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"Brutal Doom is Doomier than Doom" *SA posters flip the gently caress out and carry a grudge for a century*
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Apr 15, 2014 01:10
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I mean, once you start playing the original doom/doom2 levels with mouselook all balance and difficulty already goes out of the window, so it's a little silly to complain about a mod adding gameplay changes. Unless it's ONLY the purists that still play keyboard only making those complaints, in that case fair enough.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:11
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Has anyone tried this Dragon Ball Z wad yet? I have fond memories of playing Earth Special Forces for HL1.AugmentedVision posted:I mean, once you start playing the original doom/doom2 levels with mouselook all balance and difficulty already goes out of the window, so it's a little silly to complain about a mod adding gameplay changes. Unless it's ONLY the purists that still play keyboard only making those complaints, in that case fair enough. While you do have a decent point, and there are definitely degrees of altering gameplay, this discussion tends to go nowhere. I just refreshed myself on the past 100 pages of the thread. It wasn't pretty, heh. Not trying to lessen your point, though, mate. Kazvall fucked around with this message at 01:14 on Apr 15, 2014 |
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Apr 15, 2014 01:11
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AugmentedVision posted:That seems to be the case with a lot of indie games and mods Modeling gibs off of real pictures of dead bodies that have been blown to bits is creepy, yo.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:11
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I'm one of those OG hipsters who can't appreciate how much Brutal Doom fudges around with the original game's balancing. Also yeah, Sgt. Mark is a disgusting racist piece of poo poo with a victim complex who sees any form of criticism of his work as utter jealousy for his success in adding br00tal hardcore real life gore sprite edits to a 20 year old game, then cries once too many people call him a sack of poo poo for telling suicidal people to kill themselves and having BD source code text that refers to turning enemies in to niggers with the plasma rifle. So basically, gently caress Sgt. Mark and gently caress anything he's made by proxy is what I'm trying to say here. EDIT: Adventures of Square looks really sweet, and I'm looking forward to it coming out a whole lot! EDIT2: yes vvvvv that's a thing I said. Well done for noticing! vvvvv an_mutt fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Apr 15, 2014 |
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Apr 15, 2014 01:22
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an_mutt posted:I'm one of those OG hipsters who can't appreciate how much Brutal Doom fudges around with the original game's balancing. Also yeah, Sgt. Mark is a disgusting racist piece of poo poo with a victim complex who sees any form of criticism of his work as utter jealousy for his success in adding br00tal hardcore real life gore sprite edits to a 20 year old game, then cries once too many people call him a sack of poo poo for telling suicidal people to kill themselves and having BD source code text that refers to turning enemies in to niggers with the plasma rifle. ____________/  I haven't played much of Brutal Doom (like, first 4 levels of Doom Ep1?), kinda fun though! Though if it fucks with the difficulty balance, guess I'm gonna have fun when I replay all the WADs I mentioned in a previous post with it eventually.  Still only on Doom 2 The Way ID Did though as I haven't had much time to play. The early levels in that are kinda boring in places and it seems the secrets are a little too hard to find at times. I DID find the big secret in the second level by total accident though, which is neat.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:28
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I just play RGA2 because modern warfare weapons with buffed up doom enemies is a suprisingly nice way to burn some time.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:28
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I used to think that Brutal Doom's gore was meant to be a tongue-in-cheek parody of 90's-style XTREME violence, but now I think the creator genuinely believes it's unironically badass.
closeted republican fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Apr 15, 2014 |
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Apr 15, 2014 01:43
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Brutal Doom is dogshit.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:53
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Project MSX is my go-to for making maps different and harder, though it makes some ambushes downright impossible. You just can't beat vanilla doom for balance though.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:54
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Well all that stuff about the creator kind of ruins Brutal Doom It's like finding out your favorite ridiculous metal band aren't just treating their songs as epic poo poo a la LOTR, that they actually believe in demons or Odin or whatever.
