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Popular Thug Drink posted:the ringleaders of the tea party were tea smugglers largely protesting tax cuts given to the EIC to allow them to undercut the smuggler's prices (and profits) It's a little impressive that that D&D is anti-colonialist, except when it's white Americans resisting.
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Apr 28, 2015 07:50
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Dead Reckoning posted:Well, I guess if you accept the idea that powerful countries have the right to extract wealth from their colonies, and targeted violation of the specific laws designed to do that is wrong, you'd have a point. So looting and property destruction is okay if the government is doing immoral things? Well, let me tell you a bit about the Baltimore PD...
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Apr 28, 2015 07:51
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Dead Reckoning posted:Well, I guess if you accept the idea that powerful countries have the right to extract wealth from their colonies, and targeted violation of the specific laws designed to do that is wrong, you'd have a point. wow you're 0 for 2 on this whole hilariously ironic statements demonstrating a functional ignorance of american history in reference to current events might as well go for a hat trick son
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Apr 28, 2015 07:52
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Dead Reckoning never actually wants to discuss things, he only wants to be right no matter the cost.
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Apr 28, 2015 07:52
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Dead Reckoning posted:Well, I guess if you accept the idea that powerful countries have the right to extract wealth from their colonies, and targeted violation of the specific laws designed to do that is wrong, you'd have a point. Nice revisionism.
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Apr 28, 2015 07:53
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murphyslaw posted:OK. But this is already happening. Civil rights groups, lobbying blocs, hundreds of advocacy groups and millions of dollars are involved, people vote and participate in politics to change the system the "right" way. Yet things continue on as before. Why do you think this is? They don't actually turn out the vote in meaningful numbers, which is why they should focus more of their efforts on that.
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Apr 28, 2015 07:53
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Most people distinguish between acts of state and robbing their neighbors. Tell you what though, if you can find someone who robbed that store and explain how CVS is unfairly expropriating wealth from the black citizens of Baltimore, or even make that hilariously tenuous connection yourself, I'll concede that you aren't just playing team politics. VitalSigns posted:So looting and property destruction is okay if the government is doing immoral things? Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 07:58 on Apr 28, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 07:55
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Foma posted:They don't actually turn out the vote in meaningful numbers, which is why they should focus more of their efforts on that.
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Apr 28, 2015 07:59
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Dead Reckoning posted:Most people distinguish between acts of state and robbing their neighbors. hm yes we must all endeavor to prove our sincerity and lack of bias to the poster who just claimed that the boston tea party was a good and noble destruction of property that had nothing to do with private gain and was actually a righteous protest about imperial export and resale law, you see, because really though the fact that you can't bring yourself to condemn the criminal action celebrated as a foundational myth of this country is just sad. i'm sad for you. maybe one day you'll grow up a little bit
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Apr 28, 2015 08:00
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shrike82 posted:I think it's sad that white posters are cheering on black people looting on some masturbatory anarchist fantasies. It makes more sense if you remove the racial aspect of it from the equation. It really doesn't matter one bit what the color of either side, involved or just posting about it: The police is Dad. The notion of "Don't violently riot because of the police make you upset" is a Dad Thought. If you're a gently caress You Dad kind of person, you're going to cheer on people who are doing anything that says gently caress You Dad. It doesn't matter one bit what verbose justifications for the rioting are, what matters is that Group X is doing gently caress You Dad things, gently caress You Dad people like seeing gently caress You Dad stuff, so you'll overlook the bad things about what Group X is doing because, hey, Group X is doing what I'd like to do. (It also ties into why, during all of these things, people here seem to get a little  when the news inevitably covers the events from the police side. Covering what's going on, from the position of the police, by mainstream news reporters, is a Dad Thing. Underground alt indie microbloggers are gently caress You Dad guys.)
MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 08:03 on Apr 28, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 08:01
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MisterBibs posted:It makes more sense if you remove the racial aspect of it from the equation. mods thread title please
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Apr 28, 2015 08:02
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tezcat posted:No really, you're not even going to consider gerrymandering as a thing? That's some impressive ignorance. What the gently caress are you talking about Gerrymandering? Sure it is a thing on the federal level for House and Senate races, but this is a local issue. There isn't any Gerrymandering going on over who has oversight over the local police.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:04
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British colonialism in the Americas was bad...because occasionally the British mistreated their own white colonists. This is the most amazing alternate history I've ever read, keep going.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:05
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Popular Thug Drink posted:hm yes we must all endeavor to prove our sincerity and lack of bias to the poster who just claimed that the boston tea party was a good and noble destruction of property that had nothing to do with private gain and was actually a righteous protest about imperial export and resale law, you see, because Tell me, was the The Dandi Salt March also all about black marketeering in salt? Dead Reckoning fucked around with this message at 08:08 on Apr 28, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 08:06
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on the left posted:The current mayor and previous mayor of Baltimore are both black women, so obviously it's not an impossible strategy. "Our president is black, therefore--"
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Apr 28, 2015 08:06
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Dead Reckoning posted:I see someone's discovered Howard Zinn for the first time. well at least one of us reads history books
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Apr 28, 2015 08:06
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VitalSigns posted:British colonialism in the Americas was bad...because occasionally the British mistreated their own white colonists. No, now is the part where when everybody votes, and votes for police body cameras, the issues will evaporate, like 300 years of slavery, no issues, None, leave the [insert property] owners alone!
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Apr 28, 2015 08:07
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MisterBibs posted:It makes more sense if you remove the racial aspect of it from the equation. It really doesn't matter one bit what the color of either side, involved or just posting about it: I guess the Baltimore police are like Dad, if you include the dads who occasionally beat and murder their offspring, sure.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:07
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MisterBibs posted:The police is Dad. The notion of "Don't violently riot because of the police make you upset" is a Dad Thought. They're protesting and rioting because police killed an unarmed man, which is only the latest injustice among countless other abuses that have gone on in Baltimore and around the country basically forever. They're angry about serious and neverending poo poo, and many other people understand this, and sympathize. None of it is the same as a teenager saying "gently caress you dad", you moron. Unless it's a dad like this: VitalSigns posted:I guess the Baltimore police are like Dad, if you include the dads who occasionally beat and murder their offspring, sure.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:14
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^ I disagree entirely. Kids get mad at their parents for grounding them. They get mad when parents say "I don't care if the other kid started it, I'm punishing you for what you did." They get mad when there are rules, and kids so hate to be punished for breaking rules. VitalSigns posted:I guess the Baltimore police are like Dad, if you include the dads who occasionally beat and murder their offspring, sure. To put it even broader, the legal system is Dad too. It demands reasonable-to-Dads proof that X is being done before punishing the accused. gently caress You Dads don't need any of that, and acts surprised when 'but this is what I feel happened' isn't weighed as strongly as 'this is what we can prove happened'. MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 08:21 on Apr 28, 2015 |
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Apr 28, 2015 08:15
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MisterBibs posted:It makes more sense if you remove the racial aspect of it from the equation. It really doesn't matter one bit what the color of either side, involved or just posting about it: Your father is a pretty big gently caress up, throwing stones at people and then drawing a gun when they react in kind.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:16
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Popular Thug Drink posted:well at least one of us reads history books
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Apr 28, 2015 08:18
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Dead Reckoning posted:For real though, you should have stuck with "looting is regrettable, but them's the breaks when a generation of discontent spills out on to the streets" instead trying to explain how robbing a liquor store is a revolutionary act. it's a little unseemly to get this pissy because i pointed out some factual errors in your historical analysis it's ok, everyone makes mistakes from time to time. we learn from them and move on
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Apr 28, 2015 08:18
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MisterBibs posted:^ I disagree entirely. Kids get mad at their parents for grounding them. They get mad when parents say "I don't care if the other kid started it, I'm punishing you for what you did." They get mad when there are rules, and that breaking them has consequences. You have made me see things clearly: innocents murdered by the police is just the same as a dad righteously scolding an errant child. Any protest or outrage in reaction to it is an unconscionable act of defiance to just authority.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:22
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murphyslaw posted:You have made me see things clearly: innocents murdered by the police is just the same as a dad righteously scolding an errant child. Any protest or outrage in reaction to it is an unconscionable act of defiance to just authority.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:26
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murphyslaw posted:innocents murdered by the police Innocence and any murder is for the courts to decide, and for society to collectively accept once that decision is made.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:26
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MisterBibs posted:To put it even broader, the legal system is Dad too. It demands reasonable-to-Dads proof that X is being done before punishing the accused. gently caress You Dads don't need any of that, and acts surprised when 'but this is what I feel happened' isn't weighed as strongly as 'this is what we can prove happened'. Of course, the justice system is declining to even indict cops who murder people in broad daylight on video, let alone out of sight in police custody. So I guess that's like Dad if you include the dads who murder children and cover up for their child-murdering friends, sure.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:27
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MisterBibs posted:That's for the courts to decide by a series of proof-locating, and for society to collectively accept once that decision is made. Na, I think you can be ignored, while they cannot.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:27
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Popular Thug Drink posted:it's a little unseemly to get this pissy because i pointed out some factual errors in your historical analysis  That's ok though, I can be magnanimous in victory."
