2014 NFL Free Agency-Our teams hate us!

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Ehud: Sep 19, 2003; football.

PantsFreeZone posted:

now imagine I just posted 20 pictures where Tannehill over/under threw Wallace.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 01:10

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# ? Jun 2, 2024 07:24

TheBizzness: Oct 5, 2004; Reign on me.

Wallace wasn't great last year but we also left a ton of big plays on the field with horrible under throws. Some of them were inexcusable.

Tannehill said after the season that they almost never went deep in practice and probably averaged one go route attempt per game.

I'm hoping a real OC can help them connect because the problem is not arm strength and Tanny has shown quality touch on other routes as well. I'm not real optimistic though, Dolphins football and all that.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 02:38

Parlett316: Dec 6, 2002; Jon Snow is viciously stabbed by his friends in the night's watch for wanting to rescue Mance Rayder from Ramsay Bolton

SlipUp posted:

Josh Wilson was actually good in Baltimore as of three seasons ago.

Dammit Washington, fix your field.

It's fixed. Wilson got beat like a drum all year last year. It was pretty bad. I think he had a decent two years in DC.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 02:42

Ehud: Sep 19, 2003; football.

I'll go out on a limb here and say the 2014 Miami Dolphins look pretty good sometimes, but at other times they will look bad.

oh my god I just google image searched 7-9 and I swear this image was on the fourth row

# ? Apr 9, 2014 02:49

superaielman: Mar 16, 2006; You can't harm me. Are you a fucking ass? Do you not know who I am? He must not know who I am.

Parlett316 posted:

It's fixed. Wilson got beat like a drum all year last year. It was pretty bad. I think he had a decent two years in DC.

Wilson had a lot of choice company, the entire Redskins secondary besides possibly Hall got torched on the regular. E: Living in Redskins TV market is the worst. Between them and the Packers, I saw a lot of really terrible secondary play last year.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 03:21

PantsFreeZone: May 31, 2013; by Nyc_Tattoo

Ehud posted:

now imagine I just posted 20 pictures where Tannehill over/under threw Wallace.

If you can find one where Tannehill overthrew him, I'd be impressed. And I'm not saying Wallace was the only problem. Tannehill hits Clay and Hartline in stride, but not the one guy he needs to.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 03:23

Ehud: Sep 19, 2003; football.

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

# ? Apr 9, 2014 03:28

John Brown: Jul 10, 2009

TheBizzness posted:

Tannehill said after the season that they almost never went deep in practice and probably averaged one go route attempt per game.

There's absolutely no reasonable explanation for that. Who was the OC?

# ? Apr 9, 2014 04:11

TheBizzness: Oct 5, 2004; Reign on me.

John Brown posted:

There's absolutely no reasonable explanation for that. Who was the OC?

Mike Sherman

# ? Apr 9, 2014 04:25

PantsFreeZone: May 31, 2013; by Nyc_Tattoo

John Brown posted:

There's absolutely no reasonable explanation for that. Who was the OC?

A completely useless fuckwad.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 04:30

Declan MacManus: Sep 1, 2011; damn i'm really in this bitch

Ehud posted:

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

well that's convenient

# ? Apr 9, 2014 04:51

Chilichimp: Oct 24, 2006; TIE Adv xWampa

It wamp, and it stomp; Grimey Drawer

Ehud posted:

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

I don't know what's worse; Mike Wallace throwing up his hands at Tannehill like a child when he gets over-thrown, or the DB's who look pleased with themselves for stopping an under-thrown ball.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 04:59

Brannock: Feb 9, 2006; by exmarx; Fallen Rib

Ehud posted:

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

So many of those would have gone for touchdowns if he had been on target, geez.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 05:01

Sweeper: Nov 29, 2007; The Joe Buck of Posting; Dinosaur Gum

Chilichimp posted:

I don't know what's worse; Mike Wallace throwing up his hands at Tannehill like a child when he gets over-thrown, or the DB's who look pleased with themselves for stopping an under-thrown ball.

Well I would also be pretty annoyed if my qb couldn't throw a deep ball well when it is the only thing I can do

# ? Apr 9, 2014 05:38

Intruder: Mar 5, 2003; I got a taste for blown saves

Brannock posted:

So many of those would have gone for touchdowns if he had been on target, geez.

