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Panzeh posted:Also perhaps people just don't like blood bowl? I like the way dreadball works better because failure doesn't end the turn. Not everyone who ditches cyanide blood bowl goes on to fumbbl. I was going to go on about how risk management is a big part of Blood Bowl, and that Dread Ball is an entirely different (and worse) game but something just hit me: Blood Bowl is basically an extremely elaborate push-your-luck game. That might explain why I like Incan Gold so much.
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Jul 16, 2014 04:18
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Magnetic North posted:I was going to go on about how risk management is a big part of Blood Bowl, and that Dread Ball is an entirely different (and worse) game but something just hit me: Blood Bowl is basically an extremely elaborate push-your-luck game. Different strokes for different folks. I dislike push-your-luck games.
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Jul 16, 2014 04:31
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I kind of disagree - there are certainly elements of push-your-luck, but you can mitigate those elements to the point where it's almost a non-issue. I think it's more a game of percentages and will reward people who take the time to do the math. I am more inclined to agree with your original statement - that BB is a game of risk management.
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Jul 16, 2014 13:35
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I think the difference is in what the optimal strategies are. In a (well designed) push-your-luck game you absolutely have to take risks to win. In blood bowl, avoiding risk is the best play in most situations. You'll roll a bunch of dice each match, but games aren't usually decided by the rolls. Instead it's positioning your players in a way that makes good rolls really good for you, and the bad rolls not that bad. Both types of games eventually break down into probabilities, but I think BB is about tactical sense over calculating odds in your head.
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Jul 16, 2014 14:19
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I think risk management is a better way of looking at it than "push your luck". The kinda of plays where you're really tempting fate are usually the last-turn equaliser (let's say an undead passing game without skills, or a break-cage-snag-ball-Hail Mary Pass kind of thing) or a cheeky score before half time. Most of the time if you're pushing your luck it's things like a 1db that you don't really need to make but would like. Even then 99% of the popular skills (not the funhaver skills!) are about taking the randomness out of the game. Block, dodge, sure hands, pass, etc etc are all skills designed to smooth out the random effects of the dice. I'd say most teams have something they can do well that doesn't require pushing their luck. It's about making sure when you do have to go for a chancy roll that you've either got a contingency, it's not important, or you've got no other choice. For example, I've just managed to get this working on my mac an started a vanilla undead team. Unskilled long passes will always be pushing my luck with the team, but bashing the living poo poo out of the opposition with my mummies is much less chancy. So usually I'll cage up (safe) then block and blitz (slightly risky) then make ludicrous chancy plays at the end of the turn (ag1 dodges etc). The stuff that's really really difficult and requires something like a natural six is very rare, but when it works it can turn the game upside down (always let your mummies go for interceptions). Tactical positioning is more important than the dice rolling.
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Jul 16, 2014 15:02
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Eh, at the end of the day, just about any move you make that involves an action other than moving is a gamble in blood bowl. This scratches some peoples itch and leaves others just frustrated. Do the semantics really matter?
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Jul 16, 2014 15:03
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It still falls under risk management, but positioning yourself in a way that increases the chances your opponent has to take is a big part of the game too.lenoon posted:For example, I've just managed to get this working on my mac an started a vanilla undead team. Unskilled long passes will always be pushing my luck with the team, but bashing the living poo poo out of the opposition with my mummies is much less chancy. So usually I'll cage up (safe) then block and blitz (slightly risky) then make ludicrous chancy plays at the end of the turn (ag1 dodges etc). Can I ask how much effort it took to get the game running on your mac (and if it's worth it)? I've never really dabbled in non-native mac gaming but Blood Bowl (of all things), and the upcoming sequel has been tempting me because the Xbox version is super lovely.
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Jul 16, 2014 15:23
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Installed steam through wine as "steam2", bought and downloaded blood bowl from the wine wrapped version of steam, open BB. Sorted. Can't believe it was so easy. Works online too. Only problem is to remember to close the mac version of steam.
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Jul 16, 2014 15:34
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Do bribes actually work? I've used them 4-5 times now, and literally never had them overturn a foul.
