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Dr. Faustus posted:My point was about the myopia of a group of people watching a show and seeing characters develop over several seasons and then shouting, "THEY'VE DONE NOTHING!" Characters developing over four seasons and one episode so far this season.
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May 19, 2015 14:03
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Irish Joe posted:Don't we see the repercussions of that manifest in her growing insanity? Cersei has a major inferiority complex, and being raped by her former lover and brother (if that is indeed what happened) can only contribute to that. Well she hasn't tried to hurt Jamie in anyway, she's just sent him off to Dorne. Unless she was the one that informed the king that Jamie and Bronn were coming, hoping to have him imprisoned as punishment. That would be a completely bananas move though considering how few allies she has left.
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May 19, 2015 14:11
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Irish Joe posted:Don't we see the repercussions of that manifest in her growing insanity? Cersei has a major inferiority complex, and being raped by her former lover and brother (if that is indeed what happened) can only contribute to that. You could, at a stretch. But she was already losing her grip before then and honestly, I think her arc would play out the same way since the show has constantly made it clear that she is ultimately scared of other women. The problem is that being as there's essentially no aftermath to it - and importantly the show's treatment of Jamie seems to indicate there was no wrongdoing - then it's easy to see why it looks like they've just glossed over it (To get outside of the text for a moment, it was clear the scene was utterly mishandled by everyone involved and the intent of that scene wasn't made clear). The show has a poor time so far of dealing with the aftermath of rape, and I think there were ways of doing that scene that didn't just make it look like the start of Theon's redemption arc.
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May 19, 2015 14:13
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 lol
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May 19, 2015 14:31
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I'm glad I'm not the only one. The last episode was easily the worst of the series, and I doubt things are going to get any better with D&D at the helm. GRRM gets bashed a lot, but he didn't rape Sansa.
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May 19, 2015 14:33
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I'm sorry, what is D&D? I can't stop reading it as Debate & Discussion.
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May 19, 2015 14:36
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Well, that would have been tricky as she's a fictional character.
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May 19, 2015 14:36
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The showrunners, David Benioff and Dan Weiss. And she's a fictional character that was created by GRRM, yes, and he never wrote anything about her being raped by Ramsay Snow.
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May 19, 2015 14:38
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I just wish I could masturbate over the torture and slaughter of innocents without my pet issue getting in the way.
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May 19, 2015 14:42
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I'm just glad he didn't rape her that would have been hosed up on both a moral and a dimensional level.
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May 19, 2015 14:43
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Apoplexy posted:I'm glad I'm not the only one. The last episode was easily the worst of the series, and I doubt things are going to get any better with D&D at the helm. GRRM gets bashed a lot, but he didn't rape Sansa. You're so brave.
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May 19, 2015 14:44
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Apoplexy posted:The showrunners, David Benioff and Dan Weiss. And she's a fictional character that was created by GRRM, yes, and he never wrote anything about her being raped by Ramsay Snow. He just wrote about Ramsay raping some one else.
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May 19, 2015 14:44
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Maarak posted:http://www.hitfix.com/whats-alan-watching/why-doesnt-the-game-of-thrones-map-always-match-up-with-where-the-story-is I wish they kept a little map up all the time, just like I was playing an RPG (since the show basically is an RPG).
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May 19, 2015 15:06
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Xealot posted:Exactly. That Cersei scene is lovely because there is no fallout and it meant nothing. That episode isn't terrible because this traumatic thing happened to Cersei, it's terrible because it doesn't even regard the repercussions of that, or even acknowledge her experience happened in-universe. Why should the show do that? It was a botched scene, it didn't convey what they wanted to convey. Should they just rewrite the whole story going forward because they botched a scene?
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May 19, 2015 15:10
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I've been enjoying the season for the most part and I will probably continue to do so. See everyone who dropped it next week! People seem to always forget that HBO shows need about half+ a season to build up and everyone is up in arms and then a giant man crushes the face of a beloved character and everyone is back on board 
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May 19, 2015 15:23
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I think they should ignore the botched Bronn fight scene with the snake ladies and have him and Jamie stumble into the after fight orgy instead.
