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Yes, please, by all means put this all on the PA when you absolutely control this situation.
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Dec 31, 2014 16:05
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The Israeli media is hustling and bustling with reports about possible criminal charges against Givati Brigade officers for the application of the Hannibal Directive during protective edge, the family of Captain Hadar Goldin is apparently not too pleased with their son being sacrificed on the battlefield (alongside 70 or so Palestinian civilians but naturally nobody mentions them). If this gains traction there's a distinct possibility that Colonel Ofer "May YHWH smite our enemies on the battlefield" Winter will get the short end of the stick as apparently he personally approved the use of the directive. Edit: YNET posted a recording of the comm lines during the massacre of Shujaiya, it's mostly just IDF soldiers panicking out of their minds one particularly damning snippet I thought was noteworthy "Get the tanks into this loving (refugee) camp and lift it up into the sky". Hell of a pinpoint operation. emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Dec 31, 2014 |
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Dec 31, 2014 17:23
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Oh my, it seems Abbas is going ahead with signing the Rome Statute. A last desperate attempt to save PA, or one last blaze of glory before death? I know the UN vote failed, but is joining the ICC really the best step at the moment? It's just that the PA seems lioke the only real authority or protection the Palestinians have, and if that goes... what's left?
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Dec 31, 2014 18:54
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resurgam40 posted:Oh my, it seems Abbas is going ahead with signing the Rome Statute. "Goes"? Why is this indicative of them going anywhere? I don't think they have any leverage going on if they don't join the ICC, it was either this or find refuge in a sympathetic country from the mob.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:01
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Hamas is equally likely as Israel to be investigated here.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:08
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Xandu posted:Hamas is equally likely as Israel to be investigated here. Win-win for Fatah.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:16
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Absurd Alhazred posted:"Goes"? Why is this indicative of them going anywhere? I don't think they have any leverage going on if they don't join the ICC, it was either this or find refuge in a sympathetic country from the mob. The threat of joining the ICC was leverage.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:16
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Volkerball posted:The threat of joining the ICC was leverage. Sometimes you have to follow up on your threat if you want them to be credible.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:32
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Volkerball posted:The threat of joining the ICC was leverage. Threats ain't worth squat if you're not willing to use them. Well, this was used, and now any future Israeli violation is under jurisdiction. 
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Dec 31, 2014 19:32
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Cat Mattress posted:Sometimes you have to follow up on your threat if you want them to be credible. That was the biggest, and really only threat they had left after forming the unity government. It was the biggest chip in the previous negotiations. Now it's gone, and gone in a way that says "gently caress you, Israel." I certainly think the PA is justified in going this route, but the fact remains that the slim odds of a deal happening sometime in the next several years dropped quite a bit today. Volkerball fucked around with this message at 19:39 on Dec 31, 2014 |
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Dec 31, 2014 19:36
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It is kind of crazy reading reports on this categorising seeking international judicial oversight over only the most serious of crimes a nation can commit against another as some kind of exceptionally unreasonable thing to do to Israel. It isn't like Israel will even be extraditing any of their citizens to The Hague even if they are found to have committed atrocities.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:38
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Volkerball posted:That was the biggest, and really only threat they had left after forming the unity government. It was the biggest chip in the previous negotiations. Now it's gone, and gone in a way that says "gently caress you, Israel." I certainly think the PA is justified in going this route, but the fact remains that the slim odds of a deal happening sometime in the next several years dropped quite a bit today. Israel deserved the "gently caress you". And they do have the security cooperation and the fact that they are managing regions A and B whenever the IDF isn't in the mood to break in there. They can just not help or actively fight the IDF, and good luck managing all that alone again, as in pre-Oslo. ReV VAdAUL posted:It is kind of crazy reading reports on this categorising seeking international judicial oversight over only the most serious of crimes a nation can commit against another as some kind of exceptionally unreasonable thing to do to Israel. It isn't like Israel will even be extraditing any of their citizens to The Hague even if they are found to have committed atrocities. They can say goodbye to vacationing in Europe, or anywhere else that would extradite them, though. Or doing business there.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:49
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Israel deserved the "gently caress you". And they do have the security cooperation and the fact that they are managing regions A and B whenever the IDF isn't in the mood to break in there. They can just not help or actively fight the IDF, and good luck managing all that alone again, as in pre-Oslo. Israel certainly deserves a gently caress you, but lets look at it from a strategic standpoint. There's two routes the PA could choose to take. The first is to push towards a deal with Israel by maximizing their leverage, eventually making something happen with Israel's blessing. The second is to say gently caress you to Israel, and try and appeal to the world to gain international support to force Israel to the table. While clearly, neither of these two options seems very likely, they've poisoned the well for the first option even more than it already was. So now they are basically limited to the second, and I don't know how much progress we're going to see on the "world condemning Israel" front any time soon. We'll have to see how Palestine joining the ICC works in practice. It might add significant pressure, but I'm not very hopeful.
