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Simoom posted:I'm pretty sure he owns a boxing gym, and I really hope he dispenses some of his wisdom to amateurs. You monster!
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Apr 29, 2014 02:15
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Simoom posted:I'm pretty sure he owns a boxing gym, and I really hope he dispenses some of his wisdom to amateurs. I want you to go out there and get the ever loving loving hell kicked out of you until you piss and poo poo blood and can't remember your name! That's how you win at boxing.
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Apr 29, 2014 03:49
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Simoom posted:I'm pretty sure he owns a boxing gym, and I really hope he dispenses some of his wisdom to amateurs. Yeah, which is what makes Ippo's strategy so bizarre. It's not like Morikawa doesn't (theoretically) know about the actual sport.
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Apr 29, 2014 05:45
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It's not really bizarre at all. The manga has been hammering at the point that no one boxes like Ippo anymore because it basically destroys the boxer like it did with Kamogawa and Nekota for a while now. Only reason that Ippo can do it is retard strength and a reserve of stamina that runs as deep as the plot needs it to be. It's supposed to be what makes Ippo special but after a while it's gotten a bit tedious.
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Apr 29, 2014 06:55
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Guyver posted:It's not really bizarre at all. The manga has been hammering at the point that no one boxes like Ippo anymore because it basically destroys the boxer like it did with Kamogawa and Nekota for a while now. Only reason that Ippo can do it is retard strength and a reserve of stamina that runs as deep as the plot needs it to be. It's supposed to be what makes Ippo special but after a while it's gotten a bit tedious. I don't know, it doesn't seem like the manga is giving a negative overall impression of Ippo's boxing style, even if it does point out some of its problems. I'm not really seeing any condemnation of Kamogawa's training methods in the comic itself.
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Apr 29, 2014 06:59
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Ytlaya posted:Yeah, which is what makes Ippo's strategy so bizarre. It's not like Morikawa doesn't (theoretically) know about the actual sport. He's probably just got a real bad case of traditionalism. Lamenting that the Dempsy Roll isn't viable anymore all the time, because everyone knows that since it's an older technique it's more pure honest expression of the sport.
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Apr 29, 2014 07:02
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There's some weird things with the way he writes it but all his idiosyncrasies sometimes line up to make a great story. Some of the story arcs are so incredibly good that it's almost bizarre how bad others are. I don't know when his pacing got so wildly thrown off either, it's not like he can't write a convincing build up like he did against Hawk or in the flashback. But I think it's been three or four chapters since a punch has last even touched somebody, which is just getting heinously bad. As for how he intends to portray Ippo's fighting style, I think a lot of it comes down to that big theme of "old school heart/way of the samurai" stuff and the boxing "science". It's a big thing with Takamura, and with Ippo he's directly supposed to inherit the Coach's will when he never had a chance to actually box because he broke his hands in the stupidest way possible.
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Apr 29, 2014 13:28
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Re: Morikawa runs a boxing gym:quote:Morikawa-sensei is a part time corner man for pro boxers So yeah  that second quote explains the Woli (who was from the Philippines IIRC) travesty too. Mori was cornerman for someone who ended up fighting a Filipino and it must have been a crazy match because then he went and did the same matchup in HNI. I guess it's harder to notice that the fight sucks for Mori if he was trying to recreate something he experienced IRL?And I guess that could be a reasonable explanation for some horrendous matches as well? Perhaps Mori had recently seen a match that was started out as a starefest and then closed in one punch when he wrote *that* fight? Bisse fucked around with this message at 13:33 on Apr 29, 2014 |
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Apr 29, 2014 13:31
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What's really sad is reading the 1st 40 or so chapters again and realizing that the pacing was awesome for those and you just wonder when it went off the rails.
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Apr 29, 2014 14:09
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Breaky posted:What's really sad is reading the 1st 40 or so chapters again and realizing that the pacing was awesome for those and you just wonder when it went off the rails. Sometime after the 400th chapter lol There were decent fights after that (Eagle, Sawamura, Randy Boy Jr sort of, Volg's world title match) but still it's been a looooong time since then
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Apr 29, 2014 14:14
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tbp posted:Sometime after the 400th chapter lol Oh yeah, definitely, even with the slower pacing the fights could be really good just that in the original arc or two you would routinely see Ippo fighting a single match, doing some character development after, maybe start working on something new. Seem's like lots of the earlier fights were 1-2 chapters long at most and that was with a lot of outside the ring content thrown in.
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Apr 29, 2014 14:16
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Breaky posted:Oh yeah, definitely, even with the slower pacing the fights could be really good just that in the original arc or two you would routinely see Ippo fighting a single match, doing some character development after, maybe start working on something new. Seem's like lots of the earlier fights were 1-2 chapters long at most and that was with a lot of outside the ring content thrown in. Yeah, to be fair the outside the ring stuff was and still sort of is pretty good especially the comedy. HJI is a very funny story at times, I still crack up at the Geromichi joke when Aoki says he isn't sure how he got that name.
