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FourLeaf posted:One of my good friends is ranting on Facebook about how the Civil War wasn't actually about slavery and how Robert E. Lee was really a cool person (because it's Confederate History Day or something?). This is really upsetting me (the perils of having white friends i guess). I don't even know what to say. So disappointing. There was a post about this a few pages back? Or was it the Freep thread? Somebody help me out here. The post owned. I wish I could conjour it up for you. What you have to ask yourself is, why is he/she a good friend of yours at this point?
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May 13, 2014 04:08
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Warchicken posted:The student loan bubble will burst when millions upon millions of people can't pay their student loans and just stop giving even a hint of a gently caress about it, right? Won't the banks start garnishing the wages of like 50 percent of the entire country at once at that point? How exactly can we expect that to play out? This is why lots of people want to emigrate. If you've got a doctorate there are jobs overseas for English-speakers, especially in southeast Asian universities. That's my plan when I get my PhD. I could probably make more money playing guitar in wedding bands than as an adjunct, which is pretty hosed up.
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May 13, 2014 04:09
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Pohl posted:There was a post about this a few pages back? Or was it the Freep thread? Here you go
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May 13, 2014 04:09
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FourLeaf posted:One of my good friends is ranting on Facebook about how the Civil War wasn't actually about slavery and how Robert E. Lee was really a cool person (because it's Confederate History Day or something?). This is really upsetting me (the perils of having white friends i guess). I don't even know what to say. So disappointing. Post this paragraph. Declaration of the Immediate Causes Which Induce and Justify the Secession of South Carolina from the Federal Union posted:We affirm that these ends for which this Government was instituted have been defeated, and the Government itself has been made destructive of them by the action of the non-slaveholding States. Those States have assume the right of deciding upon the propriety of our domestic institutions; and have denied the rights of property established in fifteen of the States and recognized by the Constitution; they have denounced as sinful the institution of slavery; they have permitted open establishment among them of societies, whose avowed object is to disturb the peace and to eloign the property of the citizens of other States. They have encouraged and assisted thousands of our slaves to leave their homes; and those who remain, have been incited by emissaries, books and pictures to servile insurrection. Then link to the rest of it, because it's just paragraph on paragraph bitching about how the North says mean things about slavery and how they don't just hand black people over to every Southerner who walks in and says so-and-so is my runaway slave. http://avalon.law.yale.edu/19th_century/csa_scarsec.asp
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May 13, 2014 04:10
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Pohl posted:There was a post about this a few pages back? Or was it the Freep thread? JonathonSpectre posted:This poo poo drives me loving bananas. For years and years and years when I would hear that "War of Northern Aggression" poo poo I would just ask, "So, uh, who started the actual shooting part of the war?" and watch them tie themselves in knots trying to explain how it was really all Lincoln's fault. But then I read, on this very forum, the perfect comeback, which I have used every time since I read it and which I could not possibly love any more.  e:f,b
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May 13, 2014 04:11
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I love you. And Magres, too!
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May 13, 2014 04:11
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VitalSigns posted:Post this paragraph.
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May 13, 2014 04:12
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Expect backtracking and obfuscation about how they were just using pro-slavery rhetoric as economic populism and their real intentions were states rights and individual liberty which would eventually be extended to blacks. Why yes, I have had this argument under similar circumstances before.
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May 13, 2014 04:13
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Nessus posted:It's funny how so much of that is basically "they used THEIR freedom to hurt OUR feelings!" Some things don't change, I suppose. Also "we were supposed to be sovereign and independent states but also they have to enforce our slave laws!"
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May 13, 2014 04:17
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Thanks guys.  I made the post; we'll see what she says.
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May 13, 2014 04:31
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My best guess is that she won't trust "some website on the internet", and'll assume its contents are either fake or irrelevant. But I'm really dang curious what actually happens, so, yeah. Please fill us in if appropriate.