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Jul 17, 2014 20:30
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fool_of_sound posted:Do bribes actually work? I've used them 4-5 times now, and literally never had them overturn a foul. Yeah, they work, you just had poo poo luck. That's just Blood Bowl. I foul the poo poo out of people when I have bribes, and I can usually get away with about four fouls before I have to use one.
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Jul 17, 2014 20:32
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Bribes work on a 2+.
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Jul 17, 2014 20:32
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Yep - I bribed the ref the other day. Of course, I also failed Bonehead 5 times in a row, so...
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Jul 17, 2014 20:32
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How do I play a non-Bashy team? I tried my hand at Humans and got stomped (by orcs) then I tried Dark Elves and got stomped by Dwarves. How do I actually play this game instead of just relying on Black Orcs to smash their frontline into submission and dogpiling the remaining players?
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Jul 17, 2014 20:46
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Away all Goats posted:How do I play a non-Bashy team? I tried my hand at Humans and got stomped (by orcs) then I tried Dark Elves and got stomped by Dwarves. Your main focus on defense should be to screen rather than make base contact. Your goal is to place all of your dudes a space away from your opponents, leaving them with just their blitz to punch with while preventing them from making serious forwards progress. And dwarves will stomp any elfy team early on just because half of their pieces have tackle, negating that ability to reliably dodge away with your key pieces and making them easier to punch down to boot.
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Jul 17, 2014 20:50
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Tackle don't make AG4 any less useful.
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Jul 17, 2014 20:52
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Wooper posted:Tackle don't make AG4 any less useful. This. The part about screening was correct, though. As long as you have 10 players you can prevent the Hitlers from penetrating and trapping any of your guys- your marked players will always have that 2+ dodge square to reset the screen. Once your numbers whittle down, you'll have to get creative about preventing the advance of their cage, but with elves' high movement you should be able to relocate easily enough. Just don't let your guys get sandwiched and you should be able to hold on for a 1-0 or 2-1 victory. The trick to playing against Dwarves with Elves isn't "how do I win?" but "how do I win and still have a team left to play with?".
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Jul 17, 2014 21:00
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Wooper posted:Tackle don't make AG4 any less useful. Yeah, basically it's less "Dwarves are hell because Tackle" and more "Dwarves are hell because  DWARVES "Personally, my experience with successfully playing a not so bashy team against a bashy team was a game where my Tungsten Terminators II (Norse, first iteration was Chaos that fell on its rear end after two games) took on an Orc team and won by forfeit on the tenth turn. I had five guys in the line against their five guys in the line, but their guys were some Black Orcs, some Blitzers and their Big Guy, whereas mine were mostly Linemen, so I was winning out on that front, and the rest was screening right behind them. Then my opponent made an idiot play by leaving his ball-carrying Thrower relatively open, allowing me to blitz him with a Berserker (1DB only, but I wasn't going to get a great chance like this again - I had to GFI to even make it that far), nailed him down, managed to squeeze two more players down there to mess with the ball situation while the line was holding fairly well (my guys kept getting knocked down but kept getting up) and eventually scored on him with a Werewolf when he proved unable to deal with me harassing his backside. Halftime was right after that, I received the ball and holed up in a cage - not an ubercage, but more of a double-stacked pseudo-sideline cage (one ring of four players around the carrier with two guys next to the sideline, then a ring of five players around the first ring at the front and the open side). He tried to attack it, didn't get good rolls, said something to me in French and then quit. I am proud as hell of that result. No serious injuries (two guys got Badly Hurt but hey, we have reserves) and a 2-0 victory with two MVPs and double winnings. Love it when that happens, and now I have a shiny new Yhetee on my team. So basically, screens are nice, if you have cheap guys to hold up expensive guys do so, and sometimes you've just got to get lucky.
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Jul 17, 2014 21:12
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Wooper posted:Tackle don't make AG4 any less useful. No, but it does make ag4 plus dodge less useful. You still have a good chance at dodging, but you only get 1 team reroll per turn while you get as many dodge ones as you have players with dodge. The amount of tackle dwarves have means teams that rely on dodging and mobility are a little more likely to fall over with every dodge, and that adds up over a game.