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Apr 29, 2014 14:51
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honestly the best way to read this series is to wait half a year, then catch up, then forget about it and read them all in bunches. Kinda like the Hueco Mundo arc in Bleach
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Apr 29, 2014 17:33
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trucutru posted:There is a new chapter in the usual places and Ippo has finally learned to... do exactly the same poo poo he always does, that's the way to victory because it is the invincible path. This is from the last page, sorry about that, but the raws are actually up to chapter 1055. I don't read a word of Japanese, but looks like he decides to try new stuff soon, or it's just the usual "Ippo gets the upper hand because the other guy just randomly decides to fight like an idiot" thing. Edit: Still think Ippo's supposed to be based on Marciano, who took a huge amount of punishment in a lot of his fights yet came out of his career pretty okay. Mostly in how his success was based a lot on monstrous punching power and simply having greater stamina and ability to recover from damage than the people he fought, though even he had better defence than Ippo; it'd be a lot more interesting if Morikawa'd make up his loving mind about if this guy knows how to actually box or not. Flesnolk fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Apr 30, 2014 |
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Apr 30, 2014 04:04
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So once Rising finished I started reading the manga, starting at the Hawk fight just 'cause my friend told me there wasn't really anything cut out in the anime until Rising. I'm about 5 chapters into the Woli fight. Thought I'd give some thoughts as someone who just read 500 chapters in about 2 weeks. The Hawk fight was missing a little something in the anime, I felt. I couldn't tell you what, but it just seemed right in the manga. Shimabukuro was fine in both. Aoki vs Imae was great in both versions and it makes me sad he and Kimura have only gotten one serious fight each. Sawamura was a little better in the manga and obviously one of the best fights so far. I honestly felt like the flashback arc was better in the anime just because of the way it was able to convey Nekota's speed and the intensity of Kamogawa's last punch. Itagaki vs Makino and Ippo vs Karasawa both served basically the same purpose but I was a little disappointed that Makino was brushed aside so easily. Itagaki vs Imai was awesome and I like Imai as a character so I'm glad he's popped up a couple times since the fight. Ippo vs Take dragged a bit but I thought the dynamic of Ippo fighting a tricky old veteran was cool since the oldest fighter he'd ever faced was Date, who, while experienced, was still a hothead. Itagaki and Takamura's fights since then have all been onesided beatdowns or joke matches so I don't really have any opinions on them. Ippo vs Jimmy was decent, Ippo vs Gedo was... okay, but dragged out even more than Take. There was a solid 7 or 8 chapters where basically nothing happened. If that middle section with Ippo being confounded by the glove thing was shortened up into a montage or something where 3 rounds pass in a single chapter it would have been so much more bearable. I know the Woli fight is pretty universally hated so we'll see how that goes. Miyata vs Randy was really good. It was long, and I won't say it didn't feel long, but I really dug it. Mashiba vs Sawamura... god drat. Just... man. When they finally get around to a fourth season of the anime I really don't care how much between-match stuff they have to cut if it means fitting this fight in at the end. Other thoughts: I was told Itagaki gets annoying because he's a genius at everything and it feels like he's being forced into the spotlight to seem cooler than he is but... I dunno, I kinda don't mind. I think all his speedforce zen state shenanigans are pretty fun. I also really like his bizarre friendship with Mashiba, which isn't a pairing I ever expected. Ippo's obsession with Miyata reaches new levels of "dude get over it" after awhile and I kinda don't care about their rivalry anymore. Still hate Team Aoki, still love Sendo, I fully expect every match of Kimura and Aoki's for the rest of the series to be Papaya and Eleki rematches. It's kind of a shame all the featherweight rivals are moving around in weight classes, though I'm hoping as a result we at least see a Miyata vs Volg match at some point just because that would be awesome. So yeah. I really like Hajime no Ippo. It's totally a potato chip series, where I can just keep going and going and going, which I don't normally do with most manga or anime.
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May 6, 2014 16:40
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WhiffleballDude posted:So yeah. I really like Hajime no Ippo. It's totally a potato chip series, where I can just keep going and going and going, which I don't normally do with most manga or anime. And the stare-fest fight.
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May 6, 2014 16:53
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Bisse posted:Please give us a status report after the Woli fight. Woli is enough to break any man, no need to add the stare one to it.
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May 7, 2014 03:16
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The stare-fest isn't awful but it's a head scratcher because there's not a lot of point to it since we don't really see any progression; it's literally a long version of Ippo's title defense before the Hawk fight. Like no point, Ippo teabags the dude but he COULD have instantly lost.
