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To say they got sued because someone said mean things to him his oversimplifying to the point of dishonesty. They went to a conference in another country with the intent of disrupting that conference. They wanted to make a noise and raise about how lenient the sentence was, and they did, which I no doubt would too. They didn't just say mean things.
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Nov 7, 2014 13:10
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Pissflaps posted:On economic grounds. You can certainly make the exact opposite argument, that by forcing wages down and keeping competition for jobs high, unfettered immigration is actually much more of a capitalist policy than a socialist one (and indeed, No2EU is a socialist anti-EU party on exactly those grounds).
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Nov 7, 2014 13:12
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Ludicro posted:Since when are "animal", "killer" and "charlatan" racist insults? Also the doctor had a suspended sentence, he hasn't actually gone to prison. Fair enough, I didn't know anything about the original case except what is says in the article. But it's hard to deny calling an actual GP those things when he is from Africa has some unfortunate connotations. Edit: Also if you think that similar things (confusing drugs to the point where it kills someone) never happen in the healthcare system I don't know what to tell you. What difference does it make that he wasn't British? I can't find anything directly saying that his alleged lack of competence in English was the reason for his mistake and he was a properly employed medical practitioner. Yes, maybe he should have stayed in the UK after the fact but given that he was struck from the register he would have to live unsupported in a foreign country only to face criminal judgement, which he did have to face anyway. Private Speech fucked around with this message at 14:32 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 14:13
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Pissflaps posted:On economic grounds. I mean ideally conditions worldwide would be fair enough that the pressures to emigrate/immigrate vanish, but in the meantime it feels right to empathise with people who move here. ThomasPaine posted:Fyi the indy question wasn't a 'right-wing' ideology 1. In the context of this thread, leaving Burqa King's argument from an emotional perspective go by without offering an emotional counterargument seemed like a bad move. 2. Outside the context of this thread, letting the immigration debate be framed as "Neoliberals Vs. Xenophobes (Whoever wins, we lose)" also seems like a bad move. 3. That there was a bit of a parallel (maybe not a big one) between this and the inability of No to offer a clear "heart-winning" case for staying together leading to a much closer contest than it would have been if they had made a better case.
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Nov 7, 2014 14:43
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goddamnedtwisto posted:You can certainly make the exact opposite argument, that by forcing wages down and keeping competition for jobs high, unfettered immigration is actually much more of a capitalist policy than a socialist one (and indeed, No2EU is a socialist anti-EU party on exactly those grounds). Keir Hardie posted:For the second time in their history Messrs. Merry and Cunninghame have introduced a number of Russian Poles to Glengarnock Ironworks. What object they have in doing so is beyond human ken unless it is, as stated by a speaker at Irvine, to teach men how to live on garlic and oil, or introduce the Black Death, so as to get rid of the surplus labourers. and that's why I'll never vote Labour 
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Nov 7, 2014 14:54
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Osbourne has got the £1.7 billion EU bill halved and differed until after the election, which was probably in the works all along.
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Nov 7, 2014 14:59
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Well Cameron did say he wouldn't pay on December 1st! Meanwhile The Mirror has done a pretty great thing taking apart those HMRC "where are taxes get spent" letters http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/whats-governments-misleading-tax-summaries-4573488   Also they wrote a nice thing about why the EU is good (and explaining it costs you £34 a year rather than OMG £50MILLION A DAY) makes it sound less extreme http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/ampp3d/what-your-34-year-eu-4557485
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Nov 7, 2014 15:15
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dadrips posted:This is the position that one of the much-lauded founding fathers of Labour, Keir Hardie, had regarding Lithuanian immigrants in the early 20th century. Can I ask which way you do vote?
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Nov 7, 2014 15:28
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Burqa King posted:Can I ask which way you do vote? If there's no Green candidate next year I might just hold my nose and vote SNP.
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Nov 7, 2014 15:32
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Ludicro posted:Since when are "animal", "killer" and "charlatan" racist insults? Calling black men 'animals' is one of the oldest racist slurs out there, dude. Even if it wasn't meant that way, it has bad connotations.
