Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

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Boon: Jun 21, 2005; by R. Guyovich

So I checked Escalation, but the only Eldar model there is the Revenant. Where can I find the rules on the Lynx/Cobra/etc...

# ? Aug 25, 2014 02:51

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# ? May 10, 2024 07:03

The Sex Cannon: Nov 22, 2004; Eh. I'm pretty content with my current logo.

Direwolf posted:

Battle report!

So The Sex Cannon was looking for some practice for his NOVA army, and I haven't played in a million years so we got together yesterday to hash it out. He told me he was bringing "2000 pts of Steel Legion", and as I know that he plays IG and not much else about what he plays I assumed "Steel Legion" was a tank-heavy IG list, some kind of legion of steel. So, wanting it to be more of a fair fight, I did not take my Iyanden Eldar and instead went with a new Deathwing list that wasn't quite as good against vehicles.

Turns out Steel Legion is not a tank list! Turns out massed storm bolters are actually not terrible against massed IG infantry! Whoops!

My list:
Belial
DW Command w/ Banner of Fortitude, Assault Cannon
5x DW with Assault Cannon
5x DW with Assault Cannon
10x DW with 2x Heavy Flamer
5x DW with 3x Thunder Hammer/SS and rest lightning claws
3x Ravenwing w/ 2x Melta, Melta Attack Bike
3x Ravenwing w/ 2x Melta, Melta Attack Bike

His list (roughly):
Command Squad w/ all 3 officers
3x Primaris Psyker
2x Commissar
2x Infantry platoon with 20 man/2 flamer blob, 4x plasma gun squad and 3x Autocannon HWT
2x Veteran squad with 3x melta in Chimera
2x Vendetta
2x Leman Russ with Battle Cannon
1x Leman Russ with Demolisher

The basic plan for my army was if I got first turn, to scout up the Bikers and mass DW teleport assault in first turn off their homers; if I got second turn, to still mass teleport but leave all the bikes in reserve. We rolled up the Tactical Objective mission where you get x cards where x is the turn number (1 on turn 1, 2 on 2, etc) and he went first, so he deployed his stuff out, scooted up a bit and grabbed an objective point. His psykers had gotten a mix of useful/not useful powers but he didn't manage to get any of them off, so he passed to me.
On my first turn, only 1 of my 4 squads that could scatter, did (Belial went with the 10 man/2x HF squad so I could position the flamers perfectly as they did not scatter). This was the start of what was probably the grossest most lopsided game of 40k I have ever played. Belial and his squad killed a plasma squad and 16 out of one of the 20 man squads including their commissar. The other squads shook the Demolisher, killed his entire Command squad and put a wound on his Commander.

The subsequent turns demonstrated exactly what happens when an army that is a good counter to another army has nearly every single die roll go its way.
His Vendettas didn't come in until turn 3 and turn 4. He failed every psychic test he took the entire game. I failed one armor save, the whole game (the only things that died died from failed cover/invulnerable saves). I managed to rend his Demolisher exactly when I needed to so it never shot the whole game. 3 of my bike squads got their choice of where to outflank and the last one came on right where I wanted it to. The one Battle Cannon shot he hit my bikes with, they made all their jink saves AND it scattered back onto his Leman Russ, rolling a 6 to glance the front armor and destroy it. I even nearly downed a Vendetta just from good storm bolter shots into the back of it. The vast majority of his weapons were AP 4, and the AP 1/2 shots didn't roll well either. I continually drew objective cards that I was either already standing on or next to, and he drew at least 3 that he couldn't possibly complete.

The game ended with 2 3 man guard squads falling back, 1 Vendetta with 1 HP left and 1 undamaged Vendetta versus 1 attack bike, 3 Ravenwing bikes, and 4 Terminator squads with Belial having taken 1 wound on the board. The final score was 19-3, with me taking Linebreaker, Slay the Warlord, and First Blood, and scoring 16 objective cards.

Thankfully, The Sex Cannon is a great sport and we both had a good time, but man oh man. Sometimes the dice are just not there.

Reading this makes it sound so, so much worse. I still had a great time, though!

I played TsarZiedonis tonight and I discovered that Wyverns are really, really good. Wish I had some. Got stomped, had a great time.

Guys, I might be bad at this whole Warhammer thing.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 02:54

A 50S RAYGUN: Aug 22, 2011

Boon posted:

So I checked Escalation, but the only Eldar model there is the Revenant. Where can I find the rules on the Lynx/Cobra/etc...

