|
Bloody Wanker posted:So im trying to update the OP to be Gamma-worthy. The general go-to for cheap sticks seems to fall between the Thrustmaster offering and the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, with the only real difference between them being the Thrustmaster's throttle control. Ninjaedit: 
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 11:50 |
|
|
Gas thread, New thread when release hits, tia
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:35
|
|
|
When interdicting someone is there something you are supposed to be doing like when you are on the receiving end?
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:39
|
|
|
Ghost of Eazy E posted:When interdicting someone is there something you are supposed to be doing like when you are on the receiving end? Keep r reticle on ship.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:39
|
|
|
Ernie Muppari posted:i really can't get enough of nerds arguing over the financial minutia of running video game companies Stick around, we have the post release marketing analysis to pore over. Rotation Confusion posted:(EA has pulled off Steam) Not entirely, but am I right in thinking that you're comparing the noted publisher Electronic Arts with the developer Frontier? Edit: List of EA games not not found on Steam - http://store.steampowered.com/search/?snr=1_4_4__12&term=ea
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:41
|
|
|
Hav posted:Not entirely, but am I right in thinking that you're comparing the noted publisher Electronic Arts with the developer Frontier? I was really, really, really hoping someone would point that one out  Within the context of rev sharing and steam, I think it's relevant. Within the context of how a publisher manages a game post launch, I don't think it's relevant.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:46
|
|
|
Bloody Wanker posted:So im trying to update the OP to be Gamma-worthy. Not the thrustmaster but only good things to say about the Black Widow for £23. The only thing its missing is a second hat but I was happy using arrows for shields etc.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:48
|
|
|
Mr. Crow posted:Gas thread, New thread when release hits, tia Yea this btw A big rear end launch day OP and throw this thread on the pyre.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:54
|
|
|
Serious business going on over at my house, check it out: I am now ready to log in
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:55
|
|
|
Bloody Wanker posted:So im trying to update the OP to be Gamma-worthy. I got an X-55 and i love it honestly. Pros: + All the buttons + Good driver suite and you can set up velocity curves on the axes + Nice metal toggle switches + I can do literally everything in ED without touching the keyboard if i want to Cons: - Probably too many buttons actually, you're not going to use the split throttle in elite for example - Quality control issues though i think this has improved a lot, and their RMA process is an absolute bollocks if you get a bad one - I can't figure out how to get the nubbin mouse in the throttle working right - The metal toggle switches aren't actually switches they're more like bidirectional buttons - Might be a little big but i do have small hands I hear good things about the X52 but i hear you can't set velocity curves with it, it's linear or nothing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 21:56
|
|
|
Stanko-Prussian posted:I got an X-55 and i love it honestly. All good points about the X55, but You can write your name on the X52 Pro
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:00
|
|
|
LCL-Dead posted:The general go-to for cheap sticks seems to fall between the Thrustmaster offering and the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, with the only real difference between them being the Thrustmaster's throttle control. Also, don't forget this bad boy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qsrt_Sc4Seo Subject to availability, it actually might be the best budget joystick out there. Proper gimbals, magnetic sensors, dual trigger and badass Russian fighter jet aesthetic.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:14
|
|
|