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Apr 28, 2015 08:29
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VitalSigns posted:Of course, the justice system is declining to even indict cops who murder people in broad daylight on video, let alone out of sight in police custody. That speaks more to the fact that those in the justice system have a better understanding of things than those speaking from the sidelines.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:30
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MisterBibs posted:Innocence and any murder is for the courts to decide, and for society to collectively accept once that decision is made. Agree on the principle, but a handcuffed man showing up at the station with a severed spine after a nice car ride with officer dan does throw some doubt on the whole just world angle you're going for.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:33
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MisterBibs posted:That speaks more to the fact that those in the justice system have a better understanding of things than those speaking from the sidelines. Yeah the murderer and his buddies usually do have a better understanding of how a crime went down than uninvolved people sure, but that doesn't mean we should put his friends in charge of the investigation.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:33
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murphyslaw posted:Agree on the principle, but a handcuffed man showing up at the station with a severed spine after a nice car ride with officer dan does throw some doubt on the whole just world angle you're going for. we really don't know what crimes he committed inside the police van that warranted a crushed throat. if you didn't hate your father so much you would trust the police and the legal system
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Apr 28, 2015 08:34
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VitalSigns posted:Of course, the justice system is declining to even indict cops who murder people in broad daylight on video, let alone out of sight in police custody. Michael Slager was charged with murder for shooting Walter Scott. When it is unambiguous and filmed the justice system goes after cops.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:36
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Foma posted:Michael Slager was charged with murder for shooting Walter Scott. When it is unambiguous and filmed the justice system goes after cops. And there were no riots in South Carolina either! Hmm it's almost like an independent commission that investigates corruption and wrongdoing with a solid record of fair and impartial pursuit of justice can keep the trust of the populace and avoid the complete breakdown of law and order that's happening in a place where the cops and justice system is routinely violent and bigoted! Who'd a thunk
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Apr 28, 2015 08:39
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Foma posted:Michael Slager was charged with murder for shooting Walter Scott. When it is unambiguous and filmed the justice system goes after cops. VitalSigns posted:Who'd a thunk
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Apr 28, 2015 08:40
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VitalSigns posted:And there were no riots in South Carolina either! I don't think that pans out, Darren Wilson/Michael Brown case was reviewed by the Federal government and we got riots there.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:41
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Rent-A-Cop posted:In South Carolina. Somehow I doubt Maryland has any interest in being that proactive. In Maryland the case is not filmed and is ambiguous
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Apr 28, 2015 08:42
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Foma posted:I don't think that pans out, Darren Wilson/Michael Brown case was reviewed by the Federal government and we got riots there. Foma posted:In Maryland the case is not filmed and is ambiguous
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Apr 28, 2015 08:43
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Foma posted:I don't think that pans out, Darren Wilson/Michael Brown case was reviewed by the Federal government and we got riots there. Did the riots happen before or after the federal government reviewed it? Oh and who was the first to destroy property in Ferguson. Was it rioters? Or was it police destroying the memorial to Michael Brown the very night of the shooting before any riots even happened? Think back. Think baaaaaaaaack. Weird huh, how places with bad governments have riots and places with good government that react swiftly and decisively to misconduct by their agents...don't, isn't it? Gosh.
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Apr 28, 2015 08:46
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