IA:V something, probably the Fall of Mymerea. Generally if a FW model doesn't have free rules, a book containing those rules will be in the 'suggested purchases' or whatever at the bottom.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 02:56

panascope: Mar 26, 2005

Boon posted:

So I checked Escalation, but the only Eldar model there is the Revenant. Where can I find the rules on the Lynx/Cobra/etc...

Here's the list of Forgeworld approved Lords of War. Looks like you want Imperial Armor: Apocalypse.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 02:58

Boon: Jun 21, 2005; by R. Guyovich

Ah okay, thanks guys.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:14

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

I'm still not a fan of Unbound, regardless if the list people throw together is fair or not. Back in my day, putting whatever models we wanted to on the battlefield was called 'Apocalypse'. Now you can do that at smaller point limits without your opponent's consent (although a lot of people will tell you to use a real army list anyway).

Apocalypse was cool because you could put everything on the table with max upgrades and have 40-50k points per side smashing it out over a long weekend. Now it's just about redundant, thanks to Unbound allowing stuff like 'fluffy Iron Hands lists' featuring as many Ironclad dreadnoughts as they can afford in 2k points* :v:

*refer to the first paragraph, almost nobody would play an AV13-skewing jerk like that

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:15

Sephyr: Aug 28, 2012

That list of Lords of War looks oddly...restrictive. No Nurgle Baneblade or Plague tower of Nurgle? That said, poor Necrons have only a single choice.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:32

Sulecrist: Apr 5, 2007; Better tear off this bar association logo.

My favorite thing about Apocalypse was the strategems. It was just a high-points Cities of Death for my group, most of the time--we usually ended up having loads of Troops and HQ anyway.

I've taken an Unbound army precisely once, and it was because I was playing a campaign game at low points and needed to represent a bunch of ragtag insurrectionists helping a Tactical Squad that had been shot down in a Tau-controlled hive. I lost (and as part of the scenario I was playing 250 pts up, too) and a big part of that was the lack of Objective Secured. Unbound sounds like it has serious problems in tournament play, but I'm guessing that after the Necrons get a new Codex it'll be substantially less of a bummer in casual games.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:39

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

My group gets to field all kinds of fun stuff, like an armoured column consisting of about 8-10 various Land Raiders, a stupid amount of Leman Russ tanks, in one of the more recent games we had three Thunderhawks and a Warhound :getin:

Our BA player can field something ridiculous like 20-25k points on his own, but it's awesome having 2 pingpong tables packed full of plastic men and huge explosions.

Unbound can be used for fun campaign stuff quite well, but that's the sort of thing that could be house-ruled for once-off scenario games. Incorporating it into the main rules just begs to be abused by powergaming, hypercompetitive shitbags.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:57

ThNextGreenLantern: Feb 13, 2012

HiveCommander posted:

Are they led by Chapter Master Pythagoras, by any chance?

My Space Marines hail from the Storm Blood chapter, led by Chapter Master Vlad Tempest. I'm not lying.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 03:59

SoftDrink: Nov 16, 2013

I just heard from a friend that Blood Angles might be slipt into September like the Gray Knight book. I was wondering if any of you have heard the same thing?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:14

A 50S RAYGUN: Aug 22, 2011

The Blood Angels are rumored to be getting new kits so either they're September's big release (unlikely) or they're not in September at all (probably this one).

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:34

Macdeo Lurjtux: Jul 5, 2011; BRRREADSTOOORRM!

Sephyr posted:

That list of Lords of War looks oddly...restrictive. No Nurgle Baneblade or Plague tower of Nurgle? That said, poor Necrons have only a single choice.

There's not even an entry for Dark Eldar.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:38

Post 9-11 User: Apr 14, 2010

Has anyone ever reposed the Dark Vengeance ~~Dread~~ Helbear Daddy and if not why not?

I have the Dork Vengenace set and it's getting a different pose.

And: Peter Weller. :rip:

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:38

Hencoe: Sep 4, 2012; MY LIFE GOAL IS TO STICK A FLESHLIGHT INTO THE END OF A HOWITZER AND FUCK THE SHIT OUT OF IT

Sephyr posted:

That list of Lords of War looks oddly...restrictive. No Nurgle Baneblade or Plague tower of Nurgle? That said, poor Necrons have only a single choice.

