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Eiba posted:Really? Is it that obvious? I've lived in both countries and know a bit of each language. I'm not aware of any mainstream linguist who claims a close relationship between Korean and Japanese. The grammars resemble each other and use a lot of Chinese loanwords, but that's a superficial similarity.
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Nov 16, 2014 13:38
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Grand Fromage posted:Is there any commonly accepted theory on how languages from different families can have near identical grammar? I don't know much about Korean or Japanese, so I can't say much about that case, but if you look at the Balkan sprachbund, you'll notice that very distantly related languages like Albanian, Serbian, Romanian and Greek all came to share grammatical features due to contact. It happens. With the Japonic/Altaic thing you've got this inconvenient truth, in that what's usually grouped as Altaic (Uralic, Mongolian, Turkic, Siberian, Korean Japanese) do feel very similar in terms of phonology and even grammar, but there's just no proper science to prove any real connection with them, the vocabularies don't match at all.
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Nov 16, 2014 14:42
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Ras Het posted:I don't know much about Korean or Japanese, so I can't say much about that case, but if you look at the Balkan sprachbund, you'll notice that very distantly related languages like Albanian, Serbian, Romanian and Greek all came to share grammatical features due to contact. It happens. Yeah I don't mean just Korean and Japanese, but in general. Sticking to the area, Korean and Japanese are very similar but Korean and Chinese don't really have anything in common beyond the Chinese vocabulary, and historically Korea and China have a stronger connection to one another so it seems strange.
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Nov 16, 2014 14:58
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South Korea does use hanja (chinese characters) quite a bit, particularly in the workplace. Students learn around 2,000 during their school days. Hanja is used somewhat in newspapers as well. I've been to some offices, and in highly technical places like power plants there is a lot of hanja. The government is even thinking of moving to use hanja more, given that so many people need to use it for their job.Grand Fromage posted:Yeah I don't mean just Korean and Japanese, but in general. Sticking to the area, Korean and Japanese are very similar but Korean and Chinese don't really have anything in common beyond the Chinese vocabulary, and historically Korea and China have a stronger connection to one another so it seems strange. Korean and Japanese are not in the same family. It's certainly easy for Koreans to learn Japanese and vice versa, but only a few fringe linguists group them into an Altaic super family. Off the top of my head, for instance, Korean has ending consonants while Japanese doesn't. Korean has sounds that Japanese doesn't have. Lots of other languages use SOV grammar, that doesn't make them related. FINGERBLASTER69 fucked around with this message at 16:39 on Nov 16, 2014 |
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Nov 16, 2014 16:23
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Grand Fromage posted:Yeah I don't mean just Korean and Japanese, but in general. Sticking to the area, Korean and Japanese are very similar but Korean and Chinese don't really have anything in common beyond the Chinese vocabulary, and historically Korea and China have a stronger connection to one another so it seems strange. It might be an ancient connection, from the time when Proto-Japonic speakers were still on the mainland. But again, the only academical thing I've read about this was an article about how misused data from Okinawan has corrupted a lot of historical studies of Japonic.
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Nov 16, 2014 16:38
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Nov 16, 2014 19:28
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What is going on in Alaska?
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Nov 16, 2014 20:16
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System Metternich posted:What is going on in Alaska?
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Nov 16, 2014 20:27
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System Metternich posted:What is going on in Alaska? A (very) temporary stay after Hamby v. Parnell ruled in favor of SSM.
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Nov 16, 2014 20:33
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"Activists in Saint-Petersburg flushed GPS-trackers through their toilets."
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Nov 17, 2014 01:54
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Kennel posted:"Activists in Saint-Petersburg flushed GPS-trackers through their toilets."
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Nov 17, 2014 02:31
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Eh, fish go in the ocean all the time, I'm sure it's fine.
