|
I read 40k literature for the well developed characters and deep story archs
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:32
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 16:19 |
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:What an insightful rebuttal. This worked quite well for battletech as can be seen by how beloved the dark ages are.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:33
|
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:What an insightful rebuttal. Theres 10,000 years of progression to play and write stories in.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:36
|
|
|
I think it's more a question of them having advanced the timeline to the very loving edge of the 41st century and then just started counting "40 1/2" "40 3/4" "40 4/5" like a parent that doesn't intend to punish you for real. It just seems like one of those things where the tail is wagging the dog.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:37
|
|
|
Ignite Memories posted:I think it's more a question of them having advanced the timeline to the very loving edge of the 41st century and then just started counting "40 1/2" "40 3/4" "40 4/5" like a parent that doesn't intend to punish you for real. It just seems like one of those things where the tail is wagging the dog. Yeah. It's one thing to say there's a nebulously defined space of 10,000 years where a shitload of different things can happen. Okay, great. But then you start really building up, really putting a super fine point on the last 500 or 100 or 10 or .0001 years of that whole arc, and people expect something to happen and then get blueballed when it doesn't. At this point there isn't just a gun on the wall above the fireplace, the house is loving wallpapered in guns and you're hanging guns on top of other guns and refusing to ever shoot any of them.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:40
|
|
|
JerryLee posted:At this point there isn't just a gun on the wall above the fireplace, the house is loving wallpapered in guns and you're hanging guns on top of other guns and refusing to ever shoot any of them. That is grimdark as hell, aka perfect for 40k.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:45
|
|
|
I agree that it's a bit annoying that the official fluff is pushing things so close to when the poo poo really hits the fan, but it'd be even worse if the next campaign featured the golden throne failing and warp travel becoming impossible and the tyranids eating the eye of terror or any number of things they could do because I don't want to hear spergs bitch and moan that now I shouldn't be able to ally this or that faction and it doesn't make sense that the ultramarines are fighting the space wolves because they are supposed to be defending holy terra from the dark eldar slavers. Do you guys not remember the lessons from the 90s RPGs? Metaplot is rear end.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:46
|
|
|
JerryLee posted:Yeah. It's one thing to say there's a nebulously defined space of 10,000 years where a shitload of different things can happen. Okay, great. But then you start really building up, really putting a super fine point on the last 500 or 100 or 10 or .0001 years of that whole arc, and people expect something to happen and then get blueballed when it doesn't. But are there skulls on the guns?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:49
|
|
|
drgnvale posted:Do you guys not remember the lessons from the 90s RPGs? Metaplot is rear end. Seriously, this. Shadowrun comes to mind most prominently on this.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:51
|
|
|
JerryLee posted:At this point there isn't just a gun on the wall above the fireplace, the house is loving wallpapered in guns and you're hanging guns on top of other guns and refusing to ever shoot any of them.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:51
|
|
|
Well I decided not to pull the trigger on the Deathstorm box as i don't play Tyranids and the only blood angel stuff I was mildly interested in was the Dreadnought and Captain I only really wanted the mini rules book. Instead i just got a "Buy it now" copy of the mini rulebook for £16 on Ebay so i'm pretty happy with that descision.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:51
|
|
|
Mango Polo posted:That is grimdark as hell, aka perfect for 40k. Not the refusing to shoot them part.  The problem seems to be that GW wants 40k to be a sandbox and to have this cohesive, relatively definite metaplot arc with enough mary sueisms to keep TVTropes busy for the entire 10,000 year period in question. They're trying to eat their cake and have it too.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:52
|
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:What an insightful rebuttal. It's an entire goddamn GALAXY! And you are feeling restricted? I don't think you are truly considering how large the entire GALAXY is... Your commentary on the setting is incorrect. It has nothing to do with corporate or narrative cowardice. You have SO much room to play around in and you are worried about what effectively happens to Bob of the Eldar or Chuck of the Ultramarines. All of these individuals are grains of sand in a massive beach. Maybe some are the size of pebbles. Forge your own stories and stop worrying about what GW is doing with it. BULBASAUR posted:I read 40k literature for the well developed characters and deep story archs BULBASAUR is batting a thousand lately for making me laugh. You are crackin me up dude.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:53
|
|
|
Pierzak posted:
Chenkov's bolt pistol (RIP)
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:56
|
|
|
