because I don't get much of it lately. Being on/off meds doesn't really effect this. Well, back when I took Dexedrine or Adderall, they'd make getting up and about much easier as long as I took them around 20 minutes in advance. Which was nice, but ultimately not worth the side effects/crashes.
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Dec 10, 2013 22:00
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guppiehaus posted:I wanted to ask everyone in here diagnosed with ADHD do you have problens going to sleep, staying asleep, waking up, or all three? No issues related to ADHD medication, my main issue with sleep is my body's natural clock wants to stay up until around 2AM and sleep until 10 or so. It's been like that my entire life. Waking up at 7AM every morning is a pain in the rear end.
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Dec 10, 2013 22:09
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I had problems going to sleep when I first started my medication, but not for the reason you'd expect - it gave me the focus to chat with my insomniac partner for hours, instead of just passing out 15 minutes in.skipdogg posted:my main issue with sleep is my body's natural clock wants to stay up until around 2AM and sleep until 10 or so. I have the exact same problem. That, and I'm almost completely incapable of deciding to stop focusing on something interesting to go to bed.
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Dec 10, 2013 22:19
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Zhentar posted:I have the exact same problem. That, and I'm almost completely incapable of deciding to stop focusing on something interesting to go to bed. ^^^ Ditto. I like a 4 AM to noon sleep schedule but the regular world doesn't and it's one of my biggest problems. 5-HTP helps sometimes, if I remember to take it (that's the hard part: I usually think "nah I should finish XYZ first and I don't want the drowsiness to kick in before I'm done"... but then end up procrastinating).
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Dec 10, 2013 22:31
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My mom has hypothyroidism so I've been tested for it like 6 times a year every year going back forever. Every time I go to a doctor with any complaint they want to test for it and surprise, I don't have it now any more than I did two months ago. Good job, doc. And yes, sleeping is loving hard and I'm not on any stimulants right now. Must be a thyroid problem. Hold on while I extract some more blood.
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Dec 10, 2013 23:00
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Qu Appelle posted:I took my Final today. Even if I completely bomb the class (which I won't), I feel accomplished I being able to complete a credit college course in a math heavy field, and online to boot. Do reading while on a treadmill or a stationary cycle. (I used a hoodie to block peripheral vision and a rainstorm app to white noise out all the pumped in music at the gym). I had higher retention rates and when I did problems or work I was able to focus better. Even working in exercise right before study time will help a poo poo ton with productivity and cognition.
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Dec 10, 2013 23:33
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TheBigBad posted:Do reading while on a treadmill or a stationary cycle. (I used a hoodie to block peripheral vision and a rainstorm app to white noise out all the pumped in music at the gym). I had higher retention rates and when I did problems or work I was able to focus better. Even working in exercise right before study time will help a poo poo ton with productivity and cognition. I'm going to try to remember to take advantage of this. Next quarter, my classes will be on campus, so I'll have access to their gym!
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Dec 11, 2013 00:14
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Qu Appelle posted:I'm going to try to remember to take advantage of this. Next quarter, my classes will be on campus, so I'll have access to their gym! My wife is a professor at an art school that is converting to online classes and when I was finishing my degree the last couple years I was splitting between online and in class. I was so pissed that they didn't offer some classes in person because I needed to be there too. Eventually it became about finishing rather than getting knowledge and so once I made that transition in attitude it was paint by numbers. Got into a routine stuck it out. I HATE that education is going online (and the prices they charge)- I don't think its good for us or good for normies. Relevant anecdote- Evidently I started as a computer science major when I got into the large corporation I've spent most of my career as a DBA in. I did not pass it. I just adhd'ed out, and in looking at my transcript I took it again in the spring... and failed it. Then as I was entering my last couple of semesters, graduating with honors became a possibility, except that pesky class meant the difference between graduating and graduating Summa cum Laude. So I retook it online- because it was not offered on campus. After treating the ADHD for two years, I got 997 out 1000 possible points in the curriculum. I answered a database multiple choice question incorrectly. (For those outside of IT, a DBA is a database admin).
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Dec 11, 2013 07:48
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It's interesting that so many of you are having problems with sleep too, but it makes sense. There's been a bit of research and back and forth within the medical community regarding sleep disorder comorbidity with ADHD. I was first diagnosed because I went to my physician regarding issues staying asleep during the night and daytime fatigue. I'd wake up on average about 2-4 times a night briefly and when I'd wake up in the morning I'd feel like hell and notice my bed was a mess due to tossing and turning throughout the night. I always thought it was unrelated to the diagnosis and thought it was funny that my physician picked up on it through that complaint. Guess it wasn't so strange after all. Do you guys do anything to help yourself sleep better at night? I'm starting to take about 1.5 mg of melatonin and trying to relax while in bed. guppiehaus fucked around with this message at 06:46 on Dec 12, 2013 |
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Dec 12, 2013 06:40
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Exercise, both weights and aerobic. I fuckin' love DDR. I hate the treadmill/elliptical/stationary bike. Boring as poo poo. Find a sport you like or something interesting and wear yourself out. Bonus: helps your attention span too.
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Dec 12, 2013 06:58
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Tried adderall 10mg for the first time yesterday. Or rather a generic version of it, specially mixed-up by the pharmacy. This is the only way you can still get it in belgium. After reading about it and seeing the doctor's and pharmacist's concern I was scared the side effect would be massive. But not much happened. side effects were a bit like ritalin or provigil, but the headache was not as bad. The dizziness and generally feeling weird was. It did help a little with my concentration, but not to the extend that I feel it is worth the side effects. It was the last type of medication that I could try I think. Seeing that I have all these bad reactions I start wondering if it's because of my rather sensitive liver. I know most of these pills put strain on it. And the only thing that has always helped a little is lorazepam, and apparently it doesn't ask too much of your liver.
