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Lemon Curdistan posted:Push the Limit, Veteran Instincts and a Proton Rocket (with Munitions Failsafe if you have the points left). PtL + VI lets you arc-dodge effectively and shoot first, PRockets give you enough alpha to put a dent in things. Proton rockets seem pretty much made for the A-Wing, but I can't help feeling that Chardaan Refit has kind of sabotaged the meta for them--Their effective price has jumped from 3 to 5 points now, which seems prohibitively expensive for what they do. I've been tooling around with some potential A-Wing lists lately and I just can't justify the opportunity cost.
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Jan 21, 2015 22:46
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Obama 2012 posted:Proton rockets seem pretty much made for the A-Wing, but I can't help feeling that Chardaan Refit has kind of sabotaged the meta for them--Their effective price has jumped from 3 to 5 points now, which seems prohibitively expensive for what they do. I've been tooling around with some potential A-Wing lists lately and I just can't justify the opportunity cost. OTOH, Prockets are a godsend to the TIE Advanced.
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Jan 21, 2015 22:58
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Madurai posted:OTOH, Prockets are a godsend to the TIE Advanced. Oh hell yes, I can't wait to dust mine off when the Raider hits. It's gonna be rowdy.
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Jan 21, 2015 23:28
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I really enjoyed reading Proton Rockets for the first time. "Oh, neat, these are really thematic. 5 points seems a little steep for +2 dice on one attack, though. I guess you could put them on a Defender, that's only 3 points but it's also only one extra die. Oh, poo poo, this is for the Advanced, they just printed an A-Wing on it as a red herring."
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Jan 21, 2015 23:37
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To be honest, there is little point to running the A-Wing except in fun lists without some way to get more firepower out of them. There's Expose (although that only works with Tycho and EI, which is even more expensive than just getting prockets), there's opportunist (although that means that you can't PtL) and potentially Outmaneuver, although that doesn't help the fact that you still relying on two attack dice. If you are going for A-Wings anyway, you've pretty much stopped caring about opportunity costs because there are much more cost-effective ships out there. Might as well load them up with prockets anyway at that stage, because 2 points aren't going to make that much of a difference and you might as well make them as effective as they are ever going to be.
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Jan 21, 2015 23:41
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parabolic posted:I enjoy playing these three pilots together, but I would consider dropping the shield upgrade and recon specialist for a gunner on Whisper. You already get a defensive focus when you perform an attack that hits, so the additional one will only be used if you're being shot more than once. This should only really happen if you're playing against two turreted ships or they do a great job boxing you in. To be fair, I might be suggesting doubling down too hard on Whisper, but I like the synergy between gunner and fire control system to make the most out of the offensive capabilities. Strobe posted:Gunner on Whisper is a waste of points, especially if you've got an ACD and FCS on it already. The number of times you won't get a hit with four red dice and a TL against... drat near anything are small enough that it's the most situational five points you're ever going to find. With Recon Specialist on top, you're getting a defensive focus regardless, and you can spend one on offense to all but ensure four or five hits every turn. Most ships are literally incapable of dodging all that, and the ones that are capable of it aren't going to unless their dice are hot poo poo. The Gate posted:Gunner triggers when your opponent evades your shots as well. So when you take a shot on Fel, or another rough target, you burn away their defense with one shot, then murder them on number two. Or force them to take 1 or 2 hits to avoid the risk of taking 4. Gunner Whisper is amazing. Ill try it both ways today and see how it works out . In related news I finally got a Slave-1 that was actuallly regularly priced 
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Jan 22, 2015 01:27
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Sadly only got to play one game last night and I used my more serious build for tournament practice. I got totally destroyed which wasn't much fun. Do ion tokens still get applied if the target has shields? 3 different people saw my rebel list sitting out and took me aside to tell me that 3 ships isn't good enough for Rebels. Edit: After last nights fiasco I am thinking something like: Darth Vader - Swarm Tactics, Proton Rockets Soontir Fel - Push the limit Academy Pilot x3 Phrosphor fucked around with this message at 10:35 on Jan 22, 2015 |
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Jan 22, 2015 10:28
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Ions are still applied through shields
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Jan 22, 2015 10:47
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Phrosphor posted:3 different people saw my rebel list sitting out and took me aside to tell me that 3 ships isn't good enough for Rebels. You can safely ignore them. People have been doing 3-ship Rebel lists successfully for a while now (with the caveat that of course, the fewer ships you have, the harder a list generally is to fly).