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May 8, 2014 03:59
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Finished the Woli fight. Gonna be honest, not sure what the big issue is. It's not great or anything, it has the same problems as the Gedo fight with a large chunk of it basically having nothing happen while Ippo gets his rear end kicked, and the way Woli loses his advantage is loving stupid, but it wasn't all that terrible. Probably unbearable to read when it's not all out there already but it seems like that's been the case for like 10 years with this series so w/e.
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May 8, 2014 18:36
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WhiffleballDude posted:Finished the Woli fight. Gonna be honest, not sure what the big issue is. It's not great or anything, it has the same problems as the Gedo fight with a large chunk of it basically having nothing happen while Ippo gets his rear end kicked, and the way Woli loses his advantage is loving stupid, but it wasn't all that terrible. Probably unbearable to read when it's not all out there already but it seems like that's been the case for like 10 years with this series so w/e. That's the problem. Over the last few years it's gone from weekly releases to a few all at once and then none for a few weeks. It's annoying as gently caress when you get 5 chapters at once and it encompasses like half of one round of a fight with an opponent who you think is stupid and that literally no one gives a poo poo about.
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May 8, 2014 20:03
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WhiffleballDude posted:Finished the Woli fight. Gonna be honest, not sure what the big issue is. It's not great or anything, it has the same problems as the Gedo fight with a large chunk of it basically having nothing happen while Ippo gets his rear end kicked, and the way Woli loses his advantage is loving stupid, but it wasn't all that terrible. Probably unbearable to read when it's not all out there already but it seems like that's been the case for like 10 years with this series so w/e. Dunno, I like my boxing manga to be about boxing, not whatever the gently caress was it that Woli was doing in the ring. Having a monkey-man is kinda offensive but then having him monkey-box is dumb as gently caress.
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May 8, 2014 21:54
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WhiffleballDude posted:Finished the Woli fight. Gonna be honest, not sure what the big issue is. It's not great or anything, it has the same problems as the Gedo fight with a large chunk of it basically having nothing happen while Ippo gets his rear end kicked, and the way Woli loses his advantage is loving stupid, but it wasn't all that terrible. Probably unbearable to read when it's not all out there already but it seems like that's been the case for like 10 years with this series so w/e. - Racist stereotype monkey man - ...jumping around on the ropes and doing pretty much impossible punches because vat a genius - ...for 25 chapters - ...while never getting hit, as if reactions, positioning, momentum, and physically intersecting the travel path of the opponents fists, do not matter. - Light taps that leave a fist mark - ...the ONE INCH PUNCH! (Which will never be used ever again) - Ippo "The Punching Bag" Makunochi with his unique "Block the opponents fist with my face" fighting style - ...and taking no lasting damage whatsoever and regenerating it all between each round. - Coach's amazing coaching. 'Your strategy of "charging in like a dumbfuck and getting punched" isn't working! My advice is... keep doing it! Eventually it HAS to work' There is a reason (or well, lots of them) it's panned as the worst fight in the series.
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May 8, 2014 22:04
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Bisse posted:So you liked: - He just reminded me of Goku to be perfectly honest. - Do "impossible punches" include Flicker Jabs because those seem pretty not possible as well. - I said that was a problem - This series distorts time in every fight, distorting space once in awhile is hardly a noteworthy offense. - I freely admit that is probably the stupidest single aspect of any fight so far. - Don't even remember that part - I'm... not sure what you're getting at here? That's literally his style. I can recall a grand total of 4 fights where he didn't get the absolute poo poo beat out of him, two of which were Ponchai and Yi Yonsu who were just no-name jerkoffs. - There's a difference between regenerating damage and having an inhuman stamina reserve and tolerance for damage, which Ippo has demonstrated multiple times. - Kamogawa's uselessness is shown in pretty much every difficult fight Ippo and Takamura have so it's not exactly a new thing but yes this instance was a little more irritating than the rest. I never said I liked the fight. I just said I didn't hate it.
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May 9, 2014 06:37
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To be fair, some of these things are present in all the fights. It's just that this fight had all of them, at the same time, and so much more, and pushed them all to the max. This fight is, for example, by far the worst case of Ippo "Fist Magnet" "King of Dodg-oh wait" "Faceful-o-fists" "Unique fighting style" Makunouchi. In literally no other fight does he take so many blows directly to the head for so long. And the of course no lasting damage from them at all. I mean usually I can tolerate it and relate it to real boxers even but this was just too much, beyond the realms of plausibility. I don't think he blocked a single punch ever throughout the entire fight. (Except for with his face) Not saying you have to hate, just saying why i Do hate it. Bisse fucked around with this message at 11:51 on May 9, 2014 |
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May 9, 2014 07:15
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To me the main problem with that shitastic fight is that Ippo was so outmatched that his goal was just to tap Woli. And then, somehow, that's all he needed! Because Ippo doesn't even need to hit you hard to destroy your rear end, just the gentle touch of his virginal fists causes all kinds of internal damage.
