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Dross posted:Talk me into or out of playing Enchanted Arms. On one hand, it's a pretty neat combat system (I have a fetish for grid based JRPG combat), with a nice pokemon/monster creations system (pizza head monster man is best teammate). On the other hand, it has a couple of really obnoxious mechanics to it (like your stamina system that punishes you for both fighting and fleeing), and I've tried to to play through it like twice now only to get bored/forget what the Hell I'm doing a few hours in.
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Aug 24, 2014 00:03
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Dross posted:Talk me into or out of playing Enchanted Arms. There are better things than it but it's kind of okay.
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Aug 24, 2014 01:39
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NikkolasKing posted:In other news, I think I'm gonna go on a "Popular JRPGs Run" next month now I have a PS3 and PSN. Gonna play Chrono Trigger (I don't care about load times okay? I grew up with the PS1 and never had a SNES. Load Times are a part of my life) and maybe venture into Tales by trying out Symphonia. Seems to be a lot of people's favorites and even if it isn't as good as some of the others, I've been advised to play older Tales games first because then the "old and outdated" battle system won't feel so bad whereas if I started with Xillia or Graces f, it would. I kinda doubt this but whatever. I remember that you were talking about Nier awhile ago. Have you ever got around to playing that? If not, speaking as someone just like you who worships Xenogears and puts story and music as the highest priority for RPGs, I recommend you do Nier before Tales Of. Nier is really something special. Knowing what games you like, I think you would fall in love with it.
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Aug 24, 2014 02:04
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Ibram Gaunt posted:Reyn seems loving useless, his entire gimmick is that he's supposed to be the tank right? well he's a loving lovely one because he can't hold aggro for poo poo, which makes it impossible to do any of the positional attacks because the monsters are always glued to Shulk. I've been trying to use Shadow Eye to combat this but even upgraded it seems to give me enough time to do maybe one attack before they're back on me. Most of Reyn's equipped arts should be ones that either create aggro, or fill the talent gauge (since his talent art boosts aggro). Get rid of Guard Shift and Anchor Chain, because they will only keep Reyn from doing anything. Once you get Dive Sobat, make sure that's equipped too, because the Bone Upper + Dive Sobat combo lowers the enemy's agility, making it less likely that Shulk gets hit if he starts to draw aggro. Go down Reyn's Enthusiasm skill tree to get the aggro boosting skills. Reyn's a good aggro tank, but you really need to make sure that his skills are devoted to that purpose, since Shulk's high DPS makes him an aggro magnet.
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Aug 24, 2014 02:27
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Super Ninja Fish posted:I remember that you were talking about Nier awhile ago. Have you ever got around to playing that? If not, speaking as someone just like you who worships Xenogears and puts story and music as the highest priority for RPGs, I recommend you do Nier before Tales Of. Nier is really something special. Knowing what games you like, I think you would fall in love with it. Ah yes, thank you for reminding me. That's a good suggestion. The problem is that there are so many JRPGs I want to play and while this forum has only the highest praise for it, I barely hear anything about it elsewhere so I guess I tend to forget about it in face of more popular titles. But yeah, that sounds like a plan. It runs about $20 on ebay so same price as Symphonia more or less. I'll check it out along with the Chrono games this upcoming month. Having a fellow XG fan recommending the game definitely helps.
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Aug 24, 2014 02:53
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NikkolasKing posted:Ah yes, thank you for reminding me. That's a good suggestion. The problem is that there are so many JRPGs I want to play and while this forum has only the highest praise for it, I barely hear anything about it elsewhere so I guess I tend to forget about it in face of more popular titles. You're going to love Chrono Cross. Someone decided to write a sci-fi plot as complicated as Xenogears, only they forgot to have good characters, and they forgot to actually tell the story until the very end. Imagine Miang's disc 2 monologue about Deus, only every single goddamn character does this in the last 2 hours, telling you things that they probably shouldn't even know, and that there was absolutely no foreshadowing for.