All but the first one as far as I could tell

e: and maybe even the first if he throws over the outside shoulder

Intruder fucked around with this message at 05:44 on Apr 9, 2014

# ? Apr 9, 2014 05:39

Miss Lonelyhearts: Mar 22, 2003

For some context compare Wallace w/ the Steelers vs Wallace w/ the Dolphins. Bruce Arians loved the deep ball in Pittsburgh but it's not like Wallace caught them all, his game didn't really explode until 2010 when he started getting huge catch-and-runs. Speed is the best part of his game, not just the deep ball.

In 2010-2011 he averaged about 6.5 YAC (they also tried to give him end-arounds and poo poo; for example he scored a rushing TD in the Tebow playoff game). He dropped to 4.3 YAC in 2012 after Arians left and, for whatever reason, Haley's system favored Antonio Brown; in 2013 w/ the Dolphins he averaged 3.9 YAC. Bruce Arians had the key to his roller-skates, Haley and Sherman haven't gotten the same production.

Miss Lonelyhearts fucked around with this message at 07:50 on Apr 9, 2014

# ? Apr 9, 2014 06:40

The Puppy Bowl: Jan 31, 2013; A dog, in the house.

*woof*

It's important to keep in mind that hooking up on the deep ball is one of the harder things to do in football. Hitting a dude in stride 50 yards away is pretty amazing and really needs QB and WR to be at their best.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 06:48

gohuskies: Oct 23, 2010; I spend a lot of time making posts to justify why I'm not a self centered shithead that just wants to act like COVID isn't a thing.

Ehud posted:

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

A fun game is to guess as he releases the ball whether it'll be over or under thrown.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 07:06

Ehud: Sep 19, 2003; football.

If Tannehill had a good deep ball, we would have made the playoffs and there would be little question as to his future because his numbers would actually be pretty good; probably something like 28-30TD, 17INT, and 4300ish yards.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 12:02

Eifert Posting: Apr 1, 2007; Most of the time he catches it every time.; Grimey Drawer

Ehud posted:

If Tannehill had a good deep ball, we would have made the playoffs and there would be little question as to his future because his numbers would actually be pretty good; probably something like 28-30TD, 17INT, and 4300ish yards.

So about the same as Andy Dalton?

# ? Apr 9, 2014 13:25

onomatopizza: Dec 12, 2004; A word that sounds like pizza.

Eifert Posting posted:

So about the same as Andy Dalton?

Except for interceptions in the mid-20s.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 13:42

Amy Pole Her: Jun 17, 2002

Catfish Noodlin posted:

He didn't have problems throwing deep the year before, or to anyone else other than Wallace. Everyone on the team who had a deep attempt thrown to them over the past two years besides Marlon Moore(and only in 2013) had at worst double the success rate on deep passes as Wallace. The year before Wallace got here Tannehill was top 10 in completion % on those throws, this year he dropped to 32 of 40.

That's so rear end-backwards it isn't funny.

Yeah he missed hartline deep multiple times in 2012 actually, most notably in the Arizona game.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 13:47

Brannigans Law: Oct 3, 2013

Eifert Posting posted:

So about the same as Andy Dalton?

It's easier to get a deep ball to A.J. Green than to Mike Wallace. That being said, yes.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 13:48

Eifert Posting: Apr 1, 2007; Most of the time he catches it every time.; Grimey Drawer

onomatopizza posted:

Except for interceptions in the mid-20s.

34 TDs 20 INTs.

Edit: Looking at the game logs, Dalton threw 4 of his INTs week 17. :stare:

Imagine how different the dialog would be if he had sat week 17.

Eifert Posting fucked around with this message at 13:56 on Apr 9, 2014

# ? Apr 9, 2014 13:52

Regnevelc: Jan 12, 2003; I'M A GROWN ASS MAN!

Febreeze posted:

Every Cardinals fan I've ever met has been like "eh, whatever, i don't really care about them but i'll watch games from time to time"

I've never met a hardcore Cards fan.

gently caress you, bro.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 14:05

Hamhandler: Aug 9, 2008; [I want to] shit in your fucking mouth. [I'm going to] slap your fucking mouth. [I'm going to] slap your real mother across the face [laughter]. Fuck you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you.

