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Shooting Blanks posted:Ok, someone help me understand this (the M9 story) since I never served. It's easier to kill 4 dudes, destroy millions of dollars in equipment and put countless others in danger with zero repercussion, than to do the paperwork to say a gat was lost in a combat zone. And a FLIPL isn't even that hard.
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Apr 22, 2015 23:02
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MegaJoe89 posted:I'm a human Intel analyst/linguist in the Italian Army and because we have such a shortage I have spent a huge portion of my career in Afghanistan with 6 months on 6 months off, up until last year as you can imagine I have no shortage of stories of total stupidity. While talking to a local I was informed of a large supply cache/resting area shared between several anti ISAF groups, but due to stupid policy it was a nogo zone for us. I proceeded to have it passed on to a ISAF liason and some forces from the U.S. Army were assigned to end the muj fun parade, with exact locations. Except they passed up the compound entirely and hit another one but proceeded to detain EVERYONE in sight. Queue US commanders getting angry at me for giving bad Intel until I found out what compound they hit and told them it was the wrong one....the look on his face was priceless.they would later search the compound but found it totally empty because Muj aren't that dumb. Oh and the informant whom I had worked so hard to get him to trust me proceeded to never ever provide anything again. what language is this sean10mm posted:I later saw him, promoted to captain, attending the military intelligence officer advanced course. Yeah I went thru the MICCC and 90% of the officers there could be described like this. sean10mm posted:t I met the platonic ideal of the awful junior officer and it was amazing. what edit--- more info on the Kiowa Crash from http://www.armyaircrews.com/kiowa.html quote:B/6-6 CAV Zeris fucked around with this message at 23:07 on Apr 22, 2015 |
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Apr 22, 2015 23:02
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Zeris posted:what language is this despite speaking Egyptian/Moroccan Arabic and pashto my written English kinda sucks sorry
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Apr 22, 2015 23:06
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MegaJoe89 posted:despite speaking Egyptian/Moroccan Arabic and pashto my written English kinda sucks sorry 
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Apr 22, 2015 23:09
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I'm pretty sure ISIS is developing TTPs based in our propensity to shut down our actual military abilities in order to avoid losing something serialized.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:03
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All we have to do is get that drill with the pilferable tag on it and the whole base will shut down.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:20
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I wonder how crazy the army was in Vietnam for recovering lost sensitive items when entire companies and poo poo were wiped out by NVA and Viet Cong.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:22
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Mike-o posted:I wonder how crazy the army was in Vietnam for recovering lost sensitive items when entire companies and poo poo were wiped out by NVA and Viet Cong. You think Linebacker was an offensive mission?
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Apr 23, 2015 00:37
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Wasabi the J posted:You think Linebacker was an offensive mission? Arc light...when a funny joke on a bar napkin flew out of a general's pocket during a khe sanh flyover
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Apr 23, 2015 00:51
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sean10mm posted:He peaked early as a tank platoon leader on the gunnery range, where he 1) ordered his crew to load sabot (super high velocity), 2)had the ballistic computer set to HEAT (lower velocity) , and 3) used the commander's override to personally fire a round clear out of the impact area and almost hit the PX parking lot. Cease fire freeze, call mike golf.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:54
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Wasabi the J posted:I'm pretty sure ISIS is developing TTPs based in our propensity to shut down our actual military abilities in order to avoid losing something serialized. http://edition.cnn.com/2009/WORLD/meast/04/10/iraq.soldiers.killed/ My XO was almost as stressed about doing the paperwork on the equipment destroyed in this incident as he was having several of his former Soldiers get blown up.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:55
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I can see maybe pulling something sort of like that if someone dropped something loaded with crypto, probably not even then though. But 4 guys and 2 helicopters for a handgun?! It's not as if the bad guys have a short supply of guns.This incident ought be taught in every branch's OCS, while the instructor screams "STUPID STUPID STUPID!!!" over and over again while throwing dodgeballs at the class.
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Apr 23, 2015 00:58
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Nobody wants to be in the chain of command of a US military weapon later found in insurgents' hands. It's happened before and it sucks. There is no, zero, loving none, sense of "I shouldn't commit these helicopters because they might happen to crash into each other and die in fiery horror" when scraping up excuses for boss' boss' boss as to why "we really really really couldn't find the M9, M4, radio, whatever, sirrrr" For one of these, there are a hundred instances of actually finding the sensitive item Every time we ruin lives to find sensitive items, we incentivize dummy-cording and deter future loss of SI It's not fun and hilarious to admit, but there are real reasons why it, at the time, makes sense to send human beings after a piece of poo poo $300 pistol. Often it only makes sense within the context of our military bureaucracy & policies, but that speaks more to the latter than the idiocy of commanders who learn the rules for success in that context. Sometimes it makes no sense at all, for example we know Kiowa optics are hot loving garbage and they're barely able to identify tank-sized heat signatures so an M9 is a joke. That's a true commentary on bad leadership, or pussy-rear end leadership unwilling to go to the mat on why sending late 80's-era cold-war-optimized thermal optics after a pistol makes no loving sense to their supervisor. Oh wait, it makes complete sense in our lovely zero defect no-balls culture.