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Dec 31, 2014 19:58
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resurgam40 posted:Oh my, it seems Abbas is going ahead with signing the Rome Statute. Im sorry for my dumb question but will such a move as ICC jurisdiction remain in effect if the Palestinian Authority ceases to be a distinct entity itself?
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Dec 31, 2014 20:01
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Volkerball posted:Israel certainly deserves a gently caress you, but lets look at it from a strategic standpoint. There's two routes the PA could choose to take. The first is to push towards a deal with Israel by maximizing their leverage, eventually making something happen with Israel's blessing. The second is to say gently caress you to Israel, and try and appeal to the world to gain international support to force Israel to the table. While clearly, neither of these two options seems very likely, they've poisoned the well for the first option even more than it already was. So now they are basically limited to the second, and I don't know how much progress we're going to see on the "world condemning Israel" front any time soon. We'll have to see how Palestine joining the ICC works in practice. It might add significant pressure, but I'm not very hopeful. But it wasn't working. Hadn't been working for years. Israel was alternately scoffing at and completely sabotaging the potential of that thread through the US. At no point did the US even use this as an argument to pressure Israel. They had to make good on that threat to retain any credibility. Israel has basically shut down the negotiations, and I see no reason to pretend that the Palestinians have had a significant role in making that happen. Now that the ICC is involved, much like with European sanctions targeting the settlements, holding the West Bank becomes even pricier. Every day in every way, Israeli colonialist policies are exposing it to ICC scrutiny now. It's also making American support costlier. To little, too late, perhaps, but I think they made the right call; only fuckup was not to do this before Protective Edge, since that would have put the whole operation under scrutiny. ETA: tentative8e8op posted:Im sorry for my dumb question but will such a move as ICC jurisdiction remain in effect if the Palestinian Authority ceases to be a distinct entity itself? That's also a good point. Abbas needs a lifeline, otherwise he has no real excuse not to dissolve the PA yesterday. This is basically his only argument left for why this is in any way good for the Palestinians to have right now. Absurd Alhazred fucked around with this message at 20:07 on Dec 31, 2014 |
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Dec 31, 2014 20:05
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Absurd Alhazred posted:But it wasn't working. Hadn't been working for years. Israel was alternately scoffing at and completely sabotaging the potential of that thread through the US. At no point did the US even use this as an argument to pressure Israel. They had to make good on that threat to retain any credibility. Israel has basically shut down the negotiations, and I see no reason to pretend that the Palestinians have had a significant role in making that happen. Yes it hasn't been working, but it's also getting more difficult for Israel as the years go on. We're still not close to a deal, but there's been a lot of promising developments recently. There's a sort of wall of defiance in Israel that is an obstacle towards achieving peace, and this adds another brick to it. So now they must be brought down kicking and screaming, which is a tall order. To be clear, I'm not sold that they shouldn't have gone through with this, but I'm skeptical it was in the best interest of Palestinians in the long term. I can't find it now because of this news swallowing up all the old search results, but Netanyahu definitely was afraid of the Palestinians joining the ICC and pressing war crime prosecutions against Israeli leaders. And as far as the timing, I suppose now is as good as ever, in the immediate aftermath of the UN vote.
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Dec 31, 2014 20:16
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Also, let me be the first to inform you all that the ICC is now anti-semitic, joining fellow anti-semites the UN, every European government, and facts.
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Dec 31, 2014 20:19
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Volkerball posted:Also, let me be the first to inform you all that the ICC is now anti-semitic, joining fellow anti-semites the UN, every European government, and facts. That cards gotta have a shelf life.
