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Noxville
Dec 7, 2003

Kawabata posted:

You kind of overlooked the dozens of posters and several reviews that are complaining about this game being the cheapest Dark Souls.

I don't remember any deaths in this one as cheap as the bit in DS1 where the drake comes from nowhere to toast the bridge, or the first time you encounter a mimic. Neither is remotely predictable.

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y_3
Aug 18, 2010

THE AWESOME GHOST posted:

Everyone else you find Petrified is in an area where you can clearly see what did it. Straid was petrified so long ago whatever did it probably doesn't live there anymore.

But he's an idiot for staying there yeah. The good thing is you can clear out most of the zombies with Arrows without leaving the cell.

Lemon Curdistan posted:

Those mummies explode, they don't petrify!

Oh alright. When they do their thing I see a meter with what looks like a rock icon and when I saw Straid I was like alright, makes sense. But I've never gotten that meter full before dying/killing them so I guess I was wrong.

Cardboard Box
Jul 14, 2009

Noxville posted:

I don't remember any deaths in this one as cheap as the bit in DS1 where the drake comes from nowhere to toast the bridge, or the first time you encounter a mimic. Neither is remotely predictable.

there have been moments where I've felt like it but I think this game probably isn't any more or less cheap than the first Dark Souls or even Demon's Souls. just like those, once you know how to properly handle a situation, it's pretty easy.

El Pollo Blanco
Jun 12, 2013

by sebmojo

scamtank posted:

I don't think so, actually.

If you stand in place after getting up, they don't care about you. This means you can take a shortbow +1 and plug two of them with a wooden arrow each before heading off the last one with a single longsword slash. The rest of the room is trivial.

It's easiest to just buy a bunch of throwing knifes, since you can chuck them without switching weapons, and they're quicker to use than a bow anyway. They also one/two shot a lot of annoying enemies like the exploding mummies.

NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012

Sergeant_Crunch posted:

I still don't understand how someone can fault a video game for being designed like a video game. I would much rather have a decent and fun to play level over realistic level design.

Anor Londo archer bridge was both a fun challenge and cool design. Placing archers out of reach willy-nilly (Looking at you Drangleic Castle) isn't the same.

The problem isn't that maps are designed like a video game, it's how obvious it is this time around.

Ice_Mallet
Feb 22, 2011
I kind of wish there was some way to manage spell slots better. Is there any way to go through slots without just going in one direction?

Also, does cast speed not do anything after a certain amount? I have 60 ATT and putting on equipment that increases cast speed does nothing.

Lemon Curdistan posted:

Those mummies explode, they don't petrify!
I thought they had two explosion attacks, one that just explodes and one that deals some petrify.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009

NihilVerumNisiMors posted:

The fact that maces outperform other weapons as much as they do is an entirely different problem.

The problem is more that all the armoured stuff has slash/pierce resistances that are way too high, making non-blunt weapons not worth using against them. It would be significantly less weird if the game had more blunt weapons, I guess - at least you'd be able to use more weapons against armoured foes, instead of being stuck with having to choose one out of the maybe 8 blunt weapons in the game.

y_3 posted:

Oh alright. When they do their thing I see a meter with what looks like a rock icon and when I saw Straid I was like alright, makes sense. But I've never gotten that meter full before dying/killing them so I guess I was wrong.

Turns out I was wrong, apparently, and there are multiple types of mummies. Who knew!

(Not me, because after the first one blew up in my face, I started sniping them.)

THE PWNER
Sep 7, 2006

by merry exmarx
I've been bothered far less by dying in DS2 vs DS because bonfires are far more numerous. I'd say there's an average of less than 10 enemies between each bonfire. In DS you'd fight for 20 minutes desperately hoping the bonfire was soon, in DS2 I've used 2 estus charges then stumble upon a bonfire and I'm all "really?"

So I don't get why people are gettin' so drat mad and comparing this game to DS like it was any better at not-making-you-mad.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



Xoidanor posted:

There are some remarkably stupidly placed bonfires in this game.

Yeah I don't know why the try to hide some of them. And two of the Brightstone Cove bonfires have enemies right no top of them that aggro almost the second you stand up.

THE AWESOME GHOST
Oct 21, 2005

Oh wait I didn't know those things could petrify either. Huh.

