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SquadronROE posted:What weight oil do you guys generally use for the motor? What it says in the manual.
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Dec 29, 2014 16:50
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10W-60, only the finest random weights for KTM! (Look in your manual)
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Dec 29, 2014 20:04
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In order of bestness / safeness: 1) The correct amount of the correct weight of fresh oil according to your manual Preferably one with a motorcycle rating or no friction modifiers (often marketed as economy / efficiency boosting oils) 2) The correct amount of fresh oil as close as you can find to the weight stated in the manual, with the Again with no friction modifiers etc 3) The correct amount of any goddamn fresh engine oil of a sane weight You risk getting a slippy clutch if it's got unfriendly additives but replacing clutch plates is better than rebuilding the motor. 4) The correct amount of any engine oil you can find, even if some or all of it is old 5) Not enough oil 6) No Oil 7) Rocks / sand / gravel ReelBigLizard fucked around with this message at 09:40 on Dec 30, 2014 |
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Dec 29, 2014 20:06
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SquadronROE posted:What weight oil do you guys generally use for the motor? The one recommended by the manual you dolt.
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Dec 29, 2014 21:27
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ReelBigLizard posted:2) The correct amount of fresh oil as close as you can find to the weight stated in the manual, with the first number the most important Isn't, barring cold weather, the second one the most important? Z3n posted:10W-60, only the finest random weights for KTM! The Motorex oil recommended for my dad's Duke 690 is like $50 a quart, at least that's what the dealer wanted for it 
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Dec 29, 2014 21:30
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Every time I'm about to compare KTM oil to fine wine, I am reminded of this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1985_diethylene_glycol_wine_scandal
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Dec 29, 2014 21:48
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Granted the wine is better as a coolant than the oil.
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Dec 30, 2014 00:37
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About to buy a DRZ, wondering what your opinions are on the three general types that seem to be prevalent: A) Used DRZ, (~20000 kms), $5k B) Near new DRZ (~4000 kms), $7k C) New DRZ, $9k As far as buying a dodgy one for options A and B. There's a lot of dirt track around my parts, and I'm just worried that I'll pick up one that someone has thrashed to death. The bike needs to serve as my commuter for the next 4 or so years as well as some lengthy road trips... Thoughts?
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Dec 30, 2014 13:51
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High Protein posted:The one recommended by the manual you dolt. That's what I'm doing (and what I did last time and for every car I've ever owned). I just was curious how much disparity there really is between bikes' recommended oil weights. Oddly enough, my service manual recommends 20W50 because everything about my bike is weird. turn it up TURN ME ON fucked around with this message at 16:01 on Dec 30, 2014 |
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Dec 30, 2014 15:56
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SquadronROE posted:That's what I'm doing (and what I did last time and for every car I've ever owned). I just was curious how much disparity there really is between bikes' recommended oil weights. Oddly enough, my service manual recommends 20W50 because everything about my bike is weird. Ah my apologies then. For some reason all Harley engines use 20w50, perhaps because of the hydraulic lifters or the generally looser tolerances compared to (water cooled) metric engines.
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Dec 30, 2014 16:10
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High Protein posted:Ah my apologies then. For some reason all Harley engines use 20w50, perhaps because of the hydraulic lifters or the generally looser tolerances compared to (water cooled) metric engines. No worries. It's interesting that motorcycle engines are far pickier about oils than car engines, possibly by design.
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Dec 30, 2014 16:13
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Bubba posted:About to buy a DRZ, wondering what your opinions are on the three general types that seem to be prevalent: As I understand, they've been manufacturing that DRZ motor since the turn of the century. It's considered 'bulletproof' given reasonable maintenance and should last a long time. Unless the PO has severely hosed with it, a DRZ with 4000 km is a newborn, and is probably OK. (Useless anecdote: I bought my crashed DRZ SM at 6000 km for cheap (ish) and it's been fantastic.)
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Dec 30, 2014 16:13
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High Protein posted:Ah my apologies then. For some reason all Harley engines use 20w50, perhaps because of the hydraulic lifters or the generally looser tolerances compared to (water cooled) metric engines. Air-cooled engines generally need heavier oil than water-cooled because the oil is also the primary method of heat exchange, and v-twins generally need heavier oils than 4s for reasons I can't remember but I'm sure had something to do with crank design?
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Dec 30, 2014 18:02
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I used 20W-50 in my versys because socal and I tend to take it out to the desert fairly often. Of course right after I do this the temp starts to drop into the 30s at night. According to the manual 20W-50 is fine down to 0 C and it's usually around 50F when I leave for work every morning so I assume it should be ok until the heat starts returning. Maybe I just made a mistake in not just using 10W-50 I just found it neat that there's actually a whole chart thing instead of just one oil: 
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Dec 30, 2014 18:22
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SquadronROE posted:No worries. It's interesting that motorcycle engines are far pickier about oils than car engines, possibly by design. Cars don't generally share their engine oil with a wet clutch. Most bikes do.
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Dec 30, 2014 18:24
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Techspec or stompgrips for tank grip pads?
