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IIRC before they killed Extended totally they made it into like a double sized Standard, so by that structure KTK Extended would go INN-RTR-THS-KTK like Entropic said
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Dec 16, 2014 20:53
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Chamale posted:Or maybe he wants to spend $18,000 on a Vintage deck and dive right in, his call. I want a channel of nothing but stone cold MTG newbies piloting vintage decks commentated by LSV.
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Dec 16, 2014 20:53
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Zoness posted:At one point it was mirrodin block through zendikar block (thopter depths had jace and chrome mox) which is like 7 blocks. Extended at the end was 4 blocks. It would be Innistrad through Khans. The last legal Extended block was Scars through Theros and Extended was eliminated before Born of the Gods released.
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Dec 16, 2014 20:53
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Counterpoint: tinker extended was the best extended.
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Dec 16, 2014 20:55
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Man Extended sounds like it would be fun if it existed today. Too bad that's not the case. 
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Dec 16, 2014 20:59
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So Extended now would have Shocklands, allied Fetchlands, check-lands, scry lands, tri-lands, Cavern of Souls and Mana Confluence for mana bases. And it would have Snapcaster Mage, Liliana of the Veil, Sphinx's Revelation, Supreme Verdict, Geist of St Traft, Delver, Thragtusk... Sounds like there'd be lots of fun stuff but it would probably just be taken over by broken esper control decks or something. I'd love to build mono-green devotion with Garruk, Primal Hunter in it. 
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Dec 16, 2014 21:13
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Entropic posted:So Extended now would have Shocklands, allied Fetchlands, check-lands, scry lands, tri-lands, Cavern of Souls and Mana Confluence for mana bases. Jund would be strong I think, Deathrite and Fetches. Cruise and Dig would be nuts with Forbidden Alchemy. Heroic and Prowess with Flashback. Edit: Jeskai Ascendency with Flashback. BizarroAzrael fucked around with this message at 21:26 on Dec 16, 2014 |
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Dec 16, 2014 21:21
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Tonetta posted:Counter argument: if you sell the tutor it's really only like 30-40 for 8 decks and a lot of cross format playablea. Whats the tutor and how easy is it to sell? Because the idea of trying out different decks and swapping cards in and out of decks rather than just buying a deck outright is attractive, but maybe its better to just buy a deck and some ancillary cards. But that might be as expensive as getting the duel pack...
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Dec 16, 2014 21:23
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I ran RW Goblins in whatever Extended was around when Onslaught was in print. I think I was trying to nuke the board with Skirk Fire Marshal and Worship in play, or slapping Spirit Link on it with Test of Endurance in play  I'm just sad that Goblin Ringleader wasn't in the same Standard as Onslaught. Also I think I proxied up Extended Oath in that time period, without really understanding what made it tick other than "here's a huge Cognivore on turn 3"
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Dec 16, 2014 21:26
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Stumiester posted:Whats the tutor and how easy is it to sell? Because the idea of trying out different decks and swapping cards in and out of decks rather than just buying a deck outright is attractive, but maybe its better to just buy a deck and some ancillary cards. But that might be as expensive as getting the duel pack... He means Demonic Tutor, which is in the Demonic deck, and he's overestimating its sell price.
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Dec 16, 2014 21:28
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Devor posted:I want a channel of nothing but stone cold MTG newbies piloting vintage decks commentated by LSV. maybe not MTG newbies but Vintage newbies would be hella exciting.
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Dec 16, 2014 21:33
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Devor posted:I want a channel of nothing but stone cold MTG newbies piloting vintage decks commentated by LSV. Honestly I think handing 2 relatively new Magic players a pair of Vintage decks, giving them like 5 minutes to look over the cards in their decks and then having them go at it with no other knowledge, would be pretty interesting to watch. Relatively new in this case being someone with a decent working knowledge of the rules but has only ever played Standard or maybe just the Duels games.
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Dec 16, 2014 21:45
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Cernunnos posted:Honestly I think handing 2 relatively new Magic players a pair of Vintage decks, giving them like 5 minutes to look over the cards in their decks and then having them go at it with no other knowledge, would be pretty interesting to watch. Give them dredge and storm.