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Aug 24, 2014 03:57
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It's always peculiar when your preconceived notions turn out to be wrong. I remember getting the distinct feeling Chrono Cross was one of the most beloved JRPGs ever back before I actually paid any attention to the series. And yet with TDI's LP a few years back and general research across the Internet, I discovered it wasn't quite as popular as I first thought. It's like when I became an FMA fan. Ten years of hearing nothing but the highest praise for the first anime and then suddenly I am swamped with "Brotherhood was infinitely better and everything about the first anime sucked." Obviously I can't judge it until I play it for myself but as a fellow Xeno fan I'm sure you can understand being skeptical about internet backlash. If I listened to posters on here, I probably would hate Xenogears too.
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Aug 24, 2014 04:14
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U-DO Burger posted:You're going to love Chrono Cross. Someone decided to write a sci-fi plot as complicated as Xenogears, only they forgot to have good characters, and they forgot to actually tell the story until the very end. Imagine Miang's disc 2 monologue about Deus, only every single goddamn character does this in the last 2 hours, telling you things that they probably shouldn't even know, and that there was absolutely no foreshadowing for. Yeah Chrono Cross is pretty incomprehensible in parts and that's putting it lightly. That said, the game is worth it for the soundtrack alone.
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Aug 24, 2014 04:30
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Chrono Cross is an incredibly divisive game, mainly because it's kind of a bad sequel to one of probably the most beloved JRPG's ever, especially by people who played Chrono Trigger at the time. And that's coming from someone who actually likes Chrono Cross a lot. I think the only thing that's universally liked is the music.
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Aug 24, 2014 04:33
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Chrono cross is hated because it's a sequel to Chrono trigger that delivers absolutely none of what everyone wanted from a sequel to Chrono trigger. It's still a fun standalone game.
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Aug 24, 2014 04:44
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Dross posted:Chrono cross is hated because it's a sequel to Chrono trigger that delivers absolutely none of what everyone wanted from a sequel to Chrono trigger. This is worth echoing, I think. If you go into it expecting anything resembling a sequel then you're going to be disappointed. I mean, the games are technically related and take place in the same world and everything, but there's very little crossover as far as the plot goes. If you're playing through it for the first time NK then I won't even mention it. It's either stuff you'll notice and go "huh, that's a thing" or totally miss. As a weird PSX JRPG that tried a bunch of stuff, a lot of which admittedly didn't land, I genuinely enjoy it. The magic junctioning system is fun, the environments and world are really cool (albeit lacking in development), and the music is magical. Really the music is the only part that I'd say holds up as a sequel to CT. On the other hand, I really love Xenogears, Xenosaga, Legend of Mana, and most of the other commonly shunned PSX/PS2 RPGs, so idk maybe take what I say with a grain of salt.
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Aug 24, 2014 05:06
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I think the best thing about CC mechanically is that there's no grind, you only really level up by beating bosses (and a couple of fights afterwards), though that can be something that's tricky to balance since if you're stuck on a boss there's no easy way out by over-levelling. I don't remember having any problems apart from an optional boss you're not really mean to be able to do first time through.
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Aug 24, 2014 05:14
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BloodWulfe posted:This is worth echoing, I think. If you go into it expecting anything resembling a sequel then you're going to be disappointed. I mean, the games are technically related and take place in the same world and everything, but there's very little crossover as far as the plot goes. If you're playing through it for the first time NK then I won't even mention it. It's either stuff you'll notice and go "huh, that's a thing" or totally miss. Well I like Xenogears and Xenosaga so we're on the same wavelength there. Both Gears and Cross came out around the same time and both Mitsuda and Masato Kato, albeit his presence is more strongly in Chrono than Xenogears. I remember asking a good while back on this forum if I should just play Chrono Cross first as I have a friend who loved CC and never touched CT until a year ago. Since Cross was such a "loose sequel" and it seems like a lot of the hatred for it was in response to Trigger, I thought maybe playing CC before CT was the smartest approach. But people elsewhere tell me that there are connections and certain things will only have any sort of weight to them if I've played Trigger. Combined with the fact CT is almost universally considered the better game and I just figured I'll play them in order.