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Dec 30, 2014 19:46
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Techspec - stompgrips stick better, but will eventually wear away the inside of the knees of your leathers.
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Dec 30, 2014 20:02
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I was just about to post the same question. Thanks!
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Dec 30, 2014 20:03
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SquadronROE posted:No worries. It's interesting that motorcycle engines are far pickier about oils than car engines, possibly by design. HotCanadianChick posted:Cars don't generally share their engine oil with a wet clutch. Most bikes do. You'd think so, but they really aren't. Cars are extremely picky about oil nowadays, you just don't reap the consequences of using the wrong one anywhere near as quickly as you do with a bike. Using a wet clutch actually simplifies things because you don't have to worry about the various friction modifiers and other economy/emissions related standards. Most bikes I've seen are just SL/SM with minor grade variations. There are probably bikes that use SN standard nowadays but I don't work on new bikes so I wouldn't know. Gillingham posted:I used 20W-50 in my versys because socal and I tend to take it out to the desert fairly often. Of course right after I do this the temp starts to drop into the 30s at night. According to the manual 20W-50 is fine down to 0 C and it's usually around 50F when I leave for work every morning so I assume it should be ok until the heat starts returning. Maybe I just made a mistake in not just using 10W-50 That chart is usually intended as a back up for you to get the closest approximate oil if you can't get the exact oil it needs, which will be denoted with a standard as well as a weight. This is why on older bikes you can use additive-free 10w40 you find at walmart because then overwhelming majority of older bikes can handle that viscosity and are intended for SH or SJ.
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Dec 30, 2014 20:16
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Bubba posted:About to buy a DRZ, wondering what your opinions are on the three general types that seem to be prevalent: I don't know that you can really "thrash" a DRZ to death short of running it without oil. I use my SM to commute (city) and it's great. I don't really even mind the freeway up to about 70-75mph.
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Dec 30, 2014 20:27
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Slavvy posted:That chart is usually intended as a back up for you to get the closest approximate oil if you can't get the exact oil it needs, which will be denoted with a standard as well as a weight. This is why on older bikes you can use additive-free 10w40 you find at walmart because then overwhelming majority of older bikes can handle that viscosity and are intended for SH or SJ. Yea I guess it says 10W-40 is the standard: "Although 10W-40 engine oil is the recommended oil for most conditions, the oil viscosity may need to be changed to accommodate atmospheric conditions in your riding area" So I figured since this bike is literally never going to be run in freezing temp and far more likely to be used when its 80-90+ F up to and exceeding 100F ambient 20W-50 would be more suited. Maybe I'm just overly paranoid about high temps for no reason.
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Dec 30, 2014 20:47
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Z3n posted:Techspec - stompgrips stick better, but will eventually wear away the inside of the knees of your leathers. Not only that, but they are too sticky for the street.
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Dec 30, 2014 23:01
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I like the Techspec grips a lot. Stomp grips actually hurt my knees through textile riding pants. Also, unless you have something that takes an oddball oil most bikes are really happy with the Rotella 5W-40 Synthetic. It's even JASO certified and is easily the least expensive oil with that certification you'll find. I've run it in everything from my F4i to old rear end singles and they've all been happy. I've been running 0W-40 Euro spec Mobil 1 in all my engines for the past few years and noticed quite a bit more oil consumption than with the Shell. I get it for free so don't mind adding between changes but for having nearly the same weight it's noticable.
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Dec 31, 2014 03:53
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High Protein posted:Ah my apologies then. For some reason all Harley engines use 20w50, perhaps because of the hydraulic lifters or the generally looser tolerances compared to (water cooled) metric engines. I think it's more that they get real hot. The 20w50 in my Uly looks about as viscous water when it's up to temp.
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Jan 1, 2015 18:46
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Slavvy posted:You'd think so, but they really aren't. Cars are extremely picky about oil nowadays, you just don't reap the consequences of using the wrong one anywhere near as quickly as you do with a bike. Using a wet clutch actually simplifies things because you don't have to worry about the various friction modifiers and other economy/emissions related standards. Most bikes I've seen are just SL/SM with minor grade variations. There are probably bikes that use SN standard nowadays but I don't work on new bikes so I wouldn't know. When I had a hot hatch and was meticulous about oil changes (I've got a Prius now and am not as meticulous) I read a really interesting article about various oil weights/grades/brands and results from testing to see how much metal particulates were in the oil after a couple thousand miles on each. It was really interesting, because there were significant differences between synthetic and non-synthetic oils, and even more between high grade brands (royal purple) and the more bargain brands. From what I'm understanding here, metal particulates are only one part of what you would want to measure though. There are probably other things you want to do, like measure some sort of fuel economy metric and emissions metric. I guess that makes sense, since really what you're doing by using a more viscous oil is causing the engine to have to use more energy to simply push pistons and moving parts against each other. Do I have that about right?
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Jan 1, 2015 18:56
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Exactly. Imagine a 10cc syringe full of 0w20, one full of 20w50, and one full of 75w90 gear oil (note: gear oil weights aren't comparable directly). Which one takes less force to push? Your engine is doing a similar thing thousands of times a minute.