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Nov 7, 2014 16:11
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Pissflaps posted:Osbourne has got the £1.7 billion EU bill halved and differed until after the election, which was probably in the works all along. i believe actually it's half paid in cash & half off the rebate that the UK would be due next year. so the total bill ain't changed.
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Nov 7, 2014 16:35
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Cerv posted:i believe actually it's half paid in cash & half off the rebate that the UK would be due next year. http://www.thedailymash.co.uk/news/international/eu-threatens-to-install-prepayment-meter-2014110792591
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Nov 7, 2014 16:43
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Darth Walrus posted:Calling black men 'animals' is one of the oldest racist slurs out there, dude. Even if it wasn't meant that way, it has bad connotations. People who kill people and don't express remorse have also been called animals throughout history, Darth Walrus.
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Nov 7, 2014 16:45
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dadrips posted:At the last General Election I voted Lib Dem because I wanted constitutional reform, PR and sensible drug laws. whoops You know the Lib Dems still support those things, right?
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Nov 7, 2014 17:12
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Tiran Dirth posted:You know the Lib Dems still support those things, right?
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Nov 7, 2014 17:23
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dadrips posted:Yep, and they made a complete horse's arse out of all of them by going into coalition with the party least likely to be amenable to implementing any of them. Whenever I bring this up with Lib Dems they usually crow about how going into coalition with the Tories was a necessary evil and point out the few policies they've managed to enact which aren't completely horrible, but they're more than outweighed by the damage done by enabling one of the most comically-evil incarnations of the Tories yet. The policies they've enacted might be outweighed, but what about the damage that may have been caused by a minority government unable to form a proper response to the banking crisis?
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Nov 7, 2014 17:43
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Prince John posted:The policies they've enacted might be outweighed, but what about the damage that may have been caused by a minority government unable to form a proper response to the banking crisis? I promise you from the depths of the black pit where my soul was before I sold it while studying economics, doing absolutely gently caress all would have been better than austerity. Also we'd have all had a jolly good laugh at watching the tories dissolve a government after a few weeks, causing them to be unelectable for quite a while.
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Nov 7, 2014 17:48
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Prince John posted:The policies they've enacted might be outweighed, but what about the damage that may have been caused by a minority government unable to form a proper response to the banking crisis? There were a whole bunch of possibilities that would have been favourable to a Lib-Con coalition. A Liberal/Labour/SNP coalition would have been favourable to having a Tory Prime minister. Gordon Brown responded to the banking crisis, and quite effectively at that. The Tories came in to make cuts, not to reform the financial sector.
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Nov 7, 2014 17:48
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Three party coalitions are an insane idea. It makes a whip completely useless and would render any government unable to pass bills about jam and dog breeding, let alone stuff that might reach the papers.
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Nov 7, 2014 17:54
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A liberal-labour-SNP coalition would also have disregarded the party that achieved the most votes (>2 million more) on election day which might sit uncomfortably with our democratic ideals. The consequences of austerity could be listed as prolonging the recession, increasing unemployment and an increase in human misery among the more vulnerable in our society. Does that really compare with the damage that might have been caused by the collapse of the banking system, the inevitable run on thinly capitalised banks that would have occurred, the loss of everybody's life savings, loss of access to capital markets etc. if nothing had been done? Prince John fucked around with this message at 18:19 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 18:14
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Prince John posted:A liberal-labour-SNP coalition would also have disregarded the party that achieved the most votes on election day which might sit uncomfortably with our democratic ideals. What democratic ideals? UKIP will get less than ten seats despite probably pulling in more than 10% of the vote come election day. See also Lib Dems, 2007-2011 rip. Prince John posted:The consequences of austerity could be listed as prolonging the recession, increasing unemployment and an increase in human misery among the more vulnerable in our society. Does that really compare with the damage that might have been caused by the collapse of the banking system, the inevitable run on thinly capitalised banks that would have occurred, the loss of everybody's life savings, loss of access to capital markets etc.? You're vastly understating what austerity does (it's outright economic suicide, if we had proper understanding of the impact of economics on countries Germany would be up before a human rights court), and vastly overstating what happens when you tell banks to gently caress off and die. Iceland has the best growth and not everybody there died. I'm aware it's not totally comparable but this lie that lovely companies should just keep existing or else we all die is part of the problem.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:19
