USPOL September - No one's impeaching anyone!

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Pythagoras a trois: Feb 19, 2004; I have a lot of points to make and I will make them later.

OOOH- definition of decimation has been brought up. TAKE THAT JOSH, you are using the word colloquially and not literally.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:05

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 16:42

JT Jag: Aug 30, 2009; #1 Jaguars Sunk Cost Fallacy-Haver

Cheekio posted:

OOOH- definition of decimation has been brought up. TAKE THAT JOSH, you are using the word colloquially and not literally.

One could argue that Al Queda has lost at least a tenth of its force since its height though.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:07

Joementum: May 23, 2004; jesus christ

radical meme posted:

edit: this was in regard to the Wall Street story. By the way, what the hell happened to Matt Taibbi? And yes, I know about his book. Where the hell is he and is Greenwald ever going to let him publish another article or is he just going to pay him to keep his mouth shut and not say anything bad about him and Omidyar?

First Look hired Gawker's editor and pivoted Taibbi's site to be a publisher of "news, commentary, information, non-downloadable audio and visual media, and� editorial articles in the fields of government, politics, finance, business, sports, the media, entertainment, humor, arts and culture". So they're basically waiting for their coders to clone Kinja.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:08

Unzip and Attack: Mar 3, 2008; USPOL May

Cheekio posted:

Next up, Josh Earnest is back, answering dumber questions than ever: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJa7ozEIju0

HAHAHAHA they are STILL harping on about the Cairo speech where the President had the audacity to suggest a more cooperative stance might be beneficial to everyone. These mother fuckers can't ever let anything go, what a bunch of bitter assholes. (see light bulbs)

JT Jag posted:

One could argue that Al Queda has lost at least a tenth of its force since its height though.

More specifically, Obama continually states that the leadership of Al Qaeda has been decimated, which is demonstrably true.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:11

Hodgepodge: Jan 29, 2006; Can't post for 206 days!

JT Jag posted:

It's a fair point. However, there's a lot of concern regarding how much damage ISIS would have been capable of doing before they run out of steam and started focusing on incorporating their territory. If they spread beyond the Sunni- controlled areas of Iraq and Syria the scale of ethnic cleansing we would see will be unprecedented in modern times. If they overrun the Kurds that's a loss of a major US ally in the region. There's a lot of factors in play.

Fair enough, but those areas are also full of people who are quite hostile to ISIS and quite experienced in warfare themselves. Even the largest estimate of ISIS' size on Wikipedia is 100,000 (e: the CIA places the number at 20,000-31,500 for comparison). There are eight million Kurds in Iraqi Kurdistan, and they have been doing the guerrilla thing for a lot longer than ISIS has. Their official armed forces are 200,000 strong, but I somehow doubt that the whole faction that were Maoists signed up. Wikipedia has the total Peshmerga (the term refers to the regular army and irregulars) at 375,000, via CBS.

ISIS could grow via recruiting. After all, there are a lot of Suuni Muslims out there, and they're the hot poo poo right now. On the other hand, they'd have to double the most pessimistic estimate of their numbers to even match official Kurdish forces. Assuming the Kurds don't recruit and train more of their people for some reason.

So I'm thinking that such fears are a little overblown. ISIS has had a lot of success filling a vacuum. That might not translate so well to determined opposition from well-armed and trained people with a good century of having to fight just to survive under their belt. Or even just against a nation or group that isn't in utter civil chaos.

That said, I have no particular sympathy for ISIS. I just think that boxing them into playing by the same rules that keep other states in the region poor and powerless (in theory until they shape up but probably just forever) is a better strategy than hoping the next group drawn from exactly the same group of people is somehow nicer this time.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:16

Fried Chicken: Jan 9, 2011; Don't fry me, I'm no chicken!

radical meme posted:

Oh God drat it! And it had to be a black man; couldn't have been a mentally unstable white guy, gently caress no.

I find a bit of perverse pleasure* that we haven't had a mass shooter since Elliot Rodgers. His manifesto was so loving pathetic that even the would be Adam Lanzas, James Holmes, Seung-Hui Chos and Steven Kazmierczaks of the world don't want anything to do with him or what he did.

