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Stultus Maximus posted:And as a properly ratified treaty, the UN Convention Against Torture requires Barack Obama and Eric Holder to prosecute those responsible - they have declared that torture did take place. I absolutely agree. Barack Obama was a constitutional lawyer and has spoken out in the past about the importance of these very issues we are discussing. There is no doubt in my mind that he will do the right thing and in the face of these revelations bring appropriate charges against those reasonably suspected of committing crimes which are prohibited under United States law.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:22
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Stultus Maximus posted:And as a properly ratified treaty, the UN Convention Against Torture requires Barack Obama and Eric Holder to prosecute those responsible - they have declared that torture did take place. Seriouspost: we're going to be having a new attorney general appointment process soon. "Will you prosecute the war crimes in revealed in the Senate's torture report?" will be a nice question to ask her. Odds that someone actually does? 20 for / 80 against, I'd say.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:22
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TEAYCHES posted:I absolutely agree. Barack Obama was a constitutional lawyer and has spoken out in the past about the importance of these very issues we are discussing. He'll get right on that when he gets a break from summarily executing US Citizens via drone.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:30
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Seriouspost: we're going to be having a new attorney general appointment process soon. "Will you prosecute the war crimes in revealed in the Senate's torture report?" will be a nice question to ask her. Odds that someone actually does? 20 for / 80 against, I'd say. Seriouspost: I would love to see Uruguay or Sweden or someone arrest Eric Holder or Barack Obama the minute he sets foot outside the US come 2017.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:32
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Jagchosis posted:i know you're trolling but it's so removed from the realm of possibility that anyone could believe this it lacks punch He's not trolling. He's posting from a happier universe. 
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Dec 10, 2014 04:32
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:Seriouspost: we're going to be having a new attorney general appointment process soon. "Will you prosecute the war crimes in revealed in the Senate's torture report?" will be a nice question to ask her. Odds that someone actually does? 20 for / 80 against, I'd say. As if a Republican Senate would ever confirm someone willing to prosecute good men and women for just doing their jobs to protect this country.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:32
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ActusRhesus posted:He'll get right on that when he gets a break from summarily executing US Citizens via drone. The summary execution of possible suspects in the undeclared War On Terror is justified under article "gently caress this country" section "Barack H. Obama is a literal war criminal" clause "the United States Government is a cartoon villain on the level of Cobra."
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Dec 10, 2014 04:34
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ComradeCosmobot posted:As if a Republican Senate would ever confirm someone willing to prosecute good men and women for just doing their jobs to protect this country. What would Reagan do? St. Ronnie posted:The United States participated actively and effectively in the negotiation of [this] Convention. It marks a significant step in the development during this century of international measures against torture and other inhuman treatment or punishment. Ratification of the Convention by the United States will clearly express United States opposition to torture, an abhorrent practice unfortunately still prevalent in the world today.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:35
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TEAYCHES posted:The summary execution of possible suspects in the undeclared War On Terror is justified under article "gently caress this country" section "Barack H. Obama is a literal war criminal" clause "the United States Government is a cartoon villain on the level of Cobra." seriously. The "legal justification" for it was just...wow. Don't get me wrong...the guy was an rear end in a top hat. But jeez. talk about lovely precedent.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:40
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Stultus Maximus posted:Seriouspost: I would love to see Uruguay or Sweden or someone arrest Eric Holder or Barack Obama the minute he sets foot outside the US come 2017.  Yep, Sweden would have great standing.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:41
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Xandu posted:
Hong Kong?
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Dec 10, 2014 04:42
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Honestly, from just a practical perspective the government should break up the CIA. It's got a legacy of horrendous failures and I think that other existing government agencies could pick up most of the legitimate work that is supposed to be done there.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:44
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They detained and rendered a dissident to Libya.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:44
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goatse.cx posted:Hong Kong? The US and the Triads have a close working relationship.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:45
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New Division posted:Honestly, from just a practical perspective the government should break up the CIA. It's got a legacy of horrendous failures. And I think that other existing government agencies could pick up most of the legitimate work that is supposed to be done there. I don't see it. That ignores how much of this comes from policymakers. Read Jack Goldsmith or Barton Gellman's books on this period. There was huge demand from Cheney and parts of the White House to authorize this.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:45
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Xandu posted:They detained and rendered a dissident to Libya. Try to guess the kind of torture people received who we rendered to Libya, Syria and Egypt. No one will ever be held accountable for this.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:46
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Xandu posted:I don't see it. That ignores how much of this comes from policymakers. Read Jack Goldsmith or Barton Gellman's books on this period. There was huge demand from Cheney and parts of the White House to authorize this. Policymakers come and go but the CIA has a pretty unbroken string of atrocities through its entire existence. The agency is rotten to the core and should be dissolved.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:46
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Today, I am embarrassed to be an American citizen. We, as Americans, traditionally waged war against other countries who employed torture with righteous fury. We used to hold the moral high ground. Now we are no better than your run of the mill military dictatorship. There should be the equivalent of the Nuremberg trials for Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Rice, and Holder/Obama. We crossed a line we have never crossed, nor should we have. Disgusting.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:53
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Welp, this thread was nice while it lasted.
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Dec 10, 2014 04:54
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Volkerball posted:Welp, this thread was nice while it lasted. Do you disagree with the assertion that those who enabled this illegal torture to occur should be prosecuted under United States law?