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Jan 22, 2015 12:17
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Lemon Curdistan posted:You can safely ignore them. People have been doing 3-ship Rebel lists successfully for a while now (with the caveat that of course, the fewer ships you have, the harder a list generally is to fly). I was under the impression that, assuming you weren't running some kind of Fat Han list, a list of two X-wings + an A/B/E/Whatever was still the best way to go.
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Jan 22, 2015 14:51
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Depends. X-wings are still very solid ships, but there's some tricks they just can't do, and some people prefer the Z-95's for cheap filler ships instead. The only issue with running 2X/whatever else lists is that x-wings, right now, tend to get outmaneuvered by other ships.
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Jan 22, 2015 15:04
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It's always kind of tricky flying ships with no actions that allow movement options, because you have to be right on the money regarding your maneuver and can't adjust. You can go crazy though and get Wedge with Engine Upgrade/PtL and a basic R2 though 
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Jan 22, 2015 15:07
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Tekopo posted:It's always kind of tricky flying ships with no actions that allow movement options, because you have to be right on the money regarding your maneuver and can't adjust. Yeah, that's a good point to clarify. The base X-Wing is actually fairly agile. Not as good as TIEs, but not bad. But lacking a native boost or barrel roll makes them surprisingly tough to fly, because like tekopo says, you have to be perfect, and low PS generic X-Wings have a hard time with that.
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Jan 22, 2015 15:11
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Like an example I had in a recent game was when I was flying Wes/Keyan/Wedge on an Opportunist list. My opponent was flying Soontir and I KNEW that he was going to take one of my flanks and I was pretty sure what flank he was going to come from, so I did a sharp 2 turn with both of my XWings (PS 10 and 9) and did a straight with Keyan. As expected, Soontir came on my flank, moving before I moved my stuff, I did my turn and I was JUST out of arc with Wedge (even though I was moving last). If he had either barrel roll or boost I would have been in arc and probably would have taken out Soontir, but because I had no after-movement options, I was stuffed.
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Jan 22, 2015 15:19
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Played a couple of games last night, took down the falcon with two interceptors, admittedly one of them was fan favourite soontir fel (who I've been avoiding taking recently to avoid boring my opponent to death) I loving love interceptors.
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Jan 22, 2015 15:38
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Speaking of which, does anyone has a guide regarding liste building basics?
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Jan 22, 2015 17:37
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Iceclaw posted:Speaking of which, does anyone has a guide regarding liste building basics? Take ships with good pilots. Give them skills that work well with them. Don't put all your eggs in one basket. That's about it. I dunno, there aren't really any basics beyond that for list-building. Specific advice is a lot easier to give.
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Jan 22, 2015 18:04
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Han Solo is a really good egg and the Falcon can be set up as the world's best basket.
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Jan 22, 2015 18:07
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Munitions aren't that great. Weapon upgrades are better but are on the fence about cost efficiency. Usually you want either high PS or low PS - 3-6PS are effectively low PS. Don't worry too much about bidding for the initiative. E: Han breaks all the rules.  I would argue his support ships are just decent enough to not count it in the eggs in one basket rule.
Chill la Chill fucked around with this message at 18:12 on Jan 22, 2015 |
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Jan 22, 2015 18:08
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The Gate posted:Yeah, that's a good point to clarify. The base X-Wing is actually fairly agile. Not as good as TIEs, but not bad. But lacking a native boost or barrel roll makes them surprisingly tough to fly, because like tekopo says, you have to be perfect, and low PS generic X-Wings have a hard time with that. They should make 2 pt Astromechs that give either boost or barrel roll. Give the x-wing some options and get a discount over Engine Upgrade.
