|
Gah, I don't want to remake this thing, but I can't find a better way to post it. I need to get a goddamn VPN. My comparison of the fake vs. real Hongmi, on my Tumblr: http://tinyurl.com/mr2kkju
|
#
?
Feb 2, 2014 17:21
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 01:41 |
|
|
Ceciltron posted:The lawyers want money, they don't care about my career. I'm certain they will succeed should they so desire it. I'm just curious as to whether anyone has been blacklisted for this kind of thing. You're in uncharted territory.
|
|
#
?
Feb 2, 2014 17:55
|
|
|
Does the new passport number = new ID trick still work? Guess we can find out if worst comes worst right? Honestly Cecil, unless you can instantly settle and you pay 0 dollars, I say go all the way and keep us updated. If you are not comfortable in posting more private logs in the open internet, there's always the WeChat China option  Good luck!
|
|
#
?
Feb 2, 2014 18:02
|
|
You're not going to be able to reenter on a Z unless you sue for release, unless I missed the part where your employer gave you a release letter already (is that why you switched to a tourist visa I was unclear on that part?)Ceciltron posted:can this be used to bar me from re-entry to the country? Or should I wait until I return and am employed to begin litigation? Your new Z visa application is going to be rejected if your employer hasn't released you and you don't sue for release. Arakan fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Feb 2, 2014 |
|
|
#
?
Feb 2, 2014 19:24
|
|
|
I would say that whether or not you are engaged in litigation with your employer is as relevant as her ties with SAFEA. The "blacklist": http://www.safea.gov.cn/content.shtml?id=12746016 Isn't really a thing. You will have to get a new Work Permit if you are applying for a Z Visa (which requires a release letter) and that work permit is issued by SAFEA. As I have previously mentioned, my concern would be whether she decides that it would be easier to lean on someone in SAFEA to apply the existing regulations as firmly as possible to find a way to block your application which is within the rules rather than go through litigation. There's no way of knowing this until you try it though ~ it's a judgement call on how much sway your old boss had with SAFEA. Also, I doubt whether anyone has got this far in terms of legal recourse in the past, and she doesn't sound terribly bright so pre-emptive action of any kind, especially if it involves money/influence expenditure, may be beyond her ken. I mean, if you have your release letter then your new school can get everything squared away in terms of applications for Work Permits before the middle of February. Can't you just wait until then to begin court proceedings? [edit] Huh. Look at that. http://www.safea.gov.cn/content.php?id=12746423 http://webadmin.safea.gov.cn/pic/www/files/%E5%A4%96%E5%9B%BD%E4%B8%93%E5%AE%B6%E8%B0%83%E6%9F%A5%E9%97%AE%E5%8D%B7.doc GuestBob fucked around with this message at 02:02 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 01:48
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Alright, then a serious question: I am again on record as saying you really don't want to get involved in the China legal system, but you've already gone that route so I guess just see what happens and you can tell everyone if it was a good idea or a bad idea in retrospect I don't think you'll get blacklisted but "a two bit school manager who ONLY owns 3 franchises" still has a SIGNIFICANT more about of guanxi, money, understanding of Chinese culture and face than a foreigner who came to China just a few months ago with literally nothing and no one. Just something to keep in mind. I mean you don't even have any money to go home. Aren't your parents comping you a round trip ticket out of this ordeal? What if there are more fees and/or fines? Where are you getting this money from? literally, what are you still doing here? The Great Autismo! fucked around with this message at 01:58 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 01:54
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Alright, then a serious question: Did you forget to read the OP? You are doing something really loving stupid. You are going to lose and get deported, best case scenario. Do not do this. No one will give a poo poo about you
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
The problem is that China isn't just. You don't "take on the system and win!" in China. That's just not the way it works. No one cares if you feel that someone owes you overtime. This is all about OVERTIME. This isn't about getting hit by a car and having life-changing surgery and breaking your bank account. This is literally about a few hours of extra pay that you did not receive. And you're going to take down some lady over this? There are schools in Tianjin that simply DO NOT PAY PEOPLE and no on sues them. Like literally there is an international school that is months behind paying people, doesn't pay people their last paycheck and doesn't give them the bonus they promised, as well as a flight home. But no one sues them. People just leave and move on with their lives, because no one wants to get involved in the freakin' Chinese legal system. It's a complete and total mess. But you already lawyered up and went down that path, so just keep skipping along and see what happens I suppose