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Jul 18, 2014 02:18
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Tenterhooks posted:It still falls under risk management, but positioning yourself in a way that increases the chances your opponent has to take is a big part of the game too. I like to think of Blood Bowl as "Poker: The Board Game".
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Jul 18, 2014 21:06
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Anyone with more internet savvy than myself know if there's any update on the tablet version? They announced it would be coming in "early July", and Googling it just gets me the same series of articles from July 2nd or so indicating it's coming. Didn't know if there was some secret twitter or something that you kids with your technology knew about.
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Jul 23, 2014 18:09
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Russad posted:Anyone with more internet savvy than myself know if there's any update on the tablet version? They announced it would be coming in "early July", and Googling it just gets me the same series of articles from July 2nd or so indicating it's coming. Didn't know if there was some secret twitter or something that you kids with your technology knew about. It will only have humans and orcs base, the other 4 teams will be DLC. That should tell you everything you need to know.
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Jul 23, 2014 18:13
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https://twitter.com/BloodBowl_Game/status/494431898417238016 Looks like Bloodbowl is coming out on Android and iPad tomorrow. I hope it's good. I'm going to be stuck in a car with a bunch of other people for five hours Friday. Maybe a few rounds of this and Space Hulk will make the trip seem shorter. EDIT: It's available on the iOS store now. It works well on my iPad mini. The game is 4.99 and you only get two starting races, Orcs and Humans. There is in app purchases that let you buy new teams. 2.99 each. Four teams are available, Dwarf, Skaven, Wood elf and Chaos. I played a round against myself online. It works just fine. NinetySevenA fucked around with this message at 04:50 on Jul 31, 2014 |
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Jul 30, 2014 22:50
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NinetySevenA posted:I played a round against myself online. It works just fine. Does it work when the opposing team is not one of those 6?
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Jul 31, 2014 18:40
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Magnetic North posted:Does it work when the opposing team is not one of those 6? I didn't play against one of the unavailable teams. I would assume it would be the same as chaos edition playing against legendary edition though. EDIT: It seems like that is not true. I made a Chaos Dwarves team and when my iPad team goes to play the Chaos Dwarves won't show up. NinetySevenA fucked around with this message at 20:59 on Jul 31, 2014 |
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Jul 31, 2014 19:24
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I have been playing in the orca cola cup league now for about a year and a half and after losing almost my entire skaven team this season I will be switching to a new Khemri team for next season. The last time I played Khemri it was for four nine game seasons. I had leveled up 5 TGs in that time to level 3+ and not one got block and I just couldn't compete with the other high tv teams that had block. In fact the 1 death I had was from a both down. I guess my question is should I fire a TG if he hits a certain level and bring in a new one to try and get block?
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Aug 7, 2014 02:14
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NiknudStunod posted:I have been playing in the orca cola cup league now for about a year and a half and after losing almost my entire skaven team this season I will be switching to a new Khemri team for next season. The last time I played Khemri it was for four nine game seasons. I had leveled up 5 TGs in that time to level 3+ and not one got block and I just couldn't compete with the other high tv teams that had block. In fact the 1 death I had was from a both down. I guess my question is should I fire a TG if he hits a certain level and bring in a new one to try and get block? It's not a bad rule for most ST5+ players, actually - they take up too much TV to be allowed to be brought down by a both down.
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Aug 7, 2014 02:35
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I think I completely agree with you. The lack of block on my TGs was the end of that team.
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Aug 7, 2014 03:11
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I got this since it was on sale and one game in and I'm already happy with my purchase. First game with my Chaos Dwarves against Humans. I lose 2-0 but death/injuries are 2 - 1 in my favor, killed his Ogre (rerolled into a -1 Str, which he said in chat meant he was getting canned) and a lineman (I think), while one of my Dwarfs got a -1 MV. The MVPs were his Ogre, I'm guessing for not dying; and my injured Dwarf, not too sure why. I can make do without the Dwarf my next game; but should I cut him loose and replace him or just see how he goes?