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Jan 22, 2015 18:25
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alg posted:They should make 2 pt Astromechs that give either boost or barrel roll. Give the x-wing some options and get a discount over Engine Upgrade. Honestly, I'm surprised there isn't an X-Wing title yet, "XJ X-Wing" or something, that gives them an option like that. Maybe even something that would let them boost or barrel roll at the cost of a stress token. Edit: Also, Aces 2 packs that have more E-Wing, Y-Wing, Defender, and Bomber pilots. Slab Squatthrust fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Jan 22, 2015 |
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Jan 22, 2015 18:51
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They have the options for Engine Upgrade and the higher PS pilots can take Expert Handling already. Neither of those are particularly fantastic options unless you're running some decent support ships to hand out actions for offense. Before the Advanced title came out, I was really hoping for a title that would give the X-Wing a sensor slot, so you could take FCS and do engine upgrades and/or expert handling without worrying about not being able to do poo poo on offense. Now I don't see it happening. I also still want to see a generic "Rogue Squadron Pilot" with 6 PS and an EPT for 25 points. Give me my royal guard equivalent, dammit.
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Jan 22, 2015 18:57
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My FLGS is running a sort of fun casual event tomorrow nightquote:Rogues Rule The Galaxy I think "Imperial Only" will be allowed on Rebel ships as well, but I'm not sure. Early ideas I've had include squeezing a YT-1300 in, along with some scrub TIE, or running Etahn with 2 Academy Pilots, flying formation. Anyone have any experience with this sort of (goofy) format?
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Jan 22, 2015 20:20
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I think I finally have a list that doesn't suck: Han Solo + Veteran Instincts + C-3PO + Gunner + Millennium Falcon + Hull Upgrade (59) Kyle Katarn + Ion Cannon Turret (26) Prototype Pilot + Chardaan Refit (15) In theory, Kyle feeds Han a focus a turn to let him do his Evade/3PO/Gunner thing, and the A-Wing is an annoying bug that may shoot down a TIE fighter or something.
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Jan 22, 2015 20:32
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I'd swap the Hull Upgrade and Ion Cannon Turret for Moldy Crow and Recon Specialist with a Blaster Turret. Drop the A-Wing down to a Bandit and you can make it happen. If he's just there to be annoying/throw a couple random dice he doesn't need to be an A-Wing, and Kyle with Crow/Recon specialist/blaster is throwing good damage while also giving Han some spare focus.
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Jan 22, 2015 20:41
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Strobe posted:I'd swap the Hull Upgrade and Ion Cannon Turret for Moldy Crow and Recon Specialist with a Blaster Turret. Drop the A-Wing down to a Bandit and you can make it happen. If he's just there to be annoying/throw a couple random dice he doesn't need to be an A-Wing, and Kyle with Crow/Recon specialist/blaster is throwing good damage while also giving Han some spare focus. Any reason Blaster trumps Ion for one less point? I would think the board control of the Ion would be better, and can still be bought with those changes.
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Jan 22, 2015 21:05
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Blaster turret can deal up to two more damage? That's pretty significant, especially since it takes two ion tokens to get the big ships and the Hawk doesn't have any good options with primaries if you want to deal damage instead. EDIT: You're also not going to get a lot of ions against the things you want ioned most, because you'll have wholly unmodified dice.
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Jan 22, 2015 21:10
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I honestly would just drop Kyle and take Roark or jan instead. You have to dump way too many points into Kyle to make his ability worthwhile. All for a focus on Han which will net you very little since he has his natural rerolls + gunner. Predator on Han is a better investment than the points you have to spend (recon, moldy crow) to make Kyle effective. I mean it could work if you slow play like hell for 3-4 turns to build up your focus reserve but those are gonna be spent real fast. 1 to Han, 1 to shoot your turret, 1 to modify your turret attack, 1-??? On defense when they shoot Kyle. IMO Kyle is better in action stacking lists.
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Jan 22, 2015 21:51
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I kinda like Jan. Her ability does mean that you have to spend the game slow-boating her but that extra dice is very nice.