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:14
|
|
|
I was gonna hold back but Ceciltron, man, you're a loving moron. 1. You think your different skin colour is gonna save you? Well gently caress you. You might think you're king poo poo when all the laowai chasers are on your tail but as soon as you step inside the corporate Chinese world, consider your hairless balls stuck in a vice. 2. No one is gonna consider your case. Seriously. gently caress you. 3. Your privilege cannot be overstated. EVERYTHING IS FAIR screams Ceciltron as he jerks off about JUSTICE and FREEDOM. You gave up JUSTICE and FREEDOM the minute you arrived in a totalitarian capitalist society, you loving nonce. 4. UGH, gently caress 5. Everyone is laughing behind your back. I'm being a good guy here. Everyone thinks you're gonna lose. I'm just letting you know, there's no possible way for you to come out of this a winner. 6. "Will I be blacklisted?" asks the loving inbred. YES, YES YOU WILL. People don't like english monkeys who put up a fight. You'll be loving blacklisted for the rest of your days. 7. I once had to wait 2 weeks for pay. I didn't sue anybody because I'm not a white boy with a superiority complex. In summary, Holy poo poo you piece of human poo poo. You really are stupid, aren't you? I'm surprised you can pick up a pen to write "Mr. Laowai" on the board of some poo poo-tier school. But hey, no one knows better than you, Ceciltron, you loving wank stain. You're worse than BadAstronaut. Even he is just stupidly naive and unable to function on his own. He's like a fetus in a cardboard box. You are like a fetus with a switchblade preparing to take down an oncoming train. You. loving. Idiot. p.s. I hope you die. You're like a guy who sneaks into a bears cave, eats its food, then punches the bear for daring to give you bad food. ants on my cum rag fucked around with this message at 02:27 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:22
|
|
|
In other news, CTLC has elected to not screw me over and provide an official letter stating that my TEFL certificate meets Hong Kong Education Bureau standards. They assured me it would be mailed to me Friday. So maybe the NET thing will work out. Or the fellowship to study at CUHK I applied for (and will not hear word on until the end of April). We'll see. Also increasingly glad I ended up skipping out on that job at Joy Harbin.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:34
|
|
|
The Worst Muslim posted:I was gonna hold back but Ceciltron, man, you're a loving moron. Who shat on your crackers? The Worst Muslim posted:5. Everyone is laughing behind your back. For the record, I am skeptical but I am not laughing. Ceciltron has done more to handle his situation than 99% of the poor sods who end up with the fuzzy end of the chopstick. The odds are against him and people have told him that - but the only one ridiculing him here is you.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:43
|
|
|
GuestBob posted:For the record, I am skeptical but I am not laughing. Ceciltron has done more to handle his situation than 99% of the poor sods who end up with the fuzzy end of the chopstick. The odds are against him and people have told him that - but the only one ridiculing him here is you. Here's the thing: He's delusional. He's got some fantasy about killing the big bad but really, he's just ignorant about China. It's like some guy reporting the police on every street-shitter he sees. It's naive and laughable. I mean c'mon GuestBob, he called a guy a two bit owner of 3 franchise schools. That's PPC levels of arrogance.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:50
|
|
|
GuestBob posted:For the record, I am skeptical but I am not laughing. Ceciltron has done more to handle his situation than 99% of the poor sods who end up with the fuzzy end of the chopstick. The odds are against him and people have told him that - but the only one ridiculing him here is you. He managed to get his own apartment and hire a lawyer. By never been to China before barely speaks a word of Mandarin standards that's crazy competent, even with his Chinese girlfriend helping him. I mean hell, the police even seem to have sided with him. He's winning.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:50
|
|
|
I would bet dollars to donuts there are people that are ridiculing him, but I don't know for sure. I laughed at the post but I haven't laughed at Cecil's situation. But almost every person here has outspokenly told him to leave, and I will continue to beat that drum. I also have been on record for two weeks saying that you HAVE to take Seattle +2. It should have been a pick 'em at best or Seattle favored a tad. How I have so many friends that took Denver -2 makes me think that the world is actually going retarded. That is another drum I will beat for a long time. The Great Autismo! fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:52
|
|
|
Donraj posted:He managed to get his own apartment and hire a lawyer. By never been to China before barely speaks a word of Mandarin standards that's crazy competent, even with his Chinese girlfriend helping him. "He managed to hire a lawyer". Amazing stuff! You mean he found a law office and gave them money? And they accepted it?! And he found an apartment, and gave someone money for it, and they accepted it!? He's on the road to success!