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Dec 16, 2014 21:46
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Cernunnos posted:Honestly I think handing 2 relatively new Magic players a pair of Vintage decks, giving them like 5 minutes to look over the cards in their decks and then having them go at it with no other knowledge, would be pretty interesting to watch. No, no no. Clearly we need people who have no idea how to play Magic http://youtu.be/L0qQoWdjnms?t=3m50s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbKiOq5IVsM
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Dec 16, 2014 21:51
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mehall posted:No, no no. Clearly we need people who have no idea how to play Magic I want Beej and Chapin to commentate on every tournament.
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Dec 16, 2014 21:55
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Cernunnos posted:Honestly I think handing 2 relatively new Magic players a pair of Vintage decks, giving them like 5 minutes to look over the cards in their decks and then having them go at it with no other knowledge, would be pretty interesting to watch. I should give my wife control of my MTGO account and let her play Griselbrand Oath. Or better yet, Vintage Dredge. Angry Grimace fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Dec 16, 2014 |
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Dec 16, 2014 22:19
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cheetah7071 posted:Give them dredge and storm. That's just straight up mean. I watched a kid try to play a lovely version of loam and not have a firm grasp on dredge mechanic
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Dec 16, 2014 22:35
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I think the biggest problem would be them mulliganing down to low card numbers because they might not consider Bazaar of Baghdad to be that useful, so they'd just play it like a really slow deck slowly casting Stinkweed Imps off of Undiscovered Paradise. The manaless Legacy version probably would be unplayable by newbies.
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Dec 16, 2014 22:51
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cheetah7071 posted:Give them dredge and storm. I don't think that Storm would be hard for a newbie to grasp, except for the LED/Tutor interaction. There's cheap mana (Manamorphose in Modern, Rituals/Petals/LED in Legacy), cards that replenish themselves (which are easy to grok as "adds to storm counter"), and the wincons. Ascension in Modern has a bit more complexity to it, but from the looks of it, most of that is in how a spell being flashbacked doesn't give Ascension a counter etc, they probably understand "cast lots, then cast Grapeshot"
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Dec 16, 2014 22:59
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Dredge in particular might be easier to pick up than (or at least as easy as) other competitive decks since it's so different from normal Magic anyways.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:02
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The correct answer is always Doomsday
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Dec 16, 2014 23:05
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TheKingofSprings posted:Dredge in particular might be easier to pick up than (or at least as easy as) other competitive decks since it's so different from normal Magic anyways. It does mean that in order to follow what your opponent is doing, you have to know two games though.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:05
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TheKingofSprings posted:Dredge in particular might be easier to pick up than (or at least as easy as) other competitive decks since it's so different from normal Magic anyways. I don't get it you're playing spells and attacking with creatures and playing cabal therapy like a good american magic player.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:07
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I teach players how to play magic using my legacy decks all the time. I think storm, miracles, and affinity are the easiest to grasp. Might start using Lands in the rotation though.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:23
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I've recommended before, and I will again, teaching a newbie with a Soul Sisters variant. There's lots of synergies and triggers, but they're all positive - every time you remember something, you get a reward! Plus then you can give yourself a burn deck or something that will have a terrible matchup against them, giving them plenty of time to figure out how to play.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:31
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Stumiester posted:Whats the tutor and how easy is it to sell? Because the idea of trying out different decks and swapping cards in and out of decks rather than just buying a deck outright is attractive, but maybe its better to just buy a deck and some ancillary cards. But that might be as expensive as getting the duel pack... the duel deck pack is gonna be 8 themed decks from all across Magic's history -- they were originally released in pairs designed to play against each other, and this is a reprint with 4 of those sets bundled together. because of the age of some of the cards they won't be playable decks in Standard, magic's most popular tournament format (only cards released in the past 2~ years are legal) but you'll probably have a lot of fun mixing and matching them against each other and you'll also have 8 full, 60 card decks sitting to play against with your friends. if $100 isn't more than you're willing to spend you could get a lot of mileage out of the duel decks but the most cost-effective option is basically always gonna be finding/building a deck you like and then buying the individual cards for it as singles. It just depends on how fiddly you wanna get, basically
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Dec 16, 2014 23:33
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Anybody have a quote handy for why Maro considers Storm the devil's work?