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May 13, 2014 04:39
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Stultus Maximus posted:Also "we were supposed to be sovereign and independent states but also they have to enforce our slave laws!" Yeah this. Ask where's the States' Rights in federal troops marching into Boston and taking black people back into bondage.  My favorite part of the Confederate Constitution is that States weren't allowed to ban slavery Constitution of the Confederate States of America posted:Article I Section 9(4) States have the RIGHT to shut the gently caress up and let me have slaves.
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May 13, 2014 04:40
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FourLeaf posted:One of my good friends is ranting on Facebook about how the Civil War wasn't actually about slavery and how Robert E. Lee was really a cool person (because it's Confederate History Day or something?). This is really upsetting me (the perils of having white friends i guess). I don't even know what to say. So disappointing. If you live outside the South don't talk politics with this person, and if that puts your relationship in jeopardy then sever? If you live in the South my condolences
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May 13, 2014 04:59
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FourLeaf posted:Thanks guys. If it's something other than "you're siding with the Yankee lib secularists who hate God and NASCAR," I'll be pleasantly surprised. icantfindaname posted:If you live in the South my condolences I'm in the blue island of Athens; we're not all like that.
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May 13, 2014 05:00
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Ghost of Reagan Past posted:It's gonna blow up soon because the ability to pay back these loans is going to collapse as good-paying jobs continue to disappear. I can probably make more money at Starbucks than as an adjunct. And by probably I mean definitely. But god damnit I want to play opera and orchestral music and teach music, and if I'm gonna do something to pay back my loans that I used to get music degrees it's gonna be music, and if it can't be music then I'll just move to Europe and send them a picture of my rear end in a top hat on the way out of the country because they're the ones creating every part of the situation.
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May 13, 2014 05:01
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It's nice to see that the BLM might be charging these moronic assholes: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/charges-utah-atv-protest-riders-23685634
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May 13, 2014 05:19
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She... she backed down and said "Well, I guess I learned something today"! There is hope!  (but to be fair she is generally very liberal. I know her parents are extremely conservative though so that's probably where it came from).
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May 13, 2014 05:22
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FourLeaf posted:She... she backed down and said "Well, I guess I learned something today"! Just like a Liberal to back down. 
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May 13, 2014 05:25
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icantfindaname posted:If you live in the South my condolences I drive by the South Carolina statehouse every drat weekday. You know, the one that flies the loving Confederate flag at full mast alongside the stars and stripes. 
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May 13, 2014 05:28
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Warchicken posted:I can probably make more money at Starbucks than as an adjunct. And by probably I mean definitely. But god damnit I want to play opera and orchestral music and teach music, and if I'm gonna do something to pay back my loans that I used to get music degrees it's gonna be music, and if it can't be music then I'll just move to Europe and send them a picture of my rear end in a top hat on the way out of the country because they're the ones creating every part of the situation. Best of luck to you. I tried for a solid decade to make a decent living as a musician, although with only a bachelor's in violin performance. I did the normal playing gigs and teaching lessons thing, and then branched into music production, sound engineering, arrangement writing, and even less musically-related things like sound-for-picture and foley. Anything to pay the bills. I didn't require a day job flipping burgers or hawking electronics, so compared to my musical peers I was wildly successful. Eventually though, I chose to throw in the towel and go back to school for engineering. This country is not kind to musicians. This is why I am so single-mindedly obsessed with early retirement and building and maintaining health. I'm trying to build a future for myself where I have all the money I need, and the health required to live a long time to enjoy it, so I can get back to playing and writing music all the time, as God intended me to do, without the stupid and corrupting obstacle of money. But by all means, god speed to you.
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May 13, 2014 05:45
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FourLeaf posted:She... she backed down and said "Well, I guess I learned something today"! Oh, good news then.