TheBizness posted:

Tannehill said after the season that they almost never went deep in practice and probably averaged one go route attempt per game.

Maybe just "go" routes, but Wallace had a load of deep targets. PFF has him at third most in the league this year, and the most in his career. It's just his success rate sucked.

Again, Wallace's work ethic blows. He won't warm-up with Tannehill before games, he can't be bothered to show up to pre-OTA QB/WR workouts, which would really be an ideal time for them to fix the deep ball issue. You know, when he can focus on that without worrying if he'll get exhausted during practice or pre-game running long routes over and over.

AAA DOLFAN posted:

Yeah he missed hartline deep multiple times in 2012 actually, most notably in the Arizona game.

Sure, but he was still in the top 10 for completion percentage on deep throws.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 14:34

fsif: Jul 18, 2003

Eifert Posting posted:

34 TDs 20 INTs.

Edit: Looking at the game logs, Dalton threw 4 of his INTs week 17. Imagine how different the dialog would be if he had sat week 17.

It would probably still be about how he can't win a playoff game because he doesn't have *it*.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 14:45

SlipUp: Sep 30, 2006; stayin c o o l

If *it* happens to be a strong arm and good decision making, then yes.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 14:49

Tzen: Sep 11, 2001

Ehud posted:

There are several in here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNLTdNxhFvw

Haha gently caress this is frustrating to watch. The majority of these should have been touchdowns but instead... :flaccid:

# ? Apr 9, 2014 15:01

Grittybeard: Mar 29, 2010; Bad, very bad!

SlipUp posted:

If *it* happens to be a strong arm and good decision making, then yes.

It means playing for someone other than the Bengals, Lions, Chiefs, Browns or Bills I think.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 15:02

Eifert Posting: Apr 1, 2007; Most of the time he catches it every time.; Grimey Drawer

SlipUp posted:

If *it* happens to be a strong arm and good decision making, then yes.

Of course you'd think that, Dalton threw 40% of his INTs last year to the Ravens. Actual stats argue otherwise:

PFF posted:

2. Dalton is a quality decision-maker.

One of my favorite stats in the PFF Signature Stat portfolio is Time in Pocket for quarterbacks. Watching any NFL telecast, you�re likely to hear a lot about how important it is for the quarterback to make swift decisions and get the ball out quickly. I�m going to examine this concept in more detail later in the offseason, but right now I�m going to ask you to take it on faith that this is one area where the conventional wisdom gets it right. For pocket passers, getting rid of the ball quickly is hugely valuable. In 2013 Peyton Manning led the NFL in Time to Throw at 2.36 seconds. Dalton finished second at 2.43. Tom Brady was fourth at 2.46. Dalton led the NFL in percentage of passes thrown in 2.5 seconds or less.

It�s not enough to get rid of the ball quickly, however. You must also do it successfully. Dalton is obviously not anywhere near Manning�s insane 121.4 passer rating in such situations, but his 91.7 is very solid. Brady finished at 98.3. Matthew Stafford, another quarterback who receives scant recognition for getting rid of the ball quickly, was at 93.1. (Unlike Brady and Stafford, Dalton�s passer rating didn�t crater on passes released after 2.5 seconds.)

3. Andy Dalton is an elite deep passer.

If there�s one thing about Dalton no one disputes, it�s this: he finds himself in possession of a lousy arm. Fortunately, having a howitzer isn�t the key component in attacking a defense deep. Accuracy, anticipation, and a willingness to let it rip are all more important.

Ignoring small sample passers, only Aaron Rodgers, Russell Wilson, and Peyton Manning were meaningfully more accurate than Dalton on deep balls in 2013. Only Manning and Drew Brees � who was less accurate than Dalton � threw for more yardage on balls that traveled at least 20 yards in the air. Neither of them attacked deep as frequently as Dalton, who threw long on 14.7% of his attempts. Then there�s this. Manning and Brees saw their receivers drop four deep passes combined. Dalton�s receivers dropped seven all by themselves, the highest number of deep drops in the NFL.