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Dec 16, 2014 23:46
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I saw a new player perform amazingly with a reanimator deck. t1 grizzlebees just makes plain sense to johnnies, timmies and spikes alike.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:50
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Rinkles posted:Anybody have a quote handy for why Maro considers Storm the devil's work? I thought that was just for being overpowered. Maro can say some weird rear end poo poo sometimes - for example, he's been in a tizzle recently over Walls being creatures despite being inanimate objects.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:53
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Rinkles posted:Anybody have a quote handy for why Maro considers Storm the devil's work? http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/29462361516/why-do-you-feel-that-storm-is-the-most-broken quote:acclimation6 asked: Why do you feel that Storm is the most broken mechanic of all time? http://markrosewater.tumblr.com/post/103216381283/i-have-trouble-believing-that-literally-every quote:ixe8 asked: I have trouble believing that literally every storm card was "buh-roken." Aren't some effects that have no way of ending the game safe for storm, like Ground Rift, Hindering Touch, and Wing Shards?
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Dec 16, 2014 23:54
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Thank you.
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Dec 16, 2014 23:58
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Rinkles posted:Anybody have a quote handy for why Maro considers Storm the devil's work? Basically any card you put it on is going to end up either over- or under-powered, there's no good way to make it fair. If it does something that's actually good to duplicate a bunch of times, it's broken when you build a deck around it, and if you put on something that isn't worth duplicating a bunch of times then really, what's the point?
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Dec 16, 2014 23:58
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Angry Grimace posted:I thought that was just for being overpowered. Maro can say some weird rear end poo poo sometimes - for example, he's been in a tizzle recently over Walls being creatures despite being inanimate objects. But if they weren't creatures how would they block?
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Dec 17, 2014 00:00
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Cactrot posted:But if they weren't creatures how would they block? He thinks they should be damage prevention type effects or ghostly prison type effects. Alternatively flavored to be a type of defensive creature that isn't a wall. When you read maro's writings it is important to keep in mind that he is probably insane.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:00
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I've never seen Flusterstorm cast entirely for value on another storm spell on MODO because MODO forces you to manually target each copy and it always gets hosed up.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:01
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I thought he might have had some fundamental issues w/ how it works on top of power level. Keeping track of the number of cast spells can be tricky w/o a computer.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:01
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Rinkles posted:Anybody have a quote handy for why Maro considers Storm the devil's work? I think that the only reason why Storm is so unlikely to be revisited is because it's very powerful. On all other fronts it is pretty good: -Easy to understand. I grokked Storm when I first saw it, in Daniel Zink's Worlds-winning deck. Yeah, probably wasn't 100% on the proper RULES of it, but I knew I got one Beast for the spell itself, plus one for every other spell that turn. -Resonates well as an effect. The more spells that happen, the better it is for you, so cast more spells and find ways to cast more spells, to make the biggie better. -Appeals to everyone. Spike likes the inherent power, Timmy likes the whoa factor, Johnny likes the combo, Melvin likes the potential, and Vorthos can probably dig how the flavour is very open-ended. But it's very powerful. And like Entropic said, if it isn't powerful, it's bad. Not to mention how easy it is to break, even with something as simple as a Dark Ritual and a couple of cheap draw spells or something, much more so with a deck tuned around that.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:01
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Would you like a random FRF spoiler? Okay.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:06
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Angry Grimace posted:Would you like a random FRF spoiler? Okay. That looks strangely constructed playable. Good modal spells be good, yo.
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Dec 17, 2014 00:09
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Angry Grimace posted:Would you like a random FRF spoiler? Okay. Well drat, that's certainly a card. E: makes me wonder if there'll be a stance cycle of cards with an offensive and defensive mode
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Dec 17, 2014 00:09
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