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Spangly A posted:What democratic ideals? UKIP will get less than ten seats despite probably pulling in more than 10% of the vote come election day. See also Lib Dems, 2007-2011 rip. Yeah, I was thinking about Iceland when I wrote the reply and debated whether to reference it. I agree with your caveat about comparability, but it's worth noting that you still can't buy Icelandic Krona outside of Iceland - if the same applied to the UK and the rest of the world couldn't buy pounds, wouldn't that have a considerable knock-on effect on our international services? They're also missing a lot of 'typical' international shops/businesses as a result of the exchange controls. I may be overstating the impact of a bank sector collapse, but to be honest, I find it hard to imagine the consequences of an event so unprecedented and far-reaching. I can't shake the feeling that it would be catastrophic for an economy as complex as the UK's.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:24
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Also you can bail out banks and do QE and whatever else, without also imposing austerity through a crusade to run down the national deficit. Because the two things are unrelated
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Nov 7, 2014 18:26
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Prince John posted:A liberal-labour-SNP coalition would also have disregarded the party that achieved the most votes (>2 million more) on election day which might sit uncomfortably with our democratic ideals. Erm... what has the current Government done to prevent the collapse of the banking industry, exactly? Their main economic policy has provably weakened the economy and financial sector (to the point where even the World Bank and the credit reference agencies were telling Osborne to chill the gently caress out), and they've gleefully dismantled even the figleaf regulations erected in the late naughties in response to the credit crunch and bailouts.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:29
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Prince John posted:it's worth noting that you still can't buy Icelandic Krona outside of Iceland Do you mean you can't buy them on a large scale or they aren't traded in the same way other currencies are or what? Because when I went to Iceland earlier in the year I bought a whole bunch of Krona in the UK, I think I got them from M&S.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:30
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Prince John posted:
Yeah, like it or lump it (lump it lump it LUMP IT) our economy is ridiculously overspecialized in the finance sector, it's one of the main reasons (in my opinion) that London has that bowling-ball-on-a-rubber-sheet effect; if we still made things, the sheer footage of factories would probably move some of the focus from the capital. Even beyond all the issues we mentioned, if we let the banks fail we'd be erasing a huge chunk of our GDP. We need to structure our incentives in a way that rebalances the economy the gently caress away from finance but until then we are absolutely at their mercy  Put money into things we're good at, sell it to other people: that's the only way we reduce the banking stanglehold. We make globally competitive, what, post secondary degrees, entertainment and technology, and research and development (correct me if I've forgotten anything)? That's where we need to focus. e: and as Twisto rightly says, until we can get the gently caress away from finance we at very least need to pass loving laws that try to control them, which the current government is making no effort to do. CoolCab fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Nov 7, 2014 |
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Nov 7, 2014 18:32
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An "Anyone But The Tories" coalition was, in effect, impossible with the results of the election. Either it was "anyone but the Tories and the DUP", which would've had a majority of nine, or it included the DUP; it isn't unheard of Labour to make deals with Ulster unionists to get laws passed (see: Winter of Discontent, 42-day detention). On paper, an "literally anyone but the Tories" has a majority of 37. But Sinn Fein doesn't take the oath of office, which knocks it down to 32. Labour getting one more deputy speaker than the Tories (as the Speaker was elected from the Tory benches) knocks the majority down to 31. Then you've got to consider the fact that the SNP, by convention, don't vote on English matters. That majority of 37 is now down to 25: only four more than Major won with in 1992. Then you've got to consider that it would be unlikely, and maybe also unpalatable for the Lib Dems and Greens (and possibly even the DUP themselves), for Brown to be able to get the DUP around the cabinet table. More than anything, they would've stormed out on rescinding the blood ban, let alone same-sex marriage. Suddenly the strong rainbow coalition is anything but, and only a few by-elections could then give the Tories the balance of power. And given Brown was perceived to be an "unelected" Prime Minister anyway, both Labour and any of the minor rainbow coalition partners would be heavily punished for "stealing" the election for years to come. That's not even considering the risk of Blue Labour and Orange Bookers crossing the floor.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:34