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Dec 12, 2013 13:29
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mrfart, I've always found amphetamines to be really weird for the first few days, especially the very first. If it isn't awful, try it for a few more days (up to a week or so, unless nothing's changing at all) and see if the side effects subside. Need to drink more water too. I think the only cases of liver damage were from abusers injecting high doses intravenously... But it's best to double-check with a doctor.
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Dec 12, 2013 13:46
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mrfart posted:Tried adderall 10mg for the first time yesterday. YOU. How did you get adderall in Belgium? I'd love to give it a try and see if I can function better on it than on ritalin. I'm guessing it's the side-effects, what kind are you experiencing?
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Dec 12, 2013 13:48
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Goddamn posted:mrfart, I've always found amphetamines to be really weird for the first few days, especially the very first. If it isn't awful, try it for a few more days (up to a week or so, unless nothing's changing at all) and see if the side effects subside. Need to drink more water too. I think the only cases of liver damage were from abusers injecting high doses intravenously... But it's best to double-check with a doctor. Thanks. I'm aware of the need to drink sufficient water (even if I'm not using any medication). I drank 3 liters of water yesterday. And to NeilPerry, I didn't get Adderall, I got something generic that only a pharmacist can prepare for you. Now that I read the label on the bottle I realize it's not entirely the same ( my doctor told me it was ). It's only one ingredient, it's dextroamphetamine sulfate in English I think. Anyway, my doctor was clear that stuff like Adderall is of the market here. And I think it's even illegal in some european countries.
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Dec 12, 2013 15:13
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Does ADHD get worse over time? It was pretty bad but seems to have gotten a lot worse the past two years, to the point where I actually decided to post here and then tell the psych about it
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Dec 12, 2013 15:17
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bad posts ahead!!! posted:Does ADHD get worse over time? It was pretty bad but seems to have gotten a lot worse the past two years, to the point where I actually decided to post here and then tell the psych about it I've definitely had better years and worse years. I haven't tracked it closely enough to chart a general trend, though.
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Dec 12, 2013 19:19
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Goddamn posted:mrfart, I've always found amphetamines to be really weird for the first few days, especially the very first. If it isn't awful, try it for a few more days (up to a week or so, unless nothing's changing at all) and see if the side effects subside. Seconding this.. I felt so weird the first week I took Ritalin, I even made a post about it here. The side-effects have almost disappeared by now and it has really made a difference in my life.
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Dec 12, 2013 19:55
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prefect posted:I've definitely had better years and worse years. I haven't tracked it closely enough to chart a general trend, though.  I started a chart but I don't know wh.... look a squirrel!
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Dec 12, 2013 23:35
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bad posts ahead!!! posted:Does ADHD get worse over time? It was pretty bad but seems to have gotten a lot worse the past two years, to the point where I actually decided to post here and then tell the psych about it Take good care of yourself. It might not be as easy and fast acting as the pill, and not even be enough for you by itself, but it does help. It does get better.
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Dec 13, 2013 06:52
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mrfart posted:Tried adderall 10mg for the first time yesterday. Make sure you eat enough- it's an appetite suppressant, and because you can concentrate on what you need to so much better, you may even forget to eat. It's something that you have to be especially conscious of with amphetamines. If you don't eat enough, you're likely to feel dizzy, tired and irritable. I find that it helps to have a light breakfast before I take it in the morning. Amphetamines are also expelled from the body quite quickly. In any case, if the side effects don't subside, try a smaller dose. I'm speaking from experience here too. I used to have problems with food cravings and emotional eating, which, as I discovered, were exacerbated if not caused by the hyperactive-impulsive side of my ADHD. At one point, my dose was too high and the side effects began to impact the benefits. I wasn't eating enough a lot of the time and eating too many carbs, fats and sugars when I did have an appetite. I had some moods that concerned me too. Dropping the dosage from 60 to 50 mg made a huge difference- I can focus just as well, if not better, and the only side effect I notice is dry mouth if I miss a day. Sunshine89 fucked around with this message at 13:49 on Dec 14, 2013 |
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Dec 14, 2013 13:34
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usha posted:Take good care of yourself. It might not be as easy and fast acting as the pill, and not even be enough for you by itself, but it does help. It does get better. This is kind of a "well, duh" point, but it bears repeating. My symptoms have always been at the worst when coupled with poor lifestyle choices like eating processed foods, sedentary lifestyle, poor sleeping, drug and alcohol abuse, and being immersed in stressful and chaotic situations. Also, in regards to sleep, I have problems with all 3 as well. The only things that improve sleep quality for me is lots of physical activity, to release hyperactive energy and tire my body with exercise, and supplementing with 100mg of 5-htp prior to bedtime. Strangely, melatonin makes no difference in sleep quality for me, but 5-htp, which becomes melatonin, does. Research shows that ADHD is implicated in decreased REM-sleep duration and percentage over controls. The 5-htp has a way of significantly increasing REM duration and percentage for me. This in turn leads to a significant reduction in my brain fog, and we have all probably seen how stimulant medication works so much better on top of good sleep.
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Dec 14, 2013 21:50
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God, I've been getting so irritable and angry lately, I feel like I'm spinning out of control. I don't have any hope left and I really, really wish I could die rather than keep trying bullshit treatments and talking to shrinks I know who won't care. It's either complete numbness or feeling like giving up entirely
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Dec 15, 2013 01:53
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