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FRINGE posted:The only area on the west coast that is hard to distinguish from New Jersey. The OC. You're stupid.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:27
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Northern california is basically the stealth east coast due to their obsession with status and career.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:30
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Trabisnikof posted:Edit: for those arguing that Ag should use a smaller % of total water use in California, what is a correct percent in your mind? How much food price increase is ok to increase the amount of water used for cities (helping them grow)? The point isn't that ag use is "too much," it's that individual consumer water-saving measures are essentially irrelevant to the long term picture right now because non-agricultural consumption is completely dwarfed by agricultural consumption. And the problem is that the current agricultural water market is incredibly distorted and unsuited for the state's needs.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:33
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You can tell how lovely the OC is because of how desperately people need to defend it to feel ok about themselves. You can talk poo poo about SD, LA, Malibu, Ventura, SB, SLO ... no one says anything. ..But the precious OC! Oh my!
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Mar 16, 2015 03:33
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FRINGE posted:You can tell how lovely the OC is because of how desperately people need to defend it to feel ok about themselves. I'm just saying bro.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:46
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GrumpyDoctor posted:The point isn't that ag use is "too much," it's that individual consumer water-saving measures are essentially irrelevant to the long term picture right now because non-agricultural consumption is completely dwarfed by agricultural consumption. And the problem is that the current agricultural water market is incredibly distorted and unsuited for the state's needs. It's basically no different than the clever soviet plan in which they the grew water intensive crops like cotton in the desert and ended destroying the Ural sea.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:47
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FRINGE posted:You can tell how lovely the OC is because of how desperately people need to defend it to feel ok about themselves. OC is basically if the worst parts of the IE won the lottery, but shoved some poor people they ignore in the north part.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:50
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Nothing in the world is more funny than Northern Californians acting like they don't ship in water from across the state.
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Mar 16, 2015 03:55
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GrumpyDoctor posted:The point isn't that ag use is "too much," it's that individual consumer water-saving measures are essentially irrelevant to the long term picture right now because non-agricultural consumption is completely dwarfed by agricultural consumption. And the problem is that the current agricultural water market is incredibly distorted and unsuited for the state's needs. And I'm asking if you believe a less distorted and "suitable for the state's needs" water market would impact either the total actual consumption of water for Ag or local food availability or prices? It just seems like your asking for something more like AB32 and less like Venezuela. We don't need to redistribute property rights just tax use more effectively. etalian posted:It's basically no different than the clever soviet plan in which they the grew water intensive crops like cotton in the desert and ended destroying the Ural sea. At least the Soviets didn't then try and build some of their largest metropolis fed by those same crops and supplied from the same water sources. Bip Roberts posted:Nothing in the world is more funny than Northern Californians acting like they don't ship in water from across the state. Keep Hetch Hetchy Blue! 
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Mar 16, 2015 03:56
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Bip Roberts posted:Nothing in the world is more funny than Northern Californians acting like they don't ship in water from across the state. Trabisnikof posted:And I'm asking if you believe a less distorted and "suitable for the state's needs" water market would impact either the total actual consumption of water for Ag or local food availability or prices?
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Mar 16, 2015 04:06
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Trabisnikof posted:And I'm asking if you believe a less distorted and "suitable for the state's needs" water market would impact either the total actual consumption of water for Ag or local food availability or prices? Well there might be an argument that proper incentivization of conservation and efficiency measures would allow farmers to produce exactly what they do now with less water, but I don't have a problem with admitting that agricultural outputs will probably change. But you seem to be implying that this means the inevitable submission to our corn overlords, when it seems more plausible to me that it just results in fewer almond exports. If you've got a more detailed analysis of the consequences of a shift to less water-intensive crops, I'm all ears. And sooner or later, there just won't be enough water. If we don't make the decisions, nature will.