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May 13, 2014 06:20
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fade5 posted:Agreed, and good to see you here dude. Thanks for all the positive responses guys, I'm surprised so many people recognized me. Thank you. SedanChair posted:That's awesome! Your write-ups were really good as well, I am always down to read more of them. That thread was on the whole a really positive experience for me. Recieving so much empathetic feedback, in combination with what I was experiencing at the Haven, really contributed to a pretty dramatic overhaul of my view on life. I'm really upbeat about life and the future of the human race now, despite all the unpleasantness in the world.  If you all will indulge me here,(I mean anything to get off the suicide derail) I'll give a bit of an explanation with what happened with that thread. I want to emphasize that I view the entire thing as a net positive experience. But yeah, there was some stuff that happened, and in some ways I had a relapse. A relapse I am really grateful for that taught me a shitload. Allow me to explain. So I have a bit of a thing with being successful at something. It terrifies me. Especially when I am successful at doing something I am really passionate about. I've never maintained a successful effort for long, and I had chalked that all up to being Bi-Polar.(What with the whole mania/deppression cycle) As it turned out, its a bit more complicated than that, and my triggers aren't only what I thought they were at the time. So the interest in the thread and all the positive attention caused an onset of what I recognized as one of my really severe anxiety attacks where I basically shutdown for literally days. I avoided a full onset because I recognized my early symptoms, and on my doctors advice I walked away from the thread. It hurt doing that, and I felt some guilt about just disappearing, but I figured you guys would understand. Anywho I got past the whole anxiety attack thing far better than I have in the past, mostly because of early detection. So that was nice. But the real thing that got to me was that it had happened at all. You see, I'm at heart a very success driven person, and all along through my recovery one of the reasons I worked so hard at it was because I really believed that with the combination of all the therapy and now the meds I would not have these sorts of crashes anymore when something starting to be successful. I don't think I had really admitted it to myself at the time, but deep down I still really believed that I was going to somehow find a way to basically be not mentally ill, or at least not significantly impaired by my illness. I still wanted nothing more than financial independence/to fulfill a meaningful role in society and I couldn't do that if I was laying in bed unable to function because something so seemingly paltry (mind you, I don't now think this way at all) as a successful thread on a message board could overwhelm me. I was now forced to concede that simply wasn't true. It was an extremely bitter pill to swallow. A definite ashes in mouth moment. And it went a bit downhill from there. The frustration and disappointment made me go manic, which when I realized I hadn't slept in oer three days, was a double whammy, because that was another thing I had thought the medication would be able to eliminate/substantially mitigate. This, in conjunction with some personal events playing out, turned out to be really stressful, and I more or less experienced a quick greater hits of various other symptoms I had presumed gone/fixed. To make a long story short it culminated a few months in me committing myself due to some really serious suicidal idealization. This isn't as dreary/depressing as it sounds. For the first time in my life I had help available. The staff at Haven really went out of the way to do what they could for me, and I had professional help and counseling available every step of the way. This was in many ways an enormous relief to me. I've certainly crashed spectacularly before, but this time there was no one that got hurt by it. No one was depending on me, no matter what I knew I still had food/shelter, which was an immense relief. In the past I've tried to tough out a couple big collapses (pre-developing suicidal thoughts) on willpower alone and it made a miserable experience agonizing. So this time nothing I felt was irreplaceable at risk and I didn't feel immense shame. I just felt really frustrated, and discouraged. Very discouraged. In the end being committed wound up being more boring than anything else. (Longest 36 hours of my life by a pretty wide margin, which is saying something.) I was released pretty quickly after some adjustments were made to my medication. I can't really say where along the way it started to happen, but over time I came to grips with the fact that deep underneath I was still holding onto alot of ideas about the world that simply were not true. I had to let them go. Mental Illness or not, there were ways I had of thinking/looking at things that were just simply unhealthy, and prevented me from really ever accepting myself unless I was either great or on my to being great. It isn't something I necessarily could have described well at the time, but I just started examining everything really deeply and learning to rethink