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Jan 22, 2015 23:26
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I'm doing a 120 point tournament tomorrow and, for fun, I'd like to take four B-Wings, probably in this configuration. I expect to see a lot of Decimators with Engine Upgrades and Fat Dash. I imagine the mobility of these, and the random Phantom I'm sure I'll see will mess me up, but, whatever. I like B-Wings. I'm looking at flying a very slow pinwheel formation, starting in one corner, waiting for them to come to me, then either turning to focus fire, or fanning a little to spread. Anyone have any suggestions on dealing with more mobile targets better?
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Jan 23, 2015 15:51
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I don't really think I like the Defender all that much. I ran with this build last night: Rexler Brath + Predator + Engine Upgrade Howlrunner + Swarm Tactics Alpha Sq. Pilot Alpha Sq. Pilot The Defender just costs a lot of points and while it can take more of a beating than your typical TIE and can do some cool things like K-turn w/o getting stressed, it has no evade action, my opponent managed to focus fire on him and blew him up fairly quick. My opponent ran with E'Tann A'baht, Ten Numb and a Green Sq. Pilot, dunno what upgrades he had, but he had a decent amount. I made a poor choice early on and Howlrunner bumped into someone, couldn't take an evade action and subsequently got a crit, crippling her for the rest of the game. I focused fire on the E-Wing and managed to take it out at the cost of my Defender. By that point, Howlrunner and my two squints took out the B-Wing at point blank range. At the very end it was a solitary A-Wing vs. two Interceptors, one of which had two damage. A couple bad rolls later and he took them both out. It was a really close game. I almost feel like the Defender is too dang expensive for its own good and I would have been better off with a Phantom or Soontir Fel who are both cheaper and would allow me an extra nameless mook or two. I just need to learn how to fly a Phantom properly, because I really don't know how.
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Jan 23, 2015 16:05
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Chill la Chill posted:Munitions aren't that great. Weapon upgrades are better but are on the fence about cost efficiency. Usually you want either high PS or low PS - 3-6PS are effectively low PS. Don't worry too much about bidding for the initiative. I keep forgetting to ask; can you post pics of all your custom paint X-Wing minis? TIA
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Jan 23, 2015 16:16
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Defenders are extremely gimmicky and usually not worth their points unless you have a list fit around using them. I personally just like going with Vessery over Rexler: if you have something to provide a lock, you can quite reliably save the focus for defence and use the free TL for attack and that should make your Defender more survivable, even without using evade (taking evade over focus is a debatable option, to be honest).. I used to fly him with an HLC but it just makes an already expensive ship too expensive. Rexler requires too many upgrades or a strict combo list to make him work so I almost never use him. Delta squadrons can work sometimes in conjunction. I'm still gonna use a Defender in my store tourney list because I like it dispite its faults.
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Jan 23, 2015 16:23
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New Article for S&V Well it's a bust for the hopes of the M3-A being the S&V interceptor  : (they were apparently hidden somewhere in the new article).
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Jan 23, 2015 21:18
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Indolent Bastard posted:I keep forgetting to ask; can you post pics of all your custom paint X-Wing minis? TIA Sure. I had to dig them up in facebook cuz I don't think I've posted them all here. Some of these apparently look terrible when I'm not on my phone - I keep overestimating the zoom-in capabilities. Apparently I never took pics of the whole Z-95 wing, especially the nice yellow wing commander. I'll do that this weekend when I have time. And the Falcon will be done...someday. That much surface area really gets tiring when you have to work on a different blend for each panel.     
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Jan 23, 2015 21:32
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Tekopo posted:New Article for S&V It's a slightly speedier Z-95 then, apparently. That can mount an HLC or a Mangler, so I'm still happy enough with it.
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Jan 23, 2015 21:33
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Tekopo posted:New Article for S&V At 12 points it was always going to be more TIE fighter than TIE Interceptor. No 3 turn is pretty weird though.
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Jan 24, 2015 00:28
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It's 14 points. Reminder that the A-Wing is 15, so it was reasonable to expect at least one sharp green.
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Jan 24, 2015 00:34
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White 1-turn is good enough, honestly. Not a lot of green, but there's really no reason to stress them out either.
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Jan 24, 2015 00:35
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The Gate posted:White 1-turn is good enough, honestly. Not a lot of green, but there's really no reason to stress them out either. 
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Jan 24, 2015 00:36
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