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Mar 16, 2015 04:16
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In other news, San Francisco landlord finds and exploits legal loophole to raise tenant's rent from $2,145 to $8,900: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=10153190864139878 Here's her explanation: quote:I guess I should say 1st - I need a place to live if anyone knows of anything please let me know, even if it is a temporary roommate situation or temporary sublet. Here's the letter she got: 
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Mar 16, 2015 04:31
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enraged_camel posted:In other news, San Francisco landlord finds and exploits legal loophole to raise tenant's rent from $2,145 to $8,900: To be fair, removing a unit's bathroom and kitchen isn't exactly a free change, but that's still pretty disgusting. e: And what kind of apartment is that that's worth $8900 a month? I know SF housing is insane, but that's, like, gibbering-in-the-street insane. raminasi fucked around with this message at 04:41 on Mar 16, 2015 |
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Mar 16, 2015 04:38
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GrumpyDoctor posted:e: And what kind of apartment is that that's worth $8900 a month? I know SF housing is insane, but that's, like, gibbering-in-the-street insane. Hence the claim that the change is more to get the tenant to move out than it is to seriously keep a tenant there.
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Mar 16, 2015 04:42
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ComradeCosmobot posted:Hence the claim that the change is more to get the tenant to move out than it is to seriously keep a tenant there. Oh, right  That seems like a lot of effort to kick a tenant out, though.
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Mar 16, 2015 04:46
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FRINGE posted:You can talk poo poo about SD, LA, Malibu, Ventura, SB, SLO ... no one says anything. ..But the precious OC! Oh my! If somebody says something bad about SLO, we just trick them into staying at the Madonna Inn, where they quickly go insane from kitsch overload. Then their khakis get all splattered from that stupid urinal that's shaped like a waterfall.
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Mar 16, 2015 04:48
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cheese posted:Not quite the same. All the Yosemite/Hetch Hetchy water would end up in SF bay via the San Joaquin Delta anyway. In CA, moving water on the east-west axis is very different than the north-south axis (in general, and with some exceptions). Good to hear there are inherent rules of water piping on when it is and isn't okay. You're allowed to pipe water two watersheds over but god help you if it's north-south.
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Mar 16, 2015 04:49
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Hitlers Gay Secret posted:Moved here, maybe you should do the same. I actually did. I live in Midtown Sacramento now for my girlfriend's job, and it's actually quite lovely here, but we do both miss LA quite a bit. Not the traffic, parking, heat, food deserts, rent, and douchebags, but all the other stuff.
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Mar 16, 2015 05:30
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ComradeCosmobot posted:Hence the claim that the change is more to get the tenant to move out than it is to seriously keep a tenant there. Yeah basically a clever trick SF owners use to get around tenant protection laws, by doing "Remodeling" they can recategorize the rental.
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Mar 16, 2015 05:35
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GrumpyDoctor posted:Oh, right These houses are premium property and generate a ton of revenue for their owners. A few thousand dollars to remodel them to get around property laws and kick tenants out is not a big deal. If you kick out a tenant who is paying you $2,200 and re-rent it at $3,000, that's almost $10,000 extra per year.
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Mar 16, 2015 06:05
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SlimGoodbody posted:I actually did. I live in Midtown Sacramento now for my girlfriend's job, and it's actually quite lovely here, but we do both miss LA quite a bit. I'm moving back to Sacramento from SoCal and am so loving happy. Different strokes.
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Mar 16, 2015 06:20
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Sounds like the free market hard at work here folks. Sorry you guys arnt down with the creative disruption of an archaic old economy 
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Mar 16, 2015 06:34
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nm posted:I'm moving back to Sacramento from SoCal and am so loving happy. Different strokes. I'm moving from the Sacramento area (1 year in Long Island in between) to LA this summer and I'm weirdly excited to see how different it is.
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Mar 16, 2015 06:42
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sba posted:I'm moving from the Sacramento area (1 year in Long Island in between) to LA this summer and I'm weirdly excited to see how different it is. Prepare to get pissed at people calling it "the 5," then accepting it, and then doing it yourself. Also, driving a half-hour or more for anything.
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Mar 16, 2015 06:52
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GrumpyDoctor posted:Oh, right To buy someone out of a rent-controlled apartment like that is on the order of $20k+.