Moongrave
Jun 19, 2004

Finally Living Rent Free

Ice_Mallet posted:

I thought they had two explosion attacks, one that just explodes and one that deals some petrify.

Yellow glowing belly = petrify explosion

Cardboard Box
Jul 14, 2009

THE PWNER posted:

I've been bothered far less by dying in DS2 vs DS because bonfires are far more numerous. I'd say there's an average of less than 10 enemies between each bonfire. In DS you'd fight for 20 minutes desperately hoping the bonfire was soon, in DS2 I've used 2 estus charges then stumble upon a bonfire and I'm all "really?"

So I don't get why people are gettin' so drat mad and comparing this game to DS like it was any better at not-making-you-mad.

yeah in a way I really miss that feeling of desperation that another bonfire will be in the next room. now I can't get mad about getting stuck in a place because I know there'll be another one in ten feet. :v:

Kild
Apr 24, 2010

Manatee Cannon posted:

Yeah I don't know why the try to hide some of them. And two of the Brightstone Cove bonfires have enemies right no top of them that aggro almost the second you stand up.

What? Only the 3rd bonfire should have enemies.

NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012

THE PWNER posted:

I've been bothered far less by dying in DS2 vs DS because bonfires are far more numerous. I'd say there's an average of less than 10 enemies between each bonfire. In DS you'd fight for 20 minutes desperately hoping the bonfire was soon, in DS2 I've used 2 estus charges then stumble upon a bonfire and I'm all "really?"

So I don't get why people are gettin' so drat mad and comparing this game to DS like it was any better at not-making-you-mad.

The amount of bonfires is necessary because the levels mostly don't loop around and there are few shortcuts. You also often can't just run through enemies this time around.

Although I agree that there are still too many in some places. Earthen Peak has one for each level, I mean drat.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009


The name filter will never stop being funny.

THE AWESOME GHOST
Oct 21, 2005

Lemon Curdistan posted:

The problem is more that all the armoured stuff has slash/pierce resistances that are way too high, making non-blunt weapons not worth using against them. It would be significantly less weird if the game had more blunt weapons, I guess - at least you'd be able to use more weapons against armoured foes, instead of being stuck with having to choose one out of the maybe 8 blunt weapons in the game.

Heh look at this guy that doesn't take his Heide sword which already deals lightning damage and make it Lightning so it basically does 0 slash damage. I'm wielding a lightning bolt what of it

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



Kild posted:

What? Only the 3rd bonfire should have enemies.

The first one is in the camp with the villagers and the pigs, the second is safe to the side of a stairwell and the third has a couple spiders. It's not hard to deal with but it is kinda annoying.

NihilVerumNisiMors posted:

The amount of bonfires is necessary because the levels mostly don't loop around and there are few shortcuts. You also often can't just run through enemies this time around.

Although I agree that there are still too many in some places. Earthen Peak has one for each level, I mean drat.

You must not have played Demon's Souls, where the levels were all longer and there were no checkpoints between the beginning and the boss.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

BARONS GAMES WHINER posted:

Yellow glowing belly = petrify explosion
The yellow guys are acid, the gray ones are petrify, and the red ones explode.

e: Maybe the gray ones have a yellow belly, I can't remember, but there are definitely some Yellow Exploding Zombies in Dragon Aerie that drop acid clouds.

NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012

Lemon Curdistan posted:



The name filter will never stop being funny.

It creates swear words where there actually aren't any. Had to stare at this for 10 seconds before realizing that, no, it's actually not an insult. :psyduck:

poptart_fairy
Apr 8, 2009

by R. Guyovich

Tracula posted:

Funny how things change.

Running headfirst at the enemy is far from standing behind them as they load in. :colbert:

yes power does corrupt

THE PWNER
Sep 7, 2006

by merry exmarx

NihilVerumNisiMors posted:

The amount of bonfires is necessary because the levels mostly don't loop around and there are few shortcuts. You also often can't just run through enemies this time around.

Although I agree that there are still too many in some places. Earthen Peak has one for each level, I mean drat.

Yeah I get why they're needed, though I do wish they'd gone for the "main town is seamlessly interconnected to everything oh my god it's so amazing" thing from ds again.