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Dec 10, 2014 04:59
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PgIKAukheo#t=251 Starts in the middle, just watch 15 seconds. We really have crossed over to the onionverse.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:02
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rockopete posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PgIKAukheo#t=251 Jesus christ. This is a real thought someone had.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:04
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I honestly want to hear nuanced views on how sticking hoses up stretched anuses, pumping in slush, after water boarding, hitting their broken legs, shouldn't be actively pursued by the United States Justice Department with charges leveled against senior officials for crimes against humanity.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:04
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TEAYCHES posted:Do you disagree with the assertion that those who enabled this illegal torture to occur should be prosecuted under United States law? I was referring to Farking Bastage's post probably causing a shitshow. I don't disagree with that at all, but it's not going to happen any more than the Reagan administration was prosecuted for Iran Contra. This is just too big and too deep to get anything other than some token fall guys if it came down to it. I would much rather the emphasis be on reigning in the CIA and setting in controls that would prevent this type of operation from happening in the future instead of sending some nameless dudes to jail a decade after the fact like it means something.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:04
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rockopete posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8PgIKAukheo#t=251 holy poo poo
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Dec 10, 2014 05:06
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What really gets me about all of this is the assertion, from the President himself, that this is all in the past and we have to look forward. That's not how breaking the law works. It's especially not how breaking the United Nations Convention Against Torture works.  This kind of rationale is so unbelievably repugnant and gross. What's the statute of limitations on torture?
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Dec 10, 2014 05:12
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TEAYCHES posted:I honestly want to hear nuanced views on how sticking hoses up stretched anuses, pumping in slush, after water boarding, hitting their broken legs, shouldn't be actively pursued by the United States Justice Department with charges leveled against senior officials for crimes against humanity. http://www.slate.com/articles/news_...nistration.html this is about as close as yer gonna get
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Dec 10, 2014 05:14
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TEAYCHES posted:I absolutely agree. Barack Obama was a constitutional lawyer and has spoken out in the past about the importance of these very issues we are discussing. I hope you're right, but I'm not going to hold my breath.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:23
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ComradeCosmobot posted:As if a Republican Senate would ever confirm someone willing to prosecute good men and women for just doing their jobs to protect this country. The Republicans are literally going to fall on their own swords before selling out Bush and Cheney.
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Dec 10, 2014 05:30
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Job Truniht posted:The Republicans are literally going to fall on their own swords before selling out Bush and Cheney. Yeah, they're hosed if they want to stop this, those that do. With no prosecutions its only a matter of time before another administration decides to "take the gloves off".
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Dec 10, 2014 05:34
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TEAYCHES posted:What really gets me about all of this is the assertion, from the President himself, that this is all in the past and we have to look forward. I really hope this boomerangs and causes the word "patriot" to become synonymous with "person who raped another person with a feeding tube."
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Dec 10, 2014 05:57
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nopantsjack posted:Yeah, they're hosed if they want to stop this, those that do. With no prosecutions its only a matter of time before another administration decides to "take the gloves off". Obama could create a precedent of criminality for these actions by blanket pardoning everyone in the Bush administration for torturing people. Which would effectively be admitting that they were criminals. However he won't take any action at all because he's a coward.
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Dec 10, 2014 06:09
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Barack Obama is complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable. This has turned into an IRL goatse joke. He is a piece of poo poo, and a bad president, poo poo, pee pee. But really.
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Dec 10, 2014 06:14
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TEAYCHES posted:Barack Obama is complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable. This has turned into an IRL goatse joke. What presidents other than Carter would you place on the list of "not complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable" or is the butt part worse than everything else ever?
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Dec 10, 2014 06:15
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Trabisnikof posted:What presidents other than Carter would you place on the list of "not complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable" or is the butt part worse than everything else ever? Garlic and hummus up the rear end, ouch
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Dec 10, 2014 06:18
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Literally. Human beings were penetrated by dildo wands and injected with Mediterranean cuisine.TEAYCHES posted:Barack Obama is complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable. This has turned into an IRL goatse joke. It certainly explains his lackluster, halting tone when chiding other nations for human rights abuses
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Dec 10, 2014 06:20
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Trabisnikof posted:What presidents other than Carter would you place on the list of "not complicit with the grossest crimes imaginable" or is the butt part worse than everything else ever? I voted for Obama twice. So yeah, this isn't worse than anything else. Carter hosed up South America too in his term. Let me have my moment. I feel partly responsible for this torture. But maybe I shouldn't now because I'm pretty sure this isn't a democracy? IDK, lmao.
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Dec 10, 2014 06:20
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Feral Integral posted:Garlic and hummus up the rear end, ouch That's bad and all, but really is it worse than the internment camps, the fact we anally probe our own citizens, or giving black people STDs just for "science"?
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Dec 10, 2014 06:21
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Trabisnikof posted:That's bad and all, but really is it worse than the internment camps, the fact we anally probe our own citizens, or giving black people STDs just for "science"? The past is a foreign country. This is here and now.
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Dec 10, 2014 06:23
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Trabisnikof posted:That's bad and all, but really is it worse than the internment camps, the fact we anally probe our own citizens, or giving black people STDs just for "science"? It just stays with you. In 500 years the lawless Bush/Obama regime will be remembered as war, waterboarding and lebanese pilates shakes up the rear end.
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Dec 10, 2014 06:23
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