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May 19, 2015 15:23
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If Bronn dies I am so done with this show.
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May 19, 2015 15:35
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The Duggler posted:I've been enjoying the season for the most part and I will probably continue to do so. See everyone who dropped it next week! Joffrey died in the second episode of season 4 IIRC
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May 19, 2015 15:41
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Yeah, poo poo went down from episode 1 in season 4. It built up to a crescendo sure, but it was never this loving boring.Elephanthead posted:I think they should ignore the botched Bronn fight scene with the snake ladies and have him and Jamie stumble into the after fight orgy instead. Also: XMNN posted:If Bronn dies I am so done with this show. tooterfish fucked around with this message at 15:55 on May 19, 2015 |
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May 19, 2015 15:52
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Apoplexy posted:I'm glad I'm not the only one. The last episode was easily the worst of the series, and I doubt things are going to get any better with D&D at the helm. GRRM gets bashed a lot, but he didn't rape Sansa. lol no it wasn't we got: * Arya being forced to deal with the fact that she didn't hate the hound, great for audiences who liked their relationship * Arya faceless man stuff * Olenna vs Cersei * poo poo going down with Tyrells * Jorah & Jeor * Great lines from Tyrion * Everyone's favorite rapist from Oz In fact it was one of the better episodes.
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May 19, 2015 15:59
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tooterfish posted:Yeah, poo poo went down from episode 1 in season 4. It built up to a crescendo sure, but it was never this loving boring. Does boring = people not getting killed to you? Plenty of stuff is happening every episode so far
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May 19, 2015 16:03
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Junkfist posted:
I honestly am trying to figure out why people are freaking over this event, and don't buy the "it was building up to this!" excuse. I think I figured it out: It's because you watched Sansa grow up on screen since season 1, and a lot of people I think have become exceptionally protective of her as a result. The fact is, with the plot of her marrying Ramsey, this outcome was inevitable. It just was. They could have avoided showing it on screen, but in the story, this was going to happen: People who keep screaming it's bad storytelling need to understand that including a few extra (not even exploitative) shots, it wouldn't change the story. If Reek didn't involve Theon as his method of being a psychopath, it'd been something else, ranging from his hunting dogs to "I know, let's go on a hunt for my annoying ex-girlfriend! Then we can take a nice bloodbath first!" Did you seriously think Ramsey loving Snow/Bolton, who has been tormenting her since she got there for amusement and has been tormenting Reek for seasons, was going to somehow be gentle or listen to her whims? Honestly I'd say "They could have just not shown it," but the thing is, they really didn't even show that much. Honestly they've shown similar if not worse things on the show many, many times and I understood people screaming "I'm done!!!!" when they stabbed the pregnant woman - again a change from the books as I'm sure everyone has heard but spoilering in case right in the baby first. This seems absolutely in line with the show's culture. ... also while I know there's this culture of putting your head in the sand, I think one of the reasons Game of Thrones can show stuff like that is because in backwards cultures, ugliness is common and rape is apart of that ugliness. Look at the 3rd world, in the modern age: It's still used as a weapon of war with warlords, it's rampant in undeveloped countries, there are even parts of Mexico you can skirt prison charges if you kidnap a woman as long as you offer to marry her after (and there's several other countries that have similar practices). It's very hosed up but I think they've gone out of their way to make an analogue to our own hosed up world, and that erasing it as a subject is such a dumb idea. It'd be like if we went back to all our civil war movies and took our slavery, because it's offensive, and instead demanded they be shown with a diverse cast working together, or demand that a show set in a Mad Men esque universe promote women to more power than the men. If you start trying to pretend the bad parts of humanity never happened because you might get TRIGGERED is insane, but again to loop back to the start: I think if this was another character, people wouldn't have freaked. So yeah. Money is on the fact that you almost never see terrible things happen to a character you've been following since she was a little clueless girl, and the protective instincts formed in people on some level as a result. Where as I've basically been looking at the characters as if it was one of those "You are already dead! You must somehow make it through this episode to reclaim your life!" lenses; I am honestly shocked she's made it this far with her head still attached. XMNN posted:If Bronn dies I am so done with this show. If they do a very special episode about drug use and cross it over with a promotion of Star Wars, and HBO strikes a deal with Marvel to reveal Dany is a mutant, I'm so done with this show. Blazing Ownager fucked around with this message at 16:10 on May 19, 2015 |
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May 19, 2015 16:05
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Blazing Ownager posted:If they do a very special episode about drug use and cross it over with a promotion of Star Wars, and HBO strikes a deal with Marvel to reveal Dany is a mutant, I'm so done with this show. Khaleesi in Once Upon a Time would be cool. They already have dragons!