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Aug 7, 2014 06:47
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Coffeehitler posted:I got this since it was on sale and one game in and I'm already happy with my purchase. First game with my Chaos Dwarves against Humans. I lose 2-0 but death/injuries are 2 - 1 in my favor, killed his Ogre (rerolled into a -1 Str, which he said in chat meant he was getting canned) and a lineman (I think), while one of my Dwarfs got a -1 MV. The MVPs were his Ogre, I'm guessing for not dying; and my injured Dwarf, not too sure why. MVPs are decided totally randomly. If you have the cash to replace the dwarf you should, but if you'd rather save for another re-roll (or Bull Centaur if you went re-rolls over a 2nd Centaur) a -MV dwarf isn't too badly off. Just stick him on the line and tie up something you don't want punching your other guys.
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Aug 7, 2014 06:51
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I'm running 1 Mino, 2 Bull Centaurs, 5 Dwarfs, 4 Hobs which only left me enough for 1 reroll, which in hindsight was probably a bad idea. What process do people use to make a team, add-ons (re-rolls, apoths, etc) first or team members?
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Aug 7, 2014 07:38
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I prefer to buy the minimum rerolls I want, then work out players from that. No problem if you do it the other way around either, just hit the X to sell off your character at no extra cost before you save.
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Aug 7, 2014 07:42
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Don't worry too much about an apothecary for your first game if you play a bashy team. Scrap them and start again if you suffer a loss that you feel will gimp the team. My priority usually is rerolls->max positionals->apothecary. Some teams (DE ) won't allow you to do this, so start with players you want in your lineup but will take some time to level up (generally those that get SPP by punching people).Buy 1 cheerleader to pretty up the sidelines. Fat Samurai fucked around with this message at 07:48 on Aug 7, 2014 |
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Aug 7, 2014 07:45
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I usually get the slowest to level players first. In chorfs case it'd be the dwarfs and mino. The centaurs will usually be my ball carriers so they will level fast so they are bought last. I try to start out with 3 rerolls whenever possible because they become more expencive after team creation. Apo is usually the first thing to buy either during or after team creation. For chorfs the apo isn't that important but still better to get early as a safety. Also keep in mind the minotaur is compleatly optional and a funhaver choice.
Iretep fucked around with this message at 07:47 on Aug 7, 2014 |
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Aug 7, 2014 07:45
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Coffeehitler posted:I'm running 1 Mino, 2 Bull Centaurs, 5 Dwarfs, 4 Hobs which only left me enough for 1 reroll, which in hindsight was probably a bad idea. What process do people use to make a team, add-ons (re-rolls, apoths, etc) first or team members? This Fumbbl page is great for looking over rosters and it also has team creation strategies. Personally I always try to buy 3 re-rolls at team creation because they're expensive and very necessary early on.
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Aug 7, 2014 07:45
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I wonder how this game would play if some of the "always pick" skills that allow risk free play like block/dodge were removed and also turnovers were either removed or toned down? Asking more from the sense of "would it be possible to bridge the gap between funhavers and try hards, by making risky play more rewarding / conservative play less necessary?" I'd like to think that kind of divide between having fun and playing well shouldn't have to exist at all.
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Aug 7, 2014 08:15
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NiknudStunod posted:I have been playing in the orca cola cup league now for about a year and a half and after losing almost my entire skaven team this season I will be switching to a new Khemri team for next season. The last time I played Khemri it was for four nine game seasons. I had leveled up 5 TGs in that time to level 3+ and not one got block and I just couldn't compete with the other high tv teams that had block. In fact the 1 death I had was from a both down. I guess my question is should I fire a TG if he hits a certain level and bring in a new one to try and get block? Yeah in the occ set up you should fire Them since they Will get clawed too easily without block in division 3 and 2. The only problem is that it's pretty hard to lvl up a new tg before facing the 2000 tv claw teams in division 3 unless you throw matches to stay in the lower divisions.
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Aug 7, 2014 10:17
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 Someone's unhappy about my lack of skull rolls.
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Aug 7, 2014 11:40
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The ball is on his tomb guardian and hes angry about dice.
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Aug 7, 2014 12:11
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No, that's MY tomb guardian. 
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Aug 7, 2014 12:18
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SynthOrange posted:No, that's MY tomb guardian. Ridiculous as it is, reading the chat I want to think that you tossed a Hail Mary pass to a Tomb Guardian. Live the dream, AGI 1 player...
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Aug 7, 2014 12:27
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