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Aug 24, 2014 05:57
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NikkolasKing posted:It's always peculiar when your preconceived notions turn out to be wrong. I remember getting the distinct feeling Chrono Cross was one of the most beloved JRPGs ever back before I actually paid any attention to the series. And yet with TDI's LP a few years back and general research across the Internet, I discovered it wasn't quite as popular as I first thought. We don't hate Xenogears (most people in this thread, myself included, seem to love it). We just acknowledge that it's a bad game. Sakurazuka posted:I think the best thing about CC mechanically is that there's no grind, you only really level up by beating bosses (and a couple of fights afterwards), though that can be something that's tricky to balance since if you're stuck on a boss there's no easy way out by over-leveling. I don't remember having any problems apart from an optional boss you're not really mean to be able to do first time through. I feel like this actually makes it worse. Even though most RPGs make you fight trash mobs, they at least give you some Skinner box reward for doing so. In Chrono Cross, you have to fight a bunch of roaming monsters but you don't actually get anything from it (ignoring the game's crafting system). If they aren't going to give a reward and aren't going to be a threat (and aren't even an attrition threat as you tend to get healed after every battle due to how magic works), why included them at all? Also, why include a leveling system at all if you just power up at specific points (bosses) in a linear plot?
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Aug 24, 2014 06:02
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NikkolasKing posted:Well I like Xenogears and Xenosaga so we're on the same wavelength there. Both Gears and Cross came out around the same time and both Mitsuda and Masato Kato, albeit his presence is more strongly in Chrono than Xenogears. Kato just did some of the script and event stuff for Xenogears, right? I think Chrono Cross was the first game he directed. Maybe the only one because I can't think of anything he did after that except for Baten Kaitos. Playing the "series" in order is the right idea. You already know CC is a sort of sequel to a hugely popular game, so the bar is set even if you skip the original. The connections are mostly just nods to CT, but at least you'll be able to recognize them and smile, especially if CT is so fresh in your mind. I think that would be more fun than just reading about it all after the fact. If you want to go all in then play Radical Dreamers in between CT and CC. In case you aren't familiar: it's a visual novel Satellaview game that we never got because, well, Satellaview. It stars the protagonists of CC and takes place in one of the major story locations. It's not at all required before going into CC, but you can beat it in a couple of hours and playing it before ever touching CC would be a cool experience. It has a nice, sort of minimalistic soundtrack by Mitsuda, and a couple of the tracks are brought back in CC too. e: now that I think about it Kato did direct Radical Dreamers, so I guess he has two games
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Aug 24, 2014 07:19
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BloodWulfe posted:Kato just did some of the script and event stuff for Xenogears, right? There's this interview on Mitsuda's official site. Go to "My Friends" and then Masato Kato. "Xeno - Lahan Village, Citan's house, Shevato, etc" It's a pretty cool interview. Chrono Trigger sounds like it was the sum of a lot of different people's efforts for just the story alone. quote:I think Chrono Cross was the first game he directed. Maybe the only one because I can't think of anything he did after that except for Baten Kaitos. Yeah it looks like he's mainly a writer. I guess it's because he freelances now so they just bring him in to write stuff and nothing else whereas he was an actual employee of Square back in the day. quote:If you want to go all in then play Radical Dreamers in between CT and CC. In case you aren't familiar: it's a visual novel Satellaview game that we never got because, well, Satellaview. It stars the protagonists of CC and takes place in one of the major story locations. It's not at all required before going into CC, but you can beat it in a couple of hours and playing it before ever touching CC would be a cool experience. It has a nice, sort of minimalistic soundtrack by Mitsuda, and a couple of the tracks are brought back in CC too. That's a pretty cool idea. I'll look into it.