Joystick Hierarchy: Thrustmaster Warthog: Very expensive ($400-500). Requires Pedals for yaw (+$50-100). Will last forever. Every button. Well made. Profile software designed by Satan. CH Products Fighterstick Pro and Throttle: Expensive ($230ish together). Very solidly built, could knock down a house with them. Throttle is linear glide which some ppl love some ppl hate. Saitech X-55: Expensive ($200). Great all around features. Iffy track record on durability. Plenty of buttons. Tech support terrible. Saitech X-52 Pro: Mid-range ($150). Good features. Good track record on durability recently; bad at launch. Enough buttons. Black. Tech support terrible. Saitech X-52: Mid-Range ($120). Good features. Good track record on durability recently; bad at launch. Has some plastic in places the Pro has metal. Enough buttons. Looks like a toy. Tech support terrible. Thrustmaster 16000M: Cheap ($50). OK features, base is nice and heavy. Good durability. You will need to keyboard a lot of button commands. Thrustmaster T-Flight HOTAS: Cheap ($40). Cheapest "hotas" and a good way to see if you'll like HOTAS. Not enough hats or buttons, so not equivalent to the above ones. Logitech Extreme 3D Pro: Cheap ($30). OK features. Good durability. You will need to keyboard a lot of button commands. In joysticks you want either "cheap and functional and I'm gonna use keyboard a lot" or you want "everything ever necessary in combat is done w/o taking hands off joysticks." To get the latter, you need 3 HATs + about 10 buttons (including triggers). All the HOTAS setups supply this (aside from the T-Flight). Most of the non-HOTAS setups do not supply this. You can also go with dual-stick, which is an insane way to fly maximizing 6DoF controls, but it's very hard to get enough HATs/buttons doing that as the better sticks are all right-handed only. Also, if you're going to dual-stick, either you're going to do a bunch of profile management or you should use two different sticks because Elite only looks at the general device ID and not the specific one, and with two of the same type of stick you will get Elite confused about which is which. Edit: There's lots of other ones out there, but they're all basically very difficult to find and if you're sticking to a general "joystick info" section for the new OP, leave em out. Rotation Confusion fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Dec 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:17
|
|
|
tooterfish posted:The Thrustmaster T16000m uses magnetic sensors instead of pots, so it outclasses pretty much every joystick in its price range in terms of accuracy and reliability. There's something called the Thrustmaster? That's just grand.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:18
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:I was really, really, really hoping someone would point that one out I'm speaking in terms of actually getting ANY sales. You're comparing EA, a company whose marketing budgets are routinely north of $20M, to Frontier, a company that barely hit 100,000 backers for it's long-awaited flagship game. I'm sure Steam's revenue sharing isn't great, but when you literally have dick for marketing, you might want to consider following one of those no-name indie companies. Hav posted:Stick around, we have the post release marketing analysis to pore over. Yaaaay 
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:20
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:Joystick Hierarchy: Probably worth adding the CH stuff to the Joystick list. The throttle is very good and I find the thumbstick perfect for thruster control.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:20
|
|
|
biglads posted:Probably worth adding the CH stuff to the Joystick list. The throttle is very good and I find the thumbstick perfect for thruster control. Yea, I left em out as I tried them and think they're terribly kludgy, but will edit in.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:26
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:Joystick Hierarchy: Do you have any comment on the Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick, as it sells on Amazon for $35, how does it compare to the Thrustmaster 16000M ?
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:28
|
|
|
Pretty neat Release countdown-timer : http://afrospartan.github.io/WebDesign/EliteCountdown/ (only displays correctly in Chrome or Firefox) courtesy of Afrospartan EDIT: and thanks for all the joystick info peeps!
