Auspol June - Can't Afford the Education to Think of a Witty Thread Title

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plumpy hole lever: Aug 8, 2003; ♥ Anime is real ♥

Why not just put a helicopter blade on a fighter plane

Where's my cheque ministry of defence

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:09

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# ? Jun 12, 2024 01:11

Skellybones: May 31, 2011; Fun Shoe

How about two?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYeLishJ_Js

Maybe the F-35 is revenge for us selling them a ship that dissolves in water.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:11

Jonah Galtberg: Feb 11, 2009

webmeister posted:

That's not at all what I was suggesting. But given a choice between "money to the arts" and "not cutting welfare", I know which one I'd prefer.

I mean I know you know that this is a false dilemma but do you know that I know that you know that this is a false dilemma?

Ragingsheep posted:

My implication was that they're willing to throw $1m at a mate's hobby but aren't willing to fund other more important things.

$1m is literally nothing in the context of the federal budget, there are many many other pet projects that are costing far more and are far less worthy than ballet (chaplains, roads, F-35, direct action,)

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:13

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

Chris Pynes Knob posted:

Why not just put a helicopter blade on a fighter plane

Where's my cheque ministry of defence

Clive's plan is to buy the Newcastle Knights off Tinkler and give them Teradactyls to ride.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:15

Quantum Mechanic: Apr 25, 2010; Just another fuckwit who thrives on fake moral outrage.
Waaaah the Christians are out to get me

lol abbottsgonnawin

It's not the ballet funding itself that's the issue, it's the political motivation behind specifically funding it while other arts programs are being massively cut.

I mean, yes, it's better than no arts funding at all, but we don't want to really encourage the government to start deciding arts funding by who the PM owes favours

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:16

Fruity Gordo: Aug 5, 2013; Neurotic, Impotent Rage!

Not to mention that the Australian Ballet is like the least-needy arts corporation in the bloody country.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:19

Jonah Galtberg: Feb 11, 2009

Quantum Mechanic posted:

It's not the ballet funding itself that's the issue, it's the political motivation behind specifically funding it while other arts programs are being massively cut.

I mean, yes, it's better than no arts funding at all, but we don't want to really encourage the government to start deciding arts funding by who the PM owes favours

I did already say that I agree with it being a skeezy move. What I'm also saying is that a lot of the arguments being ostensibly made against it are really shite and could ultimately result in more harm rather than less

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:20

Jonah Galtberg: Feb 11, 2009

Fruity Gordo posted:

Not to mention that the Australian Ballet is like the least-needy arts corporation in the bloody country.

Like this one. How do you think most tories will respond to this argument? They will say "right, better take a whole chunk of money away from ballet if it is so well-off anyway".

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:22

Ler: Mar 23, 2005; I believe...

GhostWhoVotes ‏@GhostWhoVotes 39s
#Essential Poll ALP blocking the Budget & forcing new election: Support 47 Oppose 40 #auspol

:getin:

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:24

Fruity Gordo: Aug 5, 2013; Neurotic, Impotent Rage!

Jonah Galtberg posted:

Like this one. How do you think most tories will respond to this argument? They will say "right, better take a whole chunk of money away from ballet if it is so well-off anyway".

Except the reason why it is so well-funded in the first place is that Tories already love it and regard it as a legitimate national institution, which it is. The Australian Ballet is not at any risk of cuts.

Fruity Gordo fucked around with this message at 08:34 on Jun 3, 2014

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:31

Paingod556: Nov 8, 2011; Not a problem, sir

Shadeoses posted:

Oh, god, I hadn't realised we were getting the B version.

A is for the Air Force, so probably is the 'best' one as an actual plane.

B is for the Marines to operate off short amphibious assault ships (Baby carrier) but is basically a failure in every way possible.

C is for the Navy to operate off their regular Carriers, and it looks like the airframe isn't actually up to the stresses of the catapult takeoffs and arrestor landings.

And we're getting the bizarro incompetent version that ruined the program, designed for the Navy's Army's Airforce which Australia doesn't have the capabilities or reason to use

We're buying the Alpha, that article is a speculative piece about flying the Bravo from our assault ships. Which is fine if the bloody thing didn't melt ~~decks~~ everything

http://youtu.be/t0jgZKV4N_A

The Alpha mostly works aside from the usual 'pilot dies of asphyxiation' flaw, while the Naval Charlie has a slight issue with the wings catching fire. It's the Bravo that's a clusterfuck, all from the VSTOL systems

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:31

Tokamak: Dec 22, 2004

Jonah Galtberg posted:

Whoa thanks I had no idea of these things, thanks for the headsup guy with a fusion-related username. I'll be sure to keep them in mind for future debates.