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Aug 24, 2014 07:47
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boy oh boy was it a big mistake to let kato anywhere near xenogears. also the dumb seamen arc was written by some event planner who kaori tanaka didnt even bother to mention when asked to list writers
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Aug 24, 2014 08:03
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Ibram Gaunt posted:And finally, back to my first comment, is there just something I'm doing wrong because it's not fun being unable to fully use my abilities because I can never position myself properly to use them most of the time due to aggro. The aggro in that game unfortunately is not a buildup of aggro but whoever is doing the most aggro at any given moment, which is basically vanilla wow so high dps folk can steal threat very fast. swtor also had this issue that wow fixed ages ago.
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Aug 24, 2014 08:39
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I can't find anything on Google about Freddie Mercury being in Tales of Destiny, so you heard it here first: Freddie Mercury is in Tales of Destiny!
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Aug 24, 2014 15:45
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NikkolasKing posted:It's always peculiar when your preconceived notions turn out to be wrong. I remember getting the distinct feeling Chrono Cross was one of the most beloved JRPGs ever back before I actually paid any attention to the series. And yet with TDI's LP a few years back and general research across the Internet, I discovered it wasn't quite as popular as I first thought. Well, not if you read the Xenogears TDI LP thread. That was about 200 pages of people being invested in the story. From what I saw, it was almost all positive. There were people even seriously discussing the game's themes, history, and symbolism. I was surprised. Compare that to the Chrono Cross TDI LP which was 200 pages of people making fun of it. The Nier thread is like the former. 200 pages of people being enamored with the story. There were lots of people who hadn't played the game and couldn't wait for the next update to see what would happen next.
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Aug 24, 2014 21:16
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Thanks for all the Xenoblade tips everyone. Switching some of Reyn's arts around really helped, even if aggro is still kind of finnicky. One final thing, am I expected to go back to colony 9 or whatever to create gems? I haven't made any since the beginning so I'm stuck with a giant bag full of gem materials and seemingly no place to craft them at.
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Aug 24, 2014 21:48
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Ibram Gaunt posted:One final thing, am I expected to go back to colony 9 or whatever to create gems? I haven't made any since the beginning so I'm stuck with a giant bag full of gem materials and seemingly no place to craft them at. By the time gems matter you'll be able to get a mobile furnace via a quest from the gem man.
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Aug 24, 2014 23:16
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Ibram Gaunt posted:One final thing, am I expected to go back to colony 9 or whatever to create gems? I haven't made any since the beginning so I'm stuck with a giant bag full of gem materials and seemingly no place to craft them at. It's a spoiler, but important enough to merit spoiling: Get everything in Colony 6 to level 1. Then again there's not that many places in the game without fast travel.
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Aug 24, 2014 23:41
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Wendell posted:I can't find anything on Google about Freddie Mercury being in Tales of Destiny, so you heard it here first: Freddie Mercury is in Tales of Destiny! Pretty sure that there are movie poster ads in Persona 4 for Fast Times at Ridgemont High
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Aug 25, 2014 02:06
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Super Ninja Fish posted:Well, not if you read the Xenogears TDI LP thread. That was about 200 pages of people being invested in the story. From what I saw, it was almost all positive. Xenogears is a lot more fun when you don't have to actually play it.
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Aug 25, 2014 08:12
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Sir Unimaginative posted:It's a spoiler, but important enough to merit spoiling: Get everything in Colony 6 to level 1. If it's the furnace I think you can just get that by doing one quest as some people have mentioned.
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Aug 26, 2014 04:16
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Rascyc posted:Why is that, I don't think I ever bothered It's the quest "The Gem Man's Invention", and the steps are 1. Reconstruct Colony 6 to level 1 and receive an Ultra Small Reactor. 2. Return to the Gem Man. The first level of colony reconstruction is pretty easy (you'll likely have everything already except for the light rain element) so it probably doesn't stick out as much as the level 4/5 bullshit.
