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To be fair the thugs out front and on the surrounding rooftops had guns and sniper rifles. I assume the garage on the side was less well guarded to defuse tensions between Black Joker's men and SWAT. But that might be justifying a game in the DARK KNIGHT thread.
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May 21, 2015 14:46
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Turns out that the Arkham games are on offer on Steam again this weekend, probably to promote Arkham Knight. I'm in two minds as to whether to get Origins, since I already bought it once for the PS3 I no longer own. Does anyone have any (non-spoiler, of course) recommendations on whether Cold, Cold Heart is actually any good?
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May 21, 2015 19:17
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inflatablefish posted:Turns out that the Arkham games are on offer on Steam again this weekend, probably to promote Arkham Knight. I'm in two minds as to whether to get Origins, since I already bought it once for the PS3 I no longer own. Does anyone have any (non-spoiler, of course) recommendations on whether Cold, Cold Heart is actually any good? You can pick it up for $10 with all the challenge maps. I don't recommend the challenge maps. You can get just Cold Cold Heart for $7.50. I think you'd be better off just watching the Mr. Freeze BTAS episode again.
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May 21, 2015 19:31
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I liked Cold Cold Heart, but it's rather short and takes you into the nightclub that is notorious for crashing games. (MAJOR GLITCH/SPOILERS)
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May 21, 2015 21:23
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I think I could feel your frustration through the screen on that last combat map trying to take out the enforcer when every other goddamn enemy keeps getting in your way then the enforcer goes and grabs you out of attacking them.Mzbundifund posted:MY PARENTS ARE DEAD The popular alternate move to the Arkham games' other famous finisher, Batman's Butt-Punch. 
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May 22, 2015 05:43
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This isn't a gladiator pit. It's an operating table. And he's the proctologist. 
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May 22, 2015 06:00
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Video 16 Notes Snipe Man I'm afraid some of scruffy's description of this encounter isn't accurate. The devs of Origins either didn't have access to, or chose not to use, whatever script logic allowed the Two Face encounter to include infinite, continuously spawning enemies. Deadshot actually has a series of phases in which he follows different patrol patterns (the last of these being the hostage grab). When his health is reduced enough to change patterns, the game summons a new set of enemies from the front of the bank(you can see them spawning in when Deadshot runs for his hostage) as needed to replace any that were taken down. I (not knowing the rushdown technique) would repeatedly empty the arena of enemies, then use a silent takedown on Deadshot, triggering his next phase- which would be fine if the sightlines and interaction options for the final hostage phase weren't unclear, causing Deadshot to repeatedly kill the hostage and me to repeatedly restart what was a thirty minute or so process. The deadshot fight is depressingly normal- the trickshot mechanic rarely comes up, mostly because the gargoyles remain a really easy way to navigate the area. If deadshot either swept the gargoyles with his laser, or they were wired with TNT, the fight would be a lot more interesting. Ah, well. It's different enough that it could have been an interesting challenge mode map. Also in the "ah, well" range- Deadshot isn't actually tied up or anything at the end, he's just pretending. It also sounds like they cut some lines, since he is expecting Batman to execute him. Deadshot's actually fairly interesting backstory is that for a number of traumatic backstory reasons (some of which Scruffy describes) he has a really strong death wish and takes meaningless risks and performs stunts(like wearing red) to commit indirect suicide- it's the whole reason he's a hitman. For some reason Batman doesn't respond to this, and Deadshot doesn't react with surprise/anger/despair to, you know, not being killed. I'm guessing this material was actually recorded and cut for censorship reasons- the lines to Alfred are cut for the same reasons, probably. Manny P As near as I can tell this is Emmanuel Pappas, one of the level artists for the game. The name also appears on scraps of paper inside the hotel. The alternative is that it's a reference to Manuel Pardo, which is, um...yeah. (it's not a reference to Manuel Pardo.) edit: I found a really well-hidden easter egg area with another Manny P plaque. It was how he signed maps he made, I guess- I'd appreciate it more if I didn't think the maps largely sucked. The only good things the AO interior maps have are some really nicely framed point perspective areas- but that comes almost entirely from the fact that they're derived heavily from static concept art. Get ready for lots more "the joker's so edgyevilgonutty-lookit alla dem corpses" map design. This is one of the lowest points of the game in terms of both writing and design. I'll have a lot more to say next video. 100 to 1/Full Lot Notes The bugginess of AO's combat is especially visible in this video- there are several cases where an enemy skips most of their attack animation in order to hit batman. The Enforcer shenanigans on Full Lot are the worst I've ever seen, but they are a good illustration of why taking out these "Big enemies" first is a good idea- even in AC, the Twins weren't really well-integrated with the normal combat systems, and the enforcers in this game are much worse. Discendo Vox fucked around with this message at 16:04 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 06:51
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TwoPair posted:The popular alternate move to the Arkham games' other famous finisher, Batman's Butt-Punch. While in the east Batman learned the secret Kancho Fist technique.
