Alastor_the_Stylish posted:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/video-shows-tulsa-man-shot-deputy-meant-stun-article-1.2181787

Grandpa meant to taze the subdued suspect, but shot him to death. Haha, ooooh grandpa you crazy old coot.

My Rhythmic Crotch posted:

I'll be watching this one closely as I unfortunately lived many years in that shithole of a state. It's just as backwards and racist as you'd imagine so I'm not sure what the response will be. My gut instinct is "not much" - both in terms of investigation into the incident and response from the citizens.

My Rhythmic Crotch posted:

I'll be watching this one closely as I unfortunately lived many years in that shithole of a state. It's just as backwards and racist as you'd imagine so I'm not sure what the response will be. My gut instinct is "not much" - both in terms of investigation into the incident and response from the citizens.

Florida Betty posted:

Here's a story out of VA.

A mentally ill woman was in a jail cell with her hands handcuffed behind her back, leg shackles, and a protective face mask, and was tasered to death because she refused to bend her knees to be put in a wheeled restraint chair.

Such a completely unnecessary death. Police are investigating, no charges filed yet, etc.

quote:

Fairfax County Sheriff Stacey Kincaid declined to comment on the case but defended the use of a stun gun on a restrained prisoner, saying it was “a means that is often useful to ensure the safety of a person” rather than using physical force to gain compliance.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Genuinely curious about the validity of this. It seems like being tazed may be safer for the prisoner than being tackled to the floor of a concrete cell, but I'd like to know what research has been done.

Pohl posted:

Why would they need to tackle her or taze her? Just leave her alone for a little while until she calmed down. If you have her completely shackled and in a cell, why do you have to force her to do anything? Leave her alone. If that fails, get someone qualified to deal with her and drug her rear end into compliance. Seriously, was she loving up their schedule? They had to move her right goddamn now, so backing off wasn't an option?

There is no justification for tazing her or tackling her. If she is fully restrained and freaking out, leave her alone and let her tire herself out or wait until she has a moment of sanity.


Edit: What makes you think they didn't tackle and punch her before they tazed her? Even their accounts seem to indicate they abused her physically before the tazing, even when she was already in restraints.

Alastor_the_Stylish posted:

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national/video-shows-tulsa-man-shot-deputy-meant-stun-article-1.2181787

Grandpa meant to taze the subdued suspect, but shot him to death. Haha, ooooh grandpa you crazy old coot.

quote:

Sheriff’s Capt. Billy McKelvey claims the arresting officers were not aware Harris had been shot, despite the gunshot noise and Bates’ admission. They called paramedics and firefighters, and rendered aid when they realized, McKelvey said.

“He made an inadvertent mistake,” McKelvey said.

Sgt. Dave Walker told the Tulsa World that police “would not investigate the death unless the sheriff’s office asked them to, and they have not asked us to.”

FuriousxGeorge posted:

If a person is of sound mind pain might make them realize they need to start complying with orders. If they aren't, the chances that it just makes them less compliant are pretty drat good. Just from the brief description of this incident, it sounds like the use of the tazer was completely pointless and brutal.

Combined with the mentally ill guy who was shot for lunging with a screwdriver it's pretty clear to me cops and prison guards just don't realize they need to handle the mentally ill, at least the known mentally ill, differently than a normal person. If someone is severely mentally ill, it's probably not their fault they aren't complying with your orders. They can't.

blunt for century posted:

Pohl posted:

I'm more concerned about how they treated him after he was shot.

quote:

“He shot me! He shot me, man. Oh, my god. I’m losing my breath,” Eric Harris says as he struggles on the ground following the April 2 shooting, which flew under the radar until video emerged a week later.

“F--- your breath,” a callous officer can be heard saying. “Shut the f--- up!”
...
“You shouldn’t have f-----g ran!” another deputy screams, as Harris is held down by his neck and head.

Cichlid the Loach posted:

The level of "meh" at all levels, from the cops on the scene to the sheriff to the police sergeant, feels so bizarre. Enough that it looks like a coordinated response. Like everyone knows it's a polite fiction. And if it's not, if they just care that little that somebody died, it's depraved indifference.

And I'll believe they provided CPR when I see it on the video.

Dead Reckoning posted:

It seems like being tazed may be safer for the prisoner

Zwabu posted:

I'm thinking in the Virginia case the opposite was true.

Also, re: Oklahoma case (lol thought I was reaching for the Taser silly me), even if it wasn't considered malicious, isn't making that kind of mistake a HUGE loving DEAL since it results in the death of a person you weren't trying to kill? Doesn't making that error alone warrant severe discipline and/or dismissal of the officer? Like in the Oakland Fruitvale Station case?

The official response "honest mistake" is like spilling your morning coffee on the floor is an honest mistake. No big deal, really.

Rhesus Pieces posted:

http://m.newsok.com/sheriffs-office-reserve-deputy-who-fired-fatal-shot-was-among-lots-of-wealthy-donors-in-reserve-program/article/5407923

Does anyone have any more info on this "reserve deputy" nonsense? From what I've read the guy who shot Harris was a 73 year old unpaid "volunteer." Do they seriously give retired wannabes guns and tasers for ride-alongs if they donate enough money to the department? How the gently caress is this legal?