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:31
|
|
|
Tempus Thales posted:Do you have any comment on the Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick, as it sells on Amazon for $35, how does it compare to the Thrustmaster 16000M ? Added in, good call. It's a good "see if I like HOTAS" but it doesn't have enough hats/buttons to let you work entirely off the stick, so I think it's actually worse than most stick+KB setups.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:34
|
|
|
Naturally Selected posted:I'm speaking in terms of actually getting ANY sales. It's a space sim that is both deliberately hard and a objective-less sandbox. Putting it on steam would only generate a thread full of people complaining about how the game isn't things it isn't trying to be (like you). Everyone who actually wants to play something close to what they're trying to make has heard of it at this point. Again, they aren't trying to sell this game into being a blockbuster, they're trying to sell this game enough to fund servers, further development for content+expansions, and mostly showcase it as the engine flagship and sell engine licenses to other studios.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:36
|
|
|
Bloody Wanker posted:So im trying to update the OP to be Gamma-worthy. I note that you still have the version of the Capital Ship Battle video without the correct, canonical musical accompaniment. See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2VgApQ0joY
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:42
|
|
|
Mr. Crow posted:Gas thread, New thread when release hits, tia I hope this thread goes back to just talking about how cool this game is, how neat the sound design is, and posts beautiful pictures of space! I still love turning off flight assist and just floating around in space.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:44
|
|
|
Hey does anyone know if Cygnus X-1 exists in this game and, if so, does it look like all those pictures of a star getting sucked into a black hole that I saw in a bunch of 1980s astronomy books?? (I hope it does)Knifegrab posted:Hey man I'd be down for some exploring. Need to save up for an asp or something though. Haha sure thing, I'll see you in two years when you finally save up enough money for one 
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:45
|
|
|
There's a couple more pros with the 52Pro I think, for this game. When you see some employed nerds from Frontier playing Elite, they use the 52 Pro: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0GxJbOMaXa0&t=1535s This is a good thing. It really is plug and play with the game, no messing around needed if you don't want to with configs etc. The pilots hands in your cockpit are holding what is pretty much a 52 Pro, this is a good thing as it looks badass. Also, and most importantly, you can WRITE YOUR NAME ON IT
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:46
|
|
|
Tempus Thales posted:Do you have any comment on the Thrustmaster T-Flight Hotas X Flight Stick, as it sells on Amazon for $35, how does it compare to the Thrustmaster 16000M ? Bear in mind this guy uses the T-Flight without much issue though: https://www.youtube.com/user/Isinona/videos He kinda puts the grognards with their million dollar setups to shame. One of the best known pilots in Elite, famed for his FAOFF skills, and he uses one of the cheapest HOTASs you can lay your hands on. edit: it's bear, not bare. Rowr etc. tooterfish fucked around with this message at 22:50 on Dec 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:46
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:It's a space sim that is both deliberately hard and a objective-less sandbox. Putting it on steam would only generate a thread full of people complaining about how the game isn't things it isn't trying to be (like you). Everyone who actually wants to play something close to what they're trying to make has heard of it at this point. Again, they aren't trying to sell this game into being a blockbuster, they're trying to sell this game enough to fund servers, further development for content+expansions, and mostly showcase it as the engine flagship and sell engine licenses to other studios. So, considering that everyone's already heard of it, and the money that came in from backers hasn't come close to covering dev costs alone, would you say that the game will have a lot of money and time dedicated to it's continued development? Taking into account that this is now a publicly-traded company with a few major stakeholders that aren't Braben.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:50
|
|
|
Thrustmaster T-Flight HOTAS: Cheap ($40). Cheapest "hotas" and a good way to see if you'll like HOTAS. Not enough hats or buttons, so not equivalent to the above ones. Just get this one. Unless you have more disposable income.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:51