the way I thought about my really basic ideas about life. Its funny how things from young childhood can impact and cling to you(I once saw a man whom had done 12 years in Federal Prison break down in tears while discussing his mother literally rejecting him when he was young.) Things that aren't even particularly dramatic, just part of the background noise, can really etch deeply into the way you see the world and your place in it. For me, I was raised and educated k-9 in an A.C.E. school that my family was also heavily involved with in a variety of capacities over the years. Or to put it more simply, I was raised in a Freep-flavored quasi-cult. Accelerated Christian Education (or A.C.E) is the Mt. Gox of racist southern christian curriculum's that came out in the wake of school integration. It only succeeded because it was first. Imagine if Freepers designed a school. No, I mean that literally. Basically, after forced school integration became a thing there was a big race to release a curriculum that could be used by church's to set up My loving actual "Social Studies" (which is less subject, more propaganda) textbook posted:Although white businessmen and developers are guilty of some unfair treatment of blacks, they turned South Africa into a modern industrialized nation, which the poor, uneducated blacks couldn't have accomplished in several more decades. If more blacks were suddenly given control of the nation, its economy and business, as Mandela wished, they could have destroyed what they have waited and worked so hard for. Also this video, wherein the 9th grade World History introductory workbook is read aloud. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_2tCMlHEBI So yeah, that was pretty much my education up until the 8th grade. Well, that and an unhealthy dose of Rush Limbaugh. I was fortunate that I managed to talk my parents into letting me enroll into a "secular" school in my Freshman year. In many ways I have been trying to grow beyond and heal from what I experienced k-8. I have rethought my worldview several times over my life, and each time I've rejected/replaced things that I had learned as a child. Beliefs that I never reasoned myself into, just accepted because they were taught to me as a child. The reason I bring this all up is that there were two really fundamental ideas I had never in my life I had ever re-examined before. The first was that I viewed myself as inherently "other" in relation to the world. The second was that the world was teetering on some sort of apocalypse. From the time I could talk I had been told to "Be in the world but not of it". To view myself as having an adversarial relationship with every human whom isn't "christian". I was taught to envision the hostile world as being endlessly jealous of me and seeking to do me personal harm in any way it could. There were only a tiny sliver of people whom would ever be trustworthy, everyone else was either "lost" and it was our job to "save" them, or they were too far gone/demon-possessed/evil/atheist/whatever and would try to thwart us at every turn, even if they didn't do it consciously, because they were deceived the Satan was really the one making all the decisions in their life. On top of this my family was viewed by the As a result I was otherized by the other students with a quasi sanction from their The rapture was also kind of a big thing. A really, really, really important, and totally really imminent, big thing that was gonna happen any day now. It was a pretty frequent thing that during morning worship the Pastor would, in his cheery and bubbly way, say something like "Wouldn't it be great if we all died today and went up to see Jesus". I heard variations on that from the time I was five years old. When we spoke of what we wanted to do when we grew up it was often in the context of "If the world still exists by then", which is probably why there were girl students whom literally graduated early at 16 so that they could get married and have children. (Because if they didn't hurry they might never get the chance to experience motherhood, because rapture). I just always accepted that the world was going to end. As my schizophrenia set in over the years the idea that I had some special role to play set in, and at times I was here to be a leader in the ultimate battle between heaven and hell, other times I was here to help raise the vibration of the planet, then finally by the time I got to the Haven I was here to try and prevent the Illuminati takeover of this planet. When I got on medication and started therapy the special role idea went away but the fatalism did not because well, Republicans. Which brings me to why I initially started what has become a really long post. The depressed atmosphere that sometimes descends on this thread. I found something that works for me. I have no idea if its true or not, but I don't care, it works for me. There was no real sort of "Aha!" moment but I learned to accept that I am a fully normal expression of human diversity. I am in no meaningful way different from anyone else ever. I also view my life now in the context that looking back, understanding what I do now of the conditions that I had no or little control of, I actually did allright. I made plenty of mistakes yeah, I've done some rotten things to people that didn't deserve it, and I've not always tried