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TFRazorsaw posted:No, she needed to tilt her head for the transition to be complete. It makes a good entry point into the harder stuff. I think American audiences would die* if they weren't properly inoculated before being exposed to the head-tilt at full power.  *of laughter
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Dec 24, 2014 20:00
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I'll add Meelo to my least favorite list. Character is farts.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:00
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You guys are gonna be so pissed when Meelo is the villain of the next Avatar series.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:02
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Best Character: Lin, pretty much hands down. I really liked her in S1, and S3 sold me on her from then on. Worst Character: Deska/Eska. The creepy twins thing has been done to death, and honestly nothing ever really happens that validates their existence in the narrative. The romance subplot with Bolin was stupid as hell, too. I give Meelo a pass because he was the obvious comic relief for children character. AtLA had fart jokes too, and if I could ignore them then, I can ignore them now.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:07
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How could anyone hate Meelo more than the walking deux ex that was Jinora?
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Dec 24, 2014 20:07
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Irish Joe posted:How could anyone hate Meelo more than the walking deux ex that was Jinora? It could be reasonably argued that Jinora isn't actually a character, she's a Macguffin. And we were talking about characters.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:11
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DrSunshine posted:It makes a good entry point into the harder stuff. I think American audiences would die* if they weren't properly inoculated before being exposed to the head-tilt at full power. lol u think that's maximum animu head tilt? 
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Dec 24, 2014 20:13
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Irish Joe posted:How could anyone hate Meelo more than the walking deux ex that was Jinora? Meh, as odd as it sounds, I never minded Jinora's shenanigans because I really like Tenzin, and her character in seasons 2 & 3 basically existed to bring his flaws into the light. Tenzin is really interesting because he acts opposite to what Aang always said an Airbender was supposed to be: Tenzin is stubborn, set in his ways, not very spiritual, and concerned with earthly things like his family & feelings of inferiority to his dad and later Jinora. Jinora was always the one who either brought those flaws out, or acted as a foil towards them. And Jinora getting her tattoos is just as much a victory for her as it is for Tenzin, who finally let go of those feelings and acknowledged Jinora.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:19
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uncleKitchener posted:I'll add Meelo to my least favorite list. Character is farts. My least favorite character out of both series was easily Unalaq. He was a really flat villain who's goal seemed idiotic to anyone who could think. The whole cast had to be dumbed down to make his plot work. This season would have been much better if the villain was just Vaatu. Miss Nomer fucked around with this message at 20:23 on Dec 24, 2014 |
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Dec 24, 2014 20:21
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Best avatar character for me is a toss-up between Zuko, Lin, and Varrick. Worst is Unalaq by a mile.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:22
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Irish Joe posted:How could anyone hate Meelo more than the walking deux ex that was Jinora? Particularly since Jinora is directly involved in an instance of the show teaching children an awful loving lesson: Working hard doesn't mean poo poo. Jinora and Meelo are definitely the two characters I disliked the most. Varrick and Su ended up being two characters I enjoyed a lot, along with Zhu Li. Lin would be up there if her season 2 character hadn't been a thing. But this is me limiting myself to Korra-only characters. Oh Snapple! fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Dec 24, 2014 |
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Dec 24, 2014 20:30
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Oh Snapple! posted:Particularly since Jinora is directly involved in an instance of the show teaching children an awful loving lesson: Working hard doesn't mean poo poo. Which instance was this? That can be true in context.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:36
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computer parts posted:Which instance was this? That can be true in context. When a lifetime of work on Tenzin's part amounts to nothing while Jinora effortlessly completes his life's ambition fueled purely by ~being special~.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:38
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It's probably how she just had a natural knack for spirit stuff and Tenzin didn't despite all his efforts. Yeah that poo poo happens in real life and it's depressing when it does.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:38
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Miss Nomer posted:I didn't mind Meelo that much. I think I enjoyed him more for his juxtaposition against the other airbenders. While they are all peace and harmony, he's more about wanting to rule/dominate. It really made me want to see some pre-Aang airbender history to see if there were any megalomaniac airbenders. I totally forgot about Unalaq, mainly because I felt S2 wasn't even about him. He was just a pawn in Vaatu's plans or maybe I'm giving S2 too much credit outside of being very pretty and visually vibrant. Oh Snapple! posted:Particularly since Jinora is directly involved in an instance of the show teaching children an awful loving lesson: Working hard doesn't mean poo poo. It's funny, because I'm Jinora.