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May 19, 2015 16:12
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A lot of it is that so, so many genre stories use violence against women that people often react reflexively to seeing it. It's such an awful traumatic thing that they just kind of shut the door on considering it in a broader context because the vast majority of the time there is no broader context.
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May 19, 2015 16:17
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The Duggler posted:Does boring = people not getting killed to you? Plenty of people have been killed this season, hasn't stopped it being boring for the most part. It seems to me like every episode has been chock full of filler, and we're continually retreading the same ground. There's a bit of progression here and there, but the pacing has been loving glacial compared to last season. Maybe it'll pick up in these last 4 episodes, or maybe they're deliberately dragging it out to give people the authentic novel experience (because the last book was 2000 pages of absolutely poo poo all happening too, it was well worth the money. Actually checking wikipedia it was only 1000 pages, but it sure as gently caress felt like 2000).
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May 19, 2015 16:17
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hiddenmovement posted:Unless she was the one that informed the king that Jamie and Bronn were coming, hoping to have him imprisoned as punishment. And there's the fact that she genuinely thinks her daughter is in danger and wants her back in Kings Landing, so I'm gonna go with no on that one. Blazing Ownager posted:It's because you watched Sansa grow up on screen since season 1, and a lot of people I think have become exceptionally protective of her as a result. And so this is a thumb in the eye of all the people who look at the show and get invested and romanticize the middle ages and knighthood and chivalry. Which is fine because they really aren't getting the point, which is this world is horrible, the people in it are horrible, the things those people do to each other are horrible and their motivations are horrible, which really is a thing they need to show and not just tell.
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May 19, 2015 16:24
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Nah dawgs this seasons a lovely snooze fest. Most scenes dwell on boring things: John Snow's stoicism, Dany's crap leadership, a dark boring cult Arya joined, and even King's Landing sucks because fun characters have been replaced by lovely religious zealots. Wake me when Tyrion does something relevant or Stannis gets to Winterfell.
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May 19, 2015 16:32
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My Q-Face posted:And so this is a thumb in the eye of all the people who look at the show and get invested and romanticize the middle ages and knighthood and chivalry. Which is fine because they really aren't getting the point, which is this world is horrible, the people in it are horrible, the things those people do to each other are horrible and their motivations are horrible, which really is a thing they need to show and not just tell. It's true. I've seen lots of friends on facebook posted stupid poo poo about which fantasy world they'd want to live in, and a lot of the time they say that living in Westeros would be so amazing. No it loving wouldn't. Even if you were one of the extremely rare privileged folks to be highborn, life would still be pretty horrible. Especially if you were a woman (which most of the people posting stuff like this on my facebook are).
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May 19, 2015 16:41
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The reason the Sand Snakes fight scene sucks is because they transferred the fight scene budget to the rape scene budget.
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May 19, 2015 16:42
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I don't find it boring at all. Compared to the rest of TV it is pretty entertaining. What do you expect for $15 a month?
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May 19, 2015 16:44
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Id live on the discworld myself. A benevolent dictator, ample work, and a multi ethnic modern metropolis.