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009

NihilVerumNisiMors posted:

It creates swear words where there actually aren't any. Had to stare at this for 10 seconds before realizing that, no, it's actually not an insult. :psyduck:

Why the gently caress is "ead" filtered? Why, FROM? Why?!

(Unless the dude uses asterisks or was Chosen Undgay or something, I guess. "Ho" is definitely censored.)

Kild
Apr 24, 2010

Manatee Cannon posted:

The first one is in the camp with the villagers and the pigs, the second is safe to the side of a stairwell and the third has a couple spiders. It's not hard to deal with but it is kinda annoying.


You must not have played Demon's Souls, where the levels were all longer and there were no checkpoints between the beginning and the boss.

I've never gotten aggroed on the first bonfire.

NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012

THE PWNER posted:

Yeah I get why they're needed, though I do wish they'd gone for the "main town is seamlessly interconnected to everything oh my god it's so amazing" thing from ds again.

Either that or the Demon's Souls way of just teleporting to areas. The half-and-half approach feels a bit janky.
I still can't wrap my head around the Earthen Peak -> Iron Keep transition, because there is none.

Cardboard Box
Jul 14, 2009

THE PWNER posted:

Yeah I get why they're needed, though I do wish they'd gone for the "main town is seamlessly interconnected to everything oh my god it's so amazing" thing from ds again.

yeah if I have one big complaint about this game it's that the world is just not very well put-together. the first time I played the original Dark Souls I was blown away whenever I found a new shortcut to an area I had been to previously and how all these places were interconnected, but here, not so much.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



One of the villagers was always mad at me and was rushing my position by the time I walked out of the tent.

NihilVerumNisiMors posted:

Either that or the Demon's Souls way of just teleporting to areas. The half-and-half approach feels a bit janky.
I still can't wrap my head around the Earthen Peak -> Iron Keep transition, because there is none.

Again, in Demon's Souls the only checkpoints are after you kill a boss. If this were the Demon's Souls system you'd be walking from the entrance to the Shrine of Amana to the boss to every time you died and the enemies would never despawn. Which worked in that game but does not work here.

Oh yeah and you needed to interact with the checkpoint to get the boss soul and activate the warp point, so if you used a spell or something you had to walk all the way through the last level to get back. Never happened to me but I bet someone somewhere is really upset about that.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

Kild posted:

I've never gotten aggroed on the first bonfire.

It happens in NG+ and startled the poo poo out of me when I wasn't expecting it after burning an Ascetic.

TexMexFoodbaby
Sep 6, 2011

by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

Manatee Cannon posted:

Again, in Demon's Souls the only checkpoints are after you kill a boss. If this were the Demon's Souls system you'd be walking from the entrance to the Shrine of Amana to the boss to every time you died and the enemies would never despawn. Which worked in that game but does not work here.

Yeah but you would have looping shortcuts that would remain after you die. That would be the benefit if they went that route.

NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012

Manatee Cannon posted:

One of the villagers was always mad at me and was rushing my position by the time I walked out of the tent.


Again, in Demon's Souls the only checkpoints are after you kill a boss. If this were the Demon's Souls system you'd be walking from the entrance to the Shrine of Amana to the boss to every time you died and the enemies would never despawn. Which worked in that game but does not work here.

I realize that, it would've required different level design. What I meant specifically was that having self-contained levels ("Earthen Peak" instead of "Harvest Valley -> EP -> Iron Keep" for example) with shortcuts and/or bonfires might have been a better approach. Ultimately I feel like the game is too big to pull of the holistic world design from DaS1.

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005

Is there any way to predict when the smelter demon is about to do his loving out-of-nowhere pulse attack? I had him down to 10% health but got oneshotted by that bullshit.

Even with the set you get from the area + flash sweat + flame quartz ring + small orange burr his fire attacks are still kicking my rear end. gently caress him.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



FauxGateau posted:

Yeah but you would have looping shortcuts that would remain after you die. That would be the benefit if they went that route.

Not every area has a(n intentional) shortcut. Most areas didn't, in fact. If you died, tough poo poo do it all again. Hell, if this were Demon's Souls the Smelter Demon would be a miniboss like the Vanguard was. It's just different, and different is not necessarily worse. It's just different.