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Mar 16, 2015 06:56
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nm posted:Prepare to get pissed at people calling it "the 5," then accepting it, and then doing it yourself. THAT'S BECAUSE IT'S THE FREEWAY. You don't say "take freeway," you say "take the freeway," as in "take the 5 freeway to the 405 freeway." edit: I said freeway too many times. Freeway!!
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Mar 16, 2015 07:00
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etalian posted:Northern california is basically the stealth east coast due to their obsession with status and career. Except the only people in Northern California who are obsessed with status and career are transplants from the east coast. Most of us that are from here are actually dirty hobos that will soon be purged and replaced by even more career/status-obsessed east coast transplants. Bip Roberts posted:Nothing in the world is more funny than Northern Californians acting like they don't ship in water from across the state. At least we're shipping water within our own half of the state though. It's not stealing if it's staying in Nor Cal 
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Mar 16, 2015 07:07
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cheese posted:Sounds like the free market hard at work here folks. Sorry you guys arnt down with the creative disruption of an archaic old economy At this point, I don't really care if it's more private or public housing that gets built, as long as there's a lot of it either one would help to relieve pressure on rents.
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Mar 16, 2015 08:05
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Cicero posted:The restrictions on housing supply/density are pretty much the opposite of a free market. Alternatively, just let it crash. Or rather, pop.
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Mar 16, 2015 08:50
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Cicero posted:The restrictions on housing supply/density are pretty much the opposite of a free market. yeah you basically have a cabal of NIMBYists/Environmentalists, people who bought in when it was affordable, and foreign speculative investors, who all have incentive to keep development as surpressed as possible in hopes of a massive payoff. With stuff like Prop 13, it's really hard to get any serious development in housing stock for the bay area. The problem is basically 'let's artificially suppress supply, so we can get crazy rich'. It's sort of the perfect storm of environmental leftists and unchecked avarice. This sort of seems to be endemic to housing prices in california as a whole, but it's just hypercharged in the bay area. enraged_camel posted:Alternatively, just let it crash. Or rather, pop. I unfortunately don't see how the housing market will ever crash, unless something completely catastrophic happens. Hoping for 'The Big One' to hit, or the entire tech industry to tank just so housing prices are readjusted, is extremely depressing. I feel like the tech workers end up being the scapegoat for a far more sinister, man made problem. The simple fact of the matter is, if you want to make a career in the Tech industry, the bay area is one of the, if not the driving center for that. The 'gently caress off we're full, go back to where you came from' attitude some locals have is basically nuts. It's not like there are a lot of other thriving sectors of the US economy people can just jump into...
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Mar 16, 2015 12:34
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Space-Bird posted:The 'gently caress off we're full, go back to where you came from' attitude some locals have is basically nuts. It's not like there are a lot of other thriving sectors of the US economy people can just jump into... The people complaining about it are either the hippies who moved there years to create their own (gross but well meaning) alternative culture, or the idiots who moved there recently to live 10 to a closet with other unwashed children so they can pretend to be the hippies mentioned above. But you see this anytime a culture changes too quickly, and the tech industry's penchant for hyperspeed change and constant "disrupting" of things people already liked, only to leave them a broken shambles owned by comic book villain techno-Libertarians isn't exactly helping tech win any culture war popularity contests.
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Mar 16, 2015 17:20
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Rah! posted:At least we're shipping water within our own half of the state though. It's not stealing if it's staying in Nor Cal The only moral water theft is my water theft Space-Bird posted:I feel like the tech workers end up being the scapegoat for a far more sinister, man made problem. The simple fact of the matter is, if you want to make a career in the Tech industry, the bay area is one of the, if not the driving center for that. The 'gently caress off we're full, go back to where you came from' attitude some locals have is basically nuts. It's not like there are a lot of other thriving sectors of the US economy people can just jump into... This is a symptom all over the country. See Denver, Colorado, Oregon, anyplace that isn't California thinks that transplant Californians are somehow "destroying" their culture. FCKGW fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Mar 16, 2015 |
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Mar 16, 2015 17:22
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The gently caress off we're full is only going to get worse globally as the oceans rise at rates far quicker than anyone is currently realizing and people get displaced. Look what's already happening in Bangladesh. Basically the next century is going to be a whole bunch of gently caress off we're fulls combined with NIMBY.