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Apr 23, 2015 01:07
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At what point do they just say "gently caress it not worth it"? Let's say for example a soldier gets hit and drops his rifle, but somehow gets to safety, does someone have to go and retrieve that rifle? That simply makes no sense to me we would write it off instead of risking another casualty to retrieve a standard issue rifle...it would have to be something that is capable of substantial damage ie a rocket launcher
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Apr 23, 2015 01:51
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I've spent nights walking through swamps looking for dropped magazines, and that poo poo isn't even serialized. Of course people have found boxes of linked ammo and grenades in the training area before so who loving knows.
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Apr 23, 2015 01:58
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MegaJoe89 posted:At what point do they just say "gently caress it not worth it"? Let's say for example a soldier gets hit and drops his rifle, but somehow gets to safety, does someone have to go and retrieve that rifle? That simply makes no sense to me we would write it off instead of risking another casualty to retrieve a standard issue rifle...it would have to be something that is capable of substantial damage ie a rocket launcher
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Apr 23, 2015 02:04
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it's pretty rare poo poo gets left behind unless patrols get ambushed or bases get over run. If a guys gets hit you pick his gear up that you can find along with his body parts. Crypto is the only thing worth going out and searching for if it gets lost. the rest of that stuff just get written off, and someone may get busted down for it. training is another story. God help you if you lose a loving 20 dollar compass. the whole bn ceases training and will police call for that loving thing. elite_garbage_man fucked around with this message at 02:10 on Apr 23, 2015 |
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Apr 23, 2015 02:08
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Casimir Radon posted:Somebody in GIP told a story once about somebody who got really hurt in an IED explosion or something like that, has to be flown out of there. Then leadership shows up at his sickbed to tell him how much trouble he's in for losing his NVGs. That's the point I would grab whoever dumbfuck NCOs and officers were saying that and choke them to death with one of my non blown off limbs.
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Apr 23, 2015 02:09
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You lost a serialized item?!!?! You are scum, everything about you is scum, you should die! This poo poo would never have flown back when when I was in your position! *Has a dead ladyboy in his trunk Security Forces was making some light accusations that I'd lost some of their PRC-152s last time I checked. Some years back somebody decided to give them a bunch for free despite there being no need for them at all. Of course there's no hand receipt or ticket showing any of us ever had them but that's nothing next to the power of
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Apr 23, 2015 02:20
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Mike-o posted:That's the point I would grab whoever dumbfuck NCOs and officers were saying that and choke them to death with one of my non blown off limbs. Agreed. Were that to happen in our service he would get the boot so quick, literally too. The only word to describe that is shameful. To change the subject a bit I have a story of stupidity. As some of you may know Italy, Greece Malta have been having some big issues with immigrants. One of my jobs is going around to camps and interviewing them etc. One of the camps houses suspected radical islamists and had been having a issue with lice. As they are very attached to their beards and hair so we did not want to force them to shave(the staff had attempted using shampoos but the infestation was so high it was not effective) but rather understand that it is their own benefit, I had identified what appeared to be a key figure hoping that I could convince him and he could convince the others. Prior to this I had looked up literature (there is whole books devoted to the beard!) That backed up my point, that a beard was not required and they could be permitted to shave it under circumstances such as this. After much talking, he agreed provided that we replace all linens and mattresses and afterwards give them tea. An easy compromise? About thirty minutes later he had been killed for conspiring with infidels and a riot commenced. Yeeeep. Apparently CS gas kills lice.
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Apr 23, 2015 02:48
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USMC503 posted:The US military has a boner for accountability for equipment, especially so for items deemed "serialized" (i.e. they have a serial number on them). It's really bizarre how bad they are at it. I was an equipment custodian for like six items...a couple of STEs (secure telephones that work by inserting an encryption card, the card is the really important part not the phone) and a TACLANE (sort of like a modem for the classified internet), that kind of stuff. No actual crypto. But somewhere around 2009 we found a loving STU-3. That's the 80s/90s secure phone. The base supply folks were absolutely baffled and it wasn't until I broke it down into a 3 minute version of "hey we found a STU-goddamned-3 that nobody here has ever signed for" that they finally understood the words that were coming out of my mouth and decided to do something about it. Which meant they wanted to blame it on me, which I immediately called bullshit on and threatened to hang up and call the IG if that poo poo ever came up again. I dropped it off at their office and that was the end of it. Edit: Salute stupidity. At ASBC (stupid class for AF lieutenants that no longer exists), one week was set aside for "mentorship" with the students from the SNCO academy which was over at the annex a few miles away. One day it was our turn to bus over there, and some jackass MSgt or whatever just stood at the door of the bus holding a salute and a poo poo-eating-grin for all the 50 or so Lts. 
Godholio fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Apr 23, 2015 |
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Apr 23, 2015 03:25
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MegaJoe89 posted:About thirty minutes later he had been killed for conspiring with infidels and a riot commenced. Yeeeep. Apparently CS gas kills lice. Holy poo poo, this is literally every TV show episode where they try to help some primitive culture.