Firstly, it's really dishonest to try and make out like these renewable technologies are even remotely as far off as commercial thorium energy.

CSP isn't (years, not decades), but technologies that rely less on heavy/rare-earths certainly are (Dyes, Organic, Non Cadmium Quantum Dots). Which is kind of important if you are concerned about the impact mineral resources. I think building CSP plants with electro-static cleaning cycles is a worthy endeavour.

Its not exactly like I think renewables have shot my dog. Renewables are just as interesting to science nerds as nuclear. I just don't think its good to sugar coat that renewable's aren't a mineral intensive industry; poo poo doesn't grow on trees (yet!).

quote:

Secondly, yes it is a good reason to rubbish further development. By the time thorium is viable we'll either be completely and irreversibly hosed or we'll have already switched to a combination of renewables alongside a reduced and sustainable consumption of energy.

Fundamental research isn't important. Thanks for the heads up. I find the dogmatism in parts of the Green movement with regards to scientific research a little troubling. I never said thorium is going to stop climate change, it is useful to understand the industrial applications of nuclear isotopes. It benefits no-one to remain ignorant over whole branches of physics.

Jonah Galtberg posted:

I mean I know you know that this is a false dilemma but do you know that I know that you know that this is a false dilemma?

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:33

plumpy hole lever: Aug 8, 2003; ♥ Anime is real ♥

What happens if bravo tries to land in a dirt field

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:33

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Hypation posted:

Because you cannot make a conclusion as to their preference one way or another. They may have a preference but also simply refused to comment. For whatever reason it is like they were never polled.

It's not like they were never polled; two candidates with 33% support and 33% undecided is a manifestly different situation to one where the two candidates have 50% each.

The fact you cannot determine what their preferences are is precisely why they should be included. If you don't, you're assuming they're exactly the same as the average respondent, which is clearly not the case (Labor and Greens voters are much more likely to be Undecided, for example). It's specious to say that 39% of voters support Turnbull.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:34

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

Ler posted:

GhostWhoVotes ‏@GhostWhoVotes 39s
#Essential Poll ALP blocking the Budget & forcing new election: Support 47 Oppose 40 #auspol

This would be ironic:

In order for this to succeed the ALP must recognise that it was appropriate for Whitlam to be dismissed by the Governor General. Otherwise the plan fails because there is nothing compelling Abbott to resign or call a double dissolution election. (And Abbott is not going to do that south of a 60% TPP result.)

These days constitutional crises are managed/avoided by a change in the leadership.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:34

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Bunch of disturbing stuff in Crikey today. There's a bit on how Bolt is apparently setting the Libs agenda, I think we can just chalk that up to our conservatives aping whatever commentariat/policy structure the US teapartiers set up, with predictable results. They aren't even examining why it isn't working, just copying it. Ever notice that its the really dumb people who spout right-wing views? The smart ones do this nudge-wink routine but its the nongs who come out with hilarious stuff like "working weeks are a left-wing construct" hahahaha, what idiots. That's how Bolt works, getting fools to actually build policy joke routines for him.

Anyway, here's a thing on another right-wing culture war, indoctrinating children with a religion noone gives a gently caress about :

Cathy Alexander posted:

Jesus is coming -- to your local primary school

Interested in a taxpayer-funded job in a state school? There are some going, and here are the prerequisites:

* subscribe to one or both of the creeds of the Christian church (Apostles� Creed and/or Nicene Creed);
* demonstrate a living and personal relationship with Jesus Christ;
* demonstrate strong Christian character evidenced by "servant leadership"; and
* demonstrated ability to apply the teachings of the Bible to real-life situations.

Unfortunately, if you're not up with the Nicene Creed then you can't be a chaplain in a state school. At least not with the Scripture Union Queensland, one of the major chaplain providers (these are just some of its prerequisites).

But there's great news for Christians who want to get their message out to children. In a tough budget that stripped the dole from unemployed people, levied a tax on GP visits and cut funding to uni students, the federal government has spent $244 million putting religious chaplains in schools.

So Crikey decided to dig around on how the scheme works, who these chaplains are, and what they're up to.

The scheme was brought in by the Howard government in 2007 and continued by Labor, which allowed secular welfare workers to be hired as well as chaplains. The Abbott government has banned secular workers from the scheme.