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:Added in, good call. It's a good "see if I like HOTAS" but it doesn't have enough hats/buttons to let you work entirely off the stick, so I think it's actually worse than most stick+KB setups. I ordered one of these recently on the basis that I wanted to use a stick + throttle setup, it was the cheapest, and Isinona uses and seems to do fine flying FA off so the lack of buttons and stuff can't be that much of a downside. I tried a friend's X52 and found that it just had way more buttons and fancy bits than I could comfortably use (I also found it aesthetically hideous but that's a fairly minor issue), I'm sure in time I will change my mind and want something more advanced but for now I think that I will be able to fly around comfortably with it and slowly grow into its limitations. Any other throttle + stick setup that I could find would have been many times more expensive, and I'm not even a US customer who can take advantage of Amazon's current discounted price on it. Stick + KB might be the better choice objectively for pure control (and the Thrustmaster 16000M certainly looks like a great stick at a reasonable price) but I really loved the tactility you get from a throttle and I decided that I was willing to compromise elsewhere to use one.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:55
|
|
|
Naturally Selected posted:So, considering that everyone's already heard of it, and the money that came in from backers hasn't come close to covering dev costs alone, would you say that the game will have a lot of money and time dedicated to it's continued development? Taking into account that this is now a publicly-traded company with a few major stakeholders that aren't Braben. I don't follow your presumptions about dev costs. My 30 sec flip through of the MAY 2014 financial statement was that they were cashflow positive from other income sources (presumably: KS+early access fees) while not selling much else while working on E:D. Even if I misread that (entirely possible), it was 8 months ago so unless you have better info this is just more of your unqualified presumptions based on unqualified presumptions and I don't see the point in arguing with your unsubstantiated guess work. Not that it would matter if there was some point to it, as they've clearly decided they don't want to be involved with Steam until they have a history of managing back-end infra at a price point they control, and possibly not then. You can of course games forum masturbate about how they're wrong and you're right and surely they should do things your way. No one has managed to stop you yet. But it isn't actually an argument that you're having with anyone. You're just yelling "I THINK THEY SHOULD DO THIS" at the internet. Rotation Confusion fucked around with this message at 22:58 on Dec 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:55
|
|
|
Bloody Wanker posted:Pretty neat Release countdown-timer : Correction: Works in IE:10 too. (Work upgraded us from 8 to 10 a few weeks ago) Edit: Now someone figure out how I can make this my background.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:57
|
|
|
RabidWeasel posted:I ordered one of these recently on the basis that I wanted to use a stick + throttle setup, it was the cheapest, and Isinona uses and seems to do fine flying FA off so the lack of buttons and stuff can't be that much of a downside. I tried a friend's X52 and found that it just had way more buttons and fancy bits than I could comfortably use (I also found it aesthetically hideous but that's a fairly minor issue), I'm sure in time I will change my mind and want something more advanced but for now I think that I will be able to fly around comfortably with it and slowly grow into its limitations. Any other throttle + stick setup that I could find would have been many times more expensive, and I'm not even a US customer who can take advantage of Amazon's current discounted price on it. There's nothing wrong with any possible control choice here until we get into "did you buy a Rift" and at that point going to one of the HOTAS that lets you play 100% w/o keyboard is a major advantage.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 22:57
|
|
|
peter gabriel posted:Also, and most importantly, you can WRITE YOUR NAME ON IT You could have saved $30 and done that with the X52. Admittedly you don't get the gaudy blue lights, but that's totally sci-fi. I'd totally recommend another stick over the aging X52 line simply because they're not that well put together. The stick wobbles around the zero mark, requiring a mod to the spring, or a 5mm spacer. The Hall sensors were teamed with regular magnets, when rare earths give a much tighter response profile; again, you can mod this with a hot glue gun and $5 worth of magnets from home depot. Rotation Confusion posted:I was really, really, really hoping someone would point that one out Yeah, when someone compares a cantoloupe to an orange, it sets off my bullshit detector. Sure, they're fruit, but one is not a stocking stuffer. EA has infrastructure and a serious cash buffer, not to mention a serious presence in the world, which translates to things like preferential rates for CDN transfer, so the scale does matter. You want to talk redundancy and support on globally managed systems, I can talk your ear off, but I'd point you in the direction of the farm that runs Eve online and ask if you're aware of the sheer salary weight of supporting that thing. Human's with skillz are not cheap. I can totally see Braben not wanting to get into bed with Steam on the basis of control, but again, I'd suggest that he's really not gotten that far into checking things out...we simply don't know. You missed the other thing; EA pulled off Steam for day one releases. They're still happy to use the Steam storefront once they've wrung every last drop of DLC money from a property, they just want the lion's share of the money...and they can do it because they have buffer and infrastructure. No biggie, I'm just another random rear end in a top hat, but I'm an rear end in a top hat that works at scale and knows what a shower of bastards akamai can be.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:00