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Dec 31, 2014 20:28
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emanresu tnuocca posted:Edit: YNET posted a recording of the comm lines during the massacre of Shujaiya, it's mostly just IDF soldiers panicking out of their minds one particularly damning snippet I thought was noteworthy "Get the tanks into this loving (refugee) camp and lift it up into the sky". Hell of a pinpoint operation.
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Dec 31, 2014 20:39
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Xander77 posted:Have you considered actually posting a link there? Because google and the front page of YNET are at a loss. http://www.ynet.co.il/articles/0,7340,L-4609468,00.html
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Dec 31, 2014 20:43
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Volkerball posted:Yes it hasn't been working, but it's also getting more difficult for Israel as the years go on. We're still not close to a deal, but there's been a lot of promising developments recently. There's a sort of wall of defiance in Israel that is an obstacle towards achieving peace, and this adds another brick to it. So now they must be brought down kicking and screaming, which is a tall order. To be clear, I'm not sold that they shouldn't have gone through with this, but I'm skeptical it was in the best interest of Palestinians in the long term. I can't find it now because of this news swallowing up all the old search results, but Netanyahu definitely was afraid of the Palestinians joining the ICC and pressing war crime prosecutions against Israeli leaders. And as far as the timing, I suppose now is as good as ever, in the immediate aftermath of the UN vote. The negotiations have been a huge joke for eyars. During the Bush years, the Palestinian negotiators offerred to accept all of Israel's conditions in order to get peace, and Israel refused. So keeping this as leverage is useless, because it won't work and didn't work.
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Dec 31, 2014 20:55
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Volkerball posted:Also, let me be the first to inform you all that the ICC is now anti-semitic, joining fellow anti-semites the UN, every European government, and facts. Don't you know that everyone involved in international law is a secret anti-semite? The way the Israeli government attacked Schabas after he was appointed to lead the current UN inquiry was absolutely farcical, not only is he one of the single most respected living IHR scholars (who literally wrote the book on genocide) he's regarded as being rather conservative and cautious in his interpretations. Hell, he's president of an organization that gets criticized for being too timid in criticizing Israel. Comparing him to ISIS made it clear that no one can ever met Israel's standards when it comes to investigating rights violations.
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Dec 31, 2014 21:01
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MonsieurChoc posted:The negotiations have been a huge joke for eyars. During the Bush years, the Palestinian negotiators offerred to accept all of Israel's conditions in order to get peace, and Israel refused. So keeping this as leverage is useless, because it won't work and didn't work. The notion that there's anything to negotiate over is a joke in itself, honestly the whole thing is just a huge piece of misdirection and I'm always taken aback when people actually take them seriously. Abbas should have went to the ICC years ago, the fact that it only happened now is indicative of much of a collaborationist puppet regime the PA is. What is the PA bringing to the negotiations table anyway? "Peace"?
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Dec 31, 2014 21:05
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Volkerball posted:Yes it hasn't been working, but it's also getting more difficult for Israel as the years go on. We're still not close to a deal, but there's been a lot of promising developments recently. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but haven't all of the positive developments been external to Israel?
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Dec 31, 2014 21:17
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emanresu tnuocca posted:The notion that there's anything to negotiate over is a joke in itself, honestly the whole thing is just a huge piece of misdirection and I'm always taken aback when people actually take them seriously. Abbas should have went to the ICC years ago, the fact that it only happened now is indicative of much of a collaborationist puppet regime the PA is. The PA is a proto-state institution that could become one as soon as Israeli forces leave. As for how it benefits Israel, they are currently an essential source of stability in the West Bank occupation, if they just mic-drop and leave, it's going to be back to pre-Oslo. The right may think they want this, but they don't remember, and with how things have changed since then, it's going to be a lot more reminiscent of Algeria than it was.