* you know, in addition to genuine relief that we've managed to go a few months where we've been limited to spates of general gun violence rather than another massacre

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:28

Duke Igthorn: Oct 11, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

Cheekio posted:

Next up, Josh Earnest is back, answering dumber questions than ever: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uJa7ozEIju0

Reporter: "Can you agree that the statement, "Al Queda has been decimated", was incorrect?"

JE: "No, Al Queda has been decimated."

Reporter: "How can you say that?"

JE: "Because they're mostly dead, had to flee the country, are a shadow of their former organization"

Reporter: "What does that have to do with it?"

"Mission Accomplished"
"Oh, alright. Good job."

Liberal media indeed.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:34

Shear Modulus: Jun 9, 2010

Joementum posted:

First Look hired Gawker's editor and pivoted Taibbi's site to be a publisher of "news, commentary, information, non-downloadable audio and visual media, and� editorial articles in the fields of government, politics, finance, business, sports, the media, entertainment, humor, arts and culture". So they're basically waiting for their coders to clone Kinja.

Wait, so they basically hired Taibbi and said he was going to publish awesome Taibbi stuff on his sweet Taibbi site then changed their minds to make it a lovely aggregator or something? That sucks.

I followed Greenwald off-and-on while he was at the Guardian but always forget about his new thing until I think about Taibbi and am reminded of GG by their association. I wonder if this is a pattern and Greenwald's site didn't get the readership they hoped for so they decided to compromise Taibbi's thing.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:34

InequalityGodzilla: May 31, 2012

Petr posted:

Not THE final boss battle, but a boss battle, yes. I love this thread. Eric Holder resigns, but the obvious bored 13-year-old troll commands more attention from the US Politics thread.

The worst part is when I read that post I thought to myself "he sounds like that mad doctor from Bioshock" but the only quote of his that I remembered was the whole "This one, too fat! This one, too tall! This one, too...symmetrical!" So I completely missed that he was referencing him explicitly. I got out-nerded

Hodgepodge posted:

Last I checked, food derails were the most beloved of all derails. Except maybe ~~beer~~boozechat.

FTFY I don't think most of us are hitting stuff as soft as beer.

radical meme posted:

Oh God drat it! And it had to be a black man; couldn't have been a mentally unstable white guy, gently caress no.

Silly boy, no good white guy would ever convert to the religion of evil :rolleyes:

Fried Chicken posted:

I find a bit of perverse pleasure* that we haven't had a mass shooter since Elliot Rodgers. His manifesto was so loving pathetic that even the would be Adam Lanzas, James Holmes, Seung-Hui Chos and Steven Kazmierczaks of the world don't want anything to do with him or what he did.

* you know, in addition to genuine relief that we've managed to go a few months where we've been limited to spates of general gun violence rather than another massacre

I knew it felt like it'd been too long since some common occurance happened, I just hadn't been able to place what. Turns out it was some nutter killing a handful of people with guns.

:smith:

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:36

Fried Chicken: Jan 9, 2011; Don't fry me, I'm no chicken!

Shear Modulus posted:

Wait, so they basically hired Taibbi and said he was going to publish awesome Taibbi stuff on his sweet Taibbi site then changed their minds to make it a lovely aggregator or something? That sucks.

I followed Greenwald off-and-on while he was at the Guardian but always forget about his new thing until I think about Taibbi and am reminded of GG by their association. I wonder if this is a pattern and Greenwald's site didn't get the readership they hoped for so they decided to compromise Taibbi's thing.

Yeah, First Look has really been rolling back in scope. Initially they were pitching to launch 8 online news magazines. Then after months of silence it was 2. Then 1. Then an Andrew Sullivan style of links and fast takes. Now it's just... It

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:37

Hodgepodge: Jan 29, 2006; Can't post for 206 days!

I should mention that the other potential response to ISIS would be something along the lines of peacekeeping. But that didn't really have the political will behind it to succeed the first time, and is as practical a solution as pixie dust in present-day politics.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 19:52

sugar free jazz: Mar 5, 2008

JT Jag posted:

If they spread beyond the Sunni- controlled areas of Iraq and Syria the scale of ethnic cleansing we would see will be unprecedented in modern times.