Any school can apply for a chaplain; none are forced to, and not all schools get one. Most chaplains work one to three days a week with a few full-time. Schools get about $20,000 a year to hire one. The positions are usually paid.

Interestingly, the scheme's formal guidelines are quite prescriptive -- in theory. Only students with a signed consent form can be involved with the chaplain. The chaplain offers student welfare services and "spiritual guidance". Chaplains sign a code of conduct, including that they must:

* respect, accept and be sensitive to other people�s views, values and beliefs that may be different from his or her own, including respecting the rights of parents/guardians to ensure the moral and spiritual education of their children is in line with the family�s own convictions;

* actively discourage any form of harassment or discrimination on the grounds of religious ideology, beliefs or sexuality; and

* a school chaplain/student welfare worker must not take advantage of his or her privileged position to proselytise, evangelise or advocate for a particular view or belief.

There is nothing in the program's guidelines specifying that chaplain must be Christian.

All that might sound open-minded in theory, but the reality is that this scheme is putting Christian chaplains into schools.

The government's list of chaplain providers is dominated by Christians. I couldn't see a single provider from another religion. Catholics, The Salvation Army, "Young Life Australia," Macquarie Life Church, Seventh Day Adventists, Anglicans, Lutherans, Scripture Unions, "Youth for Christ," Genr8 Schools Ministry, Fusion Australia ... it's a long list, and their websites are littered with crosses and references to Jesus and the Bible.

Scripture Union Queensland's website laments that "teenage abortion rates are too high". In terms of prerequisites, "a chaplain will ... be a person whose beliefs and lifestyle reflect a Biblical understanding of and a commitment to the teachings, life and person of Jesus Christ".

As for Genr8, its website says it aims to help religious groups "strengthen their ministry in NSW schools so that many more young lives will be transformed through the Lord Jesus Christ".

Access Ministries is more specific. Its statement of belief affirms:

" ... its faith in God, as One-in-Three-Persons, whose redemptive purpose for the world is revealed in the Person of Jesus Chris. That the Lord Jesus Christ proclaimed in word and deed the presence of the Kingdom of God through mission to the world ..."

The Seventh Day Adventist (NSW Schools) mission statement states: "Empowered by the Holy Spirit our Church will be characterised by spirituality, teamwork, ministry, nurture and accountability."

Southlands Christian Church is keen to get out the message that "we believe that the Lord Jesus Christ is coming back again as He promised." But watch out; "our eternal destination of either Heaven or hell is determined by our response to the Lord Jesus Christ".

There is a certain parallel between some organisations on the chaplain provider list and the organisations being questioned by the royal commission into child abuse (the Catholic Church, Salvation Army etc).

So, who's using these chaplains? A FOI request which came through last September revealed there were just over 3500 schools participating in the scheme, and 82% of workers are religious chaplains (the other 18% are secular welfare workers).

For a more detailed breakdown we've gone back to figures from the federal Education Department in mid-2012. Crikey has graphed the data, which shows most chaplains are placed in public schools, and mostly in primary schools. (This data includes some secular welfare workers hired under the scheme, but they were a minority -- 15%. Soon there will be none.)

Number of people employed under school chaplain program

Queensland is the epicentre of the chaplain program; there are more than 1000 working there. Next comes Victoria with just under 750, and NSW is third with 670.

Queensland man Ron Williams successfully challenged the way the program was funded in the High Court back in 2012. The then-Labor government changed the laws to circumvent the decision. Williams is now back in court challenging the scheme again. Last month he told the ABC; "this is simply about seeing that the Commonwealth doesn't keep funding such exercises. It got completely out of hand and has now cost nearly half a billion dollars."

Amen to that.

Even nongs should be able to grasp the implication of those graphs, but I'll spell it out anyway: some arseholes don't like that kids in public schools are spared from jesus freaks very very much. It goes beyond the assumption that many private schools have a specifically Christian component in the curriculum alone and the proportion of public to private school population. And the focus is getting their mitts on young minds that have no protection against evil bullshit. Scripture Union in particular are evil clones from their US evangelist counterparts who funnel all kinds of US religious propaganda into Australia. Your kids will come home with stuff that will amaze you, all in the service of those who cannot stand that someone somewhere might be thinking differently.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:34

Ler: Mar 23, 2005; I believe...

quote:

Greens will use Senate powers to release government modelling on university cuts

03 Jun 2014 | Lee Rhiannon

Responding to comments by the Minister of Education, Christopher Pyne, that departmental modelling on the impact of the government's university cuts would not be released "as it may have commercial implications within a deregulated market", Greens spokesperson for higher education Senator Lee Rhiannon said:

"It is extraordinary that Mr Pyne is attempting to hide his own department's modelling on the impact of his regressive changes to university funding, using the fig leaf of �commercial implications'.