Dalton is weird as gently caress and I honestly don't know what to think about him. The more I read and watch the more confused I get. I wouldn't argue he's good, I wouldn't argue he's bad. He could be both. At any rate the Bengals would be fools to not extend him. His perceived value is far, far, below his actual value.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 15:02

TheChirurgeon: Aug 7, 2002; Remember how good you are; Taco Defender

Eifert Posting posted:

Of course you'd think that, Dalton threw 40% of his INTs last year to the Ravens. Actual stats argue otherwise:

Dalton is weird as gently caress and I honestly don't know what to think about him. The more I read and watch the more confused I get. I wouldn't argue he's good, I wouldn't argue he's bad. He could be both. At any rate the Bengals would be fools to not extend him. His perceived value is far, far, below his actual value.

Can't he just be "an alright QB"?

Not everyone is going to be amazing or bad. Some guys will be average, above average, work well in some situations, be below average, etc. Dalton is clearly above average, but also clearly not by a lot.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 15:14

The Puppy Bowl: Jan 31, 2013; A dog, in the house.

*woof*

Eifert Posting posted:

Of course you'd think that, Dalton threw 40% of his INTs last year to the Ravens.

Originally I figured it was Reed that was loving him up so bad but nah. Seems like purple just isn't Andy's color. I'm still mad that our o-line threw week 17 away after all the chances the defense provided

# ? Apr 9, 2014 17:24

Flikken: Oct 23, 2009; 10,363 snaps and not a playoff win to show for it

The Puppy Bowl posted:

Originally I figured it was Reed that was loving him up so bad but nah. Seems like purple just isn't Andy's color. I'm still mad that our o-line threw week 17 away after all the chances the defense provided

Not just purple, he seems to think Joe Haden plays for the Bengals.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 17:34

The Puppy Bowl: Jan 31, 2013; A dog, in the house.

*woof*

Intercepting Dalton is like riding a bike. Once you learn you can always do it again.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 17:55

Cavauro: Jan 9, 2008

Dalton may end up getting a lot of praise this coming season for his "improvement" even though the key will be that he threw about 490 passes instead of 590. He may also lob up like 30 interceptions though. Either way I'm really looking forward to the next swift death of all hope and joy.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 18:09

SlipUp: Sep 30, 2006; stayin c o o l

Eifert Posting posted:

Of course you'd think that, Dalton threw 40% of his INTs last year to the Ravens. Actual stats argue otherwise:

Dalton is weird as gently caress and I honestly don't know what to think about him. The more I read and watch the more confused I get. I wouldn't argue he's good, I wouldn't argue he's bad. He could be both. At any rate the Bengals would be fools to not extend him. His perceived value is far, far, below his actual value.

I fundamentally disagree with the assertion that Dalton is a good decision maker. Good decisions makers aren't as hugely inconsistent in their decision making as Dalton is.

Also, while I thought it was a good article overall, I got a laugh out of point seven when the author goes "High variance? what? statistical noise! LALALA" But the answer he's looking for as to why Dalton turns in really good games against bad teams and poo poo games against good teams is that Dalton can follow a basic script well enough but when challenged and has to improvise on the fly or make a great throw to put the defense on it's heels, he can't. Dalton is a low ceiling, average starter.

As for his deep ball, I'll have to look into it more but I don't buy that the problems with the Cinci offense are Jay Gruden and AJ Green.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 18:29

The 7th Guest: Dec 17, 2003

Dalton doesn't necessarily turn in good vs bad and bad vs good, it just looks like he sucks inside his own division exclusively. 120.3 QB rating in 4 games against the NFC North, 90.7 QB rating in 4 games against the AFC East, 66.4 rating in-division.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 18:41

The Puppy Bowl: Jan 31, 2013; A dog, in the house.

*woof*

So he's just really easy to read. Divison games when the other teams know him best and playoff games when the other teams have the most to lose are when Dalton is at his worst. I agree with Slipup. The guy is serviceable but once you figure him out he is terrible at adjusting his game to suit the situation.

# ? Apr 9, 2014 18:51

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# ? Jun 2, 2024 07:24

Amy Pole Her: Jun 17, 2002

He pretty much kept Miami in that game after Lamar miller worked so hard to throw it away

# ? Apr 9, 2014 18:53

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