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Apr 15, 2014 01:57
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Since the subject of Brutal Doom has come up again, I guess this is as good a time as any for this question: Last year, I played version 18 and had a lot of fun with it. I recently tried version 19, and it just seems...well, more brutal is one way of putting it I guess. The whole enemies-crawling-around-slowly-dying thing seems more frequent, which is making me kinda uncomfortable. But I really can't tell if this is just perception changing over the course of a year, or if there is actually a difference between the two versions. On that note, is there any way Brutal Doom allows you to edit the frequency of this? 'Cause I can dig the over-the-top splatterhouse feel of the WAD, but those animations just make me weary.
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Apr 15, 2014 02:17
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Disregarding the creator's personality or opinions (because seriously we don't want to go down the rabbit hole of examining every wad author up close) Brutal Doom is fine for a few hours of fun. It, like every other gameplay mod, would be much more fun if there were levels built around its design. Also, the gore just gets kinda bleh after a while. It's no worse than many other games, but it doesn't fit with Doom. It doesn't make it "Doomier", at least as far as the things about Doom that I enjoy.
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Apr 15, 2014 02:24
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When the gently caress YOURSELF was no longer Danny Glover... that was the moment it all went downhill. (Not to poo poo on the goon who did the voice acting, you just can't beat ol' Danny G)
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Apr 15, 2014 02:47
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Sobatchja Morda posted:But I really can't tell if this is just perception changing over the course of a year, or if there is actually a difference between the two versions. Brutal Doom's changed so many design decisions and reversed its direction so many times I wouldn't be surprised if there actually is a difference. And short of opening the wad yourself and editing it, no. There are no cvars or settings that would allow the player choose the blood amount/frequency/etc etc.
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Apr 15, 2014 02:55
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Sobatchja Morda posted:Thanks to that book, every time I see John Carmack I imagine him battering down doors with his battle axe. Masters of Doom is awesome. I would pay David Kushner so much god drat money to see him do a similar book about 3D Realms. Would love to see just how hosed things got throughout DNF as George Broussard's company just comes crashing down around him. 
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Apr 15, 2014 03:07
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I think Quake is when I learned not to trust pre-release hype. People from id were talking about how you'd be this Thor-like guy flying around the countryside killing demons and sacrificing their heads on altars. Then the game comes out and it's absolutely nothing like that.
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Apr 15, 2014 10:20
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To be fair it probably was that when they talked about it.
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Apr 15, 2014 10:54
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TerminusEst13 posted:To be fair it probably was that when they talked about it. Form what I remember, Quake 1 was basically an overglorified tech demo when Romero was talking about stuff like using a hammer as your only weapon. When they figured out there was zero way they could get the Quake 1 they promised out the door as fast as they wanted, they changed the gameplay to be Doom v2 but kept most of the art they had made for the original design up to that point. That's why you do weird poo poo like gib knights with a rocket launcher and shoot floating wizard snakes with a nail gun. IIRC, QTest was released around they point the team put two or three months into making Quake 1 as we know it.
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Apr 15, 2014 11:04
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Quake as you being Thor-wannabe and wielding a big hammer was an idea Romero had for a while, since it appeared first in a Keen game. http://www.3drealms.com/keenhistory/keenhistory3.html quote:Quake: The Fight For Justice I remember also an interview where Romero explained his idea for Quake's gameplay, and it sounded like it would have been a beat-em-up in 3D instead of a shoot-em-up. It was supposed to be brawls and duels where you'd need to pound on your enemy for a while to win. Really mash them into little bits. Why Romero thought it would be awesome and cool rather than boring and tedious, I have no idea. Early 3D games either had absolutely lovely melee, or controls that would make a flight simulator veteran reach for the aspirin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmP4H01oI14 Honestly, being a game where you jump around with a nailgun and a rocket launcher was the best thing that could happen to Quake.
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Apr 15, 2014 11:40
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TerminusEst13 posted:Brutal Doom's changed so many design decisions and reversed its direction so many times I wouldn't be surprised if there actually is a difference. Ah, well that explains. It's a shame that it will never happen, but the best form of Brutal Doom would just be a set of variables that you'd be allowed to mess with. I'd take the melee (which is awesome, has a nice risk-and-reward mechanic, and stolen wholesale from Space Marine), the splatterhouse blood and gibs, and the taunts. Leave the maiming and most of the weapons. Or just mix it up, depending on the type of WAD. Awesome Welles posted:I would pay David Kushner so much god drat money to see him do a similar book about 3D Realms. Would love to see just how hosed things got throughout DNF as George Broussard's company just comes crashing down around him. Speaking of this, did anyone from 3D Realms ever come forward with some juicy stories? I remember reading about one guy, around DNF's release, who talked about spending over a year working on the same level. Is there any more like that?