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Dec 24, 2014 20:55
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Favorite characters Atla: Toph and the dude always getting his cabbages wrecked. Korra: Zaheer and Zhu Li
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Dec 24, 2014 20:56
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The Sharmat posted:It's probably how she just had a natural knack for spirit stuff and Tenzin didn't despite all his efforts. Teaching kids that no matter how hard you try someone dripping with talent can do better without trying is a good life lesson.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:00
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Oh Snapple! posted:When a lifetime of work on Tenzin's part amounts to nothing while Jinora effortlessly completes his life's ambition fueled purely by ~being special~. Alternately that lesson can be "you have your own strengths and weaknesses and should embrace what you are good at instead of what your parents attempt to force upon you" which is actually a good lesson for kids. The entire point of that plot was that Tenzin is not Aang and did not need to try to be Aang. This is stated unambiguously onscreen so I'm not sure how you got that out of it.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:01
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favourite characters were Sokka and Bolin, sorry that I have a bad sense of humour  least favourites were Tai-Li and the combination of Noahtak and Tarlokk. I'm mostly just mad about the stupid telepathic bloodbending
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Dec 24, 2014 21:04
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I felt that while Jinora was a deus ex in Season 2, I liked what they did with the character in Season 3
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Dec 24, 2014 21:05
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Toshimo posted:lol u think that's maximum animu head tilt? DrSunshine posted:It makes a good entry point into the harder stuff. I think American audiences would die* if they weren't properly inoculated before being exposed to the head-tilt at full power. so you're saying SHAFT should animate the next series of Avatar because I'm 100% OK with that
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Dec 24, 2014 21:06
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Favorites: Bolin, Korra, Tenzin, Beifong sisters/Opal, Wan Least Favorites: Iroh II, Grandma Yin, Season 4 Meelo (his VA got worse somehow) I liked pretty much everyone but the people in my least favorites list. There are some characters I'm meh about (Tonraq never did anything for me, for example) but for the most part I didn't have the same issues with lack of good characters that others did with the series.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:17
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LEGO Genetics posted:so you're saying SHAFT should animate the next series of Avatar Warning: SHAFT is my TRIGGER
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Dec 24, 2014 21:17
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Turtle Sandbox posted:Teaching kids that no matter how hard you try someone dripping with talent can do better without trying is a good life lesson. And I forgot to add my favorite character(s): Zuko (for having one of the best character arcs in fiction I've ever seen) and Uncle Iroh because he's Iroh What's not to love about these two? And their best scene.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:18
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I never thought Jinora was "naturally better" at spiritual stuff than her dad, but that her personality and general more unstated wisdom and maturity helped her reach that kind of enlightenment. Tenzin does everything with a huge chip on his shoulder and with numerous specters looming over him. It's not that his hard work is useless, it's that he's more focused on what he thinks he needs to be, following the dogma and expectations of Air Nomad culture without the spirit of it. Enlightenment in the Avatar world has never been purely a matter of following rules and putting in "hard effort", it's about finding fundamental truth and being true to oneself. In a way, Tenzin is a lot more like Korra than he cares to admit.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:21
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ImpAtom posted:Alternately that lesson can be "you have your own strengths and weaknesses and should embrace what you are good at instead of what your parents attempt to force upon you" which is actually a good lesson for kids. It was said, sure. But it doesn't change what was shown in that we see a lifetime of work and dedication amount to nothing in the face of a little girl just being able to ~do~ something. I don't doubt that what was stated on-screen was the intended message, but that's also only part of the equation and it's pretty disingenuous to act like something as big and pronounced as what I've mentioned can't possibly be taken from it. Because it's certainly what stuck out the most to me, certainly more than whatever words the characters offered after the fact. "Actions speak louder" and all that, and the "action" as presented on screen during this didn't say anything I felt was positive.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:23
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quote:It was said, sure. But it doesn't change what was shown in that we see a lifetime of work and dedication amount to nothing in the face of a little girl just being able to ~do~ something. A lifetime of working something steeped in a philosophy you don't fully realize the point of shouldn't lead to what you want just because you put more hours in.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:28
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TFRazorsaw posted:I never thought Jinora was "naturally better" at spiritual stuff than her dad, but that her personality and general more unstated wisdom and maturity helped her reach that kind of enlightenment. Tenzin does everything with a huge chip on his shoulder and with numerous specters looming over him. It's not that his hard work is useless, it's that he's more focused on what he thinks he needs to be, following the dogma and expectations of Air Nomad culture without the spirit of it. The wisdom of a little girl that promptly runs the gently caress off and leaves the person she's supposed to be guiding lost in a strange world because she saw something pretty  I still don't think Jinora having to be Korra's guide was anything other than a narrative contrivance to justify Korra getting lost and needing Iroh's help. But season 2 was, of course, pretty poor all around outside of some isolated parts. And Iroh is great so whatever. I'll take him.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:31
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Korra has been my favorite character on TV since Book 2. Least favorite character is probably Tonraq, to be honest.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:34
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Oh Snapple! posted:When a lifetime of work on Tenzin's part amounts to nothing while Jinora effortlessly completes his life's ambition fueled purely by ~being special~. Isn't that also what happened to Bolin trying to metalbend too?