"Mr Pyne cannot use his decision to provide private education companies with public subsidies as an excuse to keep the public in the dark about the impact of his cuts."

"These cuts will have an enormous impact on nearly two million Australians currently studying or have a HECS debt, as well as the hundreds of thousands of young Australians contemplating a university education.

"Modelling by the Greens and the National Tertiary Education Union has shown the biggest burden of the cuts will fall on low-income graduates and women who take time out of the workforce to raise a family.

"I will be pursuing the government's modelling in Senate Estimates to ascertain whether the Minister is aware of the regressive impact of his cuts.

"If answers are not forthcoming I will be moving a motion in the Senate calling for the release of these documents.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:34

Paingod556: Nov 8, 2011; Not a problem, sir

Chris Pynes Knob posted:

What happens if bravo tries to land in a dirt field

The jetwash blows it all away, leaving a massive hole*... poo poo, I see their plan. Park it over minerals, try to 'land', and now you have an opencut mine

*Actually not sure, but all the material I've seen suggests laying a reinforced landing pad is the standard, maybe it can't use regular albeit compressed dirt like Harriers could

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:38

Jonah Galtberg: Feb 11, 2009

Tokamak posted:

CSP isn't (years, not decades), but technologies that rely less on heavy/rare-earths certainly are (Dyes, Organic, Non Cadmium Quantum Dots). Which is kind of important if you are concerned about the impact mineral resources. I think building CSP plants with electro-static cleaning cycles is a worthy endeavour.

Its not exactly like I think renewables have shot my dog. Renewables are just as interesting to science nerds as nuclear. I just don't think its good to sugar coat that renewable's aren't a mineral intensive industry; poo poo doesn't grow on trees (yet!).

Nobody's sugarcoating anything, I'm very aware of the impacts of rare earth mining especially in countries like China that are lacking in even the most vestigial of mining regulations. My position is simply that the damage caused by the solar energy production line is a more necessary evil than the damage caused by mining of thorium and uranium. (no I am not saying that the situation in China is remotely acceptable)

Tokamak posted:

Fundamental research isn't important. Thanks for the heads up. I find the dogmatism in parts of the Green movement with regards to scientific research a little troubling. I never said thorium is going to stop climate change, it is useful to understand the industrial applications of nuclear isotopes. It benefits no-one to remain ignorant over whole branches of physics.

This is classic goalpost shifting, I was under the impression that we were discussing the research and development of thorium as pertains to commercialising it as a power source. Fundamental isotope research is a completely different story since that can have a whole range of benefits in other fields.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:49

adamantium|wang: Sep 14, 2003; Missing you

Paingod556 posted:

We're buying the Alpha, that article is a speculative piece about flying the Bravo from our assault ships. Which is fine if the bloody thing didn't melt ~~decks~~ everything

http://youtu.be/t0jgZKV4N_A

The Alpha mostly works aside from the usual 'pilot dies of asphyxiation' flaw, while the Naval Charlie has a slight issue with the wings catching fire. It's the Bravo that's a clusterfuck, all from the VSTOL systems

I think this all came up because Tony was throwing around the idea to use the F-35 on some of our ships that were being converted to mini carriers. This would have required us to change our order from the -A to the -B, buy bigger ships that could actually carry them and then convert those with the special surface coating. Altogether a gigantic waste of money on an ill-considered whim.

So expect it next budget.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 08:55

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

Fruity Gordo posted:

Except the reason why it is so well-funded in the first place is that Tories already love it and regard it as a legitimate national institution, which it is. The Australian Ballet is not at any risk of cuts.

I agree. You find cuts in more popular forms of 'art' eg sport (eg Football) as well as the second and third tiers. The key issue is whether your cuts in the lower tiers break the top tier by making them unable to build the necessary talent.

Speaking of sport, if gender diversity is so important, why isn't the sport anti-syphoning list subject to gender equality provisions? Like maybe you've got to show 12 minutes of women's sport per hour of men's sport on the list?