Agrajag posted:

GG small town America. I'm sure allowing totally untrained and armed seniors to chase down suspects, while playing cops and robbers, is an absolutely bright idea.

Agrajag posted:

GG small town America. I'm sure allowing totally untrained and armed seniors to chase down suspects, while playing cops and robbers, is an absolutely bright idea.

My prediction of the outcome of this is: absolutely nothing will change and old fogey will be praised as a local hero.

Zwabu posted:

Edit: If a cop killed someone by accidentally running over them on the sidewalk driving carelessly, I get the feeling that would be considered a lot bigger deal than accidentally shooting them with a gun instead of a Taser, simply because a gun is involved in the latter case.

Rhesus Pieces posted:

http://m.newsok.com/sheriffs-office-reserve-deputy-who-fired-fatal-shot-was-among-lots-of-wealthy-donors-in-reserve-program/article/5407923

Does anyone have any more info on this "reserve deputy" nonsense? From what I've read the guy who shot Harris was a 73 year old unpaid "volunteer." Do they seriously give retired wannabes guns and tasers for ride-alongs if they donate enough money to the department? How the gently caress is this legal?


It seems like these taser vs firearm errors only go one way, too.

Tulsa World posted:

Bates apparently is not alone as both a donor and reserve deputy. While the Sheriff’s Office has not released its full roster, Clark said other wealthy donors are among the agency’s 130 reserve deputies.

“There are lots of wealthy people in the reserve program,” he said. “Many of them make donations of items. That’s not unusual at all.”

Bates has donated multiple vehicles, guns and stun guns to the Sheriff’s Office since he became a reserve deputy in 2008, Clark said. The Sheriff’s Office did not have an itemized list of donations made by Bates available Monday and deferred that question to the county commissioners’ office, which tracks those items.

The shooting, which a Sheriff’s Office press release says happened after a brief foot pursuit in the 2000 block of North Harvard Avenue, was recorded via two “sunglass cameras,” Clark said. He could not confirm whether those sunglass cameras were purchased by Bates, but a source told the Tulsa World that Bates had recently purchased them for the Violent Crimes Task Force.

Before Bates was a reserve deputy, he served one year — from 1964 to 1965 — as a police officer, according to Tulsa police.

According to the Sheriff’s Office’s Reserve Deputy Program policy manual, reserves — who Clark said are not compensated financially for any hours they work — are separated into three categories: basic, intermediate and advanced.

Bates, Clark said, is classified as an “advanced reserve,” which means he “can do anything a full-time deputy can do.” Though Bates’ assignment to the Violent Crimes Task Force was not unusual, Clark said, the insurance company executive would have been assigned to the undercover operation in a support role.

“Although he had training and experience for the arrest team, he’s not assigned to the arrest team,” Clark said of Bates’ role on the task force. “He came to render aid during the altercation, but he’s in a support role during the operation. That means keeping notes, doing counter-surveillance, things like that.”

Pohl posted:

Haha, this got crazy as poo poo.
Which reminds me, why was he even going to taze the guy anyway? He was on the ground and contained.

Pohl posted:

Maybe I'm just a big old soft lefty, but I couldn't even tell why the guy needed to be tazed.

Rah! posted:

He had to get his licks in somehow...can't miss all the fun.


See above. Also because criminals are subhuman and deserve to get beaten/shot/tased. Also, he might have been a ninja, and depending on skin color he may have had brute retard strength and/or demons in his face.

Pohl posted:

Haha, this got crazy as poo poo.
Which reminds me, why was he even going to taze the guy anyway? He was on the ground and contained. Maybe I'm just a big old soft lefty, but I couldn't even tell why the guy needed to be tazed.

Agrajag posted:

Victim was black so clearly armed.

Dead Reckoning posted:

The victim was being arrested for trying to illegally sell a 9mm pistol to undercovers, so yeah, the possibility that he was armed is not exactly a stretch.

Doesn't really have any bearing on the hilariously unjustifiable shooting though.

Agrajag posted:

Let me know where in the videow of him running his rear end off you saw him with a gun in his hands. Aside from the weapon of black guy, that is.

tentative8e8op posted:

Yeah, it sounds like he was an insurance executive who literally bought his badge.

Hollismason posted:

You guy's say that but would you pass these tests to be a police man?

http://www.policeprep.com/public/frames_sample_us.aspx

nm posted:

These guys (the not cops) are some of the dumbest people I have ever seen, I almost wonder if there's some mental health/development disability going on (which would make it sadder). I don't know what the gently caress they were thinking (I guess it was white privilege gone wrong). Sounds like someone in the group battered a walmart employee because they didn't want a female employee going into the same restroom as their mom? I have no doubt that these crazy fuckers could have grabbed the cop's gun.

The police could have used better crowd control, but misdemeanor cites rarely go this crazy.

It would be funny if no one what been shot.

effectual posted:

If they weren't white they'd all be dead.

Bel Shazar posted:

At one point in the middle of the video I could swear that one of the cops kicks another one of the cops in the head.

Amos Moses posted:

People keep saying that police need to stop shooting people.

Should be more people saying "Don't loving run from the cops" and "stop breaking the law"