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:53
|
|
|
goldboilermark posted:"He managed to hire a lawyer". Amazing stuff! You mean he found a law office and gave them money? And they accepted it?! And he found an apartment, and gave someone money for it, and they accepted it!? He's on the road to success! And he's gonna make sure to blacklist himself from being hired in that city? STUPENDOUS. edit: "Well he might be setting himself on fire but at least he's got a nice even coverage of kerosene all over his body, that's amazingly competent.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:55
|
|
|
goldboilermark posted:"He managed to hire a lawyer". Amazing stuff! You mean he found a law office and gave them money? And they accepted it?! And he found an apartment, and gave someone money for it, and they accepted it!? He's on the road to success! "By never been to China before barely speaks a word of Mandarin standards" Plus I do kinda want to know if the "get a new passport number" trick still works and this seems like a good way to find out.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:55
|
|
goldboilermark posted:The problem is that China isn't just. You don't "take on the system and win!" in China. goldboilermark posted:That's just not the way it works. No one cares if you feel that someone owes you overtime. This is all about OVERTIME. This isn't about getting hit by a car and having life-changing surgery and breaking your bank account. This is literally about a few hours of extra pay that you did not receive. And you're going to take down some lady over this? goldboilermark posted:There are schools in Tianjin that simply DO NOT PAY PEOPLE and no on sues them. Like literally there is an international school that is months behind paying people, doesn't pay people their last paycheck and doesn't give them the bonus they promised, as well as a flight home. But no one sues them. People just leave and move on with their lives, because no one wants to get involved in the freakin' Chinese legal system. It's a complete and total mess. But you already lawyered up and went down that path, so just keep skipping along and see what happens I suppose Do you see how none of the things you post are in any way based on law or factual evidence and do not help further the discourse at all? Because it's like the fifth time you've posted the same thing in slightly different words. Pipe down, the adults are speaking now.
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 02:57
|
|
|
It looks like you have a bunch of statistics. I have obviously seen very negative experiences. I am happy you have your statistics, really, that's wonderful stuff, but I am going to go with what I have seen happen over blog postings and articles from 2009. We can agree to disagree. edit: I also just realized you can report your own post. That's kinda cool, never knew that. I wonder if anyone has ever done that before.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 03:01
|
|
|
Arakan posted:Pipe down, the adults are speaking now. So you have hair down there these days, eh.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 03:03
|
|
goldboilermark posted:It looks like you have a bunch of statistics. I have obviously seen very negative experiences. I am happy you have your statistics, really, that's wonderful stuff, but I am going to go with what I have seen happen over blog postings and articles from 2009. We can agree to disagree. How many foreigners have you seen sue their employer with just cause and lose? GuestBob posted:So you have hair down there these days, eh. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xlMnrd54V8&t=57s
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 03:11
|
|
|
I think Arakan and ghost bob and gbm summed things up quite nicely. I can't tell you anything about SAFEA but personal injury laws are taken very seriously and on a more cynical note, authorities love drama. They love to see grey areas in the law because that just means another opportunity to collect a hefty bribe. And in my experience most lower level bureaucrats love seeing businesses going down because civil servants are paid peanuts and envy business men. When a new player enters the game that means there is another chance to con and fleece the new guy as much as possible. I'm not sure about Cecil's boss but maintaining smooth relations is a costly venture and Chinese New Year usually means Jack pot time for Macau gambling and hk shopping. Anyways good luck to Cecil, I'm never the one to say what you "should" do. Keep us informed and if you need a place to crash or airfare in hk you can always I only chuckle at you picking harbin on your own accord. Oh and with your credentials and goals why are you settling for a language mill. Goons never undersell yourselves. Or settle for less
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 03:16
|
|
|