They get access from the escalation book to the T-Ctan, Vault, and Obelisk. That list is basically the FW models that didn't end up in the escalation.

Macdeo Lurjtux posted:

There's not even an entry for Dark Eldar.

DE get access to the Renevent I think, but that's from the escalation book.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:41

Boon: Jun 21, 2005; by R. Guyovich

So are only the LoW that are listed in the Escalation book allowed in normal games of 40k? Or are all LoW allowed now?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:46

Von Humboldt: Jan 13, 2009

HiveCommander posted:

Unbound can be used for fun campaign stuff quite well, but that's the sort of thing that could be house-ruled for once-off scenario games. Incorporating it into the main rules just begs to be abused by powergaming, hypercompetitive shitbags.

To quote someone in our local group - "We haven't earned the right to play Unbound."

He's right, of course. We have enough problem players that it's really not practical to do Unbound or unlimited FOC stuff unless you've previously played your opponent and knows he checks out, because you're otherwise looking at playing Tau Fire Cadre/Imperial Knight/C'tan, double C'tan with double Wave of Withering (in 1500,) 8 Doom Scythes, and other poo poo.

It actually terminated the local tournament seen around here for a little while, since we allowed Unbound to test it and everyone just... sort of got sick of it.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:47

my kinda ape: Sep 15, 2008; Everything's gonna be A-OK; Oven Wrangler

Post 9-11 User posted:

And: Peter Weller. ?

He posted here yesterday?

Also if anyone has or knows someone who has an Atlas Recovery Vehicle I will pay fat stacks of :10bux:

for it.

my kinda ape fucked around with this message at 04:52 on Aug 25, 2014

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:48

PeterWeller: Apr 21, 2003; I told you that story so I could tell you this one.

Post 9-11 User posted:

Has anyone ever reposed the Dark Vengeance ~~Dread~~ Helbear Daddy and if not why not?

I have the Dork Vengenace set and it's getting a different pose.

And: Peter Weller. ?

Good luck. You'll need a lot of green stuff because the thing is basically just two pieces, front and back.

Did something happen to my namesake?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 04:52

Crab Dad: Dec 28, 2002; behold i have tempered and refined thee, but not as silver; as CRAB

Finally started painting my orks again. So far I got 30 grots painted up and now two slugga boyz... 58 to go. Sigh. Going for an all foot army jus because.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 05:14

Cataphract: Sep 10, 2004; Fun Shoe

LingcodKilla posted:

Finally started painting my orks again. So far I got 30 grots painted up and now two slugga boyz... 58 to go. Sigh. Going for an all foot army jus because.

I feel ya. I'd painted up 50 shoota boys then the codex dropped. Now I'm painting 40 slugga boyz

# ? Aug 25, 2014 05:30

LordAba: Oct 22, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

LingcodKilla posted:

Finally started painting my orks again. So far I got 30 grots painted up and now two slugga boyz... 58 to go. Sigh. Going for an all foot army jus because.

120 termagaunts, 30 gargoyles, 90 hormagants.

Then come talk to me.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 05:34

A FESTIVE SKELETON: Oct 2, 2011; TIS THE SEASON BITCH

LordAba posted:

120 termagaunts, 30 gargoyles, 90 hormagants.

Then come talk to me.

I dread the day when I decide to paint my Tyranid army. Speaking of Tyranids, I've gotten a couple more games in with them and it's pretty fun so far. I picked up a Tervigon and some more Termagaunts from one of the cool dudes at my store, and he even gave me a metal Hive Tyrant so all I need to do is pin that and put it together. I really like the Tervigon though; pretty durable, a level 1 psyker and it makes free gaunts. I just keep rolling doubles and blowing out its O-ring though sadly.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 06:24

NTRabbit: Aug 15, 2012; i wear this armour to protect myself from the histrionics of hysterical women

bitches

Boon posted:

So are only the LoW that are listed in the Escalation book allowed in normal games of 40k? Or are all LoW allowed now?