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May 22, 2015 07:02
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I think Bruce has an evil doppelganger in East Africa:quote:Popobawa is a Swahili name which translates literally as "bat-wing" (from Swahili popo, "bat", and bawa, "wing"). This name is said to have originated as a description of the dark shadow cast by the spirit when it attacks at night: it does not refer to the actual form of the spirit, which is liable to change. Wait... quote:Villagers maintain that Popobawa becomes enraged if his existence is denied. Popobawa allegedly spoke to a group of villagers on Pemba in 1971 through a girl possessed by the monster. The girl, called Fatuma, spoke in a man's deep voice and then villagers say they heard the sound of a car revving and rustling on a nearby roof. Oh God, no! 
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May 22, 2015 07:37
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Snipe Man was 12 hours well spent. I knew Deadshot was full of poo poo, so I just rushed him and didn't bother taking out any of his guard as much as I could help it. Then for the hostage I just walked up behind him and did a Silent Takedown. I feel like in my first playthrough it was difficult to do, but in this one it was easy as cake. I didn't have any troubles with his laser sight or anything. Much like Shiva, I wish they'd done more. I mean Deadshot just says "Hey, come fight me." And you do and that's that. I thought it was hilarious hearing the men do a "He got the boss, screw this!" and running out with guns still in hand, too afraid to fight Batman.
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May 22, 2015 18:03
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Today we get a new toy and take down another one of the eight assassins. Sort of. Also, welcome to one of the worst designed areas in the game! The Worst Rides/Polsy Predator Challenge: Checking Out/Polsy with Red Son Batman
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May 22, 2015 18:09
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If Deadshot wanted Batman to come fight him, why the elaborate message? What if Batman didn't piece together it was a Radio Signal?
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May 22, 2015 18:12
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Doctor Reynolds posted:If Deadshot wanted Batman to come fight him, why the elaborate message? What if Batman didn't piece together it was a Radio Signal? It's Batman. Expecting him to not figure something out is like expecting him to kill the Joker for all the hundreds if not thousands of people he's killed over the years: conventions of the character forbid it.
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May 22, 2015 18:15
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mamaluke
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May 22, 2015 18:27
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Again, they really could've backed off of the Italian stereotypes. The Black Masks aren't even an italian gang!
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May 22, 2015 18:39
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I'm fairly sure remote batarang puzzles with electricity were in AC.
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May 22, 2015 18:50
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anilEhilated posted:I'm fairly sure remote batarang puzzles with electricity were in AC. Yep, they were. They were required in the story once during the second trip through the steel mill and for a good number of Riddler trophies. I might have said and probably will say something wrong in the videos for which I apologize ahead of time. I've been going off of a backlog for almost two weeks 
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May 22, 2015 18:52
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If I could give one bit of critical feedback, scruffy, it's that you write up what you say about the background of a villain or character before you do the video voiceover. Your delivery on those parts goes through the basement, as you try to piece together commentary while (presumably) actively reading the wikipedia page for the character. edit: an errata textpost might be nice for when this LP gets archived.
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May 22, 2015 19:01
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Sorry, I probably phrased that a little too harshly. I was more trying to point out just how little this game adds - it's yet another reused mechanic.
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May 22, 2015 19:01
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Sure was worth wasting an assassin slot on a guy whose only role was to get killed by the Joker and drop a new gadget.  Also love how Deadshot and Shiva still attend the meeting, even though you can complete their sidequests before this point.
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May 22, 2015 19:06
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I think every scene I see where the Joker is mugging around being 'oh so crazy' and threatening superhumans and killers, I'm surprised none of them just throw him out a window or shoot him in the face. Like, sure, he can get away with that with Batman, Batman doesn't murder people. These guys are explicitly a bunch of crazed killers. You'd think 'This poo poo ain't worth it, just take him out and take his money.' would cross their minds. Or that he wouldn't be able to intimidate them. I mean, it was nice to see Bane just shove him in a chair and tell him to shut up, but you'd think it'd be a common occurrence. The guy just isn't as scary as the writers think he is. Night10194 fucked around with this message at 19:10 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 19:07
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Discendo Vox posted:If I could give one bit of critical feedback, scruffy, it's that you write up what you say about the background of a villain or character before you do the video voiceover. Your delivery on those parts goes through the basement, as you try to piece together commentary while (presumably) actively reading the wikipedia page for the character. Guilty as charged. I think that's the last one I really go through but yeah I could have prepared better.