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Mar 16, 2015 17:36
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jeeves posted:The gently caress off we're full is only going to get worse globally as the oceans rise at rates far quicker than anyone is currently realizing and people get displaced. America is only full in places where people want to live. Climate change may shift that balance, but gently caress off we are full does not tell the entire story.
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Mar 16, 2015 17:38
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Pohl posted:America is only full in places where people want to live. Climate change may shift that balance, but gently caress off we are full does not tell the entire story. It's true. When I helped my sister move back to California from Chicago, I was shocked at how devoid of civilization most of the country is. I had heard of the non-coastal regions being called "flyover states," but I assumed people meant it as a dig about the population there. Now I think they actually mean it as "no, really, just fly over it, there's nothing there but trees."
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Mar 16, 2015 18:15
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SlimGoodbody posted:I actually did. I live in Midtown Sacramento now for my girlfriend's job, and it's actually quite lovely here, but we do both miss LA quite a bit. I live outside of Sacramento actually. Really sucks when all the available jobs are at least an hour away from my home. 
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Mar 16, 2015 19:00
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FCKGW posted:The only moral water theft is my water theft God, if I had a dollar for every Oregonian who told me to gently caress off back to California I could afford to live in San Fransisco. For a month.
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Mar 16, 2015 19:02
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FCKGW posted:The only moral water theft is my water theft The most common complaint I hear is that rich Californian transplants are driving up the home prices in other states. After that though, here in Texas I have heard the complaint that Californians are ruining Texas and are going to turn it into the socialist hell-hole and failed economy that they're trying desperately to escape. Texans are weird. "Everyone's moving from California because of high taxes!" Well, no, see... ah gently caress it.
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Mar 16, 2015 19:08
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Space-Bird posted:I feel like the tech workers end up being the scapegoat for a far more sinister, man made problem. Yes. It doesn't help that techies as a group aren't the best at making themselves likable. They tend to be young, and therefore self-centered and clueless about how the world works, and this gets reinforced by Silicon Valley's bubble effect. On top of that, the tech press amplifies and broadcasts a lot of their controversies and dumb ideas, which generates a lot of contempt among the general populace. I mean, just look at the threads on this topic in D&D and GBS. quote:The simple fact of the matter is, if you want to make a career in the Tech industry, the bay area is one of the, if not the driving center for that. The 'gently caress off we're full, go back to where you came from' attitude some locals have is basically nuts. It's not like there are a lot of other thriving sectors of the US economy people can just jump into... Silicon Valley is not the only tech center, and arguably not even the best one anymore. Sure it has the strongest concentration of tech companies, but there's also a poo poo ton of competition for those jobs AND the insane housing situation ensures that your standard of living will be abysmal. Not to mention the awful gender ratio in the area. Seriously, the situation in the valley is so awful that a lot of techies are starting to flock to smaller but saner tech hubs. Austin is the fastest growing city in the US right now. Seattle has Microsoft and Amazon, and on the East Coast you have New York and Cambridge, Boston. At the same time, remote work in the software field is fairly common and it's gaining more widespread adoption, which gives people even more choices. There are a growing number of software developers who live in flyover states and enjoy stellar standards of living. FCKGW posted:This is a symptom all over the country. See Denver, Colorado, Oregon, anyplace that isn't California thinks that transplant Californians are somehow "destroying" their culture. I'm moving from SoCal to Austin this weekend. Last month I was there looking at apartments, and the real estate guy who was driving me around flat out said that I should refrain from telling people I meet that I moved from California. He said it jokingly of course, but everything I've read suggests I should probably take his advice.
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Mar 16, 2015 19:15
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I was just in the Arts District of LA over the weekend, "artist lofts" for 2500/mo and literally adjacent to Skin Row.
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Mar 16, 2015 19:16
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