Everything in Escalation, IA: Apocalypse and that list, because Forgeworld is proper legit, and as long as you bring the rules anyone who says "I'm not playing against Forgeworld stuff it's not real or balanced, here's my my 10 Wave Serpent list what are you bringing?" can eat a dick

# ? Aug 25, 2014 07:02

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

NTRabbit posted:

anyone who says "I'm not playing against Forgeworld stuff it's not real or balanced, here's my my 10 Wave Serpent list what are you bringing?" can eat a dick

This.
"Forgeworld is unbalanced as gently caress, take another list against my 4 Knights at 1500pts" is a stupid excuse and thankfully no-one in my meta is dumb enough to try it. Actually, the ones that drop IKs are usually bringing Mortis Contemptors for their anti-air. Now that I think about it, guys at my club are pretty chill with Forgeworld stuff and a couple of them are interested in 30k :dance:

# ? Aug 25, 2014 07:08

my kinda ape: Sep 15, 2008; Everything's gonna be A-OK; Oven Wrangler

So when you're tank shocking a unit any models that would end up under the tank "must be moved out of the way by the shortest distance, leaving at least 1" between them and the vehicle whilst maintaining unit coherency and staying on the board. Any models that cannot manage this are crushed and removed from play as casualties with no saves allowed."

Does this mean that if a unit is already out of coherency for whatever reason(such as one of your other tanks tank shocking into the middle of the unit and forcing it into two groups) that anyone stuck under a tank would be automatically crushed?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 07:40

BULBASAUR: Apr 6, 2009; Soiled Meat

Have them proxy some 30k armies. Its super fun and it'll probably warm up the others in the group to it.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 07:40

HiveCommander: Jun 19, 2012

BULBASAUR posted:

Have them proxy some 30k armies. Its super fun and it'll probably warm up the others in the group to it.

That means I have to proxy 30k as well, as much as I love the idea of the GKs diving in head-first into the Eye of Terror the moment Titan comes back to realspace or something.
I do want to pick up some EC stuff, but it's so expensive. Awesome models, but I'm protected by average income and a mortgage.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 07:55

The Sisko: Jan 9, 2009; "Whenever there's injustice, wrongs to be righted, innocents to be defended, The Sisko will be there, delivering ass-whooppings."

LingcodKilla posted:

Finally started painting my orks again. So far I got 30 grots painted up and now two slugga boyz... 58 to go. Sigh. Going for an all foot army jus because.

In order to preserve your sanity you should probably look into getting an airbrush.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 08:00

SoftDrink: Nov 16, 2013

The Sisko posted:

In order to preserve your sanity you should probably look into getting an airbrush.

Airbrushes do wonders if you have to paint a lot of models.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 09:06

Heer98: Apr 10, 2009

The Sex Cannon posted:

Reading this makes it sound so, so much worse. I still had a great time, though!

I played TsarZiedonis tonight and I discovered that Wyverns are really, really good. Wish I had some. Got stomped, had a great time.

Guys, I might be bad at this whole Warhammer thing.

Thanks for the game! When you said you wanted to get in some NOVA practice, I thought you meant the GT, not the narrative campaign! I actually expected to get stomped. And yeah, Wyverns are great at sniping characters out of units. Totally broken at 65 points each.

Still, I think you won the moral high ground. You're army is well painted, and mine is not. We should play again sometime! And you should teach me to paint.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 09:10

SoftDrink: Nov 16, 2013

Here's my Narrative and i'am going to forge it. I got this fun idea for and Exodite Eldar army. I'am going to use a lot of Wood Elf bits and make it a daemon summoning army. For the avatar i can use the Treeman kit i'am thinking for the summoned daemons dryads with conversions for each daemon type. This is going to be a project for after i get all my adepticon stuff done. I would appreciate any ideas.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 09:18

Lord Twisted: Apr 3, 2010; In the Emperor's name, let none survive.

ghetto wormhole posted:

So when you're tank shocking a unit any models that would end up under the tank "must be moved out of the way by the shortest distance, leaving at least 1" between them and the vehicle whilst maintaining unit coherency and staying on the board. Any models that cannot manage this are crushed and removed from play as casualties with no saves allowed."

Does this mean that if a unit is already out of coherency for whatever reason(such as one of your other tanks tank shocking into the middle of the unit and forcing it into two groups) that anyone stuck under a tank would be automatically crushed?

I would read it as the majority of models which remain in coherency, on the board, and 1" away from the vehicle survive, the rest die.