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May 22, 2015 19:08
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Also, another thing: why does Copperhead know about Joker, but Bane and the others seem not to?
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May 22, 2015 19:23
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Basically, the Joker (as he shows up in the games) a guy who only has one joke, and the punchline is 'and then I tortured and killed a bunch of people for no reason except that I enjoy it'. It gets old. Really fast.
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May 22, 2015 19:28
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Discendo Vox posted:edit: an errata textpost might be nice for when this LP gets archived. Nah, clearly Scruffy should focus on putting out DLC for the LP instead.
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May 22, 2015 19:38
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Night10194 posted:I think every scene I see where the Joker is mugging around being 'oh so crazy' and threatening superhumans and killers, I'm surprised none of them just throw him out a window or shoot him in the face. Because most of the time the Joker is also a genius intellect and master of preparation and planning to rival the Batman by implication for the poo poo he pulls.
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May 22, 2015 19:55
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To be fair I don't think Batman has ever struck me as particularly intelligent. He just knows the script. The whole "world's greatest detective" schtick is horribly unconvincing.
anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 20:07 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 19:56
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anilEhilated posted:To be fair I don't think Batman has ever struck me as particularly intelligent. He just knows the script. The whole "world's greatest detective" schtick is horribly unconvincing. He should probably be dubbed "World's greatest CSI" when he manages to build computer programs that somehow get fingerprints off a bullet by reconstructing shattered bricks.
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May 22, 2015 20:19
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I see others were quicker, but yeah, like the link says "mammalucco" means someone dumb.  Edit: the whole hotel situation doesn't make that much sense: while the Joker is the type of guy that would do it, I feel it weird that the SWAT would knowingly allow Black Mask gang to pull off something like this against the hotel guest. Rich hotel guests, I should add. Even in Gotham City you'd think that, as corrupt as he is, Brandon would think twice about putting these people in any sort of danger on his watch. radintorov fucked around with this message at 20:48 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 20:32
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Yeah, I was disappointed in Electrocutioner and his OHKO "boss fight" only for him to die in a cutscene. It'd be nice if the sonic batarang had a self destruct button for once it finishes its purpose.
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May 22, 2015 21:06
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anilEhilated posted:To be fair I don't think Batman has ever struck me as particularly intelligent. He just knows the script. The whole "world's greatest detective" schtick is horribly unconvincing. I was talking more in general about Batman, but yeah. I think one of the better options for one of the assassins might have been Lobo or a Red Lantern or some such, something completely and utterly outside Batman's experience that he really does have to out-think because there's no way he's outfighting this thing.
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May 22, 2015 21:15
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This is the segment that broke me and made me go "gently caress this" on playing the rest of this game. Like I got through it but was just like "Why?" when I did and stopped playing.
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May 22, 2015 21:22
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The Joker is a villain who's motivations and way of thinking is so alien that dealing with him is a crap-shot. He will not do what makes the most sense to do in your mind. That works as long as people don't realize this and it can lead to scenarios where someone tries to deal with the Joker, erroneously assuming he will take the path of highest profit vs risk. Eventually however people will get wise on the fact that dealing with him just doesn't work and someone will realize that a bullet in his head will affect him like anyone else. The Joker's powers seem to be to somehow do things. Somehow he manages to repeatedly convince a crapload of guys to work for him despite his tendency towards underling killing and taking the path of unnecessary danger (in this game he's unknown, but not in the other Arkham games). Somehow he managed to set up that horror contraption in a hotel, a feat which would have to involve a crapload of people (and more than two days) without his doing leaking out left and right. Somehow he could get away with behaving insulting and threatening towards the super villain assassins. If you don't intend to pull a gun and shoot him when he turns his back to you, he will will turn his back to you and not even considering the fact that you may do so. If you do intend to shoot him in the back, he will magically have figured that out. In this game, having those eight assassins and yet the Joker manages to steal the scene doesn't play on the strength of his character and instead highlights the flaws.