as hard as I could have. But on the balance, I accomplished alot of things that were difficult milestones in their own way, I helped people along my way when I could, and I never stopped trying to go forwards. Though there are times where it looked like I was careening backwards away from progress I had made, (my libertarian period springs to mind) I'm satisfied with what I've done in life and could call it a full life if it stopped here. But I want more time and there are a few things I'm really excited about trying to do. I take a similar tack with America at this point. Its easy to get angry at our country. We were taught to believe we were the best by default, and then we see so many other countries getting things like Universal Healthcare. It gets even worse when you consider how far away we are from really getting something like Universal Health care because well, Republicans. Its enough to drive a main to drink and despair. To me though that isn't the whole story. America has 400 years of being the largest global honeypot for greedy, ambitious people. For fucks sake half of Jamestown starved its first winter because they were a bunch of captains of industry who wouldn't loving work. Our country has been actively advertised to the greediest people the world had since Europe started to colonize us. A fact that has never once changed in our entire history and has shaped our culture. We are arguably the greatest per-capita concentration of greedy assholes the human race has ever seen. When I think about how despite that, look at all our people have accomplished and look at how hard we have worked to move things forwards, I feel really hopeful for our future. gently caress if I know if I'm right, but it works for me. I'm happier than I can ever remember being. Prester Jane fucked around with this message at 16:29 on May 13, 2014 |
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May 13, 2014 06:41
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quote:Although white businessmen and developers are guilty of some unfair treatment of blacks, they turned South Africa into a modern industrialized nation, which the poor, uneducated blacks couldn't have accomplished in several more decades. If more blacks were suddenly given control of the nation, its economy and business, as Mandela wished, they could have destroyed what they have waited and worked so hard for. Oh this makes me absolutely livid. Not allowing workers to have their families live within a few hundred miles of them, bulldozing entire neighborhoods and exiling the inhabitants to replace them with white surburbs, gunning down unarmed students. You know, some unfair treatment. Plus the whole "well see, we denied them an education, and look how uneducated they are, just goes to show they can't be trusted to run a country". Er anyway. Thanks for the rest of your story. I'm sorry all that crazy-religious stuff got forced on you. I'm glad that at least my dad didn't get Born Again and start getting into all the Evolution is a Lie and Satan is Real stuff until my sister and I were at the end of high school.
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May 13, 2014 06:55
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ShadowCatboy posted:Fun news from the Bundy Ranch. I will never get sick of this story and I hope these militia dudes stay forever. I hope they descend into a cross-faction shootout so I can make snarky jokes like "if only Obama hadn't outlawed guns in Nevada". I am sustained by schadenfruede. Justus posted:without the stupid and corrupting obstacle of money. This is the most annoying thing about our loving capitalist society. You have to have your real job, plus learn a bunch of poo poo about money so you don't go broke (or get scammed) and become homeless. You have to have 2+ jobs really. got any sevens fucked around with this message at 07:15 on May 13, 2014 |
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May 13, 2014 07:02
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Prester John, I can't thank you enough for writing about your experiences here. Despite some of the content being really downer, it was a really uplifting read. I'm so glad you're doing great I'm going to try and keep some of the things you said in mind when I hit a rough spot.
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May 13, 2014 08:14
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effectual posted:I hope they descend into a cross-faction shootout so I can make snarky jokes like "if only Obama hadn't outlawed guns in Nevada". Or three jobs if you need a job outside of what you really care about.
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May 13, 2014 08:26
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I support Obama and the Dems 110% and all, but poo poo like this really needs to stop:quote:Massachusetts pioneered universal health care in 2006. Under then-Governor Mitt Romney, it was the first state to guarantee access to insurance — and drove its uninsured rate down to just 4 percent. http://www.vox.com/2014/5/12/5691934/how-massachusetts-screwed-up-obamacare What the gently caress, Massachusetts? Same poo poo happened in Oregon and Maryland, all three run by Dem governors with Dem legislatures. Not a single one of these states can fallback on the excuse that Republicans are loving things up.