I don't think anyone disputes that you can have the whole galaxy to fluff your own stories and campaigns in, it's just frustration that GW starts plots that never actually resolve and characters that never actually accomplish new things because 'it's a setting, not a story.' It doesn't matter if the clock never moves forward from right at midnight, it'd just be nice to see their own little stories actually resolve themselves. It's a large part of the reason why I don't really care about the setting beyond whatever I do for my own games or RPG campaigns. The entire metaplot and named characters are effectively meaningless from any sort of narrative standpoint.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:58
|
|
|
PierreTheMime posted:I was fearing they wouldn't be, but they're actually not that far off. If played smartly the Tyranid player could certainly win and they have way better special abilities. It's definitely more balanced than some of the other boxed sets they've sold. Probably the most balanced, as far as I can remember. I'll be buying it for two guys in their lower teens - playing smartly might be out of their league. Is there anything that just directly addresses the imbalance? Like another bug that shoots fire or something?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 00:59
|
|
|
Lord Twisted posted:Today's game was a stunning victory for the forces of the Imperium (with filthy eldar) after the invisible cultists blobs... Didn't roll invisibility. This made it a bit tough for them. ♫ Too Many Cults, Too Many Cults! ♫ ♬ Definitely post more photos, I've never seen so many Cultists used.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:00
|
|
|
Dulkor posted:I don't think anyone disputes that you can have the whole galaxy to fluff your own stories and campaigns in, it's just frustration that GW starts plots that never actually resolve and characters that never actually accomplish new things because 'it's a setting, not a story.' It doesn't matter if the clock never moves forward from right at midnight, it'd just be nice to see their own little stories actually resolve themselves. Theres like 100 books and multiple campaigns that have a plots that finish and characters that do things because, you know, entire galaxy of things to do and 10,000 years to do them in.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:01
|
|
|
What would advancing the story-line achieve?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:01
|
|
|
Raphus C posted:What would advancing the story-line achieve? It would piss off everyone since it wouldn't be advanced how they'd want it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:02
|
|
|
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:04
|
|
|
BlackIronHeart posted:Seriously, this. Shadowrun comes to mind most prominently on this. I don't want to derail the thread too much, but can you talk about this? I had no idea RPGs from the 90s advanced their stories or whatever with hilarious results. I want to learn about the tears that were caused 
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:05
|
|
|
Battletech advanced their story constantly, until they hit a creative brick wall and time-skipped into a totally new era that was utter dogshit.Raphus C posted:What would advancing the story-line achieve? The end of the setting and a retarded reboot nobody would like. Lovely Joe Stalin fucked around with this message at 01:08 on Dec 7, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:05
|
|
|
I guess I'm one of the outliers that doesn't want the timeline progressed but I do wish GW came up with solid campaign rules that would guide people through creating a campaign with multiple factions. Rules and guidelines for how to drive that campaign forward would be great. I'm lucky enough to have a friend who decided to take that on himself and we've been playing out a pretty awesome campaign that's utilized BFG, Kill Team and regular 40K games as Orks vs. Eldar on a Necron tomb world. It's been a lot of fun and I think more people would enjoy this sort of thing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:07
|
|
|
BlackIronHeart posted:I guess I'm one of the outliers that doesn't want the timeline progressed but I do wish GW came up with solid campaign rules that would guide people through creating a campaign with multiple factions. Rules and guidelines for how to drive that campaign forward would be great. I'm lucky enough to have a friend who decided to take that on himself and we've been playing out a pretty awesome campaign that's utilized BFG, Kill Team and regular 40K games as Orks vs. Eldar on a Necron tomb world. It's been a lot of fun and I think more people would enjoy this sort of thing. The day GW both encourages you to use their product in a Forge Your Narrative way and also provides actual direct support for actually doing that will be a day to remember.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:09
|
|
|
I literally don't understand people who want the setting moved forward it says ONLY WAR right on the box, there's nothing to move forward to when there is ONLY WAR it's grim dark only war all the way down people
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:10
|
|
|
Or at least create armies or units for more races. How about more than one type of Vespid, or a viable all-Watcher in the Dark army. Some stories about previous galaxies that got wiped out by the Tyranids, or campaigns from when the Eldar were still being killed off by Slaanesh. The RP series seems to get this sort of thing right, but I want to play with models, or there's not much point. Hell, actually support Kill Team. That's the sort of game style I'd absolutely adore. It just feels like there's so much unexplored or downright ignored in the setting.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:11
|
|
|
also skulls there is ONLY SKULLS
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:11
|
|
|
Moola posted:I literally don't understand people who want the setting moved forward It really does say that right on the tin. There is no future except Space Marines. Imagine an Imperial boot stomping on a Xenos face forever, that is 40k.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:13
|