We've seen some pretty fabulous examples of ethnic cleansing over the past, say, 50 years or so (e.g. Indonesia, Cambodia). I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd love (hate) to see numbers supporting this if you've got em handy.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 21:45

Sir Tonk: Apr 18, 2006; Young Orc

Meanwhile, in Of Course That's The Case news.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/dinesh-dsouza-ex-wife-court-document

quote:

Conservative filmmaker Dinesh D'Souza's ex-wife alleged in a letter sent this week to the federal court that heard his criminal case that D'Souza was abusive, that he lied in his defense against the criminal charges, and implied D'Souza had manipulated the couple's daughter into making positive public statements about him.

In addition to addressing the illegal campaign contributions, Dixie accused D'Souza of physical abuse and suggested that he might have manipulated their daughter into making positive statements on his behalf.

"It is my husband who has an abusive nature," she wrote. "In one instance, it was my husband who physically abused me in April 2012 when he, using purple belt karate skills, kicked me in the head and shoulder, knocking me to the ground and creating injuries that pain me to this day."

"The most painful part of his conduct is his use of our daughter to bolster his character," she wrote elsewhere in the letter. "Dinesh has allowed, and perhaps encouraged, her to submit a letter to a federal judge that he knows is patently false. I am hurt and dismayed by untrue statements in our daughter's letter."

In summary, Dixie labeled D'Souza a liar.

"Dinesh lied to me, he lied to the government, he encouraged others to lie for him, and now he has allowed our daughter to submit multiple false statements to a federal court in order to avoid punishment," she wrote. "Dinesh D'Souza is not a truthful person."

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:02

JT Jag: Aug 30, 2009; #1 Jaguars Sunk Cost Fallacy-Haver

sugar free jazz posted:

We've seen some pretty fabulous examples of ethnic cleansing over the past, say, 50 years or so (e.g. Indonesia, Cambodia). I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd love (hate) to see numbers supporting this if you've got em handy.

It was a slightly baseless statement, but just a guess based on the population density of the region. We've already seen ISIS set out on campaigns to exterminate entire Sunni tribes that don't play their game, and they won't treat people of other denominations any better than that.

If ISIS got control of the entirety of Iraq, well, Iraq's population is more than twice that of Cambodia's today and five times that of Cambodia's population when the Khmer Rouge took over. Baghdad alone has a larger population than Cambodia in 1975. The deaths if ISIS managed to take it would be hideous.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:04

zoux: Apr 28, 2006

Sir Tonk posted:

Meanwhile, in Of Course That's The Case news.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/dinesh-dsouza-ex-wife-court-document

"Using purple belt karate skills..."

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:06

My Imaginary GF: Jul 17, 2005; by R. Guyovich

Sir Tonk posted:

Meanwhile, in Of Course That's The Case news.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/dinesh-dsouza-ex-wife-court-document

This is why you don't get married and have kids in politics when you do illegal things: the moment the gravy stops flowing, the claws come out.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:06

hobbesmaster: Jan 28, 2008

sugar free jazz posted:

We've seen some pretty fabulous examples of ethnic cleansing over the past, say, 50 years or so (e.g. Indonesia, Cambodia). I'm not saying you're wrong, but I'd love (hate) to see numbers supporting this if you've got em handy.

Its going to hinge on his definition of "modern times," its going to be hard to beat :godwinning:

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:09

JT Jag: Aug 30, 2009; #1 Jaguars Sunk Cost Fallacy-Haver

hobbesmaster posted:

Its going to hinge on his definition of "modern times," its going to be hard to beat

Post-war era, definitely.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:10

Die Sexmonster!: Nov 30, 2005

Sir Tonk posted:

Meanwhile, in Of Course That's The Case news.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/dinesh-dsouza-ex-wife-court-document

Jesus. I knew he was wrong about a lot of things, but I didn't quite realize he was this level of shitheel.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:10

sugar free jazz: Mar 5, 2008

JT Jag posted:

It was a slightly baseless statement, but just a guess based on the population density of the region. We've already seen ISIS set out on campaigns to exterminate entire Sunni tribes that don't play their game, and they won't treat people of other denominations any better than that.

If ISIS got control of the entirety of Iraq, well, Iraq's population is more than twice that of Cambodia's today and five times that of Cambodia's population when the Khmer Rouge took over. Baghdad alone has a larger population than Cambodia in 1975. The deaths if ISIS managed to take it would be hideous.