|
|
|
Rotation Confusion posted:I don't follow your presumptions about dev costs. My 30 sec flip through of the MAY 2014 financial statement was that they were cashflow positive from other income sources (presumably: KS+early access fees) while not selling much else while working on E:D. Even if I misread that (entirely possible), it was 8 months ago so unless you have better info this is just more of your unqualified presumptions based on unqualified presumptions and I don't see the point in arguing with your unsubstantiated guess work. Dude, they put up their accounts not five pages ago. Their other revenue streams are other published games, and deals they did with Disney, plus a royalty payout from Atari now they're out of Chapter 11. http://www.frontier.co.uk/docs/files/Frontier%20Developments%20plc%20Annual%20Report%20and%20Accounts%202014.pdf - Wed, 17 Sep 2014 08:42:59 GMT Page 36 is a good place to start. Hav fucked around with this message at 23:08 on Dec 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:03
|
|
|
Hav posted:No biggie, I'm just another random rear end in a top hat, but I'm an rear end in a top hat that works at scale and knows what a shower of bastards akamai can be. Well maybe this just isn't the stock for you  Because you see, this game is a deliberately hurf blurg hurblurghurfgag 
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:06
|
|
|
Also of note regarding joysticks: the T16000M is pretty much the only one for lefties. That also makes it a good choice for dual stick, if you fancy it. tooterfish posted:Also, don't forget this bad boy: That's what I use, posted about it somewhere further back in the thread. I'm still not entirely comfortable with the layout as it requires some slightly awkward thumb gymnastics though once muscle memory kicks in it may not be an issue, but I've come to love the feel and accuracy of the stick and nothing else in that price range can match it for features.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:11
|
|
|
TRAPEZIUM SECTOR CB-W C2-3    I don't know what that double-funnel cloud object is, but I plan to get as close as I can to it, and this Trapezium system is as close as I can get. I'm 2/3rds of the way there. After that, I'm going to check out these places which are practically next door   and then cruise around Horsehead and take in the sights. I realize that in the nebula things will just be slightly hazy, but this is the closest I can get to some unique features in our galaxy.   I'm in the Hauler, have range of 23LY with a full tank, zero cargo space and have equipped an Intermediate Discover scanner and a Detailed surface scanner, along with a class B size 3 fuel scoop. I have all class A modules save for life support, which I went with the lightest on of that. I am unarmed, and have an upgraded shield and standard armor. I image this trip would be a lot easier in something that isn't a literal space bread van, but I didn't want to grind away time to try to get a Cobra with a class A FSD or an ASP. I have maybe 10~ full-range jumps before I need to refuel, which is why this time I am scooping every time I get the opportunity. https://imgur.com/a/w0fDF KakerMix fucked around with this message at 23:30 on Dec 1, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:12
|
|
|
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8wJIJSkjPY So this guy made it to Sagittarius A, the supermassive black hole at the center of the galaxy. 25,900Ly in.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:13
|
|
|
Hav posted:No biggie, I'm just another random rear end in a top hat, but I'm an rear end in a top hat that works at scale and knows what a shower of bastards akamai can be. I've supported well into millions of users of DAU so I get where you're going. Comparing their decision to AAA relationships with steam is a huge simplification on my part and I happily admit to it, I just also think it well defrays the "but but opportunity cost" point whats his name was trying to make. I agree with pretty much all your points, and suspect that Elite will end up on Steam sometimes around year 2 when they've: 1) acquired 90%+ of the preexisting space sim user base and 2) have extremely well-detailed information on run rate for support. I think it's extremely unlikely that they'd put it on Steam in December when it'd be competing with the whole storefront based on sales discounts, and that Frontier has made a reasonable decision not to, but probably hasn't bothered looking at it very much. It's easy to exclude from rationality for a December launch without doing infinite market analysis on it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:15
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 11:50 |
|
|
Logitech keybind guides seem to assume that you'll be using the throttle on the stick, constantly switching to keyboard to have enough buttons. Mine assumes you'll be using the keyboard like a HOTAS throttle (and uses a spacey, hard to read font): The virtual throttle breaks between forward and reverse, so when I'm floating backwards after too much space drift I usually throttle up to zero and get stuck there. Spacebar then W fixes this.
|
|
#
?
Dec 1, 2014 23:19
|
|