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May 19, 2015 16:51
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It's not just about the bad fight choreography of the Dorne plot, although that's the most visible and thus easy thing to make fun of. It's the entire scene. How do Jaime and Bronn waltz right in within arms length of the HEIR to Dorne in blood stained clothes in the broad daylight? What the hell was the plan if things went awry? Why not infiltrate at night? What the fucobis happening UGH gently caress THE SANDSNAKES! There are so many things wrong with the Dornish scenes this episode. The only solace I have is to laugh/cry at the Dorne gifs.
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May 19, 2015 16:52
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My Q-Face posted:And so this is a thumb in the eye of all the people who look at the show and get invested and romanticize the middle ages and knighthood and chivalry. The Hound even gives us a nice lecture about it during the siege of King's Landing, just in case we weren't quite getting it yet. Sansa's story arc has been a (particularly graphic) journey disassembling the romanticised view of feudal society. More than anyone else she represents the audience in this story, the everyman. It's through her experiences we're supposed to lose our naivete. e:stupid dictionary tooterfish fucked around with this message at 17:08 on May 19, 2015 |
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May 19, 2015 16:52
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Blazing Ownager posted:I honestly am trying to figure out why people are freaking over this event, and don't buy the "it was building up to this!" excuse. I think I figured it out: It's because you watched Sansa grow up on screen since season 1, and a lot of people I think have become exceptionally protective of her as a result. I think people assumed (myself included) that when Littlefinger told her to make Ramsay yours and Sansa agreed to it that she was going to play the Margaery role and at least try to manipulate Ramsay. If she's too terrified of Ramsay to even convince him to make Theon leave the room, what the hell is she doing there? Margaery would have made an attempt to get Theon out of there. If she's not capable enough at playing the game to get Theon out of the room on her wedding night, then it makes no sense for her to be there. If it makes no sense to be there, then it comes off as something just done for shock value. She was raped so they could have another Red Wedding/Oberyn moment.
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May 19, 2015 16:53
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lol, 59% on rotten tomatoes, every other episode this season was 96-100% men getting castrated, men and women getting flayed, people burned alive and pregnant women stabbed in the belly - meh NP sansa marries a guy who castrated and flayed and maimed her step-brother or w/e, gets some rough not-so-consensual wedding night consummation, UNLEASH THE HOUNDS!!!!
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May 19, 2015 16:58
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She was probably raped so that Theon could have a character developing moment. Otherwise I agree with everything you said, all Sansa has shown is that she's tough enough to turn the other cheek. She shoulda thrown Littlefinger under the bus when he was being interrogated at the Vale.
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May 19, 2015 17:00
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Super Ninja Fish posted:If she's not capable enough at playing the game to get Theon out of the room on her wedding night, then it makes no sense for her to be there. She's there to split the Lannister/Bolton alliance, which was made clear in this episode. LF probably told her that poo poo so she'd go along with being his pawn.
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May 19, 2015 17:13
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In It For The Tank posted:
Hahahaha you can tell from the teleporting that its two different takes spliced together. Like the chick did 50 different kickups and that was the best one counterfeitsaint posted:The problem with dagger girl is she didn't stop, stand there and clink her daggers together for several seconds. Not even once. This is while she'll never be a fooking legend.  i also would have accepted
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May 19, 2015 17:18
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Fight Club Sandwich posted:Hahahaha you can tell from the teleporting that its two different takes spliced together. Like the chick did 50 different kickups and that was the best one I'm watching her at the point of the cut and I'm convinced that she couldn't put the two moves together, her legs do some kind of spinny almost double-take as they're farther forward before the cut than after. Like, she could fall on her back and shoulders, and she could sort of kick up, but she couldn't overcome her own momentum when she tried to do them both at the same time.
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May 19, 2015 17:34
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Irish Joe posted:She's there to split the Lannister/Bolton alliance, which was made clear in this episode. LF probably told her that poo poo so she'd go along with being his pawn. That explains why Littlefinger would want her there, not why she would agree to it. Are we just supposed to think she's a stupid character and agrees to whatever she's told? Is the post below an accurate description of her thought process? Exioce posted:Does Sansa even know what her revenge plan is, or is she hoping to stumble upon it after a dozen or so rapes?
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May 19, 2015 17:34
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