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Nov 17, 2014 02:34
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Kennel posted:"Activists in Saint-Petersburg flushed GPS-trackers through their toilets." this would be such a great gambling race idea
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Nov 17, 2014 02:38
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While I think that's cool map it leaves me wondering how the GPS trackers got a GPS signal while underground when a lovely highway overpass is enough to gently caress up my cell phone 
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Nov 17, 2014 02:49
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Parallel Paraplegic posted:While I think that's cool map it leaves me wondering how the GPS trackers got a GPS signal while underground when a lovely highway overpass is enough to gently caress up my cell phone While I'm somewhat sceptical about it's credibility (just saw it randomly on Twitter), the area it covers is mostly outdoors (river).
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Nov 17, 2014 02:52
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Kennel posted:While I'm somewhat sceptical about it's credibility (just saw it randomly on Twitter), the area it covers is mostly outdoors (river). Oh duh, I was wondering why the sewer line in St. Petersburg apparently meandered so much 
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Nov 17, 2014 03:00
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Well, that crap's gotta go somewhere anyway, so why not send it to Sweden? EDIT ThePutty posted:this would be such a great gambling race idea 
fuck off Batman fucked around with this message at 09:13 on Nov 17, 2014 |
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Nov 17, 2014 09:11
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St. Petersburg is the kind of city where you have to boil the water before you drink it anyway if you don't want to get heavy metal poisoning or some poo poo, at that point why give a poo poo?
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Nov 17, 2014 09:57
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Randarkman posted:St. Petersburg is the kind of city where you have to boil the water before you drink it anyway if you don't want to get heavy metal poisoning or some poo poo, at that point why give a poo poo?
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Nov 17, 2014 10:52
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Strudel Man posted:I'm fairly sure that boiling water wouldn't do anything to prevent heavy metal poisoning. Boiling it away and condensing it would, though. 
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Nov 17, 2014 10:53
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Every still in Russia is already in use for more vital things. What's the best way to remove heavy metals from water without being as inefficient as distillation? Ion exchange column? Reverse osmosis?
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Nov 17, 2014 10:59
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Guavanaut posted:Every still in Russia is already in use for more vital things. Most people just a simple Brita-like charcoal filter, then boil it or boil it then use a filter. Also it isn't St.Petersburg but pretty much everywhere across Russia and most of the former Soviet Union. There are people who drink straight from the tap, but even when it is from a filter it is funky tasting. Also, I would not go near the water in St.Petersburg.
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Nov 17, 2014 11:26
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I'm pretty sure a city like St. Petersburg can afford a water treatment plant. It's probably just all the old Soviet-era sewer pipes leaking into everything around them.
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Nov 17, 2014 13:42
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waitwhatno posted:I'm pretty sure a city like St. Petersburg can afford a water treatment plant. It's probably just all the old Soviet-era sewer pipes leaking into everything around them. I wouldn't be too hard on the Russians here because even London's water and sewer pipes are a mess since WW2.
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Nov 17, 2014 13:49
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Riso posted:I wouldn't be too hard on the Russians here because even London's water and sewer pipes are a mess since WW2. St. Petersburg took it harder in WWII than anyone.
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Nov 17, 2014 14:04
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waitwhatno posted:I'm pretty sure a city like St. Petersburg can afford a water treatment plant. It's probably just all the old Soviet-era sewer pipes leaking into everything around them. Granted, it is still pretty bad in Moscow itself, obviously there are the monetary resources there but so much has been siphoned off one way or another it isn't a surprise they have broken down. It has been known for a while that the Soviet era infrastructure was deteriorating, if simply because very little maintenance was put into it, and even if you were working with a Western system it will only go so long before you need to replace the mains. It is even worse in other parts of the country simply because they get so little money from the central government itself so basically everything is left as is for years if not decades. Obviously, money would be better spent on water infrastructure, as unflashy as it sounds, rather than supertall skyscrapers, stadiums, giant ring roads or most bizarrely of all trying to fill in the gulf of Finland to build luxury flats. Granted, it is more or else how Putin's Russia has worked since 2000 and Yeltsin wasn't any different.
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Nov 17, 2014 14:36
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Randarkman posted:St. Petersburg is the kind of city where you have to boil the water before you drink it anyway if you don't want to get heavy metal poisoning or some poo poo, at that point why give a poo poo? I believe the giving of poo poo is precisely the problem.
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Nov 17, 2014 23:05
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Isn't Giardia endemic in St. Petersburg?