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Aug 26, 2014 05:42
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Dross posted:Talk me into or out of playing Enchanted Arms. Cons: It's pretty much the definition of mediocre. Pros: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8zwSRUPHVo
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Aug 26, 2014 14:57
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I got incredibly bored with Xenogears and its story that was so far up its own rear end that it could see through its mouth. And that one professor-type character, ughhhhh. Awful. Enchanted Arms is....not a good game. Neat combat system. Terrible everything else. I remember one of the first characters you see is your professor, who I remember right is draped in dark purple, slick black hair, yellow eyes, and the game tries to make it a twist that he's evil (I haven't beaten the game, so if it turns out he's not, then goddamn I'm surprised). It seems that every town you visit has an inane, mandatory plot sequence that you need to go through. In one, your prequisite irritating-as-gently caress companion, a young girl in yellow cowboy finery, is accused of stealing. You spend like an hour performing lovely fetch quests and running back and forth getting 'clues' to exonerate her, but people don't believe you anyway and you have to fight (if I remember right). Afterwards, it turns out the little bitch actually stole the thing and you basically just wasted your goddamn life on her. Also it's got that annoying thing that so many of these make-your-party-members games have where you have enough main characters to fill up your roster that to use the game's primary system of actually crafting golems and poo poo, someone needs to be left at the wayside. Why even make that many characters?
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Aug 26, 2014 15:06
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Dr. Eldarion posted:Cons: It's pretty much the definition of mediocre. Also a pro: You can get the US President's mech from Metal Wolf Chaos.
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Aug 26, 2014 15:48
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kirbysuperstar posted:Also a pro: You can get the US President's mech from Metal Wolf Chaos. But does it include MWC sound bites? 
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Aug 26, 2014 15:51
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iastudent posted:But does it include MWC sound bites? Actually yes, and they're the only battle sound bites that are in English, IIRC.
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Aug 26, 2014 16:13
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Started Chrono Trigger on a DS Emulator. And after someone gave me a tip to switch Priority in Task Manager for the Emulator to "Above Normal" it runs perfectly. I hadn't even realized it was slow until I listened to the CT battle theme on YT and found that it was a lot more energetic than what I was hearing. But now that is all fixed and I'm trying to get used to this battle system. I expected something akint o Final Fantasy and I guess this has ATB but the enemies moving around is really throwing me off. The first boss, Yakra, killed Lucca in short order my first attempt because I just did not get the pattern. What I'm used to in my JRPGs is "I know Character A does this move. Character B will dot his move and Character C will just Attack." I race through the menus fast and attack attack attack But doing that here is a bad idea because you are encouraged to learn the enemy's patterns I take it. Which brings me back to another reason Lucc died, I didn't heal her with Frog's Tech. I just did not expect to need healing on my first boss figh. But given that you are apparently encouraged to just sit back with your thumb up your rear end watching the boss for a bit while he wails on you rather than attacking as quickly as possible, remembering to heal is probably going to be essential for most of the game. Not that I dislike the battle system - it's actually pretty cool and not as bad as I was affraid of. i'm always worried when i start a JRPG that the gameplay will overwhelm and confuse me but I always get over it and enjoy myself. I must say though, in terms of Plot, this is a weird game. Demon Nuns, Demons in a bar just chillin', and then that whole trial thing. What was going on with that? Apparently you can be acquitted. I got Guilty because I tried to sell her pendant and I ate some dude's food thanks to my habit of mashing X wherever I go. I did help the girl get her kitty though so she showed up to defend me for all the good it did. But yeah, that whole part was absurd and I think Marle's kingdom is in dire need of reform because its leaders are blithering idiots. I will say that the one thing that has really grabbed me though is the soundtrack. I can't recall hearing so much good music so fast in a game in a long time.
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Aug 27, 2014 04:00
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NikkolasKing posted:I think Marle's kingdom is in dire need of reform because its leaders are blithering idiots. You're gonna like the endgame sidequests to this game.