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May 22, 2015 22:29
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Yeah, and that's really dumb. It's the same case with Batman as I mentioned in the previous post - we're constantly being told he's a great detective, except he never does anything to deserve that title, all his skills in that department are obvious plot devices. It's part of why I dislike Joker so much (the whole three games full of this dickhead thing aside) - he's plot. He's random, there's no method to his madness, writers can do whatever the hell they want to do with him. Sometimes it works, sure: but in this game it really stands out. Their powers are The Plot, and that takes a lot of the character away. I think I'd like Batman a lot more if he done away with all that pretentiousness of being the best ever in everything and always having a backup plan, but I imagine it's a critical part of the whole larger-than-life comic book hero culture. Just admitting he hosed up, he's terrible at his job (since all those criminals keep getting out and back again - yeah, forced by the medium, but you can't convince me it's not stupid). Meh. I think I'd have to have grown up with this type of culture to understand it, but superheroes just baffle me. Still, I think there's a reason why most of the good Batman stories focus on the villains and not the man himself. anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 22:44 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 22:37
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Cythereal posted:I was talking more in general about Batman, but yeah. I think one of the better options for one of the assassins might have been Lobo or a Red Lantern or some such, something completely and utterly outside Batman's experience that he really does have to out-think because there's no way he's outfighting this thing. Lobo would have been great. But Lobo deserves his own game, not as a side character in the Joker and Batman black hole of sameness. Am I the only one who's absolutely sick and done with Joker? Because it can't be just me. Hell I think that the Black Mask reveal should have been Clayface. Because even though they used that in City it would be less annoying than the damned Joker once again philosophizing to Batman through a TV screen again and again and again. Rigged Death Trap fucked around with this message at 23:09 on May 22, 2015 |
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May 22, 2015 23:02
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I think what is happening is the disconnect between the characters origins in the campy comics of the 50s where the Joker would try to patent smiling fish in some convoluted plan to steal a million dollars to the grimdark stuff of today with the same characters now killing hundreds, if not thousands and not getting hauled off to a supermax or have accidents in custody in an already corrupt police department. There's only so many aimless murder rampages you can go on and still be alive when you bring a shred of realism into play.
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May 22, 2015 23:46
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Crystalgate posted:If you do intend to shoot him in the back, he will magically have figured that out. This is actually called lovely writing.
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May 22, 2015 23:55
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Rigged Death Trap posted:Am I the only one who's absolutely sick and done with Joker? Because it can't be just me. Joker is the main villain in, like, five or six mediums in this series (Asylum, City, Origins, Origins: Blackgate, Assault on Arkham, and uh... I think there was another thing). It'd be weird if you weren't sick of him.
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May 22, 2015 23:57
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pointlessone posted:I think what is happening is the disconnect between the characters origins in the campy comics of the 50s where the Joker would try to patent smiling fish in some convoluted plan to steal a million dollars to the grimdark stuff of today with the same characters now killing hundreds, if not thousands and not getting hauled off to a supermax or have accidents in custody in an already corrupt police department. There's only so many aimless murder rampages you can go on and still be alive when you bring a shred of realism into play. A factor is that early joker was actually very deadly and very cunning, but not particularly crazy- he was frequently motivated first and foremost by normal criminal goals. The Joker as overwhelmingly, exclusively Meaningless Crazy Monstrous Evil Criminal (in roughly that order) is a product of several famous batman comics, and isn't terrible, but is done really poorly in this game- as anilEhilated says, it's a narrative crutch-well, more of a narrative full body cast.