This is how I've always played it, and I've used it once to great effect with a pair of rhinos carving up 9 boyz from a mob pinned against an immovable terrain piece.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 10:14

Irate Tree: Mar 12, 2011; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Hey Goons; for anyone interested, here's my listing for all my fantasy stuff on SA Mart.

http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3660318

# ? Aug 25, 2014 13:45

Boon: Jun 21, 2005; by R. Guyovich

NTRabbit posted:

Everything in Escalation, IA: Apocalypse and that list, because Forgeworld is proper legit, and as long as you bring the rules anyone who says "I'm not playing against Forgeworld stuff it's not real or balanced, here's my my 10 Wave Serpent list what are you bringing?" can eat a dick

So here is the issue. The IA: Apoc lists items as "Warhammer 40k" and then others as various forms of "Superheavy" and the 40k Rulebook only denotes "Escalation and other codexes" or some such similar wording. Do we consider IA: Apoc a codex? If so cool, if not, then goddamnit I drunkenly purchased a $150 model that'll never get to a table in competitive play.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 14:59

Esser-Z: Jun 3, 2012

Any advice for writing up/planning a 40k campaign? I'm not really sure how to set up a fun narrative sequence of games, but I'd like to find out!

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:03

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

Boon posted:

So here is the issue. The IA: Apoc lists items as "Warhammer 40k" and then others as various forms of "Superheavy" and the 40k Rulebook only denotes "Escalation and other codexes" or some such similar wording. Do we consider IA: Apoc a codex? If so cool, if not, then goddamnit I drunkenly purchased a $150 model that'll never get to a table in competitive play.

If its got the 40k approved symbol in the IA book, you dont need to play escalation to use it. GW have come out and approved the use of Forge World books in normal 40k multiple times, so don't let grognards try and say you cant use it.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:04

SRM: Jul 10, 2009; ~*FeElIn' AweS0mE*~

Esser-Z posted:

Any advice for writing up/planning a 40k campaign? I'm not really sure how to set up a fun narrative sequence of games, but I'd like to find out!

The Independent Characters have multiple episodes about campaigns that are great listening. Here's their latest one:
http://theindependentcharacters.com/blog/?p=3512

You could do anything from just doing three games in a row right out of one of the books of alternate scenarios (Battle Missions of Altar of War) to doing a huge, sprawling map-based campaign. The Badab War books from Forgeworld also have lots of good stuff about this. I think the biggest factors for this are getting people as excited in doing that as you are, since it takes a bit more effort than a regular game for everyone involved.

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:10

NTRabbit: Aug 15, 2012; i wear this armour to protect myself from the histrionics of hysterical women

bitches

Boon posted:

So here is the issue. The IA: Apoc lists items as "Warhammer 40k" and then others as various forms of "Superheavy" and the 40k Rulebook only denotes "Escalation and other codexes" or some such similar wording. Do we consider IA: Apoc a codex? If so cool, if not, then goddamnit I drunkenly purchased a $150 model that'll never get to a table in competitive play.

Well, not that I've ever done it before, but I thought competitive play was entirely at the discretion of tournament organisers on account of the rules being a lovely mess for competition, so it wouldn't matter either way.

As for the stamps, it's like so:

Everything with a Warhammer 40k stamp is not an apoc unit, just happens to be in the book for fun because it's cool (they say this in the foreward), and goes into the regular FOC
Everything with a Superheavy stamp is for apoc
Everything in Escalation and the FW Lords of War list are the allowable Lords of War, refer to Apocalypse and IA: Apocalypse for their rules
Anyone refusing to allow your Forgeworld stuff on a regular table because it's not GW 40k is an insufferable douche and you should find a way to use 10 drop pods on them anyway

In other words your Lynx is totally valid as a Lord of War in a game of 40k Escalation. So which one did you get, sonic or pulsar? :haw:

NTRabbit fucked around with this message at 15:14 on Aug 25, 2014

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:12

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# ? May 10, 2024 07:03

Esser-Z: Jun 3, 2012

SRM posted:

The Independent Characters have multiple episodes about campaigns that are great listening. Here's their latest one:
http://theindependentcharacters.com/blog/?p=3512

You could do anything from just doing three games in a row right out of one of the books of alternate scenarios (Battle Missions of Altar of War) to doing a huge, sprawling map-based campaign. The Badab War books from Forgeworld also have lots of good stuff about this. I think the biggest factors for this are getting people as excited in doing that as you are, since it takes a bit more effort than a regular game for everyone involved.

Thanks! I know a couple guys who'll probably be interested, but I wanted to have some ideas down before I brought it up, y'know?

# ? Aug 25, 2014 15:13

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Warhammer 40k: It's the end of the game as we know it (and I feel fine)

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