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Jan 1, 2015 20:19
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If you've ever primed an oil pump using a power drill it's made very clear. It's spinning away happily until it builds pressure and then the drill is almost yanked out of your hand. I can totally see why variable volume pumps are a thing.
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Jan 1, 2015 20:58
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BlackLaser posted:I was just about to post the same question. Thanks!
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Jan 1, 2015 21:41
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Geirskogul posted:Exactly. Imagine a 10cc syringe full of 0w20, one full of 20w50, and one full of 75w90 gear oil (note: gear oil weights aren't comparable directly). Which one takes less force to push? Yeah this. I'll add to this that thinner oil allows for tighter clearances, which means reduced emissions and greater efficiency still. Also lets you more finely control VVTI movements, both through the direct effects of the oil flowing through the solenoids and actuators, and through the ecu having an easier time calculating the oil viscosity at any given time. There's a lot less leeway as to what kind of oil you can run in your car than there used to be; my 5E-FE would run on soya sauce AFAIK. As far as bikes go I think only KTM and a few other very high end models (like the panigale engine for example) are starting to reach the same level of sophistication as car engines in regards to the demands put on the engine oil.
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Jan 1, 2015 23:08
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Slavvy posted:Yeah this. I'll add to this that thinner oil allows for tighter clearances, which means reduced emissions and greater efficiency still. Also lets you more finely control VVTI movements, both through the direct effects of the oil flowing through the solenoids and actuators, and through the ecu having an easier time calculating the oil viscosity at any given time. There's a lot less leeway as to what kind of oil you can run in your car than there used to be; my 5E-FE would run on soya sauce AFAIK. Which is odd, when you think of it, because bike engines are in a truly ridiculous state of tune compared to car engines. Even relatively relaxed mid-range bike engines are making up to 125bhp/l, and the top-end bikes are rapidly approaching 200, not to mention revving way higher and with much more aggressive cam profiles etc.
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Jan 2, 2015 00:49
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Massachusetts folks, if I have a valid driver's license do I still need to take a permit test to get a motorcycle permit?
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Jan 2, 2015 01:55
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Which is odd, when you think of it, because bike engines are in a truly ridiculous state of tune compared to car engines. Even relatively relaxed mid-range bike engines are making up to 125bhp/l, and the top-end bikes are rapidly approaching 200, not to mention revving way higher and with much more aggressive cam profiles etc. The biggest reason you don't see all that stuff on bikes is mostly emissions related. As they tighten up you'll see more car tech trickle down to bikes as has been happening with more and more advanced engine controls showing up already.
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Jan 2, 2015 02:11
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Also, cars need lots low-range torque and bikes don't. It's easy to make 150-odd horsepower specific output when you aren't having to haul several tonnes worth of metal with reasonable economy figures and an auto trans. It's also easy to build an insanely high-revving engine when the engine is a. tiny and b. doesn't realistically have to last over 100,000km. Most bikes don't approach the mileages cars routinely rack up. But also: Bugdrvr posted:The biggest reason you don't see all that stuff on bikes is mostly emissions related. As they tighten up you'll see more car tech trickle down to bikes as has been happening with more and more advanced engine controls showing up already. The new Diavel has gotten the vvti engine now and apparently the increase in low-rev torque is noticeable.
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Jan 2, 2015 03:12
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Suicide Watch posted:Massachusetts folks, if I have a valid driver's license do I still need to take a permit test to get a motorcycle permit? I had to look it up to confirm, but yes. Basically the same process as getting a Class D. Bring ID forms, $30, and answer 25 questions. http://www.massrmv.com/rmv/license/6motcy.htm
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Jan 2, 2015 14:04
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Nevada goons: My buddy just moved out there and the DMV asked him if he would like a motorcycle endorsement. His response was 'uh yeah?' and they gave it to him. What gives? Don't you have to at least take a test or something? Or are you one of those Free-dumb states that doesn't care?
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Jan 2, 2015 15:36
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GnarlyCharlie4u posted:Nevada goons: As always The Onion knows all: http://www.theonion.com/articles/nevada-to-phase-out-laws-altogether,117/
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Jan 2, 2015 17:17
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Bought a bike recently. Started it a dozen times without issue. Pulled the battery to put it on a tender for the winter, but before hooking it up, it was measuring a steady 26+ volts. What the hell?
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Jan 4, 2015 07:14
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Looks like the multimeter is set to AC.
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Jan 4, 2015 07:46
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Slavvy posted:Looks like the multimeter is set to AC. Ahaha whoops :facepalm: 12.44, that's better.
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Jan 4, 2015 16:55
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I spent a bit of time browsing the various zx6 owners forums yesterday. What a bad time that was. It's all the same people that were on car forums in the early 2000's when I stopped reading them. Nobody answers questions they only tell them how they are wrong for asking it. Just the worst. Anyone have a owners manual pdf for a 09-12 zx6? Dealer gave me one for a 2013 636. I have the service manual pdf already. Google has failed me. I want to verify baseline suspension settings and go from there.
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Jan 5, 2015 20:03
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