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Apr 15, 2014 12:09
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The original Quake sounds neat on paper, but there's no way they could've pulled that off back in the mid 90s. The released Quake 1 is a lot more fun than what was originally planned, even if it was a rush-job just to get something on the market. It's one of the best deathmatch games ever made, even today.
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Apr 15, 2014 12:16
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Awesome Welles posted:I would pay David Kushner so much god drat money to see him do a similar book about 3D Realms. Would love to see just how hosed things got throughout DNF as George Broussard's company just comes crashing down around him. I wonder myself about how many parallels you can draw between Ion Storm/Daikatana and 3D Realms/Duke Forever. Both companies where headed by a huge ego who believed his own hype, and wanted his game to be the most amazing thing ever. The games both went through heavy engine changes, spent way too long in production, and ended up destroying their respective companies. I'm also pretty sure George Broussard would've greenlit a Bitch Ad if Romero hadn't done it first.
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Apr 15, 2014 12:18
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Sobatchja Morda posted:
Here's one I managed to dig up from Duke4: http://forums.duke4.net/topic/6449-former-3d-realms-employee-speaks-out/ quote:Hi everyone I should have posted this long time ago when there was still interest about the game. The fact how the game ended is also a bit of my fault. This is something for me just to feel a bit better.
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Apr 15, 2014 12:35
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 Holy poo poo. That's a terrible way to run any company.Although I did get a laugh out of this: quote:Of course I bought it with the DLCs on steam sale and played it. Does this mean he worked for years on the game, but waited patiently for it to hit the sale before buying it?
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Apr 15, 2014 14:03
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Cat Mattress posted:Quake as you being Thor-wannabe and wielding a big hammer was an idea Romero had for a while, since it appeared first in a Keen game. I remember also an interview where Romero explained his idea for Quake's gameplay, and it sounded like it would have been a beat-em-up in 3D instead of a shoot-em-up. It was supposed to be brawls and duels where you'd need to pound on your enemy for a while to win. Really mash them into little bits. Why Romero thought it would be awesome and cool rather than boring and tedious, I have no idea. Early 3D games either had absolutely lovely melee, or controls that would make a flight simulator veteran reach for the aspirin. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmP4H01oI14 Honestly, being a game where you jump around with a nailgun and a rocket launcher was the best thing that could happen to Quake. [/quote] Man that's what made that early stuff so wonderful. Those ideas sound like something I would come up with when I was 12, and draw cars with guns on them and stuff. Now it's all men in suits and marketing and product design
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Apr 15, 2014 16:12
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I've always hated the "heh PC Master Race :smugface:" but I do get a little pang at the thought of what DNF could have been if not for the hardware. But the #1 problem is that management, Jesus Christ. closeted republican posted:The original Quake sounds neat on paper, but there's no way they could've pulled that off back in the mid 90s. The released Quake 1 is a lot more fun than what was originally planned, even if it was a rush-job just to get something on the market. It's one of the best deathmatch games ever made, even today. The idea I got of the original Quake was that it was going to be a full 3D, action based The Elder Scrolls with location based damage. Which could have worked in the mid-90s. al-azad fucked around with this message at 16:19 on Apr 15, 2014 |
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Apr 15, 2014 16:15
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I stumbled upon All Out War 2 on zandronum yesterday. This is the best team play wad I have ever seen. loving tiberium sun for doom 2. They even have mechwarrior mechs. We should get a huge goon game going.
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Apr 15, 2014 16:53
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As I recall, Hexen 2 is a fair bit more melee-oriented, at least with the class I wound up going with (and I don't remember which that was), so, given it shares an engine, it's a decent approximation of what Quake was gonna end up like. It's okay. I get lost pretty easily, but that's true of Hexen's hub-and-puzzle-based design in general, and presumably wouldn't have applied to Quake itself. I do like how practically everything in the game can be destroyed if you whack it enough times. Tables, chairs, some walls, dead monsters, they all explode quite spectacularly given a bit of prodding.