Oh word. I'm not saying it wouldn't be horrendous, it would, but it likely wouldn't be as bad as something like Cambodia. There are a lot of factors that let that happen that aren't present in Iraq, and I think the context is such that the reprisals would probably be worse. Y'never know though, so hopefully we never find out.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:14

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

JT Jag posted:

It was a slightly baseless statement, but just a guess based on the population density of the region. We've already seen ISIS set out on campaigns to exterminate entire Sunni tribes that don't play their game, and they won't treat people of other denominations any better than that.

If ISIS got control of the entirety of Iraq, well, Iraq's population is more than twice that of Cambodia's today and five times that of Cambodia's population when the Khmer Rouge took over. Baghdad alone has a larger population than Cambodia in 1975. The deaths if ISIS managed to take it would be hideous.

It would seem more likely that the Kurds and Iranians, who probably would be marginally less mass-kill-y, would roll in at that point. Ironically isn't that basically what happened in Cambodia, the NVA got sick of having these butchers next door and went in and crushed the Khmer Rouge?

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:15

Sir Tonk: Apr 18, 2006; Young Orc

Also, Lt Gov Dewhurst is a loving moron.

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/david-dewhurst-prayer-rugs-constitutional-right-mexican-border

quote:

"Prayer rugs have recently been found on the Texas side of the border in the brush," Dewhurst said during a speech Friday at the Values Voter Summit, echoing a claim reported on Breitbart and thought to actually be an Adidas soccer jersey.

Dewhurst went on to say that he believed that states had the right to "act independently of the government" when it comes to border country.

Guess that's what happens when you lose your primary and need a job after you leave office.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:16

zoux: Apr 28, 2006

It's not a recent thing.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:19

Boon: Jun 21, 2005; by R. Guyovich

Nessus posted:

It would seem more likely that the Kurds and Iranians, who probably would be marginally less mass-kill-y, would roll in at that point. Ironically isn't that basically what happened in Cambodia, the NVA got sick of having these butchers next door and went in and crushed the Khmer Rouge?

The Iranians probably. The Kurds not so much, they originally thought they could sit on the sidelines and they'd be left alone - they're currently just as embattled as the rest of the region.

My take, the Iranians are probably the only country currently poised to swiftly end the threat of ISIS, and that is not in our or really most of the Middle East's long term political interest and definitely not in Iraq's short term interest either.

Boon fucked around with this message at 22:30 on Sep 26, 2014

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:27

My Imaginary GF: Jul 17, 2005; by R. Guyovich

IL Polichat: Indictments being handed down. Expect more former politicos in prison soon.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:27

JT Jag: Aug 30, 2009; #1 Jaguars Sunk Cost Fallacy-Haver

sugar free jazz posted:

Oh word. I'm not saying it wouldn't be horrendous, it would, but it likely wouldn't be as bad as something like Cambodia. There are a lot of factors that let that happen that aren't present in Iraq, and I think the context is such that the reprisals would probably be worse. Y'never know though, so hopefully we never find out.

That was the worst case scenario if ISIS was left alone for several years. Which of course isn't happening. Now we just have to worry about the fact that the region is being destabilized even more than it already was by a new Western bombing campaign, and the ramifications that will have in the future.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:30

Sir Tonk: Apr 18, 2006; Young Orc

zoux posted:

It's not a recent thing.

Yeah, it was proven false a few months ago. Which makes him talking about it even more ridiculous than the idea itself.

It shouldn't matter if a prayer rug is found on the ground somewhere in the first place, but the GOP has somehow made it even more absurd when they decided to lie about finding one.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:31

sugar free jazz: Mar 5, 2008

Nessus posted:

It would seem more likely that the Kurds and Iranians, who probably would be marginally less mass-kill-y, would roll in at that point. Ironically isn't that basically what happened in Cambodia, the NVA got sick of having these butchers next door and went in and crushed the Khmer Rouge?

If I remember right, Camboda started a war with Vietnam and started a massive internal purge at the same time, which hosed poo poo up bad. Had they only done one or the other, things would be very different in Cambodia right now.