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May 13, 2014 09:43
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Prester John posted:gently caress if I know if I'm right, but it works for me. I'm happier than I can ever remember being. I'm happy for you, Prester John. Thanks for posting
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May 13, 2014 09:43
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Mr Interweb posted:I support Obama and the Dems 110% and all, but poo poo like this really needs to stop: And speaking for Maryland, there's multiple big name competent IT hubs right here. How the gently caress could you not find and grab one of them to do it right?
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May 13, 2014 09:52
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Slickdrac posted:And speaking for Maryland, there's multiple big name competent IT hubs right here. How the gently caress could you not find and grab one of them to do it right? Is it graft?
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May 13, 2014 09:53
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Oregon's exchange was also a massive fuckup from what I've read. I know gently caress all about IT especially contracting or outsourcing; do any goons have more knowledge? Oregon contracted with Oracle for their exchange is the extent of my knowledge. Is Oracle a particularly lovely company?
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May 13, 2014 10:07
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icantfindaname posted:So what has been happening lately to make the GOP rise in the polls? Is this just statistical noise? Last I turned on the radio they were screaming about some new Benghazi developments but that means nothing. Are they actually getting traction with this scandal garbage? I thought the healthcare rollout was doing well, or at least well enough to not hurt polling? Selective polls, unskewing results, and willful suspension of disbelief. The usual. Swan Oat posted:Oregon's exchange was also a massive fuckup from what I've read. I know gently caress all about IT especially contracting or outsourcing; do any goons have more knowledge? Oregon contracted with Oracle for their exchange is the extent of my knowledge. Is Oracle a particularly lovely company? Is the pope catholic? anonumos fucked around with this message at 10:43 on May 13, 2014 |
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May 13, 2014 10:31
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anonumos posted:Is the pope catholic? Nope  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sedevacantism
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May 13, 2014 10:47
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Speaking of student loans and debt, it is weird to me that universities are slowly phasing out tenure programs and just going with hiring a poo poo load of adjuncts. I guess it makes sense since more and more people are going to college than ever and there are a whole lot of of people who got Master's/Doctorates that can't find anything to do with them. But it definitely does lead to a crappy situation.
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May 13, 2014 10:51
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anonumos posted:Is the pope catholic? No, he's a socialist.
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May 13, 2014 11:15
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At one point I was convinced by Pope Francis' rhetoric, now I think it is just a bid to make the church relevant again.
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May 13, 2014 11:35
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:At one point I was convinced by Pope Francis' rhetoric, now I think it is just a bid to make the church relevant again. At one point I was convinced the accelerationists and cynics and pessimists offered something of value with pithy  handwaves like this...Yeah man, His Holiness The Pope preaching tenets of legitimate social justice, pushing for downright acceptance of gays, and generally standing athwart the straitlaced orthodoxy that's set like concrete over the past centuries isn't something to genuinely feel good about and find hope in, it's just a loving outreach campaign with an expiration date.
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May 13, 2014 12:08
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FAUXTON posted:At one point I was convinced the accelerationists and cynics and pessimists offered something of value with pithy To be fair he has kind of a lovely past with liberation theology and I've yet to see anything of substance come out of the church lately that meets his proclamations. I'll admit that the verdict is perhaps yet to be out on Pope Francis but I would like to see more substantive measures taken.
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May 13, 2014 12:23
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Mr Interweb posted:I support Obama and the Dems 110% and all, but poo poo like this really needs to stop: I get letters in the mail every month or two that say I'm still temporarily covered, and to show that piece of paper to the ER if I happen to end up there. That, and promises they'll have a ruling on my RomBamaCare status shortly.
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May 13, 2014 12:27
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AstheWorldWorlds posted:To be fair he has kind of a lovely past with liberation theology and I've yet to see anything of substance come out of the church lately that meets his proclamations. I'll admit that the verdict is perhaps yet to be out on Pope Francis but I would like to see more substantive measures taken. Thing about Pope is that he is already an old dude and won't be Popin for several decades like JPII was able to. He has to make changes to the church that are enduring and can't just be rolled back by the inevitably reactionary pope the cardinals are going to elect once he kicks it. That requires incremental changes and persuasion.
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May 13, 2014 12:33
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