Arakan posted:How many foreigners have you seen sue their employer with just cause and lose? Zero. I told him to keep skipping along down that road. I am not necessarily disagreeing with you, Arakan, I just think he's making much more trouble that what he could possibly get out of this. He pulled a runner, got fired, and is now trying to sue his boss over overtime. Imagine if he hadn't done any of that. He would have a lot more money right now and could continue working toward getting a new job this year. Now he's skipping down the Chinese legal system route for...what, like 1,000 RMB extra pay he didn't get? And now he has no pay because he doesn't have a job? You've been very outspoken for him to lawyer up about this, and he has, and he could end up getting that money back. I just don't think anything he is doing is worth the time and it could end up being really messy. And really the last thing I would want is to be in a foreign country in a messy situation with no money. Like literally that is one of the last things in the world I would want to be in. So I try to avoid that. Perhaps you have more balls than me, I don't know. I have been on my own since I was 18 though also so I don't have a family that will roundtrip me to China because I got fired by my employer. So maybe that's a safety net that allows him to fight for his overtime. I also think I am very cynical about China, but that's how I get through out here, and it has worked out for over four years and I'll just keep on keeping on, regardless of what internet poster Ceciltron does. The Great Autismo! fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 03:17
|
|
|
Everyone seems to feel very strongly about my thing. I'm gonna pipe down for a while about my things.The Worst Muslim posted:Holy poo poo you piece of human poo poo. You really are stupid, aren't you? I'm surprised you can pick up a pen to write "Mr. Laowai" on the board of some poo poo-tier school. But hey, no one knows better than you, Ceciltron, you loving wank stain. You're worse than BadAstronaut. Even he is just stupidly naive and unable to function on his own. He's like a fetus in a cardboard box. You are like a fetus with a switchblade preparing to take down an oncoming train. This is the nicest thing anyone has ever said about me 
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:22
|
|
|
Good luck mate. Whatever happens, let us know!
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:27
|
|
|
ghostboilermark I think he wants to sue over the whole release thing because it sounded like his boss wanted to (illegally) have him thrown out of the country for Basically if you're going to punch bears, you might as well get some good food and have a .40 handy.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:27
|
|
|
Arglebargle III posted:ghostboilermark I think he wants to sue over the whole release thing because it sounded like his boss wanted to (illegally) have him thrown out of the country for yeah, sue for the release letter than let everything else go.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:43
|
|
|
I thought that was already a given. Why would you contact a lawyer to try to get your release letter, the boss doesn't give it, and then say "Ok, welp, thanks anyway, guess I'll just toodle around." Why would Cecil ask to take that to court and sue? Wouldn't that be a given? He was talking about taking something to court, I just assumed it was something else. He quit because his boss said mean things and he didn't get overtime pay. I don't think you can sue someone for saying mean things in China but you definitely can sue for overtime, so I just assumed that is what he was talking about. I really hope whatever happens works out well for him, I have no ill-will or wish for him to fail. I'm actually very curious how it all goes down. When I got my first paycheck in China, good old 2009, I took about 7,500 RMB and hide it in my sock drawer. That was my "GET OUT OF THE COUNTRY NOW" funds. In case everything went to crap. I actually forgot about it after the first few months and found it like a year later and was totally 
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:47
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Everyone seems to feel very strongly about my thing. I'm gonna pipe down for a while about my things. This is a good response.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:48
|
|
|
Ceciltron posted:Everyone seems to feel very strongly about my thing. I'm gonna pipe down for a while about my things. Now I like you. I hope everything turns out well for you, you beautiful stupid man.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:49
|
|
|
Too bad badastronaut can't see this harmonious exchange. I've also crapped my pants a little.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 04:52
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 05:40
|
|
|
White people in China (mainly Americans and Brits) have a reputation for complaining about their work/living situations, causing it to often be dismissed outright since the proper (Chinese) thing to do is to suffer silently. Combine this with the fact that the person making complaints is getting 2x-4x the salary of their Chinese peers, and now they just look like an ungrateful dickbag to the boss.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 06:52
|
|
|