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:08

Senor Tron: May 26, 2006

Hypation posted:

This would be ironic:

In order for this to succeed the ALP must recognise that it was appropriate for Whitlam to be dismissed by the Governor General. Otherwise the plan fails because there is nothing compelling Abbott to resign or call a double dissolution election. (And Abbott is not going to do that south of a 60% TPP result.)

These days constitutional crises are managed/avoided by a change in the leadership.

Blocking the budget measures is different to blocking supply though isn't it?

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:11

Gough Suppressant: Nov 14, 2008

Hypation posted:

This would be ironic:

In order for this to succeed the ALP must recognise that it was appropriate for Whitlam to be dismissed by the Governor General. Otherwise the plan fails because there is nothing compelling Abbott to resign or call a double dissolution election. (And Abbott is not going to do that south of a 60% TPP result.)

These days constitutional crises are managed/avoided by a change in the leadership.

You are literally the dumbest loving poster. This has nothing to do with whitlam/kerr and you would have to be functionally braindead to think it did.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:16

Cartoon: Jun 20, 2008; poop

Quit living in the past! The troll has a new shiny post to be outraged by!

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:18

adamantium|wang: Sep 14, 2003; Missing you

Reuters is reporting that China is set to announce an absolute cap on CO2 emissions from 2016. Combined with the 30% emission reduction target Obama has announced for the US we are going to be so hopelessly far behind by the time this clown gets voted out.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:18

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Not a Carbon Tax :smug:

therefore

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:20

Quantum Mechanic: Apr 25, 2010; Just another fuckwit who thrives on fake moral outrage.
Waaaah the Christians are out to get me

lol abbottsgonnawin

Senor Tron posted:

Blocking the budget measures is different to blocking supply though isn't it?

Yes, but the question asked was "blocking the budget and triggering a new election." That would inherently mean blocking supply, because there's no other path that would result in a DD because there's no way in hell that Abbott's going to call one.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:21

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

adamantium|wang posted:

I think this all came up because Tony was throwing around the idea to use the F-35 on some of our ships that were being converted to mini carriers. This would have required us to change our order from the -A to the -B, buy bigger ships that could actually carry them and then convert those with the special surface coating. Altogether a gigantic waste of money on an ill-considered whim.

So expect it next budget.

What the gently caress is Australia doing with Force Projection. Why do we need carriers?
Next thing we will be getting nuke boats (as in the subs not missiles).

ewe2 posted:

Bunch of disturbing stuff in Crikey today. There's a bit on how Bolt is apparently setting the Libs agenda,

Nope. Bolt is a dickhead who speaks to the far right of the party. That part is cut off from the donor base and swinging voters - except swingers in Central-Western Sydney, which is the same votes the ALP needs. Oh crap we're hosed.

ewe2 posted:

Anyway, here's a thing on another right-wing culture war, indoctrinating children with a religion noone gives a gently caress about :

+1 for Separation of Church and State please. Next thing they'll be teaching "Of Pandas and People".

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:22

The Before Times: Mar 8, 2014; Once upon a time, I would have thrown you halfway to the moon for a crack like that.

adamantium|wang posted:

Reuters is reporting that China is set to announce an absolute cap on CO2 emissions from 2016. Combined with the 30% emission reduction target Obama has announced for the US we are going to be so hopelessly far behind by the time this clown gets voted out.

But, but, until the big polluters like China and India start doing THEIR bit, Australia shouldn't have to do anything!

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:23

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Hypation posted:

Nope. Bolt is a dickhead who speaks to the far right of the party. That part is cut off from the donor base and swinging voters - except swingers in Central-Western Sydney, which is the same votes the ALP needs. Oh crap we're hosed.

Aside from the push to repeal 18C, which is fairly obviously tied to Bolt.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:24

Gough Suppressant: Nov 14, 2008

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Aside from the push to repeal 18C, which is fairly obviously tied to Bolt.

Any reasonable definition of the far right of the party would also include most of the cabinet.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:26

CROWS EVERYWHERE: Dec 17, 2012; CAW CAW CAW; Dinosaur Gum

adamantium|wang posted:

Reuters is reporting that China is set to announce an absolute cap on CO2 emissions from 2016. Combined with the 30% emission reduction target Obama has announced for the US we are going to be so hopelessly far behind by the time this clown gets voted out.

You never know, we might be lucky enough to get a carbon levy or a carbon copay. They are not taxes because

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:28

MiniSune: Sep 16, 2003; Smart like Dodo!

Those On My Beet posted:

Bad businesses are lazy and only want to compete on costs rather than compete on service or quality or experience.