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May 9, 2014 07:59
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trucutru posted:To me the main problem with that shitastic fight is that Ippo was so outmatched that his goal was just to tap Woli. And then, somehow, that's all he needed! Because Ippo doesn't even need to hit you hard to destroy your rear end, just the gentle touch of his virginal fists causes all kinds of internal damage.
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May 9, 2014 10:13
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I'm angry. Angry about comics!
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May 9, 2014 10:15
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WhiffleballDude posted:- Do "impossible punches" include Flicker Jabs because those seem pretty not possible as well. It was more apparent before the manga started going more towards the DBZ side of things, but those and Mashiba's whole style are supposed to be based off Thomas "Hitman" Hearns, so yeah, they're pretty possible.
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May 9, 2014 11:21
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The Woli fight was also annoying because EVERY hit he got looked like a game changer. He kept drawing that stupid loving reaction shot, where Woli looks sublimely disinterested and at ease and Ippo looks like he just went unconscious. There was dozens of these, it was getting insane. It was also a bit frustrating because it's like he's made no progress whatsoever, you have to remember he's essentially been at the same level from like chapter.. I want to say 250 when he beat Sendo for the title all the way until he got to this most recent fight. It's his first step up in hundreds and hundreds of chapters, and Woli was toward the end of that incredibly slog, so idk and the coach said Woli would become infinitely better after that match haha
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May 9, 2014 11:45
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tbp posted:and the coach said Woli would become infinitely better after that match haha Unless it's a mirror of the latest Itagaki fight 
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May 9, 2014 11:54
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I've gott to say it's an interesting hole moro dug himself into because Ippo fans were captured but the fact that he's the underdog getting beat but the story should have progressed beyond that after like Sanada. The ebb and flow of fights should have been starting to change to Ippo becoming dominant like Takamura but then that would then the pace would change and the manga would have ended and no more cash for basically making GBS threads out lead up and the same fight over and over again.
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May 9, 2014 12:08
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KidDynamite posted:I've gott to say it's an interesting hole moro dug himself into because Ippo fans were captured but the fact that he's the underdog getting beat but the story should have progressed beyond that after like Sanada. The ebb and flow of fights should have been starting to change to Ippo becoming dominant like Takamura but then that would then the pace would change and the manga would have ended and no more cash for basically making GBS threads out lead up and the same fight over and over again.
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May 9, 2014 12:53
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You guys are gonna poo poo a brick when it's revealed everything from the Sisfa fight onwards is all in Ippo's head and he's been in a coma for a couple hundred chapters.
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May 9, 2014 12:58
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I miss when Ippo was doing actual crippling damage to his opponents. Remember for a while where everyone who fought him was literally leaving the ring with broken eyesockets, broken/cracked ribs, concussions, etc?
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May 9, 2014 13:26
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Fabricated posted:I miss when Ippo was doing actual crippling damage to his opponents. Pretty sure he's retired more boxers than Mashiba, the "God of death".
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May 9, 2014 16:19
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So I finished the next 3 fights after Woli. Itagaki vs Karasawa was pretty standard, though that ending sequence where Itagaki goes nuts with the lefts was pretty awesome. I really like this obsessively competitive side of Itagaki. Ippo vs Kojima was interesting, and despite there only being two punches in the entire match they were both really really loving good looking. Itagaki vs Saeki was goddamn incredible and I love that they both just basically enter the speedforce. I think that's officially my 3rd favorite fight, behind Ippo/Date and Mashiba/Sawamura. Also that bit with Takamura and all the featherweights in a bar fight was the best.
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May 10, 2014 07:09
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You are going to love the next Itagaki fight 
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May 10, 2014 10:10
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WhiffleballDude posted:Itagaki vs Saeki was goddamn incredible and I love that they both just basically enter the speedforce. I think that's officially my 3rd favorite fight, behind Ippo/Date and Mashiba/Sawamura. Ugh really? Man that one was just all "Car analogies!" and "I think he has another gear" "look at him change lanes without looking" It was like guest written by the dude from Initial D or something.
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May 10, 2014 14:58
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Breaky posted:Ugh really? Man that one was just all "Car analogies!" and "I think he has another gear" "look at him change lanes without looking" It was like guest written by the dude from Initial D or something. Hell I barely noticed. Didn't bother me at all. I was too busy watching Barry Allen fight Wally West.
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May 10, 2014 15:09
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Woli also is less annoying when you view it as a tribute to Harimau from Ashita no Joe. It doesn't make it good, but makes it less "why does it even exist".
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May 11, 2014 13:16
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