LentThem posted:Combine this with the fact that the person making complaints is getting 2x-4x the salary of their Chinese peers, and now they just look like an ungrateful dickbag to the boss. I do take your point and would raise you a disturbingly high frequency of asshats and man children amongst the expat population in China. The salary thing I have to take a bit of an issue with though because I recently compared my overall income with that of my mini-bosses and we're weren't that far apart in the end. I do have twice their monthly salaries but I don't have access to: a full salary equivalent pension after I retire; the purchase of housing at massively subsidized rates; random bonuses; training allowances; grey income in general. The pension is especially good: half of the teachers earn more after they retire than when they are working. On balance, I am ahead a bit, but not that much and certainly nowhere close to "4x" even though I get the odd bonus myself these days. I also have no idea about the private sector, only the public danwei system.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 07:39
|
|
|
GuestBob posted:The salary thing I have to take a bit of an issue with though because I recently compared my overall income with that of my mini-bosses and we're weren't that far apart in the end. I do have twice their monthly salaries but I don't have access to: a full salary equivalent pension after I retire; the purchase of housing at massively subsidized rates; random bonuses; training allowances; grey income in general. The Chinese teachers at our (public) high school get paid far more than we do, and we do quite well. That said, it is a pretty elite institution, like 3rd best in the province, and those teachers work crazy hours.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 08:22
|
|
|
blinkyzero posted:The Chinese teachers at our (public) high school get paid far more than we do, and we do quite well. That said, it is a pretty elite institution, like 3rd best in the province, and those teachers work crazy hours. I am going to go out on a limb here and ask whether they technically have two jobs: one tied to the international program and then a regular income from the school?
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 08:31
|
|
|
GuestBob posted:I am going to go out on a limb here and ask whether they technically have two jobs: one tied to the international program and then a regular income from the school? That's a good question. I'm not sure, actually. I do know that the teachers who don't work with our program at all do get paid quite well regardless, though.
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 09:28
|
|
|
blinkyzero posted:That's a good question. I'm not sure, actually. I do know that the teachers who don't work with our program at all do get paid quite well regardless, though. Hard guideline salaries for teachers at state schools, colleges and universities are generally set by the provincial MoE. And, indeed, provided by the provincial MoE on a monthly basis. There are some exceptions for key personnel and schools (your school is a key school or an experimental school?) but my guess would be that the school actually employs the teachers on two contracts: one solid f/t state sector, giving them access to all of the benefits that brings, and a second "part-time" whatsit which gives them a much higher monthly income from the international program. That's how I would do it. GuestBob fucked around with this message at 09:44 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 09:34
|
|
|
GuestBob posted:Salaries for teachers at state schools, colleges and universities are generally set by the provincial MoE. And, indeed, provided by the provincial MoE on a monthly basis. There are some exceptions for key personnel and schools (your school is a key school or an experimental school?) but my guess would be that the school actually employs the teachers on two contracts: one solid f/t state sector, giving them access to all of the benefits that brings, and a second "part-time" whatsit which gives them a much higher monthly income from the international program. Could be. There are definitely major differences between this school and some of the others in the city. It is an experimental school, yeah, though that gets applied to so many schools now. (Our head teacher explained the genesis of this classifier to me a while back and how nowadays it's a bit odd to call schools experimental when there's often just as many of them as there are non-experimental.)
|
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 09:43
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 01:41 |
|
|
blinkyzero posted:Could be. There are definitely major differences between this school and some of the others in the city. It is an experimental school, yeah, though that gets applied to so many schools now. (Our {school's accountant then our} head teacher explained the genesis of this classifier to me a while back and how nowadays it's a bit odd to call schools experimental when there's often just as many of them as there are non-experimental.) Yeah, come to the boonies and that classifier will mean something. Henan's reputation as backasswards is actually somewhat justified when you look at how they handle these things. It's also why there are so few good high schools in Henan - there's only one that specializes in Foreign Languages as far as I know - and don't even get me started on the lack of 211/985 universities here! Anhui manages to get by with an open minded MoE (I count two English language documentaries which feature education in Anhui in the past ten years - how many in other provinces?) and they are piss poor compared to us. It's really very annoying. GuestBob fucked around with this message at 10:01 on Feb 3, 2014 |
|
#
?
Feb 3, 2014 09:56
|
|