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May 23, 2015 00:01
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Video 17 Notes Lobby sculpture The figure in the lobby is apparently based on an actual french sculpture. The actual sculpture is less humongous, but much more impressive for actually existing. Also, the lion looks less like a furry in the real thing. I've decided the inclusion of this striking figure is meant to symbolize the struggle between Batman and the Joker. Or Batman and Bane. Or the Joker and Bane. Or the developers and a well-developed narrative structure. Your choice. (the real reason is actually quite a nice touch- the hotel is the Gotham Royal, and the original sculpture was meant as a political symbol/endorsement of the ascension of Louis-Phillipe of France. He was the guy who got overturned by Napoleon (the other one, the really famous one's nephew). This probably isn't relevant to the plot, though. I think I'm the first one to piece this particular symbol together- it was probably decided way before anyone even knew what the Royal was going to be used for. The Challenges What scruffy pulls off in the lobby, getting those two particular challenges together, is really hard-that was really impressive! I think the "unseen on Hard or higher" bug is actually another version of some bugs I mentioned earlier, where the conditions aren't properly tied together in the same encounter. Assassin meeting cutscene Notice that the assassins you've already had an optional opportunity to fight, Shiva and Deadshot, only appear on the "I am evilcrazy stack O' staticky screens". At the same time, notice, too, that there's a blank screen in the corner. This cutscene was designed around some parts of the plot, to compensate for the optional assassins- but on the other hand, notice that the screens with these sidequest enemies don't ever appear at the same time as any of the other assassins, except the very last shot, and that there is room for all of the assassins on the screens. The firefly shots are also inconsistent, and the characters keep changing positions. I can't tell exactly how this scene was altered during development, but, again, cuts and changes were made to make it work. Electrocutioner and his Gloves Yup, no real fight against him. Yes, it's disappointing. As others have said, the electroshock gloves are a sort of easy button that tries to compensate for the abundance of shields, armor, etc. in the game. Its effective role in combat is really to diminish the choices players have, since realistically there's basically never a setting where you wouldn't want to use it. It's a dumb rage meter mechanic and I hope it goes away and stays away. I do like how batman just, like clones the gloves off of his corpse- they're still very much there after he gets the upgrade. Maybe that megaman metaphor was more apt than I'd anticipated! (the megaman thing-at least the part where you get a separate upgrade from each enemy- might have actually been a part of the very early development plan, before the Joker Happened. I doubt the story would have given you free order choice, though- it would have been impossible to implement. This Fruitcake is Fantastic! WHEEEEE You see, it has the best writing in the series, because the characters develop. Again, the most abysmal prose appears in cutscenes, where later revisions and improvements couldn't be made. I continue to be floored by how stupid an idea this was. The Hotel The Hotel actually has a degree of internal consistency to it, sort of (there are still some rotational errors, I think). That said, it's the absolute nadir of space design in all parts of the game- a series of corridors, festooned with prop setpieces, to show how Evil and Scary the Joker is. The whole "descent into madness" thing the setting is going for would have worked a lot better if a) it hadn't been done before in the previous games, much better (like the beginning areas of AA), b) we hadn't already seen worse in the Bank, and c) any of it was interesting. The devs try to use elevator shafts as interludes between increasingly unpleasant Joker Spaces to remind you of the outside world, but they're too short, and the Joker Spaces are too boring and rote to really trigger a response. Troy Baker's voice acting is good, but it doesn't actually do anything to help given what's happening onscreen. The Greatest Sin Remember how, in AA and AC, interior spaces were nonlinear, with hub regions and loopbacks? Remember how changes over the course of AC gave you multiple ways to go enter a building, and things changed inside if you returned to them- new enemies, new events, small easter eggs? Those weren't just nice immersive set dressing- there was also a very important design purpose for all that. These games have a collection mechanic, and the player winds up revisiting buildings multiple times, combing through them for riddler trophies. These extra entrances, nonlinear routes and added enemies keep the process of collection interesting. Spoiler Alert- when, at the end of, I assume, the next video, we finish the Gotham Royal, we'll leave via a cutscene, and no new way in will be created. When the collectathon video happens, we will have to start at the lobby and go through every inch of this linear, gaudy, terrible space again looking for datapacks we couldn't get the first time- and there will be no enemies, no events, in some cases no sound. And when we reach the end? We'll have to walk all the way back out. This happens for all but one interior space in the game, and it is inexcusable and infuriating. The Elevator You can't die there. Like most other scripted events, there's no meaningful choice or interaction. Amusement Park This should be your first warning that the game is about to descend into a meaningless downward spiral of wink-wink references to The Killing Joke. It also makes no sense- it's an obstacle course, but its intended victims, the hotel guests, wouldn't be able to get out of the first room. I think the writers couldn't decide if the thing was made for the guests or Batman. The whole space is buggy as heck and loaded with collision detection problems. I think, in order to capture the chaos of the funhouse, the mapper must have literally just made up the layout as they went along. Joker's lines also appear to have been stitched together, since a lot of them don't make any sense.  LP EXCLUSIVE Easter EggAs far as I can tell, I am the only (or close to only) player spergy enough to notice, zoom in on, and post the contents of this paper asset that appears in a few places on the floor around the hotel, including near that switch scruffy hit right at the end of the video:  The torn letter on the lower right is actually a reused easter egg asset from AA. At least someone is having fun, I guess.
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May 23, 2015 00:02
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