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Nov 17, 2014 23:09
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Romanian presidential elections 2014 Main contenders: Victor Ponta (prime minister, leader of the social democrat party) Klaus Iohannis (mayor of Sibiu, leader of the liberal party) First round (2 weeks ago) Red=Ponta, Blue=Iohannis, Green=hungarian guy, with percentages with which they won each county  Results: Ponta - 40% Iohannis - 30% And the old border between Austria-Hungary and the Kingdom of Romania, superimposed over the election map:  Second round (yesterday), winning percentages for each county  Final results: Ponta - 45.5% Iohannis - 54.5% - New President Notes - the 2 counties on the south east that turned blue form the region of Dobrogea, which is the only region of the country that's geographically in the Balkans, and the only region of Romania that used to be an integral part of the Ottoman Empire - Suceava, the north-eastern county that turned blue, used to be the first capital of the Principality of Moldova, and is the only Moldovan county that belonged to Austria for a while - Iasi, the eastern county that turned blue, has been the capital of the Principality of Moldova until mid 19th century when the union with Wallachia happened
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Nov 17, 2014 23:24
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The Romanians voted for the only remaining German in Romania, at least they're not xenophobes.
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Nov 17, 2014 23:30
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3peat posted:And the old border between Austria-Hungary and the Kingdom of Romania, superimposed over the election map:  
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Nov 17, 2014 23:49
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3peat posted:Romanian presidential elections 2014 What about Bucharest and the county north is that just a matter of the capital region being more of a microcosm as in other countries?
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Nov 18, 2014 00:02
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There's an interesting Vox article containing linguistic maps.
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Nov 18, 2014 00:21
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Rumda posted:What about Bucharest and the county north is that just a matter of the capital region being more of a microcosm as in other countries? Yea, Bucharest and the county around it (Ilfov) are pretty different from the rest of the south, as they're way richer and have a lot more educated people. In this particular election, the young, educated, and those that care about anti-corruption voted for Iohannis (well, it was more of a vote against Ponta's corruption scandals and dirty campaign), while the religious, nationalists, lesser educated and older people voted for Ponta. I talked about it some more it in the eastern europe thread, but in Romania the "social-democrats" are socially way more conservative than the "center-right" (they're very into nationalism, orthodoxy, the "traditional family", etc) while also managing to be more neo-liberal than the center-right (they're also more corrupt, tho all of the parties have corruption scandals), so the kind of people that would vote right-wing in the west are voting "social-democrat" in Romania.
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Nov 18, 2014 00:22
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frankenfreak posted:It's interesting how these old borders still influence things. This is the most interesting one to me, because it's clearly not for the obvious reason; there aren't many Germans left inside modern Poland, which means that there must still be something still structurally or culturally different between the German and Russian portions.
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Nov 18, 2014 00:24
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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I think its more the lasting effect of the Russian Empire than solely the shadow of the German
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Nov 18, 2014 00:29
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TinTower posted:There's an interesting Vox article containing linguistic maps. Pff, to have a median of 1.5 the number of single-language speakers has to be exactly equal to the multilingual population. Unlikely!
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Nov 18, 2014 00:42
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3peat, you're like the only Romanian goon I've seen around. Is there anything interesting about Braila, politically-loaded or not? That's where my Romanian half comes from.
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Nov 18, 2014 01:01
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3peat posted:
Interestingly, there was recently an article in a Norwegian newspaper about the upper secondary school dropouts statistics (it has been a really hot issue for the past year or more over here). Apparently the numbers are aggregated solely on the number of pupils that fail on a final exam for the given year, but we have the option to retake them at any point later on, which many are doing, so the number of actual dropouts (those that never reapply for an exam and has in effect never passed upper secondary school) might be closer to that of Finland or Denmark, or maybe even Sweden.
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Nov 18, 2014 01:06
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Vivian Darkbloom posted:Pff, to have a median of 1.5 the number of single-language speakers has to be exactly equal to the multilingual population. Unlikely! Perhaps 50% know 3 languages and 50% know 0? Bet you didn't think of that. 
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Nov 18, 2014 01:07
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