Cardboard Box
Jul 14, 2009

ulvir posted:

Is there any way to predict when the smelter demon is about to do his loving out-of-nowhere pulse attack? I had him down to 10% health but got oneshotted by that bullshit.

I only ever saw that move after he did one of his jumping downstabs. sometimes he gets right up, and sometimes he starts to get up and then does that pulse. so I just assumed he was always going to do the pulse and kept my distance when I saw that move.

e: spoilered for boss strats

Cardboard Box fucked around with this message at 13:25 on May 1, 2014

Lemon-Lime
Aug 6, 2009

ulvir posted:

Is there any way to predict when the smelter demon is about to do his loving out-of-nowhere pulse attack? I had him down to 10% health but got oneshotted by that bullshit.

Stand back and don't get near him when his sword is in the ground, instead of trying to get hits in.

If he's going to pull it out, he usually does so pretty fast (after a second or so), so you could tell what he's doing from that, but it's usually too late to get a hit in once you realise which one he's going to do. Just let him be, he'll give you plenty of other openings.

Ice_Mallet
Feb 22, 2011

ulvir posted:

Is there any way to predict when the smelter demon is about to do his loving out-of-nowhere pulse attack? I had him down to 10% health but got oneshotted by that bullshit.

Even with the set you get from the area + flash sweat + flame quartz ring + small orange burr his fire attacks are still kicking my rear end. gently caress him.

I had pretty much the same problem, until I went human and summoned Lucateil.

And then she blocked the Smelter Demon with her face, and I just shot magic from afar.

I think you have to summon her at least once for her sidestory, so you might want to do that.

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005

Cardboard Box posted:

I only ever saw that move after he did one of his jumping downstabs. sometimes he gets right up, and sometimes he starts to get up and then does that pulse. so I just assumed he was always going to do the pulse and kept my distance when I saw that move.

He pulsed between regular strikes and took me by complete surprise. I've already wasted 3 effigies on that fucker, so I think I'm just gonna suck it up and admit that I'm never going to get to utilise that bonfire anytime soon.

Manatee Cannon
Aug 26, 2010



Ice_Mallet posted:

I had pretty much the same problem, until I went human and summoned Lucateil.

And then she blocked the Smelter Demon with her face, and I just shot magic from afar.

I think you have to summon her at least once for her sidestory, so you might want to do that.

You have to summon NPCs three times each to complete their story. If you beat the boss already I think you can use a bonfire ascetic to reset it and it'll still count.

Does bonfire intensity reset in ng+? Or if you set the rat area to +8 for the covenant will it still be +8 when you reset the world?

Ignimbrite
Jan 5, 2010

BALLS BALLS BALLS
Dinosaur Gum
I just had my first invasion, in drangleic castle, I had just gotten past the room with the 3 knights and the giant cursing painting when he shows up; he's in light armour double-handing what looked like a broken longsword or something. We traded blows for a while before I lead him back to the room that backs onto the acid pit and my black knight halberd came out and I splattered him over the walls :getin:

Ignimbrite fucked around with this message at 13:31 on May 1, 2014

Kerc Kasha
Apr 18, 2007

He does it whenever a player is near to him after stabbing the ground. So best way to avoid it? don't go near him after he stabs the ground wait for another opening

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005

Lemon Curdistan posted:

Stand back and don't get near him when his sword is in the ground, instead of trying to get hits in.

If he's going to pull it out, he usually does so pretty fast (after a second or so), so you could tell what he's doing from that, but it's usually too late to get a hit in once you realise which one he's going to do. Just let him be, he'll give you plenty of other openings.

Alright, thanks.

Ice_Mallet posted:

I had pretty much the same problem, until I went human and summoned Lucateil.

And then she blocked the Smelter Demon with her face, and I just shot magic from afar.

I think you have to summon her at least once for her sidestory, so you might want to do that.

I've been summoning Lucatiel at every attempt. First two times she was stuck to a wall and died pretty quickly. I'm also a melee character, and the only thing by way of spells I have is pyromancy, which I have a feeling will be quite useless against him. I've also stacked up Flash Sweat in my only available slot anyways. :shrug:

I hear this rear end in a top hat is optional, so I think I'm gonna let him be for the time being.

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NihilVerumNisiMors
Aug 16, 2012
Easiest way to get lockstones is to ratbro it up, yes?

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