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Dec 24, 2014 21:36
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TFRazorsaw posted:A lifetime of working something steeped in a philosophy you don't fully realize the point of shouldn't lead to what you want just because you put more hours in. Yeah, Tenzin is interesting in that he acts nothing like what an air nomad is supposed to. Aang always had another clever strategy, or another angle of attack, or another crazy plan to pull out of his rear end. Part of his arc is explicitly realizing that you cannot run from or avoid your problems forever, eventually you have to face them head on. Tenzin meanwhile really doesn't know how to do anything but brute force through problems. We see this in season one when he starts to train Korra. Rather than trying something different when Korra struggles to pick up airbending, he just doubles down on his teaching methods, and lashes out at Korra when she tries something different with Pro Bending. If anything, Tenzin is an airbender with the personality of an earthbender. Maybe Lin rubbed off a little on him during their youth. 
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Dec 24, 2014 21:37
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RareAcumen posted:Isn't that also what happened to Bolin trying to metalbend too? Pretty much, it's honestly why, as rad as lava bending is, I'm disappointed he never picked up metal bending. It's ultimately kind of a latent thing you have to deal with in the series because the very premise of it (and other media, obviously, including TLA) revolves around a cast of Exceptional People with Innate Talent Out the rear end. It's why it becomes disappointing, narratively, when a character that has to work hard for something can't accomplish it and it instead just gets accomplished effortlessly by someone else with that innate talent, usually right in front of them.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:38
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Favorite ATLA Character: I can't choose. The best I can do is narrow it down to five: Katara, Toph, Iroh, Zuko, and Azula. They are all a joy to watch whenever they are on screen. Best ATLA Character: Objectively Zuko. One of the greatest characters in the history of television, Zuko's arc is perfectly done. Every incremental step of his development is perfectly justified and so well-done that you don't even realize just how much he's changing until you look back on where he started from. I'm astounded every time I rewatch the series and I see that angry freak with a ponytail knowing where he ends up, and his journey of growth and learning is just as magical the fifth time as it was the first. Least Favorite ATLA Character: Suki. She's badass, she teaches Sokka not to be a misogynist dick, and... well that's about it. She's not a bad character, she just didn't really get enough time to come into her own. Worst ATLA Character: Jet. I like the episodes that Jet is in. I like the events that happen and the ideas that are expressed as a result of Jet. I do not think Jet is well written. I am not actively annoyed by him, but I feel that he lacks any real nuance or subtlety. I feel his obsession, but I don't feel his struggle, and that makes me think of him more as a piece on the chessboard of storytelling rather than a person who has thoughts and feelings and a reason for me to care about them beyond utility. That's probably why I laugh at the joke about his death in Ember Island Players instead of feeling it to be in poor taste and against the good nature of the other characters. Favorite LOK Character: Varrick. The saving grace of Book 2, a welcome addition to Book 3, and a highlight of Book 4, Varrick takes Greatest One-Off Simpsons Character of All Time Hank Scorpio and puts him in the fantasy world of Avatar that we all know and love, and then gives him a not-too-shabby character arc for good measure. He's great. Varrick's great. Yay Varrick. Best LOK Character: Tarrlok. I wish I could give this to Tenzin, a character who appeared in more than one out of four books and seven out of 52 episodes. I really do. But no, Tarrlok's arc, where he goes from cocksure smarmy motherfucker to man who realizes his entire life is brutally cyclical and he should just kill himself right now before he fucks anything else up, is wonderfully affecting. Yes his father was a two-dimensional Bad Dad, but so was Ozai, and we all let that slide because Tarrlok's dad like Ozai is important in what he represents, namely what Tarrlok and Noatak desperately don't want to become. But they do become their father. And when everything has collapsed, when he sits in that cell, his bending gone forever along with his power, and his brother comes to him and says they can just try again, Tarrlok does the smartest and saddest thing in the series. He kills himself and his brother, because