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Dec 31, 2014 21:33
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Volkerball posted:Also, let me be the first to inform you all that the ICC is now anti-semitic, joining fellow anti-semites the UN, every European government, and facts. the ICC: brings charges against Kenyatta for ethnic cleansing, before dropping them. I'm sure joining the ICC will do much to boost Palestinian credibility, and won't result in Hamas members in Turkey being brought up on charges. Absurd Alhazred posted:The PA is a proto-state institution that could become one as soon as Israeli forces leave. As for how it benefits Israel, they are currently an essential source of stability in the West Bank occupation, if they just mic-drop and leave, it's going to be back to pre-Oslo. The right may think they want this, but they don't remember, and with how things have changed since then, it's going to be a lot more reminiscent of Algeria than it was. America formed multi-party state institutions under a prolonged period of English occupation. Oslo is dead, killed by Hamas, Erdogan, and Iran. Unless Palestinians accept a two-state solution, Israel will be forced to implement a one-state solution. emanresu tnuocca posted:The notion that there's anything to negotiate over is a joke in itself, honestly the whole thing is just a huge piece of misdirection and I'm always taken aback when people actually take them seriously. Abbas should have went to the ICC years ago, the fact that it only happened now is indicative of much of a collaborationist puppet regime the PA is. Energy and resource rights, monopolies, and future revenue potential. Due to Erdogan, Israel's opportunities for gas export are a bit limited. Hopefully, African industrialization will provide novel solutions to future export market access. My Imaginary GF fucked around with this message at 03:16 on Jan 1, 2015 |
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Jan 1, 2015 03:10
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My Imaginary GF posted:the ICC: brings charges against Kenyatta for ethnic cleansing, before dropping them. The case against Kenyatta collapsed due to pretty transparent witness intimidation and a lack of cooperation from the Kenyan government who failed to turn over documents requested by the prosecutor on multiple occasions. With the withdrawal of the original witnesses and no new evidence available the case had to be dropped. Do you think the prosecutors decision to suspend the Darfur investigation days later was a coincidence? The prosecutor has made it pretty clear that the international communities failure to support the ICC in Sudan and Kenya has hampered their investigations.
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Jan 1, 2015 03:38
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My Imaginary GF posted:I'm sure joining the ICC will do much to boost Palestinian credibility, and won't result in Hamas members in Turkey being brought up on charges. Prosecuting criminals of any stripe will result in increased credibility for everyone. It's a two way street.
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Jan 1, 2015 03:39
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kustomkarkommando posted:The case against Kenyatta collapsed due to pretty transparent witness intimidation and a lack of cooperation from the Kenyan government who failed to turn over documents requested by the prosecutor on multiple occasions. With the withdrawal of the original witnesses and no new evidence available the case had to be dropped. Do you expect Israeli or Palestinian co-operation on ICC investigations, or for the agency to be used as a political tool? That's why USG has been opposed to Palestinian membership: Palestinians at the ICC threatens the credibility of the institution itself, and guarantes its use as an active political bargaining chip. Israel, America, Australia, and our other allies won't press ICC charges against Palestinians in European and semi-European nations, in exchange for Palestinian non-membership. Now that they're becoming members, pre-emptive prosecutions must be launched against Palestinian targets. syscall girl posted:Prosecuting criminals of any stripe will result in increased credibility for everyone. It's a two way street. Tell that to the Kenyan populations who had hoped for ICC enforcement of the Kenyatta indictment. I'm sure Palestinians won't be inflamed with further anti-semetic rhetoric like "Israel made ICC drop charges" and violence will not result from Palestinian membership at ICC 
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Jan 1, 2015 03:56
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 the UN and all related bodies are toothless and ineffectualNews at 11!
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Jan 1, 2015 04:22
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My Imaginary GF posted:Do you expect Israeli or Palestinian co-operation on ICC investigations, or for the agency to be used as a political tool? That's why USG has been opposed to Palestinian membership: Palestinians at the ICC threatens the credibility of the institution itself, and guarantes its use as an active political bargaining chip. Israel, America, Australia, and our other allies won't press ICC charges against Palestinians in European and semi-European nations, in exchange for Palestinian non-membership. Now that they're becoming members, pre-emptive prosecutions must be launched against Palestinian targets. It'd be a real trick for Israel to press charges against Palestine in the ICC, given that neither Israel nor the US are members of the ICC. Israel refused to ratify the ICC treaty for fear of being forced to cooperate with any possible future investigation into their actions in Palestine. This also makes it difficult for them to influence ICC proceedings.
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Jan 1, 2015 04:40
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Main Paineframe posted:It'd be a real trick for Israel to press charges against Palestine in the ICC, given that neither Israel nor the US are members of the ICC. Israel refused to ratify the ICC treaty for fear of being forced to cooperate with any possible future investigation into their actions in Palestine. This also makes it difficult for them to influence ICC proceedings. You know, Guatemala, we'd really like to assist you with developing your offshore energy capacity. You see, we have some experience with Eastern Mediteranian energy development in partnership with USG interests. Would be an awful shame if our deal fell through because of terrorist attacks financed and operational from Turkey. Wouldn't it be nice if those terrorists were brought up in a complaint at ICC? Please, feel free to discuss this with US Embassy Economic and Political Officers.