A bit late, but when we do compete on service or quality or experience we still get shafted.

We just lost a large BHP contract to a competitor on 10% price differential (good luck to them) - we exceeded our safety targets, recorded low TRIFR rates, came in on time and on budget with a minimum of screw ups. We won awards and got positive feedback. We had experienced guys and frankly one of the best operators in the business. And we still lost to a bunch of guys kicked out of ODO for a bunch of safety violations, who have a shithouse track record on running ontime and on budget.

It is a harsh fact, service or quality or experience only really counts when the price is the same, especially in this "Age of the Accountant" where everything is lowest price possible. To think otherwise is delusional, and is a sad reflection on the current state of the mining business.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:29

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

Senor Tron posted:

Blocking the budget measures is different to blocking supply though isn't it?

Yes it is.

But if that is all you did then you could not achieve this:

Ler posted:

GhostWhoVotes ‏@GhostWhoVotes 39s
#Essential Poll ALP blocking the Budget & forcing new election: Support 47 Oppose 40 #auspol

There is no way for "force" a new election if all you are doing is blocking the measures. The way to "block the budget" in order to "force a new election" is to block the recurring programs as well as the measures. ie a complete blocking of supply.

Essential asked two relevant questions on the subject - see below. The first indicated a preference to block some of the measures. The second indicated support for a complete blocking of supply.

quote:

Q. Do you think the Labor Opposition should vote to block the whole budget, vote against certain parts of the budget or pass the whole budget?

53% think the Labor Opposition should vote against some parts of the budget, 18% think they should block the whole budget and 18% think they should pass the whole budget.

quote:

Q. Would you support or oppose the Labor Opposition blocking the budget and forcing a new election?

47% said they would support the Labor Opposition blocking the budget and forcing a new election and 40% said they were opposed. A substantial majority of Labor voters (84%) and Greens voters (64%) supported forcing a new election.

Source: http://essentialvision.com.au/category/essentialreport

So we have a situation where:

Quantum Mechanic posted:

Yes, but the question asked was "blocking the budget and triggering a new election." That would inherently mean blocking supply, because there's no other path that would result in a DD because there's no way in hell that Abbott's going to call one.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:35

Hypation: Jul 11, 2013; The White Witch never knew what hit her.

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Aside from the push to repeal 18C, which is fairly obviously tied to Bolt.

Brandis didn't need any encouraging for that. Bolt is just cheering from the sidelines.

CROWS EVERYWHERE posted:

You never know, we might be lucky enough to get a carbon levy or a carbon copay. They are not taxes because

But Tony Abbott has brought in a Carbon Tax: http://www.afr.com/p/national/now_liberals_to_raise_petrol_tax_TXDe6zGdQEFGhoeGIXK6qN
Piss-weak carbon tax but still a 1:1 relationship between fuel and carbon equivalent emissions.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:41

Lid: Feb 18, 2005; And the mercy seat is awaiting,
And I think my head is burning,
And in a way I'm yearning,
To be done with all this measuring of proof.
An eye for an eye
And a tooth for a tooth,
And anyway I told the truth,
And I'm not afraid to die.

For Victoria

quote:

Geoff Shaw will support no confidence motion against Napthine government

The Premier is facing a fresh crisis, with rogue MP Geoff Shaw declaring he no longer trusts the Napthine government and would support a no confidence motion against Denis Napthine.

Mr Shaw said on Tuesday that he believed the Coalition was encouraging former Speaker Ken Smith to vote with Labor on finding Mr Shaw guilty of contempt of parliament.

Labor was surprised by Mr Shaw's announcement on Tuesday evening and senior members of the Opposition are holding a meeting.

Read more: http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/geoff-shaw-will-support-no-confidence-motion-against-napthine-government-20140603-39gsu.html#ixzz33Z1SXXKC

Headline says it all.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:43

Doctor Spaceman: Jul 6, 2010; "Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Abbott didn't introduce the fuel excise, nor is it a carbon tax.

Hypation posted:

Brandis didn't need any encouraging for that. Bolt is just cheering from the sidelines.

It's hardly the sidelines when he is by far the most prominent person hit by the law in recent years.

# ? Jun 3, 2014 09:47

Coq au Nandos: Nov 7, 2006; I think I would say to my daughters if they were to ask me this question... A shitpost is the greatest gift that you can give someone, the ultimate gift of giving and don't give it to someone lightly, that's what I would say.