he knows what will happen if they don't. Failure. Death. Misery. And it will just happen again and again and again and they won't change. Tarrlok's arc is the opposite of Zuko's: a man fails to break away from the father that he hates. And that resonates. Tarrlok is the soul of Book 1. Least Favorite LOK Character: Bolin. A clear attempt to replicate the success of Sokka, but without the strategic mind that balanced Sokka's character and allowed his more infantile moments to be endearing rather than irritating. While he did end up having a decent arc when all was said and done, the fact is that Bolin was the clearest instance of LOK still being in the shadow of its predecessor. Worst LOK Character: Unalaq. His actions those of a man playing chess against himself when he doesn't know the rules, Unalaq bumbles and shitfucks along for an entire season before mercifully being killed. The following seasons each call him out for being a lovely villain, and, implicitly, a poo poo character.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:41
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My favorite characters are Toph and Asami. I don't care to have least favorites.
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Dec 24, 2014 21:49
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Favorites: Zaheer and Sokka I never felt like Sokka got his due. Most tend to think Aang was the leader of the anti-firebender effort but honestly Sokka was leading that outfit. Aang was just the avatar. Then Sokka got shafted in LOK by not having any kind of descendants mentioned (I know there are those out there that wanna believe Su is his daughter but it could just as easily be someone we never heard of) and being the only one of the original core gAang to be dead, aside from Aang obviously. Sokka was awesome and even with being a non-bender and starting out a misogynist, sarcastic, goof he really grew up by the end. He was still goofy but Sokka actually made some big strides from where he started. I don't feel like I gotta explain Zaheer. Least Favorite: The spirits I don't dislike some individual spirits, some of them are pretty nifty but all and all the spirits suck. They are like the most "screw you, got mine" group of characters in the show. A lot of times when the spirits show up the interaction would leave me about as frustrated as the characters who had to put up with them. Heibei: The fire nation burned down my forest so I am gonna go just smash up a near by village of humans because... That monkey spirit when Aang was looking for the Moon and Ocean spirits was just an rear end for no reason. He could have answered Aang's question and had him on his way in about as much time as it took for him to be a total dick. The spirits left Wan to wander in the wilds after he asked for help and didn't bother till he was in danger to finally let him in. Like one beaten up, starving human is a threat to a bunch of immortal magic beings. Spirits in the final season personified "screw you, got mine" and then when the work was done they came back. I actually boo'd that part. All and all spirits more often then not are portrayed as self righteous, abrasive, selfish, callous, stuck up, jerks. GO BACK TO THE SPIRIT WORLD YOU SEEM TRANSPARENT BAGS OF NONSENSE!
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Dec 24, 2014 21:53
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Tenzin put his life into airbending, and as a result, he is the best airbender in the world. Hard work clearly does pay off.
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Dec 24, 2014 22:01
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Ghazan is the best.
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Dec 24, 2014 22:04
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Yo, gently caress spirits.
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Dec 24, 2014 22:04
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Lucy Heartfilia posted:Yo, gently caress spirits. Truth. I enjoy that the only two things really accomplished by leaving the spirit portal open were 1) letting those dicks come and lounge around and be haughty and 2) providing fuel for a doomsday weapon. I guess the airbending thing too? I can't remember if that was a result of the portals being open or an after effect of the whole s2 mess.
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Dec 24, 2014 22:08
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Mymla posted:Tenzin put his life into airbending, and as a result, he is the best airbender in the world. Hard work clearly does pay off. Tenzin completely dominating Zaheer in their airbending fight was the best, and made up for the fact that he ended up jobbing anyway once the rest of the Red Lotus stepped in.
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Dec 24, 2014 22:09
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