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Apr 15, 2014 17:25
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Edit: poo poo sorry I'm behind the thread, shoulda checked the page Oh look we're back to bitching about brutal doom GUI posted:I believe it was the original Gears of War for PC failing that soured CliffyB on PC gaming. I recall it bombed pretty terribly because it came out a year after the console version, had a very common savegame corruption bug and it was in the early days of GFWL when the PC client wanted you to pay for multiplayer. I'll never forget UT3 because it had probably the worst bug I've ever encountered in a AAA game release. Entire series of CPUs couldn't play the Onslaught mode or whichever was the really good one with bases and vehicles, because it used a special portal, and the shader for that portal or something to do with its code would reliably blue-screen my computer every single loving time it came up on screen; instant bluescreen. You could play deathmatch or CTF for hours and never have an issue, but as soon as you started up Onslaught, instant BSOD. I've never seen anything like it. I remember waiting like an entire year, going back to their website, and still seeing it listed under "known bugs" or something. What the loving hell Epic games? Fix your poo poo! gently caress them, UT3 sucked balls and deserved to die in a fire. Holy poo poo I remember playing the story mode one time and it was ungodly terribad. Zaphod42 fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Apr 15, 2014 |
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Apr 15, 2014 18:14
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Zaphod42 posted:Edit: poo poo sorry I'm behind the thread, shoulda checked the page Hey, at least it didn't last long! Mostly just people saying why exactly they don't enjoy it when asked.
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Apr 15, 2014 18:35
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Kazvall posted:I stumbled upon All Out War 2 on zandronum yesterday. This is the best team play wad I have ever seen. loving tiberium sun for doom 2. They even have mechwarrior mechs. We should get a huge goon game going.
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Apr 15, 2014 18:37
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That long post about the guy who worked on DNF explains alot on why that game was so terrible. Really it boils down to blaming consoles for alot of the terrible design decisions. I foolishly pre-ordered the game despite knowing it'll be most likely a trainwreck. My god was I ever right, what a huge trainwreck DNF was.
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Apr 15, 2014 18:58
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Sobatchja Morda posted:It's a shame that it will never happen, but the best form of Brutal Doom would just be a set of variables that you'd be allowed to mess with. It could really easily happen, actually. I've done a whole ton of different variables with Samsara and it's even possible to create different settings for different types of blood. GetCvar isn't that complicated. Why Sarge hasn't done it yet...I don't know.
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Apr 15, 2014 19:38
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Zaphod42 posted:gently caress them, UT3 sucked balls and deserved to die in a fire. I really enjoyed the UT3 story mode. Of course, I played it coop with three other people and we were all laughing at how stupid the goddamn plot was, and ended up with the most tense game of CTF I have ever been in when the host accidently played the Instagib card on the second-to-last map. Three minutes later, we're down 0-2. Twenty minutes after that, we win 3-2. It was the best round of UT3 I have ever played. Then the final level came around and it was stupid again.
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Apr 15, 2014 19:47
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TerminusEst13 posted:Why Sarge hasn't done it yet...I don't know. I suspect it's mostly to do with his worldview, but doesn't Brutal Doom also bake a lot more gore into the sprites themselves? That'd be more art assets to do, and more to change every time there's an update.
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Apr 15, 2014 20:19
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Agent Kool-Aid posted:Modeling gibs off of real pictures of dead bodies that have been blown to bits is creepy, yo. In 'Masters of Doom' I think they mention one of the designers looking at car accident pictures for inspiration. Also the newer book about Rockstar isn't nearly as interesting.
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Apr 15, 2014 20:33
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McDowell posted:In 'Masters of Doom' I think they mention one of the designers looking at car accident pictures for inspiration. I think he's referring to the whole debacle of using real photos of dismembered corpses as the gib sprites.
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Apr 15, 2014 20:43
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McDowell posted:In 'Masters of Doom' I think they mention one of the designers looking at car accident pictures for inspiration. Adrian Carmack worked at a hospital and saw a lot of gory poo poo there. A lot of inspiration came from that.
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Apr 15, 2014 20:51
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He specifically worked in a morgue, if I recall correctly.
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Apr 15, 2014 20:55
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