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Apr 23, 2015 03:28
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the property poo poo is precisely as bad as it is because DPAS is a loving joke and getting something added to or removed from the property record is a goddamned nightmare, and that's before considering poo poo like crypto gear or other things requiring special handling. the installation I work on just unearthed a conex box from the 90s filled with what "appears to be comsec related items"  my office handles property
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Apr 23, 2015 03:37
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Unearthed? As in someone buried an entire connex? 
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Apr 23, 2015 03:42
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So what's the Army version of tossing something off the fantail in the middle of the night to avoid dealing with its existence?
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Apr 23, 2015 03:44
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Stultus Maximus posted:So what's the Army version of tossing something off the fantail in the middle of the night to avoid dealing with its existence? It appears you put it in a container and burry it
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Apr 23, 2015 03:48
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Ammo unaccounted for? Non-sensitive items? Give it to chuck (throw it in the woods). Sensitive items? Find a clever way to get rid of it, or have a ton of people breathing down your neck. Hope to god you never get caught and the buck gets passed onto the poor bastard who takes your position when you PCS. Never had to deal with anything serious but that's what I gather from stories.
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Apr 23, 2015 03:50
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I can't even imagine how that's going to be handled. It could range from people going to prison to the situation where I found an entire drawer full of personnel documents...OPRs, EPRs, all kinds of PII like social security numbers, all from the late 90s. "Uhhh...just put it back."
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Apr 23, 2015 03:52
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That's seriously some crazy poo poo. Multiple high level people must have been involved, being as you probably need a HEMMT and an excavator or whatever those are called to haul a connex and then dig a big enough hole to bury it. Not to mention a good enough plan to somehow not get caught I'd assume.
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Apr 23, 2015 03:54
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krispykremessuck posted:the installation I work on just unearthed a conex box from the 90s filled with what "appears to be comsec related items" Jesus loving christ 
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Apr 23, 2015 03:56
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MegaJoe89 posted:It appears you put it in a container and burry it
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Apr 23, 2015 03:58
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Mike-o posted:Ammo unaccounted for? Non-sensitive items? Give it to chuck (throw it in the woods). Sensitive items? Find a clever way to get rid of it, or have a ton of people breathing down your neck. Hope to god you never get caught and the buck gets passed onto the poor bastard who takes your position when you PCS. Never had to deal with anything serious but that's what I gather from stories. Man... a lot of people in the Navy don't appreciate how great ships are. Nothing like the middle of the ocean to get rid of anything, and I mean anything. We've dumped refrigerator sized stuff that needed to get gone.
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Apr 23, 2015 03:59
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Stultus Maximus posted:Man... a lot of people in the Navy don't appreciate how great ships are. Nothing like the middle of the ocean to get rid of anything, and I mean anything. We've dumped refrigerator sized stuff that needed to get gone.
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Apr 23, 2015 04:06
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Wasn't there a goon who relatively recently found a bunch of old unsigned com sec poo poo in a vault he just signed for with no inspection?
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Apr 23, 2015 04:15
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since it's been found I don't know how much of it has been gone through, when I took a look at it w/ the property people for money reasons I told them it just looked like a bunch of old computers, but as you can imagine people aren't exactly chomping at the bit to dig through it and find out e: and by unearthed I mean someone was clearing brush and found an unidentified sealed/locked one, it wasn't buried
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Apr 23, 2015 04:18
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Stultus Maximus posted:Man... a lot of people in the Navy don't appreciate how great ships are. Nothing like the middle of the ocean to get rid of anything, and I mean anything. We've dumped refrigerator sized stuff that needed to get gone. if it sinks or is food waste, or biodegradable ... it's good to go. anything else is for night ops
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Apr 23, 2015 04:20
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Casimir Radon posted:Somebody in GIP told a story once about somebody who got really hurt in an IED explosion or something like that, has to be flown out of there. Then leadership shows up at his sickbed to tell him how much trouble he's in for losing his NVGs. gently caress. That. Just reading that made me livid. If it were me in that bed, I would simply spit on whoever came to tell me that, gently caress words.
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Apr 23, 2015 04:22
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oh and just to be clear I'm not walking back what I said, but I don't think the people that made the comsec remark really understand what comsec gear is which is why I'm skeptical about it (without digging through the mess) since they've identified where it likely came from, and where it likely came from while attached to a scif was not actually a scif or any place where comsec poo poo should have been stored
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Apr 23, 2015 04:26
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Wasabi the J posted:Wasn't there a goon who relatively recently found a bunch of old unsigned com sec poo poo in a vault he just signed for with no inspection?
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Apr 23, 2015 04:27
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Casimir Radon posted:Somebody in GIP told a story once about somebody who got really hurt in an IED explosion or something like that, has to be flown out of there. Then leadership shows up at his sickbed to tell him how much trouble he's in for losing his NVGs. That's me, amigo. Buddy of mine in OEF 11.1. Still need to get the details about that; the guy got NJP'd and lost a stripe while recovering from a concussion... but hey, he got a purple heart! Admiral Bosch fucked around with this message at 05:51 on Apr 23, 2015 |
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Apr 23, 2015 05:47
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