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Jan 1, 2015 04:50
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Absurd Alhazred posted:The PA is a proto-state institution that could become one as soon as Israeli forces leave. As for how it benefits Israel, they are currently an essential source of stability in the West Bank occupation, if they just mic-drop and leave, it's going to be back to pre-Oslo. The right may think they want this, but they don't remember, and with how things have changed since then, it's going to be a lot more reminiscent of Algeria than it was. That only supports my point that the PA mostly benefits Israeli interests, it is not an institution oriented towards ending the occupation and changing the status quo, it might be a fantastic orginization to pick up the pieces once the occupation ends but at the moment it doesn't serve Palestinian interests. I didn't question its benefits to Israel, quite the opposite. The simple fact is that after two decades of the PA being the main Palestinian player diplomatically the struggle against the occupation has completely stagnated. Main Paineframe posted:It'd be a real trick for Israel to press charges against Palestine in the ICC, given that neither Israel nor the US are members of the ICC. Israel refused to ratify the ICC treaty for fear of being forced to cooperate with any possible future investigation into their actions in Palestine. This also makes it difficult for them to influence ICC proceedings. Technically Israel doesn't have to press charges, once Abbas files an investigation request with the ICC they'd have the jurisdiction to review possible infractions by all involved parties, this will certainly extend to Hamas and would possibly reflect somewhat upon the PA due to the unity government, I don't think Abbas overly concerned with that though, nor should he be, he's trying to win back some sovereignty if some Hamas members wind up with international arrest warrants in the process it won't really be a tragedy from his perspective. emanresu tnuocca fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Jan 1, 2015 |
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Jan 1, 2015 09:31
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emanresu tnuocca posted:That only supports my point that the PA mostly benefits Israeli interests, it is not an institution oriented towards ending the occupation and changing the status quo, it might be a fantastic orginization to pick up the pieces once the occupation ends but at the moment it doesn't serve Palestinian interests. quote:I didn't question its benefits to Israel, quite the opposite. The simply fact is that after two decades of the PA being the main Palestinian player diplomatically the struggle against the occupation has completely stagnated.
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Jan 1, 2015 09:36
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The coronation of Arafat by Israel was a means to stagnate the intifada, his popularity among the palestinian citizenry was hitting an all time low prior to the negotiations with Rabin which were for all intents and purposes a lifeline extended to the PLO, at the end of the day if everything the PA is bringing to the table a promise to create a stable and 'not-anti-Israel' regime then they're truly not bringing much, for that purpose they're also not really bringing anything permanent, who's to say that in 10 years the Palestinian state would still be led by PA sympathizers etc. It's a farce. I had a whimsical thought yesterday as I was going to bed, as an extension of the 'what is there to negotiate' notion, it would be a grand move by Abbas to publicly call for Israel to list its pre-requisites for a peace treaty, to clearly state what it requires from Palestinians so that it could end the occupation, pushing this point would really be the best way to unmask Israel and prove to anyone who still doubts that the occupation is intended to be permanent.
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Jan 1, 2015 09:44
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Who's to say there will be a Palestinian state in 10 years? If the PLO collapses, its entirely possible that no state will rise to take its place.emanresu tnuocca posted:I had a whimsical thought yesterday as I was going to bed, as an extension of the 'what is there to negotiate' notion, it would be a grand move by Abbas to publicly call for Israel to list its pre-requisites for a peace treaty, to clearly state what it requires from Palestinians so that it could end the occupation, pushing this point would really be the best way to unmask Israel and prove to anyone who still doubts that the occupation is intended to be permanent. -representation and protection of Jewish individuals living within Palestinian territories Maybe if PLO wishes to have a Palestinian state, they should represent all individuals living within Palestine and incorporate them into their governing coalition. Has PLO ever tried to represent or incorporate settlers into Palestinian government? My Imaginary GF fucked around with this message at 09:50 on Jan 1, 2015 |
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Jan 1, 2015 09:47
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emanresu tnuocca posted:The coronation of Arafat by Israel was a means to stagnate the intifada, his popularity among the palestinian citizenry was hitting an all time low prior to the negotiations with Rabin which were for all intents and purposes a lifeline extended to the PLO, at the end of the day if everything the PA is bringing to the table a promise to create a stable and 'not-anti-Israel' regime then they're truly not bringing much, for that purpose they're also not really bringing anything permanent, who's to say that in 10 years the Palestinian state would still be led by PA sympathizers etc. It's a farce. quote:I had a whimsical thought yesterday as I was going to bed, as an extension of the 'what is there to negotiate' notion, it would be a grand move by Abbas to publicly call for Israel to list its pre-requisites for a peace treaty, to clearly state what it requires from Palestinians so that it could end the occupation, pushing this point would really be the best way to unmask Israel and prove to anyone who still doubts that the occupation is intended to be permanent.