But yeah there'd probably be international pressure in Iraq that wasn't really present in Cambodia because of the Chinese patronage and the fact that ISIS is not the internationally recognized government. Context if Iraq is, lookin at history, relatively safe.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:31

zoux: Apr 28, 2006

Sir Tonk posted:

Yeah, it was proven false a few months ago. Which makes him talking about it even more ridiculous than the idea itself.

It shouldn't matter if a prayer rug is found on the ground somewhere in the first place, but the GOP has somehow made it even more absurd when they decided to lie about finding one.

No I mean his idiocy isn't new.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:31

Sir Tonk: Apr 18, 2006; Young Orc

My Imaginary GF posted:

IL Polichat: Indictments being handed down. Expect more former politicos in prison soon.

Finally, the White House chef's reign of culinary terror will come to an end!

zoux posted:

No I mean his idiocy isn't new.

Oh sorry, I forget not everyone is from Texas. We've accepted that every Governor since we let Ann Richards lose is going to be a moron.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:34

My Imaginary GF: Jul 17, 2005; by R. Guyovich

Sir Tonk posted:

Finally, the White House chef's reign of culinary terror will come to an end!

I don't often play the race card, why are you against soul food in the white house?

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:36

NoEyedSquareGuy: Mar 16, 2009; Just because Liquor's dead, doesn't mean you can just roll this bitch all over town with "The Freedoms."

Fried Chicken posted:

Yeah, First Look has really been rolling back in scope. Initially they were pitching to launch 8 online news magazines. Then after months of silence it was 2. Then 1. Then an Andrew Sullivan style of links and fast takes. Now it's just... It

To be fair, they at least added a "coming soon" thing to the front page not too long ago regarding Taibbi's contribution to Firstlook. It only links to the introduction article that was written back in February when the site first launched, but it's at least an indication that Taibbi's online mag isn't dead in the water or anything.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:38

Kitfox88: Aug 21, 2007; Anybody lose their glasses?

Evil Fluffy posted:

Apparetly someone shot a random kid in New Jersey as their own personal Jihad as well recently and, well, I've seen all the white wing people I have on Facebook post about it.

Only one or two of them have posted anything about the crazy loving survivalist kid who shot a police barracks and killed an officer, wounded another, and is still on the loose (or was when I last read about it a few days ago).

He's still on the loose, yeah. Local opinion in my town which is an hour or so from where it happened is he must have went into the woods and shot himself afterwards and they haven't found the body yet. :downs:

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:43

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

Sir Tonk posted:

Finally, the White House chef's reign of culinary terror will come to an end!

Oh sorry, I forget not everyone is from Texas. We've accepted that every Governor since we let Ann Richards lose is going to be a moron.

Dewhurst was never Governor of Texas, he is Lt. Governor of Texas a position with vastly different responsibilities under the Texas Constitution.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 22:44

Venusian Weasel: Nov 18, 2011

My Imaginary GF posted:

IL Polichat: Indictments being handed down. Expect more former politicos in prison soon.

Ooh, who is it this time?

# ? Sep 26, 2014 23:27

My Imaginary GF: Jul 17, 2005; by R. Guyovich

Venusian Weasel posted:

Ooh, who is it this time?

Burris, Quinn, Rauner: Pick 2.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 23:30

Joementum: May 23, 2004; jesus christ

Maybe not the best idea for an image and slogan to go along with Dallas. :shrug:

# ? Sep 26, 2014 23:36

beatlegs: Mar 11, 2001

Pyroxene Stigma posted:

Jesus. I knew he was wrong about a lot of things, but I didn't quite realize he was this level of shitheel.

I'm not surprised. Actually I've always been very suspicious how a person with horrible, cruel political views could be a decent human being personally.

# ? Sep 26, 2014 23:36

radical meme: Apr 17, 2009; by Fluffdaddy

Joementum posted:

Maybe not the best idea for an image and slogan to go along with Dallas.

drat it, I just blew Dr. Pepper outta my nose and all over my laptop.

# ? Sep 27, 2014 00:01

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# ? Jun 3, 2024 16:42

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

Joementum posted:

Maybe not the best idea for an image and slogan to go along with Dallas.

Maybe they're going for a subtle "Dallas: Where Democrats are Murdered" vibe?

# ? Sep 27, 2014 00:02

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > USPOL September - No one's impeaching anyone!

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