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Aug 27, 2014 04:02
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NikkolasKing posted:I must say though, in terms of Plot, this is a weird game. Demon Nuns, Demons in a bar just chillin', and then that whole trial thing. What was going on with that? Apparently you can be acquitted. I got Guilty because I tried to sell her pendant and I ate some dude's food thanks to my habit of mashing X wherever I go. I did help the girl get her kitty though so she showed up to defend me for all the good it did. Has anyone ever received a not guilty verdict on their first playthrough of Chrono Trigger? Everyone grabbed the pendant first, stole that old man's lunch, and tried to ditch Marle at the candy. Nothing will convince me otherwise.
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Aug 27, 2014 04:45
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I never ate the man's lunch. ...I did, however, try to sell the pendant to Melchior for a quick buck.
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Aug 27, 2014 04:47
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I always go for the guilty verdict, because it just seems to make more sense. Why do they still throw you in jail if you're found not guilty? I know the chancellor's corrupt (and, y'know, literally a monster), but c'mon now, that's not how incarceration works.
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Aug 27, 2014 09:53
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Rookersh posted:Can someone "explain" the Dark Eye setting to me? Disclaimer: It's been a while since I played Drakensang, so this may be a bit off. To make a skill check in Dark Eye, you roll 3 d20s against 3 stats(which stat depends on the skill). Any margin of failure is 'made up' for with your skill points(SP). Any remaining skill points are called SP*: sometimes SP* matters, sometimes it doesn't. So if someone wants to pick herbs, and if it were a Dex/Int/Agi task, your roll might look something like: 13 vs. Dex 10 12 vs. Int 15 15 vs. Agi 13 Total margin of failure: 5 Herb Lore: 8, therefore success with SP* 3 So, someone with poor related stats will do worse at a given skill than someone with good related stats. Magic spells are basically the same as skills. So Fastness of Body is an Int/Agi/Con skill, and if your mage really sucks at, say, Con, he might fail to cast the spell from time to time without a few points into the spell. It also looks like the only thing SP* does for this spell is to reduce the Astral Point(AsP, ie mana). I'd keep the Fastness of Body spell just high enough to meet the modifier requirements, and only pump it if I kept failing to cast it all the time. AR is armor. AR zone is something to do with combat: 20% chance to hit head/arms/legs, 40% torso. So if you run around in plate mail with no helmet: 20% chance to get owned. All "All AR zones +1" means Fastness of Body covers everything. From what I remember, at high levels it meant my mages were tankier than my fighters, who were running around with 3 or 4 AR. I can't help you with the other specifically game-related stuff, though. Stat cap is maybe 20? I'm not too sure, but I think you don't get all that many points to spend. I'd say 11-13 was average, with 15 being pretty good. The capstone melee abilities need 15 courage or something like that, and I remember having difficulty meeting that requirement. The Dark Eye may seem intimidating at first, but once you get it, it's pretty intuitive. I found working with a strange RPG system really refreshing, though. Like trying to wrap my mind around THAC0, lo these many years ago. If there's still stuff you don't quite get, feel free to ask, although I'm hardly an expert.
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Aug 27, 2014 11:35
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Coughing Hobo posted:I always go for the guilty verdict, because it just seems to make more sense. Why do they still throw you in jail if you're found not guilty? I know the chancellor's corrupt (and, y'know, literally a monster), but c'mon now, that's not how incarceration works.
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Aug 27, 2014 11:40
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I'm absolutely going to have to put DQ5 down for a bit because I'm getting destroyed by the final boss with my hero around level 36, and needing to put everything on hold while I grind up a few levels right at the end of the game is drat annoying. So, as a break from Dragon Questing I'm going to pick up either Trails in the Sky or Tails of Symphonia Chronicles, as I own then both but have played neither. Any opinions on which of the two to go through next?
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Aug 27, 2014 11:46
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