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Jan 1, 2015 09:53
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My Imaginary GF posted:Who's to say there will be a Palestinian state in 10 years? If the PLO collapses, its entirely possible that no state will rise to take its place. Who's to say anything really? The talmud says: Ever since the fall of the holy temple, it has come to be that prophecy was taken away from the prophets, and given to the infants and the fools. The point I was making was a hypothetical, that is, even if a peace accord is reached, how does it guarantee that at a certain point in the future the palestinian leadership won't change its mind, a peace treaty is just that, a treaty, and personally I find it very hard to believe that Israel is willing to negotiate exchanging the west bank for some words on a paper. quote:-representation and protection of Jewish individuals living within Palestinian territories That's a nice concept but indicative more than anything that you did not read about the round of negotiations during the Olmert administration led by Livni, cause that was discussed and was flatly rejected by the Israeli government, it has been expressly stated that only IDF troopers on the ground are considered a sufficient protection for settler communities. Absurd Alhazred posted:From what I've read and seen in documentaries, from Madrid on, whoever the Israelis talked to, they'd say the PLO was the representative organization. And Arafat's set up a line through Oslo as early as 1979. There was no meaningful alternative negotiation partner for even the most honest Israeli leadership. Unless you know something I don't; I'm always happy to hear more about. My understanding is that by the time Oslo started the Intifada had long since lost its wind. http://www.chomsky.info/articles/199601--.htm posted:There has been another change from 1988: at Oslo, Rabin and Shimon Peres were willing to negotiate with the PLO and recognize it as “the representative of the Palestinian people,” at least in a side letter though not in the official agreement. In 1988, they had flatly refused any dealings with the PLO. That transformation has evoked much acclaim from U.S. commentators, who were particularly impressed by Rabin's ability to overcome the revulsion he felt for his old enemy -- and who prefer not to listen to the explanation offered by the objects of their admiration: “There has been a change in them, not us,” Peres informed the Israeli public as the Oslo I accords were announced; “We are not negotiating with the PLO, but only with a shadow of its former self.” The new approved shadow effectively accepts Israel's demands, abandoning its call for mutual recognition in a two-state settlement, the program that branded the PLO a terrorist organization unfit for entry into negotiations, according to the conventions of U.S. discourse. I don't recall whether Abbas tried something like that in the past tbh.
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Jan 1, 2015 10:17
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emanresu tnuocca posted:chomskyquote That's not addressing what I asked. I didn't say the Israeli leadership was honest, I was saying I don't think there was another meaningful entity with which to speak other than the PLO at the time. The weaknesses of the Oslo Accords weren't a cause, but an effect.
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Jan 1, 2015 10:21
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There was little to negotiate then and little to negotiate now. Whether there was an alternative negotiations partner is immaterial really, Israel knew it could subvert that original goals of the PLO and turn it into a collaborationist proto-government, which is what it did. The Oslo accords were de facto an annexation, not a jumping off point to a fair settlement. More from the chomp: quote:By incorporating these provisions, Oslo II rescinds the position of virtually the entire world that the settlements are illegal and that Israel has no claim to the territories acquired by force in 1967. Oslo II reaffirms the basic principle of Oslo I: UN resolution 242 of November 1967, the basic framework of Middle East diplomacy, is dead and buried; UN 242, that is, as interpreted by those who formulated it, including -- quite explicitly -- the United States until Washington switched policy in 1971, departing from the international consensus it had helped shape. The “peace process” keeps to the doctrines that the U.S. has upheld in international isolation (apart from Israel) for 25 years, a matter of no slight significance. etc etc
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Jan 1, 2015 10:27
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