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CoolCab posted:We make globally competitive, what, post secondary degrees, entertainment and technology, and research and development (correct me if I've forgotten anything)? That's where we need to focus. Also cheese. e: and crisps.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:34
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Erm... what has the current Government done to prevent the collapse of the banking industry, exactly? Their main economic policy has provably weakened the economy and financial sector (to the point where even the World Bank and the credit reference agencies were telling Osborne to chill the gently caress out), and they've gleefully dismantled even the figleaf regulations erected in the late naughties in response to the credit crunch and bailouts. I guess I would pick the Banking Reform Act ringfencing investment/high street banking, the creation of the Prudential Regulation Authority and Financial Conduct Authority and scrapping of the FSA and giving depositors preferential status if a bank becomes insolvent. You're right though, I was conflating the bailout with the 2010 General Election which was dumb, apologies. Mr. Brown gets credit for the heavy lifting on that one I suppose.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:40
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big scary monsters posted:Do you mean you can't buy them on a large scale or they aren't traded in the same way other currencies are or what? Because when I went to Iceland earlier in the year I bought a whole bunch of Krona in the UK, I think I got them from M&S. That's interesting, I couldn't get them at the airport when I went in January this year and was told the reason was capital controls and "you can't get them here, you have to wait until you land". Maybe it was relaxed between our two visits? Edit: This must be why: End of 2013 posted:Tourists heading to Iceland this winter should plan their holiday money in advance due to shortages in Icelandic krona in Britain, according to M&S Bank.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:43
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Huh, strange. I went in February and didn't hear anything about it, I guess it was just a shortage of Krona in the UK rather than an intentional policy.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:49
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Iceland still has capital controls.
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Nov 7, 2014 18:54
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Ha, the Tories spent the day gloating about getting the EU to halve our agreed budget contribution top up, and now someone at the treasury has stomped on it by admitting the rest will be subtracted from the rebate.
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Nov 7, 2014 19:57
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Not sure how they thought they'd get away with this but even the boot licking BBC is giving them stick.TinTower posted:An "Anyone But The Tories" coalition was, in effect, impossible with the results of the election. Either it was "anyone but the Tories and the DUP", which would've had a majority of nine, or it included the DUP; it isn't unheard of Labour to make deals with Ulster unionists to get laws passed (see: Winter of Discontent, 42-day detention). All good points that still feel hard to accept when compared to the incredible damage the Tories have done with their non-majority non-mandate. But that's hind sight I guess. I just think that absolutely anything should have been done to stop this last four years. It's not just the actual changes to policy. It's the constant poisoning of society. It has been nothing but the demonisation of the poor, the disabled, the foreign, the EU, Badgers. They've successfully turned us into a very negative culture. It would be interesting to see if the Daily Mail has sold better these last couple of years because I listen to people and they have nothing good to say. nothing happy about their own lives or anyone around them. They feel miserable and wish misery on others. It did not feel this bad even in the darkest days of Labour. The fuckers have barely governed the country and just seemed to put things on autopilot but as agents of changing society for the worst they've been amazingly successful. Regarde Aduck fucked around with this message at 01:47 on Nov 8, 2014 |
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Nov 8, 2014 01:37
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Animals are killing people in the NHS this loving animal was administering care for an elderly patient who died just hours afterwards.
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Nov 8, 2014 06:28
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Tories reveal new private health providers animal hospital. It was a fully registered horse practioner. Horse-pital.
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Nov 8, 2014 09:55
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Ekx3xK4qXU
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Nov 8, 2014 10:48
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namesake posted:Horse-pital.
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Nov 8, 2014 10:53
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Semprini posted:The patient's condition is stable. For this horse pun, you shall face my unbridled wrath.
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Nov 8, 2014 12:00
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Regarde Aduck posted:Not sure how they thought they'd get away with this but even the boot licking BBC is giving them stick. I dont buy this. If you hang round with negative nancies then you will feel more pessimistic and live a shorter life. But you have the power to change that. You can begin by paying less attention to the news.
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Nov 8, 2014 12:11
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