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:Or at least create armies or units for more races. How about more than one type of Vespid, or a viable all-Watcher in the Dark army. Some stories about previous galaxies that got wiped out by the Tyranids, or campaigns from when the Eldar were still being killed off by Slaanesh. The RP series seems to get this sort of thing right, but I want to play with models, or there's not much point. Hell, actually support Kill Team. That's the sort of game style I'd absolutely adore. It just feels like there's so much unexplored or downright ignored in the setting. Exodites. I mean, who doesn't want an army of Eldar who conquer a space empire on foot through the webway, riding dinosaurs and rocking out with old school Wood Elf mohawks?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:15
|
|
|
BULBASAUR posted:I don't want to derail the thread too much, but can you talk about this? I had no idea RPGs from the 90s advanced their stories or whatever with hilarious results. I want to learn about the tears that were caused I don't know if there're a lot of tears to be had but SR liked to advance the metaplot timeline a couple years with every release. So one book might be set in, say, 2055 and the next in 2057. What this really did was lead customers to not buy the newer books. If I'm running a campaign set in 2053, I don't need to know what happens in 4 years. I might not want the things in the 2057 book, like the president being assassinated, to actually come to fruition in my game, so it's kinda useless to me. There are RPGs out there that set a firm 'end point' for their material and let players make up whatever comes next and I personally favor that. Hârn by Columbia Games is a good example though it's not very popular by any measure.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:19
|
|
|
Can you play Infinity with GW models?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:22
|
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:Can you play Infinity with GW models? You can, but it leads to buying 3 factions of Infinity models proper once pokemonitis sets in. Or do you mean Kill Team-ish 40 skirmish with Infinity rules and 40k fluff? That'd be interesting and I'd love to help make some stats for that.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:38
|
|
|
Mod Bolt Action into Bolter Action, imo.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:40
|
|
|
An Angry Bug posted:Can you play Infinity with GW models? My coworker did just that during our office Infinity games this week. He claims to be bringing his actual Haqq models next week, but my Salamanders worked well enough.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 01:42
|
|
|
I might be unintentionally kicking a hornet's nest here but re: warhams metaplot and lack thereof, I stopped paying attention to Warmachine years ago but for a while it seemed like there was actually forward narrative progression going on, i.e. characters got promoted, new units got developed and new factions cropped up, etc. So is the Warmachine metaplot a shitshow then or is it working as intended?
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 02:06
|
|
|
I'd be alright with the setting if there was just a _little_ bit of indication that this is really the Dark Millenium, where crap is finally going down. Have the nids eat a First Founding chapter homeworld and their survivors relocate somewhere else. Have Cadia fall and the Eye of Terror grow a bit. I don't care if you say they fortified another world two sectors back into New Cadia so everyone can still play their AM. Just something to clearly state that "This stalemate that has been going on for 10 millenia? It's coming an end." Since people have brought Infinity up, their fluff does seem to be moving, if the name of their next supplement is any indication. Actually, they removed a popular Yu Jing character and gave her to another faction for fluff reasons, come to think of it...which was kind of a crap thing to do. Careful what you want, I guess.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 02:07
|
|
|
Sephyr posted:Actually, they removed a popular Yu Jing character and gave her to another faction for fluff reasons, come to think of it...which was kind of a crap thing to do. They're now killing off another character, Izzat Beg, to replace him with his murderer with entirely different stats & model. Again, this should piss off a whole 3 people. Pierzak fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Dec 7, 2014 |
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
Dulkor posted:I don't think anyone disputes that you can have the whole galaxy to fluff your own stories and campaigns in, it's just frustration that GW starts plots that never actually resolve and characters that never actually accomplish new things because 'it's a setting, not a story.' It doesn't matter if the clock never moves forward from right at midnight, it'd just be nice to see their own little stories actually resolve themselves. Yeah, that's pretty much where I'm at. I understand that the point of the setting is to ensure that anything can happen, but it'd be nice if they narratively shook things up every once in a while. Big changes would be cool, but even little stuff like a resolution to Sanctus Reach or an update on Yarrick's pursuit of Ghazghull would be nice every other edition or codex or so, just to keep things marginally fresh. Edit: Rulebook Heavily posted:Mod Bolt Action into Bolter Action, imo. I'm tempted to do this. I tried BA at GenCon and it seemed like a fun system, may try to convince a friend or two to try it out with some Guardsmen.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 02:10
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 16:19 |
|
|
40k hooks people by presenting these stories. It is not unreasonable to ask people hooked by them to ask for resolution, and the "it's a massive setting you can play anywhere!!!" thing doesn't address that.
|
|
#
?
Dec 7, 2014 02:12
|
|